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How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

Thomas II said:
https://nypost.com/2022/03/10/fuming-putin-fires-generals-over-ukraine-invasion-losses/

"Enraged Russian President Vladimir Putin has gone on a tear, firing as many as eight generals over Moscow’s military losses in the invasion of Ukraine, Kyiv’s defense chief claims.

Ukraine Defense Secretary Oleksiy Danilov made the claim on Ukrainian TV Wednesday, according to the newspaper Ukrayinska Pravda.

“[The enemy] had about 8 generals removed from their posts because they did not complete the task. New ones have been appointed,” Danilov said.

“We clearly understand what is happening in the Russian Federation,” he added. “What’s more, I can tell they’re desperate.”

The claims by Danilov come amid other indications that all is not well in Moscow..."


"While Putin is busy firing Russian generals, the Ukrainians have been hard at work killing them..."
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Not sure which is worse, getting fired by Putin, or getting shot by a sniper in Ukraine. Although in all fairness, the severance package for anyone being fired by Putin might also include a shot in the head.

I get a little chuckle every time I read news like this, but I know it's not permanent. Putin replacing his generals means that he's at least trying to get his army's act together. And it will probably succeed to some extent, which means harder times for Ukraine. I think Russia can just keep on sending more people and intensify the bombing until he wins. Just like Stalin in WW2.
 
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So, can I expect to see Russia and Cuba in the news soon after this debacle?
 
Elixir said:
ZiprHead said:
View attachment 37673
Click to expand...

An interesting aside... I got banned from Farcebook for a week for sharing that picture.
The facebot said I was "bullying" poor Pootey.
Pootey is so lucky to have the Mother Zucker's skirts to hide under.
Click to expand...
I shared it and nothing happened. Hmmm. Maybe no one complained. I did get suspended for 24 hours for saying we should blow up nordstream.
 
Jayjay said:
Thomas II said:
https://nypost.com/2022/03/10/fuming-putin-fires-generals-over-ukraine-invasion-losses/

"Enraged Russian President Vladimir Putin has gone on a tear, firing as many as eight generals over Moscow’s military losses in the invasion of Ukraine, Kyiv’s defense chief claims.

Ukraine Defense Secretary Oleksiy Danilov made the claim on Ukrainian TV Wednesday, according to the newspaper Ukrayinska Pravda.

“[The enemy] had about 8 generals removed from their posts because they did not complete the task. New ones have been appointed,” Danilov said.

“We clearly understand what is happening in the Russian Federation,” he added. “What’s more, I can tell they’re desperate.”

The claims by Danilov come amid other indications that all is not well in Moscow..."


"While Putin is busy firing Russian generals, the Ukrainians have been hard at work killing them..."
Click to expand...
Not sure which is worse, getting fired by Putin, or getting shot by a sniper in Ukraine. Although in all fairness, the severance package for anyone being fired by Putin might also include a shot in the head.

I get a little chuckle every time I read news like this, but I know it's not permanent. Putin replacing his generals means that he's at least trying to get his army's act together. And it will probably succeed to some extent, which means harder times for Ukraine. I think Russia can just keep on sending more people and intensify the bombing until he wins. Just like Stalin in WW2.
Click to expand...
Maybe. But it’s a good sign. Every general that he fires is another who hates him. What do the front line troops fighting think of their generals or the new ones? Or do they even give a shit? Do they even know?

I’d bet quite a few of them are pissed at all of the generals right now. They were expecting a cake walk, to be welcomed. Now they’re suffering severe casualties. Worse than anything since WWII. Will they last?

Note how the tank column in ysterday’s video fled after their CO was killed. Junior officers don’t know how to take over and lead. There’s no initiative taken by the forces. Granted, the Ukrainians got lucky then. But when your soldiers are told only to obey, that’s all they do. Without orders they fall apart. They aren’t pressing the fight.
 
SLD said:
Elixir said:
ZiprHead said:
View attachment 37673
Click to expand...

An interesting aside... I got banned from Farcebook for a week for sharing that picture.
The facebot said I was "bullying" poor Pootey.
Pootey is so lucky to have the Mother Zucker's skirts to hide under.
Click to expand...
I shared it and nothing happened. Hmmm. Maybe no one complained. I did get suspended for 24 hours for saying we should blow up nordstream.
Click to expand...
My only other one was for saying it’s time to kill the filibuster.
Seriously.
I appealed, they confirmed - it was an incitement to violence.
Seriously fucked up.
 
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Reactions: SLD
www.cnn.com

Analysis: After over three decades of covering Russia, I leave in despair

There is a burning rage when you see what's happening in both Ukraine and Russia, knowing innocents will suffer, and you find your voice strangled and struggling to shout against the obvious concocted insanity of Putin's justification for the war.
www.cnn.com www.cnn.com
(CNN)I leave Moscow angry and sad.
It feels like a passage out of darkness to light, but left behind are friends trapped in one man's tunnel vision.
Russian President Vladimir Putin isn't just destroying Ukraine, but two nations, condemning Russians to an isolation they didn't necessarily choose.
Over the past couple of months while I've been reporting from Moscow, I've met many people who have been horrified, shocked and numbed by Putin's wanton aggression. Some of them believed him when he said he wouldn't invade Ukraine. Some even knew players in the Kremlin inner circle and thought they understood the President's red lines, but now that trust is blown and they fear he has no limits at all.
What makes Putin's actions all the more galling is how he executed his plot in plain sight. Distracting with one hand, transfixing attention on diplomacy, even while insisting falsely that his massed troops were carrying out exercises on Ukraine's borders.
Ordinary Muscovites didn't even flinch as he perpetrated this betrayal by marching the nation to war on a cocktail of carefully stewed grievances.
Putin spent years building a false narrative along with his empire. The wishes that he was denied, such as NATO withdrawing to 1997 lines or barring Ukraine from membership, was the West's fault, he claimed. But if Putin did believe Russia's security was threatened, and that the modern western world was pitted against him, the truth was that he never adjusted to the changing dynamics of the 21st century.
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If the west allows Ukraine to be taken by Putin he will have become stronger and there will be other places he will do the same thing. The west should openly oppose him in western Ukraine, draw a line somewhere. If Putin is going to start WW3 then we will have to fight WW3. Right now that Pig is doing whatever he wants. We are literally allowing him to invade and bomb the fuck out of one of our allies. The Russian Pig gets stronger everyday we hesitate to help Ukraine and Zelensky.

I hope Biden and his people have more up their sleeves then what we've seen to date. We're afraid to help Ukraine openly because Putin will start WW3. We're a bunch of fucking cowards. Making a stand with Ukraine is a gift we should not turn down.
 
Russia can take Ukraine but it’ll cost them their economy. They might defeat Ukraine but they have already lost any benefit.
 
Kherson has fallen
Kherson, Ukraine, is the first and only major city to fall to Russian forces two weeks into the invasion. Russian forces are suppressing dissidents, and locals accuse them of looting. The mayor says they only have about a week of food left.
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www.nbcnews.com

Russian foreign minister denies invading Ukraine as high-level talks fail to secure ceasefire

Ukraine’s foreign minister says Russia is demanding the government’s surrender, while his Russian counterpart denied invading Ukraine. As Ukrainians continue to put up a tough fight, NBC News’ Richard Engel shows us the defenses on the front lines in Irpin.
www.nbcnews.com www.nbcnews.com
 
www.npr.org

The mayor of Melitopol, Ukraine, has been abducted, officials say

Mayor Ivan Fedorov was abducted on Friday, according to Ukrainian officials. He was reportedly seized by approximately 10 people while in the city center, and they put a plastic bag over his head.
www.npr.org www.npr.org
The mayor of Melitopol, Ukraine, was abducted Friday by Russians, according to a statement from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine, in what it calls "a war crime under the Geneva Conventions."

According to Ukraine's parliament, Mayor Ivan Fedorov was detained by approximately 10 people while in the city center.

"During Fedorov's abduction, they put a plastic bag on his head," the parliament said on its official Twitter account.

The ministry has called on the international community to help free Fedorov.

"Russian troops, who have been launching missile and bomb attacks on civilian facilities and infrastructure in Ukraine, including children's hospitals and schools, over the course of two week, are cynically accusing the mayor of 'terrorism,'" the ministry wrote on its verified Facebook page.

"The fact of the abduction of the mayor of Melitopol, along with hundreds of other facts of war crimes by Russian occupiers on the Ukrainian soil, are being carefully documented by law enforcement agencies. The perpetrators of this and other crimes will be brought to the strictest responsibility."
Click to expand...
 
T.G.G. Moogly said:
If the west allows Ukraine to be taken by Putin he will have become stronger and there will be other places he will do the same thing. The west should openly oppose him in western Ukraine, draw a line somewhere. If Putin is going to start WW3 then we will have to fight WW3. Right now that Pig is doing whatever he wants. We are literally allowing him to invade and bomb the fuck out of one of our allies. The Russian Pig gets stronger everyday we hesitate to help Ukraine and Zelensky.

I hope Biden and his people have more up their sleeves then what we've seen to date. We're afraid to help Ukraine openly because Putin will start WW3. We're a bunch of fucking cowards. Making a stand with Ukraine is a gift we should not turn down.
Click to expand...

I don't think it is cowardice to be afraid of Putin starting WW3. Nuclear weapons are good for only two things: deterrence or suicide. When the former fails, the latter succeeds. If there is anything to be avoided at all costs, it is nuclear apocalypse. The reality is that we simply cannot prevent Putin's determination to either subdue Ukraine or completely lay it to waste.

Our only option at this point is to continue isolating Russia diplomatically and economically, provide what help we can to Ukraine in material and moral support, work with allies to mitigate the damage in Eastern Europe, strengthen NATO defenses, and continue to try to find diplomatic solutions to a disaster that is destroying both Ukraine and Russia. What Biden is doing is essentially what we need to keep doing. It is up to Ukrainian leadership to decide whether to surrender or resist. Right now they choose to resist, and we should do what we can, within our limitations, to support them.
 
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