How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[ZiprHead]

Here's another video of the attack on Kharkiv that Barbos said was fake.

 

[crazyfingers]

I'm not saying that I don't believe that Trump deteriorated significantly while he was POTUS, physically and mentally. We've all seen photographic evidence of how much the office physically ages POTUS through their terms. Mentally? That was a new wrinkle re: Trump.

Hard to tell with Trump since he's covered in makeup and hair dye.

Trump suggests that the solution for US jets to attach Russia with Chinese flags painted on them.

Analysis: Donald Trump has a bonkers theory on how to win the war in Ukraine

It's sometimes useful to remind yourself what things might have been like if Donald Trump had actually won the 2020 election.

www.cnn.com

(CNN)It's sometimes useful to remind yourself what things might have been like if Donald Trump had actually won the 2020 election.
Over the weekend, the former President provided a glimpse into how he may have handled on the ongoing Russian invasion of Ukraine -- and it is a doozy.
According to audio obtained by The Washington Post, Trump told a group of Republican donors in New Orleans that the United States should paint Chinese flags on its F-22 planes and then use those planes to bomb Russia.

"And then we say, 'China did it, we didn't do it, China did it,' and then they start fighting with each other and we sit back and watch," Trump concluded.

 

[blastula]

Ukraine says 3,000 Americans have volunteered to fight Russian invaders

Ukrainian officials said several hundred volunteers are already in the country, with hundreds more awaiting approval.

www.businessinsider.com

Wonder how many signing up were from Ukraine. Was surprised to learn that there are over a million Ukrainian Americans, mostly in northeast. There are also over 1.5 million Ukrainian Canadians, guess they like the cold.

 

[Toni]

I'm not saying that I don't believe that Trump deteriorated significantly while he was POTUS, physically and mentally. We've all seen photographic evidence of how much the office physically ages POTUS through their terms. Mentally? That was a new wrinkle re: Trump.

Hard to tell with Trump since he's covered in makeup and hair dye.

Trump suggests that the solution for US jets to attach Russia with Chinese flags painted on them.

Analysis: Donald Trump has a bonkers theory on how to win the war in Ukraine

It's sometimes useful to remind yourself what things might have been like if Donald Trump had actually won the 2020 election.

www.cnn.com

(CNN)It's sometimes useful to remind yourself what things might have been like if Donald Trump had actually won the 2020 election.
Over the weekend, the former President provided a glimpse into how he may have handled on the ongoing Russian invasion of Ukraine -- and it is a doozy.
According to audio obtained by The Washington Post, Trump told a group of Republican donors in New Orleans that the United States should paint Chinese flags on its F-22 planes and then use those planes to bomb Russia.

"And then we say, 'China did it, we didn't do it, China did it,' and then they start fighting with each other and we sit back and watch," Trump concluded.

I've read this.

The thing is, what drives me crazy and what drives me crazy that his supporters either fail to recognize this or simply don't care: He's really not that stupid. Don't get me wrong: he's definitely not a 'deep thinker.' Or thinker. But the quotes from Bill Barr's book that I've read (I would NEVER deign to help put $ into Barr's pockets by buying one) is that Trump is actually capable of...thought, of reasoning. He's not nearly as stupid as he pretends in public. Why his 'supporters/fans' aren't offended by his talking down to them (from not a very high distance, and frankly, he'd need a tall ladder to get above most of them) I do not know. I guess they're just willing to support anyone who blows the right tune on dog whistles. Which also drives me nuts.

 

[Toni]

I'm not saying that I don't believe that Trump deteriorated significantly while he was POTUS, physically and mentally. We've all seen photographic evidence of how much the office physically ages POTUS through their terms. Mentally? That was a new wrinkle re: Trump.

Hard to tell with Trump since he's covered in makeup and hair dye.

Yep but it's still very, very obvious.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

I'm not saying that I don't believe that Trump deteriorated significantly while he was POTUS, physically and mentally. We've all seen photographic evidence of how much the office physically ages POTUS through their terms. Mentally? That was a new wrinkle re: Trump.

Hard to tell with Trump since he's covered in makeup and hair dye.

Trump suggests that the solution for US jets to attach Russia with Chinese flags painted on them.

Analysis: Donald Trump has a bonkers theory on how to win the war in Ukraine

It's sometimes useful to remind yourself what things might have been like if Donald Trump had actually won the 2020 election.

www.cnn.com

(CNN)It's sometimes useful to remind yourself what things might have been like if Donald Trump had actually won the 2020 election.
Over the weekend, the former President provided a glimpse into how he may have handled on the ongoing Russian invasion of Ukraine -- and it is a doozy.
According to audio obtained by The Washington Post, Trump told a group of Republican donors in New Orleans that the United States should paint Chinese flags on its F-22 planes and then use those planes to bomb Russia.

"And then we say, 'China did it, we didn't do it, China did it,' and then they start fighting with each other and we sit back and watch," Trump concluded.

Sounds like something a middle school kid would come up with, so it doesn't surprise me coming from Dotard.

 

[blastula]

Russia is down another major general.

R.I.P., Vitaly Gerassimov.

Ukraine claims it has killed another Russian general during fighting in Kharkiv

Officials say fighting also killed ‘a number’ of senior Russian army officers

www.independent.co.uk

 Andrey Sukhovetsky

 Vitaly Gerasimov

 

[Gospel]

I'm not saying that I don't believe that Trump deteriorated significantly while he was POTUS, physically and mentally. We've all seen photographic evidence of how much the office physically ages POTUS through their terms. Mentally? That was a new wrinkle re: Trump.

Hard to tell with Trump since he's covered in makeup and hair dye.

Trump suggests that the solution for US jets to attach Russia with Chinese flags painted on them.

Analysis: Donald Trump has a bonkers theory on how to win the war in Ukraine

It's sometimes useful to remind yourself what things might have been like if Donald Trump had actually won the 2020 election.

www.cnn.com

(CNN)It's sometimes useful to remind yourself what things might have been like if Donald Trump had actually won the 2020 election.
Over the weekend, the former President provided a glimpse into how he may have handled on the ongoing Russian invasion of Ukraine -- and it is a doozy.
According to audio obtained by The Washington Post, Trump told a group of Republican donors in New Orleans that the United States should paint Chinese flags on its F-22 planes and then use those planes to bomb Russia.

"And then we say, 'China did it, we didn't do it, China did it,' and then they start fighting with each other and we sit back and watch," Trump concluded.

Sounds like something a middle school kid would come up with, so it doesn't surprise me coming from Dotard.

I think Wile E Coyote could come up with a better plan than Trump.

 

[Politesse]

Russia is down another major general.

R.I.P., Vitaly Gerassimov.

Ukraine claims it has killed another Russian general during fighting in Kharkiv

Officials say fighting also killed ‘a number’ of senior Russian army officers

www.independent.co.uk

Why should he rest in peace, when he died waging war? He knew what he was signing on to. For the third time. I feel bad when innocents are killed, and that includes at least some soldiers on either side as I reckon things. Most of them are just kids, really. But their groomers can go fuck themselves.

 

[steve_bank]

Trump is doing what he he always done, create attention that puts him in the spotlight without concern for consequences.

When he took office heaisked why he can't use nuclear weapons. He suggeted drinking bleach to cure COVID. From ingerviews with peole who wored for him that was typical. An unfathomable level of ignorance.

From interviews with peole who worked with him. He'dd walk into a meeting tossing out odd things a bit like tossing a hand grenade and walk out leveing peopletto figure out how to deal with it.

To me it is lookinglike that may be Putin to some degree.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Trump is doing what he he always done, create attention that puts him in the spotlight without concern for consequences.

When he took office heaisked why he can't use nuclear weapons. He suggeted drinking bleach to cure COVID. From ingerviews with peole who wored for him that was typical. An unfathomable level of ignorance.

From interviews with peole who worked with him. He'dd walk into a meeting tossing out odd things a bit like tossing a hand grenade and walk out leveing peopletto figure out how to deal with it.

To me it is lookinglike that may be Putin to some degree

Trump is not a smart person. He may be of average adult intelligence but that means he operates at about a seventh grade level.

Two kids are running for class president. One kid promises more recess time and free candy. The other kid promises to try to get more and better equipment for gym classes. Guess who wins?

 

[SLD]

Here’s a Russian POW responding directly to Barbos Posts.

Propaganda or not, guys like this make me hope that there might be some way out of this conflict.

Apparently Russian troops didn't advance at all during the weekend; according to WSJ Russia is trying to get Syrian soldiers to come in to fight. Both news imply that Russia is having trouble with its soldiers' morale. Whether it's just a delay or something more permanent remains to be seen, but nevertheless it gave Ukraine a breather.

I read yesterday that Ukrainians came upon an abandoned Russian APC. The MREs left on board had expired eight years ago.

When my kid was in Afghanistan in 2008 and at that time he was eating MREs that were over 20 years old.

Yes, but they hadn’t expired yet!

 

[ZiprHead]

Here’s a Russian POW responding directly to Barbos Posts.

Propaganda or not, guys like this make me hope that there might be some way out of this conflict.

Apparently Russian troops didn't advance at all during the weekend; according to WSJ Russia is trying to get Syrian soldiers to come in to fight. Both news imply that Russia is having trouble with its soldiers' morale. Whether it's just a delay or something more permanent remains to be seen, but nevertheless it gave Ukraine a breather.

I read yesterday that Ukrainians came upon an abandoned Russian APC. The MREs left on board had expired eight years ago.

When my kid was in Afghanistan in 2008 and at that time he was eating MREs that were over 20 years old.

Yes, but they hadn’t expired yet!

My brother was over there for six months before he got his sand BDUs.

 

[Jayjay]

Here's another video of the attack on Kharkiv that Barbos said was fake.

The video of the guy getting caught in the attack is probably from the same strike. Probably, because I can't really tell from the clip if he's actually in the same building, and because I think there were multiple strikes in that location. But that's the only part of the video that relates to the video barbos was talking about.

The explosion in the beginning, I don't know if that's the same attack or the same city. Seems to be taken at night, so it wouldn't match.

The aftermath shows different buildings, probably the university? In any case, even though it's a different location, it actually makes it worse, because it's not like there was just one "fake" missile attack, the entire city has been bombarded with missiles for quite some time. It's even more ridiculous to claim that this is just Ukrainians shooting at themselves or setting up bombs to make Russia look bad.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Here’s a Russian POW responding directly to Barbos Posts.

Propaganda or not, guys like this make me hope that there might be some way out of this conflict.

Apparently Russian troops didn't advance at all during the weekend; according to WSJ Russia is trying to get Syrian soldiers to come in to fight. Both news imply that Russia is having trouble with its soldiers' morale. Whether it's just a delay or something more permanent remains to be seen, but nevertheless it gave Ukraine a breather.

I read yesterday that Ukrainians came upon an abandoned Russian APC. The MREs left on board had expired eight years ago.

When my kid was in Afghanistan in 2008 and at that time he was eating MREs that were over 20 years old.

Yes, but they hadn’t expired yet!

And still better than the Cracker Barrel.

 

[steve_bank]

I am familiar with a term OBE, overcome by events,

You are working to a plan. Unforeseen and unexpected problems come up. It reaches a point where you loose control of events. All you can do is react as things unfold.

Putin is a control freak, and he is OBE. Nothing is going to plan. I expect he is numb and on autopilot. He is going through the motions because there is nothing else he can do other than escalate untill Ukraine is destroyed otr he fails completely.

I am starting to think NATO should get involved. Provide air cover. It is time to raise the ante and call Putin's handt

However it turns out Putin looses. Russia will be isolated, no one will invest there. It empowers internal Russian opposition. Eventually Europe will get off of Russian energy. Putin and his oligarchs will be bottled up in Russia, except for maybe Cuba.

 

[ZiprHead]

I disagree. Let Putin do the escalation.

I had a thought. Clandestinely hire mercenaries. Keep the weapons and supplies rolling in and put them in the hands of professional experienced soldiers. Pay them through third parties.

 

[blastula]

Russia is down another major general.

R.I.P., Vitaly Gerassimov.

Ukraine claims it has killed another Russian general during fighting in Kharkiv

Officials say fighting also killed ‘a number’ of senior Russian army officers

www.independent.co.uk

 Andrey Sukhovetsky

 Vitaly Gerasimov

And earlier a Chechen general was killed, Magomed Tushayev.

Pro-Putin Chechen general who led 'gay purge' killed in Ukraine - The Jerusalem Post.

 

[Keith&Co.]

The question that keeps cumming up in the news is thwhy is Putin not fully using his air force? Russia jets have been shot down. Russia shoud have total uncontested air superiority.

Apparently Ukraine flying older MIGs are holding their own.

Is he worried about loosing top line jets?

I've wondered that myself. I've Googled it a bit and have only found more questions than answers - and speculation. I have very weak knowledge on the subject of advanced fighter jets and the infrastructure needed to maintain them but I wonder if, given the decrepit state of his ground forces, if he lacks the technology infrastructure and trained service expertise needed to maintain his best technology.

I suspect that the entire Russian military has been hollowed out by corruption and graft.

Every unit has kept just enough working equipment to pass inspection by senior officers who have been bribed not to notice anything wrong; The rest has been exchanged for vodka on the black market, and is currently in Tehran under a hastily applied Iranian Revolutionary Guard paint job.

And/or the senior officers like everyone else in their chain of command pencil-whips reports on combat readiness. As long as everything looks good on paper, all's well. No one wants to report up the chain of command that there's problems in their division, that they can't manage within budgetary constraints.

Before i got out, the Russian economy was such that individual submarine commanders had to choose between paying for maintenance of their systems or paying their crews.

When my kid was in Afghanistan in 2008 and at that time he was eating MREs that were over 20 years old.

Yes, but they hadn’t expired yet!

My brother was over there for six months before he got his sand BDUs.

Yeah, we're always set up to fight the SHIT out of the previous war until well into the current conflict.. Desert storm was equipped for tank war in Europe.
If we were to fight in Ukraine, we'll be in desert camo, with vehicles fitted against sand storms. Maps showing nearest oasis....

In ten years, we'll be in Taiwan, rigged for Ukrainian winters...

 

[Keith&Co.]

I disagree. Let Putin do the escalation.

I had a thought. Clandestinely hire mercenaries. Keep the weapons and supplies rolling in and put them in the hands of professional experienced soldiers. Pay them through third parties.

No, do it openly.
But it's not a war. It's a, whaddaya call, political operation. Protecting civilians for humanitarian reasons, no reason to call it aggression.