How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[Loren Pechtel]

It was Ukraine that decided to join NATO. And the EU… and upset the commerce of the entire continent t.. now millions of Russian are threatened with starvation because of the Ukraine.. THAT is worth Russia trying to protect its people… Stop defending the Ukrainian trouble makers. Russia ha a right to defend itself from the Ukrainian threat to their people.

Ukraine didn't join NATO.

There was discussion of joining the EU, but it didn't happen.

And the only reason Russians are in trouble is that Putin decided to make a power grab. Put the blame where it belongs, with that asshole-in-chief.

 

[Elixir]

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

If Pootey really goes off the deep end, Russia might end up begging NATO Countries to invade after their own Country gets decimated by reciprocal action. Seems that Countries that get "reconstruction" help, end up doing better than their helpers after a surprisingly short time.
O gawd. What if THAT's Pootey's plan?

 

[lpetrich]

People are tracking Russian oligarchs’ private jets and superyachts - The Washington Post - "Schadenfreude abounds online as the luxury toys of Russia’s richest residents are seized"

There’s just something satisfying about watching online as a billionaire’s luxury yacht moves around the globe — and then gets snagged by law enforcement as part of sanctions designed to crack down on Russia.

Alex Finley thinks of it as schadenfreude, or getting pleasure from another’s troubles. Finley, an author and former CIA officer, is online tweeting names, locations, ownership and the latest status of various yachts owned by Russian oligarchs.

Seeing the yachts being seized feels like a “little bit of justice,” Finley said.

...
They use sites like VesselFinder, MarineTraffic or SuperYachtFan where you can type in a ship’s name or unique identifiers, known as an International Maritime Organization (IMO) number or Maritime Mobile Service Identity (MMSI). Thanks to similar satellite-based tracking technology, oligarchs’ private jet locations can also be tracked online through sites like Flightradar24.com. It’s not just location information. Some of the more expensive and well known yachts have their own Wikipedia pages and online followings, where details about their most over-the-top features are documented.

• Free AIS Ship Tracker - VesselFinder
• MarineTraffic: Global Ship Tracking Intelligence | AIS Marine Traffic
• SUPERYACHTFAN • SuperYacht • Yacht Owners • Private Jet • Billionaires
• Flightradar24: Live Flight Tracker - Real-Time Flight Tracker Map

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

A person drunk on power is not in his right mind. The Russian Pig needs to be rationally opposed and resisted at every step that occurs outside his mob territory. Ukraine is outside his mob territory so he and his thugs are fair game.

I see he lost another one of his high ranking cronies. Excellent.

 

[steve_bank]

The Russian people have been fed state media propaganda for a long time that NATO is an imminent existential thereat to Russia.

From polling and inerviews in Russia it appease the propaganda worked, a large number of people believe it.

The polls quoted by western media say about 2/3 of Russians support the war.

After9/11 there was small mid west town that wanted federal military weapons to deal with a potential terrorist threat. Some were afraid there was a terrorist behind every tree waiting to ambush them.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

A person drunk on power is not in his right mind. The Russian Pig needs to be rationally opposed and resisted at every step that occurs outside his mob territory. Ukraine is outside his mob territory so he and his thugs are fair game.

I see he lost another one of his high ranking cronies. Excellent.

Do you even read what you posted?
“So he and his thugs are fair game”?
THEN HE HAS A RIGHT TO DEFEND HIMSELF.
So don’t whine when he starts using his NUKES.
You are asking for it. Read the following
“In 2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.”
Russia must defend itself against this Ukrainian attempt to gain control of the area. Or Russians will be left starving as Ukraine tightens the noose to trade in the area.. Russia should have invaded Ukraine years ago decades ago…

 

[bilby]

I am not sure if your grin is one of agreement or one of sarcasm…

Well, we can add that to the list of things you don't understand, though it's probably easier to just write "everything", and tolerate the utterly trivial error thus entailed.

 

[crazyfingers]

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

A person drunk on power is not in his right mind. The Russian Pig needs to be rationally opposed and resisted at every step that occurs outside his mob territory. Ukraine is outside his mob territory so he and his thugs are fair game.

I see he lost another one of his high ranking cronies. Excellent.

Do you even read what you posted?
“So he and his thugs are fair game”?
THEN HE HAS A RIGHT TO DEFEND HIMSELF.
So don’t whine when he starts using his NUKES.
You are asking for it. Read the following
“In 2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.”
Russia must defend itself against this Ukrainian attempt to gain control of the area. Or Russians will be left starving as Ukraine tightens the noose to trade in the area.. Russia should have invaded Ukraine years ago decades ago…

What the fuck would any sane person do if 3 years earlier Russia had stolen a significant coastal chunk of your country. Jesus fucking Christ.

 

[ZiprHead]

"For God's sake, this man cannot remain in power," Biden announced at the very conclusion of a capstone address delivered at the Royal Castle in Warsaw.

It was the furthest Biden has gone in calling for regime change - CNN rolling

Not a good statement, Joe.

It is not for Joe Biden to decide if Vladimir Putin stays in power, the Kremlin says.

According to Reuters, a Kremlin spokesman responded: "That's not for Biden to decide. The president of Russia is elected by Russians."

Ya gotta love that Russian comedy though.

 

[ZiprHead]

Russian soldiers release Ukraine town’s mayor and agree to leave after protests

Russian forces agreed to leave town of Slavutych if those with arms handed them over to the mayor

www.theguardian.com

A mayor in a Ukrainian town occupied by Russian forces has been released from captivity and the soldiers have agreed to leave after a mass protest by residents.

Slavutych, a northern town close to the Chernobyl nuclear site, was taken by Russian forces but stun grenades and overhead fire failed to disperse unarmed protesters on its main square on Saturday.

The crowd demanded the release of mayor Yuri Fomichev, who had been taken prisoner by the Russian troops.
Attempts by Russian troops to intimidate the growing protest failed and on Saturday afternoon Fomichev was let go by his captors.

An agreement was made that the Russians would leave the town if those with arms handed them over to the mayor with a dispensation for those with hunting rifles.

Fomichev told those protesting that the Russians had agreed to withdraw “if there are no [Ukrainian] military in the city”.

The deal struck, the mayor said, was that the Russians would make a search for Ukrainian soldiers and arms and then depart. One Russian checkpoint outside the city would remain.

 

[Copernicus]

"For God's sake, this man cannot remain in power," Biden announced at the very conclusion of a capstone address delivered at the Royal Castle in Warsaw.

It was the furthest Biden has gone in calling for regime change - CNN rolling

Not a good statement, Joe.

It is not for Joe Biden to decide if Vladimir Putin stays in power, the Kremlin says.

According to Reuters, a Kremlin spokesman responded: "That's not for Biden to decide. The president of Russia is elected by Russians."

Ya gotta love that Russian comedy though.

But the Kremlin spokesman is right. Russians should be able to choose their president in a free and fair election. That won't happen as long as Putin remains in power.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

What the fuck would any sane person do if 3 years earlier Russia had stolen a significant coastal chunk of your country. Jesus fucking Christ.

I don't bother even responding to such blather. That general that got killed is the same boot licker that said Ukraine would capitulate in a matter of hours. What a loser. It is unfortunate that so many conscripted Russians have to die because of such idiots.

 

[Jayjay]

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

A person drunk on power is not in his right mind. The Russian Pig needs to be rationally opposed and resisted at every step that occurs outside his mob territory. Ukraine is outside his mob territory so he and his thugs are fair game.

I see he lost another one of his high ranking cronies. Excellent.

Do you even read what you posted?
“So he and his thugs are fair game”?
THEN HE HAS A RIGHT TO DEFEND HIMSELF.
So don’t whine when he starts using his NUKES.
You are asking for it. Read the following
“In 2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.”
Russia must defend itself against this Ukrainian attempt to gain control of the area. Or Russians will be left starving as Ukraine tightens the noose to trade in the area.. Russia should have invaded Ukraine years ago decades ago…

Russia did invade Ukraine years ago, 2014 to be specific.

You've quoted that paragraph about Ukraine seeking NATO membership 3 or 4 times already. So what? Every nation has a freedom to seek membership in international organizations. But that doesn't even mean Ukraine would have been admitted to being a member. For one thing, NATO doesn't want members who have active territorial disputes with other countries, like Ukraine did with Russia. The application wasn't a threat to Russia at all and certainly didn't warrant a new invasion.

NATO or even EU membership wouldn't have left Russians starving. They could have traded with Ukraine and transported gas to Europe just as before. On the other hand, this war has destroyed Ukraine's harvest for at least a year, causing serious food shortages all over the world.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

A person drunk on power is not in his right mind. The Russian Pig needs to be rationally opposed and resisted at every step that occurs outside his mob territory. Ukraine is outside his mob territory so he and his thugs are fair game.

I see he lost another one of his high ranking cronies. Excellent.

Do you even read what you posted?
“So he and his thugs are fair game”?
THEN HE HAS A RIGHT TO DEFEND HIMSELF.
So don’t whine when he starts using his NUKES.
You are asking for it. Read the following
“In 2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.”
Russia must defend itself against this Ukrainian attempt to gain control of the area. Or Russians will be left starving as Ukraine tightens the noose to trade in the area.. Russia should have invaded Ukraine years ago decades ago…

What the fuck would any sane person do if 3 years earlier Russia had stolen a significant coastal chunk of your country. Jesus fucking Christ.

First having a neutral country as a buffer zone limits hostiKitties. When Ukraine chose to approach NATO it would cause Russia to be directly adjoined to Ukraine. With the neutral Ukraine buffer zone in the control of Russia or NATO the buffer zone is eliminated.

 

[AGodForTheAtheist]

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

A person drunk on power is not in his right mind. The Russian Pig needs to be rationally opposed and resisted at every step that occurs outside his mob territory. Ukraine is outside his mob territory so he and his thugs are fair game.

I see he lost another one of his high ranking cronies. Excellent.

Do you even read what you posted?
“So he and his thugs are fair game”?
THEN HE HAS A RIGHT TO DEFEND HIMSELF.
So don’t whine when he starts using his NUKES.
You are asking for it. Read the following
“In 2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.”
Russia must defend itself against this Ukrainian attempt to gain control of the area. Or Russians will be left starving as Ukraine tightens the noose to trade in the area.. Russia should have invaded Ukraine years ago decades ago…

Russia did invade Ukraine years ago, 2014 to be specific.

You've quoted that paragraph about Ukraine seeking NATO membership 3 or 4 times already. So what? Every nation has a freedom to seek membership in international organizations. But that doesn't even mean Ukraine would have been admitted to being a member. For one thing, NATO doesn't want members who have active territorial disputes with other countries, like Ukraine did with Russia. The application wasn't a threat to Russia at all and certainly didn't warrant a new invasion.

NATO or even EU membership wouldn't have left Russians starving. They could have traded with Ukraine and transported gas to Europe just as before. On the other hand, this war has destroyed Ukraine's harvest for at least a year, causing serious food shortages all over the world.

I respectfully disagree. Regardless of whether or not that situation could be realized, the threat is there. It gives Ukraine and Russia the impetus to protect themselves from the dangers of the possibility that the other side would use this… as they are doing right now for a security of control of the Ukrainian which would destroy the neutrality that is creating that buffer zone

 

[crazyfingers]

First having a neutral country as a buffer zone limits hostiKitties. When Ukraine chose to approach NATO it would cause Russia to be directly adjoined to Ukraine. With the neutral Ukraine buffer zone in the control of Russia or NATO the buffer zone is eliminated.

Why don't you volunteer to be that neutral buffer between NATO and Russia and report back what it's like.

Why would any country that values democracy and self determination want to be put out as feed for Russia to eat?

 

[ZiprHead]

No one in his right mind would worry that NATO is just going to go invade Russia.

A person drunk on power is not in his right mind. The Russian Pig needs to be rationally opposed and resisted at every step that occurs outside his mob territory. Ukraine is outside his mob territory so he and his thugs are fair game.

I see he lost another one of his high ranking cronies. Excellent.

Do you even read what you posted?
“So he and his thugs are fair game”?
THEN HE HAS A RIGHT TO DEFEND HIMSELF.
So don’t whine when he starts using his NUKES.
You are asking for it. Read the following
“In 2017, Ukraine adopted a constitutional amendment that committed itself to NATO membership. Ukraine then adopted a National Security Strategy aimed at developing its NATO partnership in 2021. The NATO application process “has been dragging on for an indecently long time,” Ukraine Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said in September 2021.”
Russia must defend itself against this Ukrainian attempt to gain control of the area. Or Russians will be left starving as Ukraine tightens the noose to trade in the area.. Russia should have invaded Ukraine years ago decades ago…

Russia did invade Ukraine years ago, 2014 to be specific.

You've quoted that paragraph about Ukraine seeking NATO membership 3 or 4 times already. So what? Every nation has a freedom to seek membership in international organizations. But that doesn't even mean Ukraine would have been admitted to being a member. For one thing, NATO doesn't want members who have active territorial disputes with other countries, like Ukraine did with Russia. The application wasn't a threat to Russia at all and certainly didn't warrant a new invasion.

NATO or even EU membership wouldn't have left Russians starving. They could have traded with Ukraine and transported gas to Europe just as before. On the other hand, this war has destroyed Ukraine's harvest for at least a year, causing serious food shortages all over the world.

I respectfully disagree. Regardless of whether or not that situation could be realized, the threat is there. It gives Ukraine and Russia the impetus to protect themselves from the dangers of the possibility that the other side would use this… as they are doing right now for a security of control of the Ukrainian which would destroy the neutrality that is creating that buffer zone

This makes no sense. If Russia takes control of Ukraine and makes it part of Russia again, one of Putin's stated goals, there will be several NATO countries on its border.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

First having a neutral country as a buffer zone limits hostiKitties. When Ukraine chose to approach NATO it would cause Russia to be directly adjoined to Ukraine. With the neutral Ukraine buffer zone in the control of Russia or NATO the buffer zone is eliminated.

Buffer zones aren't very relevant with modern weapons.

And NATO is a defensive alliance. If Ukraine was so insane as to attack Russia NATO wouldn't come to their aid.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

First having a neutral country as a buffer zone limits hostiKitties. When Ukraine chose to approach NATO it would cause Russia to be directly adjoined to Ukraine. With the neutral Ukraine buffer zone in the control of Russia or NATO the buffer zone is eliminated.

Why don't you volunteer to be that neutral buffer between NATO and Russia and report back what it's like.

Putin's billion dollar yacht is looking for a new crew. Opportunities abound to serve the Russian Pig.

 

[zorq]

I respectfully disagree. Regardless of whether or not that situation could be realized, the threat is there.

NATO is a defensive alliance. They are no threat to anyone.

... Unless someone is intent on attacking them? Who do we know in Europe who likes to attack other nations?

It gives Ukraine and Russia the impetus to protect themselves from the dangers of the possibility that the other side would use this… as they are doing right now for a security of control of the Ukrainian which would destroy the neutrality that is creating that buffer zone

Yeah, it is so understandable to go off and murder a whole bunch of people who are neutral to me because I'm paranoid that they might make friends with some people who don't like me. I did that just the other day. The folks at the supermarket all had to die or become my slaves because I saw them selling apples to that bitch who warned me not to trespass on her property last week.

Totally a reasonable reaction, don't you think? Don't you have so much empathy for my murder spree?