#IStandWithAhmed (or Inventing While Muslim is a thing?)

[Jolly_Penguin]

I still don't understand what this kid was thinking. Was this an intentional hoax to get attention and a politically correct backlash, including his invitation to the white house and now this big law suit? I'm not sure I'm ready to make that accusation, but I think it very well could have been. All this kid did was disassemble a clock and put it in a form that looked vageuly like a bomb... for no apparent purpose other than to show it to people.

 

[zorq]

“A child may not be left unattended in a juvenile processing office and is entitled to be accompanied by the child’s parent, guardian, or other custodian or by the child’s attorney,” Section 52.025
Mohamed did not see his parents until he was released from a juvenile detention center, according to police and his family.

This was a violation of the law.


One of the civil rights citizens of the US enjoy is a right to legal council. By refusing to mirandize him and refusing him access to his parents while interrogating him they effectively denied him of this civil right. The consequences of this may only apply to admitting testimony into evidence in a criminal case but they constitute an actual civil rights violation.

 

[Arctish]

f the Principal had confiscated the thing and sent Ahmed back to class, we never would have heard about it. The whole discussion is centered on probable cause, and the role Ahmed's religion played in the decision to take him out of school in handcuffs for the not-crime of bringing a clock to school, and the other not-crime of maintaining his clock was a clock.

Sure they could have simply confiscated the hoax bomb clock but they felt they needed to do more to discourage future hoaxes clocks. He wasn't arrested for the non-crime of bringing a clock to school. Once you take the wires out of a well designed clock case and shabbily put them in a large different case and bring that case somewhere it doesn't belong to school its no longer just a clock its a hoax bomb case mod clock.

fyp

 

[Arctish]

I still don't understand what this kid was thinking. Was this an intentional hoax to get attention and a politically correct backlash, including his invitation to the white house and now this big law suit? I'm not sure I'm ready to make that accusation, but I think it very well could have been. All this kid did was disassemble a clock and put it in a form that looked vageuly like a bomb... for no apparent purpose other than to show it to people.

He said what he was thinking. He wanted to show his robotics teacher the kind of electronic tinkering he did at home in the hopes that his teacher would give him more challenging assignments.

It doesn't have to make sense to you, an adult who probably never built a case mod in your entire life. But to a teenager in a robotics class, taking the electronic components from something and installing them into a different housing to make an unusual but still functional item makes perfect sense. It's what those kids like to do.

 

[zorq]

I still don't understand what this kid was thinking. Was this an intentional hoax to get attention and a politically correct backlash, including his invitation to the white house and now this big law suit? I'm not sure I'm ready to make that accusation, but I think it very well could have been. All this kid did was disassemble a clock and put it in a form that looked vageuly like a bomb... for no apparent purpose other than to show it to people.

Could you orchestrate a plot like this to get invited to a meeting with the president? You really think this was intentional? How could he predict the asinine behavior of the authorities of the school, the police and the city? It seems much more likely that showing off his clock would net him the reaction that his science teacher displayed than the one his English teacher displayed. i.e. "Huh, that's nice, now put it away, it's not time for show and tell."

Ahmed's lawyers say that his pencil-case only looks sort of like a bomb from one specific angle, (the one the police took pictures of and publicized) and at nearly every other angle it looks unmistakably like a pencil case.

I find the odds that Ahmed or his family are masters of intrigue to be highly dubious.

 

[angelo]

But clock boy claimed he built it. He didn't say he dismantled a clock and put the parts elsewhere.

 

[barbos]

"Probable cause is the key issue in the arrest process. The police need probable cause to make an arrest or obtain an arrest warrant from a judge.

There is a shitload of probable cause here.

 

[repoman]

This is a real tweet:

 

[barbos]

If the Principal had confiscated the thing and sent Ahmed back to class, we never would have heard about it.

That's not the current policy and it will never be.

The whole discussion is centered on probable cause, and the role Ahmed's religion played in the decision to take him out of school in handcuffs for the not-crime of bringing a clock to school, and the other not-crime of maintaining his clock was a clock.

It was not a clock. it was a hoax bomb.

 

[blastula]

You CAN be arrested even if there is no crime. Although I believe in this particular case there was a crime, but there was not enough evidence to successfully prosecute.

Believing something without evidence is religious delusion and often bigotry.

 

[barbos]

I find the odds that Ahmed or his family are masters of intrigue to be highly dubious.

Nobody really suggests that anymore. They all are actually pretty stupid, but being opportunistic asshole is compatible with being stupid.

You CAN be arrested even if there is no crime. Although I believe in this particular case there was a crime, but there was not enough evidence to successfully prosecute.

Believing something without evidence is religious delusion and often bigotry.

I believe with evidence.

 

[Arctish]

But clock boy claimed he built it. He didn't say he dismantled a clock and put the parts elsewhere.

There's a place in Mexico where people build Dodge trucks. They take engines and parts out of packing crates and install them into truck frames. That doesn't mean they think they invented trucks.

 

[Arctish]

That's not the current policy and it will never be.

The whole discussion is centered on probable cause, and the role Ahmed's religion played in the decision to take him out of school in handcuffs for the not-crime of bringing a clock to school, and the other not-crime of maintaining his clock was a clock.

It was not a clock. it was a hoax bomb.

Saying it over and over again doesn't make it true, you know.

 

[barbos]

That's not the current policy and it will never be.

It was not a clock. it was a hoax bomb.

Saying it over and over again doesn't make it true, you know.

And yet you keep saying it over and over.
Police was pretty clear since the beginning that he was arrested for hoax bomb

 

[Arctish]

Saying it over and over again doesn't make it true, you know.

And yet you keep saying it over and over.
Police was pretty clear since the beginning that he was arrested for hoax bomb

No, the Chief of Police said they took him to the juvenile detention center because he kept insisting the thing was a clock, and he was "not forthcoming" about other possible uses. They had nothing to justify an arrest, and they knew it. That's why they didn't even try.

 

[barbos]

And yet you keep saying it over and over.
Police was pretty clear since the beginning that he was arrested for hoax bomb

No, the Chief of Police said they took him to the juvenile detention center because he kept insisting the thing was a clock, and he was "not forthcoming" about other possible uses. They had nothing to justify an arrest, and they knew it. That's why they didn't even try.

Yes, ahmed denied it was a hoax bomb, but he was arrested because they thought it was a hoax bomb.

 

[Arctish]

No, the Chief of Police said they took him to the juvenile detention center because he kept insisting the thing was a clock, and he was "not forthcoming" about other possible uses. They had nothing to justify an arrest, and they knew it. That's why they didn't even try.

Yes, ahmed denied it was a hoax bomb, but he was arrested because they thought it was a hoax bomb.

Check the statements of the Police again. The cops did not go so far as to say the clock was a hoax bomb, or that Ahmed was going to use it as one. They said they thought it could have been used as one.

They had nothing that could have justified an arrest, and they knew it. That's why the only justification they offered was that "not forthcoming" crap. Ahmed didn't tell them what they wanted to hear, so they took him out of school in handcuffs.

 

[Nexus]

fyp

No you didn't.

It doesn't have to make sense to you, an adult who probably never built a case mod in your entire life. But to a teenager in a robotics class, taking the electronic components from something and installing them into a different housing to make an unusual but still functional item makes perfect sense. It's what those kids like to do.

I've already linked in thread to electronics kits for eight year old children more complex that what he did. The pointless mod he did makes so sense other than being good for a hoax. It doesn't demonstrate skill for a 14 year old and it didn't improve on the clock design or function.

I find the odds that Ahmed or his family are masters of intrigue to be highly dubious.

There not masters of intrigue which is why everyone that's not an Islamophile can see through their ruse.

 

[barbos]

Yes, ahmed denied it was a hoax bomb, but he was arrested because they thought it was a hoax bomb.

Check the statements of the Police again. The cops did not go so far as to say the clock was a hoax bomb, or that Ahmed was going to use it as one. They said they thought it could have been used as one.

They had nothing that could have justified an arrest, and they knew it. That's why the only justification they offered was that "not forthcoming" crap. Ahmed didn't tell them what they wanted to hear, so they took him out of school in handcuffs.

No, they did not arrest him for saying it was a clock. You can say to police whatever you have a clock all day long.

 

[Jayjay]

This family aren't master strategists. This is a clumsy attempt at extortion and Ahmed's non-fans are laughing not in awe. So there's no contradiction by also laughing at his shitty hoax clock.

There's no contradiction between thinking Ahmed is pretty ordinary and laughing at your shitty 'hoax clock' claims, either. But there is a contradiction between claiming to care about human rights, citizens' rights, and civil rights, and failing to care about a 14 year old being arrested and removed from school in handcuffs because he brought a homemade pencil case clock to school.

That's the same kind of "contradiction" that's between believing in global warming, and eating one beef burger. Yes, the latter contributes to the former, but it's such a miniscule impact as to be utterly irrelevant.

It was a minor, understandable mistake by the police or the school that had no lasting harm on Ahmed and was resolved in a few hours. Blowing it up to be a civil rights or even human rights issue is hyperbole that belittles real civil rights issues. Certainly it's not worth $15 million.