How can you say that all environments are equal when they behave completely different?

[NightHawkBuzz]

My views of people and environments have changed completely since my two completely different experiences in high school and college.

In high school I went to an arts school that was in a bad area in my city. There were many kids at the school that were disrespectful, rude, loud and aggressive. There were fights that broke out constantly in the classroom. There was always chaos in the class.. We had security guards that would have to come in and break up fights that would happen. Literally one of our teachers resigned because of chaos that happened in our classroom so much.

Also, since it was an arts school there were many homosexual kids that went there which was fine to me. However the issue became that the entire school's culture was about "outing" every single individual even if they weren't gay. Throughout all my years there I had to constantly be accused of being "gay" even though I never was just like all the other kids that went to the school because the whole culture of the school was about accusing everyone of being gay.

Throughout my years of being at that school I and everyone else had to deal to with being accused of being gay and had to deal with homosexuality being forced upon us in an extreme way.

There were a lot of kids that went there that were ghetto and extremely disrespectful. Also, it was an extremely liberal school so there were very little republicans. The day that Donald Trump was elected to office the entire school was mad and upset and anyone that said they supported Trump would have been probably been verbally and maybe even physically attacked.

I was actually scared for my safety going to that school sometimes. The teachers had very little control over the class as some of them didn't know how to manage wild out of control kids. The teachers were very harsh as well.

Then I graduated high school and went to a much better private college in a much better part of the city. Most of the kids acted much differently. I wasn't harassed about my sexuality and the school was much more civilized. Also, people could have different political views without being attacked or criticized. I felt safer in that school then I did in my high school.

So how can anyone honestly say that these two high schools and two different environments should be treated equally by everyone when they are completely different?

Also, why should you treat these two environments and schools the same when they operate in two completely different ways?

 

[pood]

“Accused” of being gay? A lot of kids that went there were “ghetto”?

Yup, you’ll make a perfedct Republican. If you ever really do make good on your threat to run for office, I hope you lose in a landslide. But, of course, whether that happends depends on where you run.

Fortunatley, the nation‘s demographics are changing, which is likely to be all for the good.

 

[NightHawkBuzz]

“Accused” of being gay? A lot of kids that went there were “ghetto”?

Yup, you’ll make a perfedct Republican. If you ever really do make good on your threat to run for office, I hope you lose in a landslide. But, of course, whether that happends depends on where you run.

<Deleted>

It becomes relevant because it does effect us.

He shouldn't be wishing me to fail at my career though that's wrong as hell and if someone does that I am going to tell them off.

Anyway, what do you mean by treating the two environments as equal? You pointed out a difference but you didn't tie it to your question. There's always a difference (exclusion principle--can't have two things in the same place), the only question is how big and how relevant.

I mean treating the two environments as equal as in when I run as a politician one of my goals is to protect schools private and public. But how can I feel the same way about public schools as I do private schools when it comes to wanting to protect both equally since I have had two completely different experiences in both?

 

[Ford]

There there, you poor persecuted thing.

Do you need a shoulder to cry on? A safe room?

Lemme know. I care.
Tom

I'm gonna call bullshit on this whole convoluted story.

Sounds like mash-up of "Fame," "Stand And Deliver," and "West Side Story." I've half a mind to ask how many times the students broke out into a dance number and stabbed each other with blows choreographed to the soundtrack.

 

[Rhea]

I mean treating the two environments as equal as in when I run as a politician one of my goals is to protect schools private and public. But how can I feel the same way about public schools as I do private schools when it comes to wanting to protect both equally since I have had two completely different experiences in both?

Because,

1. Unless you are writing legislation about ONLY those two schools, you have no reason to believe your experience is representative of the districts you’d be legislating, unless you are legislating in a single school district. (Our public school system is quite good, and the local private schools are a mixed bag with some below standard and some outstanding.
2. Private schools are private. What would you legislate? Are you saying to want to give public money to a private school that can exclude people within its district? Wouldn’t that violate your oath of office and demonstrate that you literally do not intend to serve the public?
3. You want to run as a politician planning to protect private schools? Are you also planning to protect private corporations? And follow-up, WHY? Why do you not want to serve the public? The overwhelming defining characteristic of all private schools is that they exclude members of the public that they don’t like. You’re wanting to run for public office with that being your brand? “I want to spend public taxpayer money on institutions that exclude some of those taxpayers! You pay, but we prevent you from playing. Woot.”

 

[NightHawkBuzz]

I mean treating the two environments as equal as in when I run as a politician one of my goals is to protect schools private and public. But how can I feel the same way about public schools as I do private schools when it comes to wanting to protect both equally since I have had two completely different experiences in both?

Because,

1. Unless you are writing legislation about ONLY those two schools, you have no reason to believe your experience is representative of the districts you’d be legislating, unless you are legislating in a single school district. (Our public school system is quite good, and the local private schools are a mixed bag with some below standard and some outstanding.
2. Private schools are private. What would you legislate? Are you saying to want to give public money to a private school that can exclude people within its district? Wouldn’t that violate your oath of office and demonstrate that you literally do not intend to serve the public?
3. You want to run as a politician planning to protect private schools? Are you also planning to protect private corporations? And follow-up, WHY? Why do you not want to serve the public? The overwhelming defining characteristic of all private schools is that they exclude members of the public that they don’t like. You’re wanting to run for public office with that being your brand? “I want to spend public taxpayer money on institutions that exclude some of those taxpayers! You pay, but we prevent you from playing. Woot.”

I want to protect private and public schools. My issue is protecting public arts school. How can I treat an arts school the same when it acts so much differently than a public and private school?

 

[Elixir]

I want to protect private and public schools.

Good. That is an honorable pursuit.
Get a job as a security guard.
Verbal skills not required.

Yup, you’ll make a perfedct Republican. If you ever really do make good on your threat to run for office, I hope you lose in a landslide.

Good job, pood. When I voiced a similar hope the response was impassive. But you have elicited an angry response, which bespeaks either a new level of AI or a real human.

Buzz now says you should mind your own business. But he says that while spewing his control-freak impulses all over these forums, making his fascist proclivities a public spectacle.
Go figure.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

I mean treating the two environments as equal as in when I run as a politician one of my goals is to protect schools private and public. But how can I feel the same way about public schools as I do private schools when it comes to wanting to protect both equally since I have had two completely different experiences in both?

Here's my experience: when I was in grade school, I used to get beat up and bullied all the time (always by multiple kids at once) and wouldn't you know it, their parents were very conservative white people, living in the better part of town. Meanwhile, I was on welfare and my mother was getting food stamps and I was wearing clothes from, I-don't-know-where, hand me downs from an in-law or the Salvation Army or what. I actually went to many different schools and had different experiences, but fast forward to high school, the main high school I attended had many ghetto people and no one bullied me ever....there was "ranking on" each other that was quite common, there was only really one time where someone wanted to fight me but he was mentally ill and a Jamaican student, friend of mine--very nice guy--helped me get out of that situation. It was a very safe, intellectual, hard-working environment even though many of the kids were from poor and middle class backgrounds.

This is why I have decided that you are right. We should let our personal experiences dictate our feelings and then our feelings should dictate our logic of how we decide governmental policy. I mean, fuck statistics and understanding. Who needs that shit? It makes so much sense that I have decided I am going to run against you for political office. Let me know where you live so I can register there and run against you with the exact opposite political agenda, whatever that will mean.

 

[Elixir]

Let me know where you live so I can register there and run against you with the exact opposite political agenda, whatever that will mean.

You’re going to run on NOT protecting schools? While Buzz poses in front of a shot-up school with his BDU and AK47?
Better be running in California - and NOT Santa Monica - or Buzz is going to kick your ass!

 

[TomC]

He shouldn't be wishing me to fail at my career though that's wrong as hell and if someone does that I am going to tell them off.

Honestly,
I know nothing about you but what you've posted on this forum. But your combination of self-centered and thin skinned does not make a career in public service look like an option to me.
Tom

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

He shouldn't be wishing me to fail at my career though that's wrong as hell and if someone does that I am going to tell them off.

Honestly,
I know nothing about you but what you've posted on this forum. But your combination of self-centered and thin skinned does not make a career in public service look like an option to me.
Tom

Are you sure? Trump is pretty thin-skinned and he's nothing but win.

 

[TomC]

Are you sure? Trump is pretty thin-skinned and he's nothing but win.

I don't consider Trump a public servant.
And if you notice, he's lost every popular vote he's ever stood for.
Tom

 

[IIDB Staff]

This thread is being moved from the Support/Fireside forum to Political Discussions (with a 3-day redirect that will self delete) since it is not about wanting personal support through a difficult event.

 

[Rhea]

I want to protect private and public schools. My issue is protecting public arts school. How can I treat an arts school the same when it acts so much differently than a public and private school?

Because of how ONE of them operated during ONE 4 year period that you attended?

That kind of not-thinking is harmful to society. That is a petty and vindictive attitude. You can’t see that?

 

[laughing dog]

I wonder what you mean by treating two different situations/environments "equally". Does that mean funding only in the case of schools or does it mean that laws/policy are the same for all public schools (or all schools)?

I ask because it sounds to me as if you are confusing the behavior of people - which is subject to any relevant laws - with the atmosphere of the school.

Here is a pro-tip - referring to people as "ghetto" may raise unnecessary hackles. To many observers, it implies something racial. So unless you mean something racial, it is better to be more specific as to the type of behavior you wish to describe.

 

[Toni]

Moreover, it seems that they are conflating their personal experiences with the experiences of every other student who ever attended. This is not a wise or valid basis for evaluating any school. Or teacher. I learned from experience that teachers I adored were sometimes disliked by other students/parents. I learned that teachers I detested for extremely valid reasons, based on how they treated me and how they treated other students were sometimes adored by some other students. I have learned that a teacher that is ideal for some types of students will not be ideal for other types of students. I'm thinking about a couple of teachers in particular that my children had who were.....horrible for my kids but yet, parents I know are good, loving, caring parents adored the same teachers. And the reverse is true. One teacher all of my kids had in high school was the hands down favorite of 3 of my kids....and mediocre in the opinion of the fourth. Bad year? Maybe. Different perception? Probably. Perhaps gender made a difference. I really don't know.

I've also learned that every teacher can have a bad day, a bad week, a bad year. Because they are human beings and may be dealing with serious illness (themselves or a family member), death of a loved one, divorce, other significant disruption in their lives.

 

[Bomb#20]

Because,

1. ...
2. Private schools are private. What would you legislate? Are you saying to want to give public money to a private school that can exclude people within its district? Wouldn’t that violate your oath of office and demonstrate that you literally do not intend to serve the public?
3. You want to run as a politician planning to protect private schools? Are you also planning to protect private corporations? And follow-up, WHY? Why do you not want to serve the public? The overwhelming defining characteristic of all private schools is that they exclude members of the public that they don’t like. You’re wanting to run for public office with that being your brand? “I want to spend public taxpayer money on institutions that exclude some of those taxpayers! You pay, but we prevent you from playing. Woot.”

About 90% of what government does is spend public taxpayer money on institutions that exclude some of those taxpayers. Social Security excludes the under-65. Medicaid excludes the non-impoverished. Public universities exclude people with low test scores and school grades. The Veterans Admin excludes civilians. Public employee pensions exclude the entire private sector. Interest on the national debt excludes everyone who didn't lend the government money. What, if a politician spends money on a battered-women's shelter he's violating his oath of office by not serving men?!?

And as for public schools, they're all about exclusion. One of our local roads has a public school district boundary running right down the middle. Each school half its kids go to excludes the kids on the other side of the street. Kids aren't allowed to go to the same school as their friends and neighbors; kids on one side get a school bus and kids on the other side have to be driven to school every day by their parents. Our whole community turned out to a public meeting to get this fixed, to ask for a change to the rules so half a dozen children could go to a school that worked better for them and their families. The meeting was eye-opening. It quickly became clear that not only did the school authorities not give a rat's ass about those kids' problems, neither did most of the public at the meeting. The absolutely only thing any of them gave a damn about was if those few kids changed school then the money from the state would follow them to the new school so the school they'd be leaving would get a little less funding. That school had political pull and the school the families wanted to switch to didn't, so the school they wanted to switch to was ordered to continue excluding them.

 

[pood]

He shouldn't be wishing me to fail at my career though that's wrong as hell and if someone does that I am going to tell them off.

Dude, if someone came on here and told you that they planned to design cars for a living, but to do so in such a way that the gas tanks exploded when the ignition key was turned, wouldn’t you encourage that person to find a new line of work?

 

[Elixir]

He shouldn't be wishing me to fail at my career though that's wrong as hell and if someone does that I am going to tell them off.

Get ready to repeat your “tell them off” speech a lot then, Buzz.
In politics - especially lately - trying to destroy the careers of your opponents is the name of the game, especially if you are Republican.

 

[scombrid]

I'm still trying to figure out who are the "you" that "say that all environments are equal". What does it even mean by "all environments are equal"?