How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[Jimmy Higgins]

Ownership of Greenland Ukraine is Essential to Our Security

You can't have Ukraine.

You said we already took it.

And we taking it back.

It seems terribly daft for you to say we can't have something you say we already have. Clearly you think can we have it. You just don't want us to.

 

[barbos]

Ownership of Greenland Ukraine is Essential to Our Security

You can't have Ukraine.

You said we already took it.

And we taking it back.

It seems terribly daft for you to say we can't have something you say we already have. Clearly you think can we have it. You just don't want us to.

You had had Ukraine for 8 years. Now we are taking it back. So you can't have it.

 

[SLD]

Ownership of Greenland Ukraine is Essential to Our Security

You can't have Ukraine.

You said we already took it.

And we taking it back.

It seems terribly daft for you to say we can't have something you say we already have. Clearly you think can we have it. You just don't want us to.

You had had Ukraine for 8 years. Now we are taking it back. So you can't have it.

Do you really think that is what the Ukrainians want?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

You {USA} can't have Ukraine.

You {USA} had had Ukraine for 8 years. Now we are taking it back.

In Soviet Russia, you can't have what you already have.

 

[Elixir]

Babs is confused, but it doesn’t matter.
His crap does need to be coherent, as long as his superiors think it sounds like he’s cheering on Dear Leader.

 

[barbos]

Do you really think that is what the Ukrainians want?

Does not really matter what they want, especially if they are nazis.
Speaking of getting what one is wanting, Montenegro did not want to be in NATO, they got into NATO anyway.
By the way, ukrainians did not want to be in NATO either. Did not matter to NATO, they said Ukraine would be in NATO.
So it does not matter what ukrainians want regardless.
To put it simply, they as people, lost their right to decide for themselves for undetermined amount of time.

 

[SLD]

Do you really think that is what the Ukrainians want?

Does not really matter what they want, especially if they are nazis.
Speaking of getting what one is wanting, Montenegro did not want to be in NATO, they got into NATO anyway.
By the way, ukrainians did not want to be in NATO either. Did not matter to NATO, they said Ukraine would be in NATO.
So it does not matter what ukrainians want regardless.
To put it simply, they as people, lost their right to decide for themselves for undetermined amount of time.

Montenegro is free to leave NATO anytime they want.

When did NATO approve Ukraine’s membership?

And why exactly have they lost their right to self determination?

 

[barbos]

Montenegro is free to leave NATO anytime they want.

But they did not want NATO in the first place.

When did NATO approve Ukraine’s membership?

In early 2000s NATO published their expansion into Ukraine plans.

And why exactly have they lost their right to self determination?

For the same reason Germans/japanese lost it after the WW2.

And to this day, both Germany and Japan are occupied (by US) countries.

 

[SLD]

Montenegro is free to leave NATO anytime they want.

But they did not want NATO in the first place.

When did NATO approve Ukraine’s membership?

In early 2000s NATO published their expansion into Ukraine plans.

And why exactly have they lost their right to self determination?

For the same reason Germans/japanese lost it after the WW2.

And to this day, both Germany and Japan are occupied (by US) countries.

Wait. Ukraine invaded and conquered a bunch of other countries and committed genocide against minorities?

I guess I missed that.

 

[bilby]

Forcing a country to join a mutual defence agreement would be futile if it were even possible.

What, exactly, does the USA or UK, or France gain by persuading Montenegro to agree to modernise her army, spend a minimum percentage of her (tiny) GDP on it, and to respond to an attack on Estonia as though it were an attack on Montenegro herself?

It gives the rest of NATO access to a tiny amount of extra firepower; It gives Montenegro access to vast and overwhelming firepower if "someone" attacks Montenegro. But it does nothing at all for Montenegro if the Montenegran government decides to invade a neighbour.

Countries join mutual defence pacts because they are a good way to deter agression. The civilised world likes such pacts, because they lead to more stability, and less war. The only reason to dislike such pacts is if you wanted to be able to use your big army to crush small neighbours with impunity.

NATO is a logistics and coordination organisation that seeks to make it easier for disparate national armed forces to cooperate with each other for their mutual defence. It's entire schtick is "If you attack any of us, all of us will fight back".

Only bullies have any reason to dislike mutual defence pacts.

 

[TV and credit cards]

And to this day, both Germany and Japan are occupied (by US) countries.

I'd bet Poland would love to be occupied (by US).

 

[barbos]

Forcing a country to join a mutual defence agreement would be futile if it were even possible.

There is nothing mutual about NATO or EU for that matter expansion into smaller countries.

 

[barbos]

Montenegro is free to leave NATO anytime they want.

But they did not want NATO in the first place.

When did NATO approve Ukraine’s membership?

In early 2000s NATO published their expansion into Ukraine plans.

And why exactly have they lost their right to self determination?

For the same reason Germans/japanese lost it after the WW2.

And to this day, both Germany and Japan are occupied (by US) countries.

Wait. Ukraine invaded and conquered a bunch of other countries and committed genocide against minorities?

I guess I missed that.

Actually yes. Regime in Kiev did commit a genocide against minorities.
Both cultural and literal genocide against russian "minority" and hungarian minority.
As for invasions. I am not waiting until these assholes are capable of invasion. But the truth is, they got large chunks of other countries territories by accidents.

 

[barbos]

And to this day, both Germany and Japan are occupied (by US) countries.

I'd bet Poland would love to be occupied (by US).

I bet that too. Does not make it right.
People often want shitty things. Ask germans.

 

[Patooka]

I've gotta say barbs, this os the most incoherent and inconsistent I've ever seen you. By your logic Russia invaded and "took" Syria, Kazakhstan, Armenia, Belarus and a whole bunch of other nations.

I'm calling bullshit on that nonsense.

 

[barbos]

I've gotta say barbos, this is the most incoherent and inconsistent I've ever seen you. By your logic Russia invaded and "took" Syria, Kazakhstan, Armenia, Belarus and a whole bunch of other nations.

I'm calling bullshit on that nonsense.

You must be clearly ignorant of facts and history to say that. It's not entirely your fault of course, but....

 

[Patooka]

Like I said...

 

[barbos]

Like I said...

And like I said.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

American idiots shoot down passenger aircrafts too.
In this particular case pilots appears were not aware that they were shot.
They reported bird strike and the aircraft appeared to be under control until much later.
The question is, why they were not diverted immediately once the ukro-terrorist attack was detected.

So you admit Russia is the Nazis? Because this was a Russian missile, not a Ukrainian one.

You are confused, Ukrainian side are Nazi, russian side are russian.

You said the terrorists shot down the plane. It was unquestionably a Russian missile. Ergo, the terrorists are Russian.

As for reporting a bird strike--what's more likely, bird strike or hit by a missile?

You need to check your reading comprehension, I never said it was a bird strike.

Post in thread 'How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?'

Dec 27, 2024

American idiots shoot down passenger aircrafts too.
In this particular case pilots appears were not aware that they were shot.
They reported bird strike and the aircraft appeared to be under control until much later.
The question is, why they were not diverted immediately once the ukro-terrorist attack was detected.

• barbos

You said the pilots reported a bird strike.

Both will seem to be the plane hit something, they aren't going to go out and examine things to figure it out. If the missile ripped fragments through the airplane they will know, but if it simply ate an engine all they'll know is the engine blew. Missile? Bird? Fish? Snake? They'll go with the most likely, bird. (And while I've never heard of a fish or a snake bringing down a plane such collisions do happen.)

And the problem was caused by your GPS jamming.

Nope, it was caused by a missile hit.

Yes, now we know it was a missile. I was addressing why the pilot reporting a bird strike isn't evidence it wasn't a missile.

And you're missing the bigger picture. The plane was hit by a missile after it had to abort an approach because of the GPS jamming. You jammed it, the pilots did something unexpected (but not wildly alien--planes miss approaches for various reasons. I've been on one that did a go-around because somebody else was being a slowpoke) as a result, one of your missile crews reacted to that and shot it down.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I’d love to hear better alternatives to encouraging Russian aggression.

You (the west or Deep state more specifically) can start by stopping lying. Then starting to keep your promises.
Of course that's not going to happen becasue Deep State would have to cease to exist for that to happen.
Deep State can not admit making a boo-boo with their plan to destroy Russia. They will quadruple down on BS.

Why in the world would NATO plan to destroy Russia?

Ask them. I can only speculate. But they admit that this is their plan.

You're doing a fine job of it yourself and I'm sure you're aware of the old adage about not interrupting an enemy while they're making a mistake.

Nice try. but you are projecting.

How badly the Russian army has performed to date very clearly shows I was right.