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How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

Harry Bosch said:
Oh, I agree with you. I don't think that Utin really wants a peace. But they tell the world that in order to cry that they are the victims. Haven't you been reading Aup's posts? The only way to stop Russians from stealing land and kidnapping children is to stop they with bullets. The west needs to send more weapons to Ukraine. Far more air defense capability. We need to increase sanctions on Russia. Freeze them out of economic opportunities until they are willing and able to follow international law.
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Force is the only thing that has ever stopped this kind of behavior. Russian Hitler will only stop when he has no other choice. He may have some surprises up his sleeve if the west ever ups the ante and provides Ukraine with the weaponry it needs. But he's never going to use nukes, particularly because the empty threats already have us shitting our pants with fear.
 

Russia Paid Millions to YouTubers to Help Russia & Trump Win​

(at 14:20)
Two Russian citizens who work for RT News have been indicted by the Department of Justice for money laundering and failing to register as foreign agents after paying millions to a group of right-wing podcasters and influencers including Lauren Chen, Tim Pool, Lauren Southern, Tayler Hansen, Matt Christiansen, Dave Rubin, and Benny Johnson.

 
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Then Estonia does not have much to worry about.

One of those pesky unintended consequences for Putin. He went to war in part bw3cause Ukraine might join NATO, now he has new members of NATO on his birder.

I bet that hurts.
 
steve_bank said:
Estonia appears to be flapping in the breeze. An EU member but not NATO.
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Estonia has been a full NATO member state for twenty years. It joined both tne EU and NATO in 2004, and has actually been in NATO for 33 days longer than it has been in the EU.

Estonia became a full NATO member on 29 March 2004, and an EU member state on 1 May of that year.

Estonia currently hosts one of the eight NATO "Eastern Battlegroups", made up of mostly UK forces, with contributions from France and Iceland.

The Estonian battlegroup (along with the battlegroups in Latvia, Lithuania, and Poland) is a part of the Multinational Corps Northeast, headquartered in Szczecin, Poland; It is fully integrated into the NATO command structure for European operations.
 
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steve_bank said:
One of those pesky unintended consequences for Putin. He went to war in part bw3cause Ukraine might join NATO, now he has new members of NATO on his birder.
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He has had those members on his border for two decades now.

Causes rarely happen ten years after their effects; The annexation of Crimea could not have been an attempt to keep the Baltic states out of NATO, because when Crimea was annexed, they had already been in NATO for a decade.
 
He did just "gain" Sweden, but maybe we could fix that by taking Kaliningrad away?
We'd be doing Ootey a favor according to Ootey.
 
I typed in 'is Estonia part of nato' and got a site hat said EU and not NATO. I did not look at the NATO member list.

Fake retorting?

en.wikipedia.org

Borders of Russia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

NATO members on Russia;s borders

Estonia
Norway
Lithuania
Poland
Finland
Bulgaria is on the Black Sea
Sweden borders Finland and Norway

A war with NATO would be unlikely.

Short of nuclear weapons Russia could not prevail against NATO.

Any idea of a glorious modern Russian empire is fantasy.

The alliance has increased its NATO Response Force deployments in Eastern Europe, and the combined militaries of all NATO members include around 3.5 million soldiers and personnel. All member states together cover an area of 25.07 million km² and about 966.88 million people.
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The Russian population could not support a war against all NATO membersr populations. Plus economics and the ability to make ammunition.

Putin is boxed in. Maybe he is completely deluded.
 
After Ukraine, there is only Moldova which is not a member-state bordering Europe (and Belo-Russia):


- After Ukraine has won its war, the situation in Bela-Rus will be very interesting.
- I think Moldova is working on a NATO membership. Their quite weak army might be a problem. Finland had this problem, among other problems, but built up its army in the last 50 years, little by little.
- Russia is in a very bad financial situation. Nobody wants rules anymore, not even China. Putin will be history within a year as everything is crumbling. But who will be the next Adolf?

I hope that Putin stays in power so long that the oligarchs will see, that imperialism is a dead-end street.
Once there was this "night of the long knives" in Germany and I would be very astonished if there were not "the night of open windows" in Russia.
 
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You are still discussing what some random estonian idiot was asked to say?
Baltic Vymirates are nothing but a neocon lapdogs. Neocons tell them "Bark at Russia" and they do.
That's all there is to it. Sometimes they bark without command, but that's just how dogs are.
 
barbos said:
You are still discussing what some random estonian idiot was asked to say?
Baltic Vymirates are nothing but a neocon lapdogs. Neocons tell them "Bark at Russia" and they do.
That's all there is to it. Sometimes they bark without command, but that's just how dogs are.
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No, no. We are still discussing what you say. Your are not a random idiot. We've all known your for many years now.
 
Henry-Finland said:
Their quite weak army might be a problem. Finland had this problem, among other problems, but built up its army in the last 50 years, little by little.
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The Finns have always made up in quality for what they lack in quantity.

There's an old joke from the Winter War, which I am sure you have heard, but which bears repeating:

A Russian General is inspecting the front line, and hears a voice from behind a snowdrift "One Finnish soldier can beat ten Russians!"​
​
Incensed by this cheek, the General immediately orders ten soldiers to go and bring back the Finn, dead or alive. The detail disappears behind the snowbank, and the sound of a fierce struggle can be heard. Then, silence.​
​
And then the same voice calls out "One Finnish soldier can beat fifty Russians!"​
​
The General is enraged. He orders fifty men to go and get the Finn, with orders to kill him on sight, and bring back his body. The Russian soldiers once again disappear into the snow, and once again, sounds of intense battle can be heard. Then, silence.​
​
And then, astonishingly, the same voice calls out "One Finnish soldier can beat an entire company of Russians!"​
​
The General turns a dangerous shade of purple, and orders an entire reinforced company, 150 men, with light artillery and close air support, to do whatever is needed to kill this Finn, and bring his body back.​
​
The company march off into the snow, and a huge battle can be heard. Planes streak overhead, bombs explode, machine guns and artillery fire shatter the air. And then, silence.​
​
No! Not quite! A badly wounded Russian soldier, moaning from his injuries, is bravely crawling back towards the Russian lines. As he nears, this sole survivor cries out with his last breath, "General! It's a trap! Don't send any more men!" ...​
​
"There are two of them!"​
 
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barbos said:
You are still discussing what some random estonian idiot was asked to say?
Baltic Vymirates are nothing but a neocon lapdogs. Neocons tell them "Bark at Russia" and they do.
That's all there is to it. Sometimes they bark without command, but that's just how dogs are.
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You haven't realized that this is now news all over:


Your idiot is also there.
Tim Pool has now changed sides as he does not get any money from Russia anymore.
He explains that he is a victim!
 
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barbos said:
You are still discussing what some random estonian idiot was asked to say?
Baltic Vymirates are nothing but a neocon lapdogs. Neocons tell them "Bark at Russia" and they do.
That's all there is to it. Sometimes they bark without command, but that's just how dogs are.
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What we are discussing is a Russian's random nonsense propaganda.

There is probably audio recordings somewhere online of old Soviet propaganda broadcasts. I used to listen to them on shortwave radio. China as well and Russian client states.

I bet it would sound like you. Are you banging your shoe and pounding your fists on your desk like Khrushchev did at the UN?

The text of the speech.


Putin and Khrushchev have the same vocalizations and tone of voice.

 
Tim Pool was getting $100,000 a video to spew pro-Russian propaganda. Clip from a few weeks ago had him saying Ukraine is our enemy, that we should stop sending aid, and apologize to Russia. The claim is they had no idea who was the 'investor' paying all this money. So are they completely incurious about the world around them, total idiots, or lying?

Oh, and Ukraine is now raining fire on the invaders

 
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