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Merged Gaza just launched an unprovoked attack on Israel

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Everyone benefits from Hamas being destroyed. Even the Palestinians. Fun fact, In the Middle East the country where muslims are the most free to worship as they please is in Israel. Everywhere else in the Middle-East they are less free.
If that's the only test of freedom you would be correct. Are Gazans free to move about the country unhindered as most people would define freedom? Are Palestinians in Israel free to move about unhindered?

It depends if the Palestinians live in Gaza or Israel.

Gazans lost their rights to freely move about when they couldn't stop their community from sending suicide bombers into Israel. Its cause and effect. Israelis have every right to protect themselves.

For whatever reason, the Palestinians who live in Israel are able to behave themselves. So their movements and life go on unhindered. Its almost like religion is not the problem!?!
That is not what Palestinians living in Israel say:

He Took Off His Pants and Said "Come Look"': Palestinian Women in Hebron Report Harassment by Israeli Soldiers

Palestinians describe harassment from Israeli forces over social media posts during war

Seems you are uninformed about the situation.

That's not what I said. I said that being a Muslim is the Middle East is more shit outside Israel than inside

No, Israel isn't perfect. Obviously. Israel still is in the Middle-East which means a horrifically inappropriate culture if you are a woman. But it's better in Israel. Its all relative

Dr. Zoidberg said:
Are the Palestinians on the west bank free from having their homes stolen, their farms and orchards burned, free from being murdered by illegal settlers while the IDF promptly looks away?

How extremely ignorant things to write.

A lot of things happened during the six day war. Which is what most of your post refers to. A war where Israel wasn't the aggressor. Yes, if you stupidly start an unprovoked war that you then lose you will lose territory. That's how wars work. Yes, it sucks being on the losing side. Israel have been incredibly generous to the Palestinians who stayed. Something worth keeping in mind.

The IDF doesn't look away. They do their best to control the settlers. The fanatical Jews that cause the most problems don't do military service. Its against their retarded faith. The rest of the Jews/Israelis hate them, because they make life dangerous for the rest of the Jews. There's just legal limits on what the IDF is allowed to do to contain them.

No, it is happening right now. Just google "Israeli settler violence". Here is but a sample from this past couple of months.

Settler rampage in West Bank sparks rare condemnation from Israeli leaders

Settler Violence

What Settler Violence Is Doing to Israel

To deny that Israeli West Bank settlers are not ramping up violence against West Bank Palestinians is extremely ignorant or disingenuous.
Again you can't be bothered to read what I actually write

You hold Israel to impossibly high standards. They’re a country at war. Under the circumstances they’re doing great. They’re still not perfect


The IDF is probably the world's most well behaved army. If you compare civilian dead or atrocities perpetrated by soldiers in any other conflict, the IDF are great at following rules of engagement. No they're not perfect. But the IDF are held to unrealistically high standards. They’re still soldiers
Stop falling for Isreali propaganda. They are not more well-behaved that most Western armies.

Lol... Israeli propaganda. Being spread by whom? Jews fucking suck at defending themselves in the press.

In case you haven't noticed, Israel has very few friends. Exactly who is putting a pro-Israel spin on anything outside Israel?
 
Everyone benefits from Hamas being destroyed. Even the Palestinians. Fun fact, In the Middle East the country where muslims are the most free to worship as they please is in Israel. Everywhere else in the Middle-East they are less free.
If that's the only test of freedom you would be correct. Are Gazans free to move about the country unhindered as most people would define freedom? Are Palestinians in Israel free to move about unhindered?

It depends if the Palestinians live in Gaza or Israel.

Gazans lost their rights to freely move about when they couldn't stop their community from sending suicide bombers into Israel. Its cause and effect. Israelis have every right to protect themselves.

For whatever reason, the Palestinians who live in Israel are able to behave themselves. So their movements and life go on unhindered. Its almost like religion is not the problem!?!
That is not what Palestinians living in Israel say:

He Took Off His Pants and Said "Come Look"': Palestinian Women in Hebron Report Harassment by Israeli Soldiers

Palestinians describe harassment from Israeli forces over social media posts during war

Seems you are uninformed about the situation.

That's not what I said. I said that being a Muslim is the Middle East is more shit outside Israel than inside
You words from above "the Palestinians who live in Israel are able to behave themselves. So their movements and life go on unhindered.".

As for the statement about being a Muslim in the Middle East, it accurately reflects your bigotry much more than the reality of life in the Middle East.
No, Israel isn't perfect. Obviously. Israel still is in the Middle-East which means a horrifically inappropriate culture if you are a woman. But it's better in Israel. Its all relative

Dr. Zoidberg said:
Are the Palestinians on the west bank free from having their homes stolen, their farms and orchards burned, free from being murdered by illegal settlers while the IDF promptly looks away?

How extremely ignorant things to write.

A lot of things happened during the six day war. Which is what most of your post refers to. A war where Israel wasn't the aggressor. Yes, if you stupidly start an unprovoked war that you then lose you will lose territory. That's how wars work. Yes, it sucks being on the losing side. Israel have been incredibly generous to the Palestinians who stayed. Something worth keeping in mind.

The IDF doesn't look away. They do their best to control the settlers. The fanatical Jews that cause the most problems don't do military service. Its against their retarded faith. The rest of the Jews/Israelis hate them, because they make life dangerous for the rest of the Jews. There's just legal limits on what the IDF is allowed to do to contain them.

No, it is happening right now. Just google "Israeli settler violence". Here is but a sample from this past couple of months.

Settler rampage in West Bank sparks rare condemnation from Israeli leaders

Settler Violence

What Settler Violence Is Doing to Israel

To deny that Israeli West Bank settlers are not ramping up violence against West Bank Palestinians is extremely ignorant or disingenuous.
Again you can't be bothered to read what I actually write
You wrote that what ZIprhead described happened in the six day war. It is happening today. As anyone who pays attention would know.
You hold Israel to impossibly high standards. They’re a country at war. Under the circumstances they’re doing great. They’re still not perfect
All I did is point out that you are ignoring facts on the ground. From your posts, I do understand why you feel adhering to facts is a high standard.

The IDF is probably the world's most well behaved army. If you compare civilian dead or atrocities perpetrated by soldiers in any other conflict, the IDF are great at following rules of engagement. No they're not perfect. But the IDF are held to unrealistically high standards. They’re still soldiers
Stop falling for Isreali propaganda. They are not more well-behaved that most Western armies.

Lol... Israeli propaganda. Being spread by whom? Jews fucking suck at defending themselves in the press.
In case you haven't noticed, Israel has very few friends. Exactly who is putting a pro-Israel spin on anything outside Israel?
FFS, the bullshit in this thread from you and LP are just two examples.
 

I'd just like to point out that Hamas is an organisation controlled by Iran. When Hamas took control over Gaza the first thing they did was to wreck to economy and turned Gaza into a military base (which is the reason this war is so protracted). Once the Gazan economy was wrecked they became completely dependent on Iranian economic support. Making the Gazans (Palestinians in Gaza) easy to manipulate by Iran.
What role, if any, do you think the blockade Israel imposed on Gaza and the closing of the Rafah crossing played in the destruction of the economy in Gaza?

Lol. Bad luck trying to derail the thread with irrelant nonsense. I won't bite. Better luck next time. Hamas wrecked the economy in 2007. Removing the orchards and building the tunnels and bunkers in their place.

How is asking you a question about Hamas, Gaza, and your post, a derail?

You say the first thing Hamas did when they came to power was wreck the economy of Gaza. That implies you think it was Hamas' decision to wreck it. Do you believe Hamas planned to replace the existing economy with something else, like how Mao decided to wreck the economy of China so he could replace it with his vision of a true Communist society? Is there evidence of the plan, like a Little Red Book or something?
Hamas/Gazans tore up the orchards, green houses etc. that the Israelis had left behind. That would only be done if you wanted to replace, stuff up a future possible economical activity?

I posted information on what happened to those greenhouses last October in a direct response to a post you wrote.

Did you not read the article, not believe it, or not remember?

Here's one from Mondoweiss, and here's a quote from it:

Despite the initial setbacks, the greenhouses were up and running by mid-October. By late November, the New York Times reported that the Palestinians were preparing to harvest a crop of peppers, strawberries, tomatoes and herbs worth $20 million. Presciently, in the same article, Palestinians expressed concern that if Israel did not keep the Karni border crossing open, it could result in the demise of the greenhouse project.

In mid-December, the greenhouses made their first export of 8 tons of peppers. Speaking to the Associated Press about the success of the project, Jabir said, “It makes us proud. This land was a symbol of occupation and many people were doubting our ability to rehabilitate [it], but now we have proven that we, as Palestinians, are able to manage our lives, to farm our land and to do our own business.”

That hope and pride soon turned to despair. According to Jabir, in order for the project to be successful, it would require moving at least 25 truckloads of produce a day through the Karni crossing. On rare days when the Karni crossing was functioning smoothly he was only able to move 3 truckloads. A crossing that was supposed to be open 24/7, per an international agreement to which Israel was party, was only open sporadically and unpredictably. Israel cited security concerns. The Palestine Economic Development Corporation and its Israeli distribution partner Adafresh were losing hundreds of thousands of dollars every week.

By February 2006, the BBC reported that because the farmers could not get their produce through the crossing, trucks were dumping perfect, ripe produce onto a wasteland to be eaten by goats. Bassil Jabir joked that because cows were eating their strawberries after they had rotted in the harsh sun next to the checkpoint, they had developed perfectly natural strawberry-flavored milk. According to Special Envoy Wolfensohn, “Instead of hope, the Palestinians saw that they were put back in prison.”

It's no secret why the greenhouses failed as commercial enterprises. You just have to be interested enough to find out.
I know the article of which you speak. I remember you posting. I said at the time and I will say it again that the Israeli blockade was ill-informed, badly implemented and far too harsh at the beginning.
Yes on the surface there will some who were trying to get that produce out. The failure to be allowed to so was so wrong.
Yet under the surface rockets were heading into Gaza. Pity the Egyptians did not try harder to stop the flow of such weapons.
Why did the Gazans not try the Rafah crossing which was controlled by Egypt at that time? There was the extra distance to get there but it dos not seem to have been too much extra.
 
It's no secret why the greenhouses failed as commercial enterprises. You just have to be interested enough to find out.
I strongly suspect that the real answer was the sentence that kinda got handwaved away.

"Israel cited security concerns."

Given the history of the violent and conscienceless attacks from the Palestinians and other Arab neighbors I would expect super high security measures at the border which would make shipping truckloads of fruits problematic. Blaming Israel for that is ignorant.
Tom
Of course there were/are safety concerns.

Of course there would have been plans in place to address them.

Of course Israel knew that a lot of trucks would arrive at the same time, bringing the produce to market when it was freshly harvested. Those greenhouses had been a successful operation when the settlers were the ones growing the crops, remember? And there were fewer greenhouses left for the Gazans to run after the settlers demolished half of them, so the Gazan harvest was smaller and the line of trucks shorter than it had been in previous years.

And of course, Israel had been inspecting the trucks the entire time, long before the settlers were withdrawn, for the exact same reason it was inspecting them after the Palestinians took over.

Do you have any sources that report delays in shipments of flowers and produce from Gaza when the settlers ran that enterprise? Or are you just posting a kneejerk reaction to what I posted, and haven't really given it much thought?
 
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Why did the Gazans not try the Rafah crossing which was controlled by Egypt at that time? There was the extra distance to get there but it dos not seem to have been too much extra.
That's a good question. Are you at all interested in finding out the answer?
 
Everyone benefits from Hamas being destroyed. Even the Palestinians. Fun fact, In the Middle East the country where muslims are the most free to worship as they please is in Israel. Everywhere else in the Middle-East they are less free.
If that's the only test of freedom you would be correct. Are Gazans free to move about the country unhindered as most people would define freedom? Are Palestinians in Israel free to move about unhindered?

It depends if the Palestinians live in Gaza or Israel.

Gazans lost their rights to freely move about when they couldn't stop their community from sending suicide bombers into Israel. Its cause and effect. Israelis have every right to protect themselves.

For whatever reason, the Palestinians who live in Israel are able to behave themselves. So their movements and life go on unhindered. Its almost like religion is not the problem!?!
That is not what Palestinians living in Israel say:

He Took Off His Pants and Said "Come Look"': Palestinian Women in Hebron Report Harassment by Israeli Soldiers

Palestinians describe harassment from Israeli forces over social media posts during war

Seems you are uninformed about the situation.

That's not what I said. I said that being a Muslim is the Middle East is more shit outside Israel than inside
You words from above "the Palestinians who live in Israel are able to behave themselves. So their movements and life go on unhindered.".

I think you are only pretending to be this dumb.

As for the statement about being a Muslim in the Middle East, it accurately reflects your bigotry much more than the reality of life in the Middle East.

Lol. Spoken like someone who has never been there. When it comes to freedom Arabs in the Middle-East are like indoor cats. They’re against it, but aren't sure why. Fascinated yet scared of freedom.

Middle-Eastern culture isn't all bad. It just sucks if you want to do your own thing.


No, Israel isn't perfect. Obviously. Israel still is in the Middle-East which means a horrifically inappropriate culture if you are a woman. But it's better in Israel. Its all relative

Dr. Zoidberg said:
Are the Palestinians on the west bank free from having their homes stolen, their farms and orchards burned, free from being murdered by illegal settlers while the IDF promptly looks away?

How extremely ignorant things to write.

A lot of things happened during the six day war. Which is what most of your post refers to. A war where Israel wasn't the aggressor. Yes, if you stupidly start an unprovoked war that you then lose you will lose territory. That's how wars work. Yes, it sucks being on the losing side. Israel have been incredibly generous to the Palestinians who stayed. Something worth keeping in mind.

The IDF doesn't look away. They do their best to control the settlers. The fanatical Jews that cause the most problems don't do military service. Its against their retarded faith. The rest of the Jews/Israelis hate them, because they make life dangerous for the rest of the Jews. There's just legal limits on what the IDF is allowed to do to contain them.

No, it is happening right now. Just google "Israeli settler violence". Here is but a sample from this past couple of months.

Settler rampage in West Bank sparks rare condemnation from Israeli leaders

Settler Violence

What Settler Violence Is Doing to Israel

To deny that Israeli West Bank settlers are not ramping up violence against West Bank Palestinians is extremely ignorant or disingenuous.
Again you can't be bothered to read what I actually write
You wrote that what ZIprhead described happened in the six day war. It is happening today. As anyone who pays attention would know.
You hold Israel to impossibly high standards. They’re a country at war. Under the circumstances they’re doing great. They’re still not perfect
All I did is point out that you are ignoring facts on the ground. From your posts, I do understand why you feel adhering to facts is a high standard.

I will interpret this as you conceding that you have no idea wgat you are talking about


The IDF is probably the world's most well behaved army. If you compare civilian dead or atrocities perpetrated by soldiers in any other conflict, the IDF are great at following rules of engagement. No they're not perfect. But the IDF are held to unrealistically high standards. They’re still soldiers
Stop falling for Isreali propaganda. They are not more well-behaved that most Western armies.

Lol... Israeli propaganda. Being spread by whom? Jews fucking suck at defending themselves in the press.
In case you haven't noticed, Israel has very few friends. Exactly who is putting a pro-Israel spin on anything outside Israel?
FFS, the bullshit in this thread from you and LP are just two examples.

Yes, there are some people who can be bothered to do their homework and actually care about what is true.

It is interesting how bizarrely off base the pro-palestinian narrative is, so that anyone with a balanced view comes across as pro-israeli.
 
Yes on the surface there will some who were trying to get that produce out. The failure to be allowed to so was so wrong.

Yet under the surface rockets were heading into Gaza. Pity the Egyptians did not try harder to stop the flow of such weapons.
Why did the Gazans not try the Rafah crossing which was controlled by Egypt at that time? There was the extra distance to get there but it dos not seem to have been too much extra.

The Palestinians problem with Egypt is evidence that this isn't a relgious issue. It's real politik. Egypt doesn't want to help Palestine, for a variety of reasons. The Egyptian regime is happier about a democratic stable neighbour than a chaotic islamist state.

The Palestinians aren't just pissing off Israel, they're a nightmare to deal with for any country that gets involved with them.

I blame Yasser Arafat and the PLO. Basically, the more victims Arafat could make the Palestinians be, the more money he got and the more he could go to the French rivera and have sex with hot young men. So Arafat had zero incentive to actually help the Palestinians. The religion is also to blame, since Islam has a tradition of elevating martyrs (much more than Christianity). Arafat and the PLO could exploit this to make the Palestinians willing holy soldiers against, what they saw, as the last outpost of colonial oppressors and crusaders.

When the PLO got actual power in Gaza, with the PA, he made it into a bizarrely corrupt regime. Much like so many others in the region. Making it utter shit to live there.

That is when Hamas swoops in 2007 and takes over, building hospitals and schools and starts treating the Palestinians as actual humans (for the first time in Palestinian history). Too bad they also wreck the economy, as well as using alarmingly beligerent rhetoric. Worth noting is that Hamas builds their hospitals on top of military bases, using the civilians are human shields. But seen from the Palestinian perspective, at least they had a functioning hospital that was more than a piggy bank for Fatah's parties.

Like many conflicts there's more than two sides, and sometimes both sides are bad choices to back. The main problem for the Palestinians is that they have no friends. Their own leaders suck. Other Arabs (and Iran) treat them like little more than pawns in a war against Israel. Which is why. Egypt closed the Rafah crossing. It would also be diplomatic suicide for any Arab nation to openly support Israel, against the Palestinians. So they play it safe.

We can't just give the Palestinians money and self rule. That money is guaranteed to go into the pockets of a corrupt official. The Palestinians won't see it. Self rule is just a free pass for whoever who sits on the power to embazzle to the hilt. And the grassroots movements in Palestine are all terror organisation. Whatever money they are given, it'll soon land in Israel in a big explosion.

At this point Palestine/Gaza is such a fucking mess that it's best managed by an external party. As luck would have it, Israel are excellent managers. The best in the Middle-East. Perhaps we should just let them get on with it?
 
Everyone benefits from Hamas being destroyed. Even the Palestinians. Fun fact, In the Middle East the country where muslims are the most free to worship as they please is in Israel. Everywhere else in the Middle-East they are less free.
If that's the only test of freedom you would be correct. Are Gazans free to move about the country unhindered as most people would define freedom? Are Palestinians in Israel free to move about unhindered?

It depends if the Palestinians live in Gaza or Israel.

Gazans lost their rights to freely move about when they couldn't stop their community from sending suicide bombers into Israel. Its cause and effect. Israelis have every right to protect themselves.

For whatever reason, the Palestinians who live in Israel are able to behave themselves. So their movements and life go on unhindered. Its almost like religion is not the problem!?!

All Palestinians aren't the same. All Jews aren't the same. All Muslims aren't the same.

Are the Palestinians on the west bank free from having their homes stolen, their farms and orchards burned, free from being murdered by illegal settlers while the IDF promptly looks away?

How extremely ignorant things to write.

A lot of things happened during the six day war. Which is what most of your post refers to. A war where Israel wasn't the aggressor. Yes, if you stupidly start an unprovoked war that you then lose you will lose territory. That's how wars work. Yes, it sucks being on the losing side. Israel have been incredibly generous to the Palestinians who stayed. Something worth keeping in mind.

The IDF doesn't look away. They do their best to control the settlers. The fanatical Jews that cause the most problems don't do military service. Its against their retarded faith. The rest of the Jews/Israelis hate them, because they make life dangerous for the rest of the Jews. There's just legal limits on what the IDF is allowed to do to contain them.

The IDF is probably the world's most well behaved army. If you compare civilian dead or atrocities perpetrated by soldiers in any other conflict, the IDF are great at following rules of engagement. No they're not perfect. But the IDF are held to unrealistically high standards. They’re still soldiers





Nice emotionally charged link you shared. What was the point of that? Pointlessly manipulative, imho
Didn't really go to the link and hear what Coates' experience was in the West bank.

The rest of your post is simply Israel propaganda.
 
Yes, there are some people who can be bothered to do their homework and actually care about what is true.

It is interesting how bizarrely off base the pro-palestinian narrative is, so that anyone with a balanced view comes across as pro-israeli.
Frankly, I don't remember you posting anything to back up your posts. LD did and you ignored it. You just make declarative statements just like Barbos does.

I will interpret this as you conceding that you have no idea wgat you are talking about

I will interpret this as you going :lalala:
 
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Didn't really go to the link and hear what Coates' experience was in the West bank.

Of course I did. As far as I could tell he wasn't talking about Gaza. To me it seemed like he was opportunistically using Gaza to talk about himself and black US experiences, using the Palestinians as a metaphor. A bad metaphor, since the context is so different.

I understand why public intellectuals do it. They have to continuously try to find new ways to get attention and stay relevant. But I don't think he was really talking about the situation in Gaza

And it was manipulative and emotionally charged

The rest of your post is simply Israel propaganda.

Lol. I guess reality has an Israel bias then :)
 
Yes, there are some people who can be bothered to do their homework and actually care about what is true.

It is interesting how bizarrely off base the pro-palestinian narrative is, so that anyone with a balanced view comes across as pro-israeli.
Frankly, I don't remember you posting anything to back up your posts. LD did and you ignored it. You just make declarative statements just like Barbos does.

Israel / Palestine relations are well covered. The problem isn't a lack of information. Its simply how it's interpreted.

there's no point flooding us with more information

As I recall Barbos linked to conspiracy theory youtubers, to back up his claims. I think its different :)
 
Didn't really go to the link and hear what Coates' experience was in the West bank.

Of course I did. As far as I could tell he wasn't talking about Gaza.
Of course he wasn't. He was taiking about the conditions in the West Bank. Duh. I have no idea why you think his conclusions should be applied to Gaza.

To me it seemed like he was opportunistically using Gaza to talk about himself and black US experiences, using the Palestinians as a metaphor. A bad metaphor, since the context is so different.

I understand why public intellectuals do it. They have to continuously try to find new ways to get attention and stay relevant. But I don't think he was really talking about the situation in Gaza

And it was manipulative and emotionally charged

The rest of your post is simply Israel propaganda.

Lol. I guess reality has an Israel bias then :)
See above. You seem to have absolutely no understanding about what he was sayting so your conclusions can dismissed as such.
 
Didn't really go to the link and hear what Coates' experience was in the West bank.

Of course I did. As far as I could tell he wasn't talking about Gaza. To me it seemed like he was opportunistically using Gaza to talk about himself and black US experiences, using the Palestinians as a metaphor. A bad metaphor, since the context is so different.
JFC. He said he was talking about his experience in the West Bank and comparing it to the Jim crow south of the United States, not Gaza. WTF is wrong with you?

 
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Didn't really go to the link and hear what Coates' experience was in the West bank.

Of course I did. As far as I could tell he wasn't talking about Gaza. To me it seemed like he was opportunistically using Gaza to talk about himself and black US experiences, using the Palestinians as a metaphor. A bad metaphor, since the context is so different.
JFC. He said he was talking about his experience in the West Bank, not Gaza. WTF is wrong with you?
The evidence suggests either a lack of motivation to actually read content or a deficit in reading comprehension.
 
Didn't really go to the link and hear what Coates' experience was in the West bank.

Of course I did. As far as I could tell he wasn't talking about Gaza. To me it seemed like he was opportunistically using Gaza to talk about himself and black US experiences, using the Palestinians as a metaphor. A bad metaphor, since the context is so different.
JFC. He said he was talking about his experience in the West Bank and comparing it to the Jim crow south of the United States, not Gaza. WTF is wrong with you?

Sure. My bad. My refutation of him is the same. I don't think he's talking about Palestine. I think he's just using it to draw attention to himself and his own particular heritage. Which, in the context, is completely irrelevant.

Israel is a country that has had to deal with recurring terrorist attacks since, even before, it was founded. As a result they have security check points everywhere. This is not segregration. Even though it might, superficially, look like it.

Coats' arguments are rediculous and wildly off base.

What the pro-Palestinian side seems to argue for is that Israel shouldn't respond to attacks, but just continually appease the Palestinians and just take it. When Israel responds, always in a measured and appropriate way, accusations are hurled against Israel. Try to put yourself in the shoes of the Israelis for once? What they've had to endure from the Palestinians is extreme. Israel and Israelis aren't perfect. But considering the continual extreme pressure they're put under... how about a little understanding?

Right now the IDF is in Gaza trying to repatriate the civilian hostages that Hamas took. The ideological backflips the Palestinian side is having to do to argue that Israel should just abandon their own people... because why? Hamas is using the Palestinian people are human shields? That is not an argument. The double standards are extreme. No, nation should have to deal with the shit that Israel is being put through. The least thing we can do is to back them up. At the very least, not make it harder for them.
 
Coats' arguments are rediculous and wildly off base.
What specifically was Coates' arguments you disagree with.

I saw him tell of being stopped by soldiers and demanded he tell the soldiers his religion. That Palestinians cannot walk down certain streets while Israelis can.

Settlers murder Palestinians (akin to lynching). Throw Palestinians out of their own homes. Burn their crops.
 
Yes, there are some people who can be bothered to do their homework and actually care about what is true.

It is interesting how bizarrely off base the pro-palestinian narrative is, so that anyone with a balanced view comes across as pro-israeli.
Frankly, I don't remember you posting anything to back up your posts. LD did and you ignored it. You just make declarative statements just like Barbos does.
Israel / Palestine relations are well covered. The problem isn't a lack of information. Its simply how it's interpreted.
With Israel/Palestine, I see nothing but accusation and finger pointing. I rarely ever see information. Israel has an agenda, Hamas has an agenda, Palestine has an agenda. I watch news coverage of the area with so much salt, I almost treat it all as fiction. I watch coverage of Palestinians, and I see potential for manipulation. In fact, it is all I see. Look at the children, how are they behaving, is it organic. Trying to parse the hidden information into the actual news. It isn't easy.

In general, the only thing I really can go by that I feel has any value are protests and their size, as that would help project internal feelings about what is going on.
 
Coats' arguments are rediculous and wildly off base.
What specifically was Coates' arguments you disagree with.

I saw him tell of being stopped by soldiers and demanded he tell the soldiers his religion. That Palestinians cannot walk down certain streets while Israelis can.

Settlers murder Palestinians (akin to lynching). Throw Palestinians out of their own homes. Burn their crops.
It's either pro-Palestinian propaganda or Israelis defending themselves the only way possible or right wing crazies that all the Israelis hate but who won't do anything to stop them. :rolleyes:
 
Israel is getting wht it has wanted.

Palestinian population being swept aside and justification for a direct attack on Iran.

Look at a flat world map. Te area of the Mid East where all this is going on is very small, yet it his having a global impact.

Just 25 miles long and six miles wide, the tiny coastal enclave is one of the most densely populated places on earth and is home to approximately 1.7 million people. Three quarters of Gaza's population are refugees who were expelled from the land that became Israel in 1948, and their descendants.

Isre4l has been bombing this small area back to t he s Stone Age.

It is mass insanity.

Saudis vs Iran, Arabs vs Arabs, Arabs and Iran vs Israel. Israel vs everybody in the region.
 
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