#IStandWithAhmed (or Inventing While Muslim is a thing?)

[Axulus]

OK, fair enough. But I am pretty sure that arresting is legal, meaning that 14 year olds do get arrested regularly.

But is it legal to question a kid without a lawyer or a parent present?

If it were illegal I'm sure we would've of heard about it in the media by now.

 

[Jayjay]

I wouldn't make a good patent clerk because I think the most plausible reason the engineering teacher told the kid not to show his case full of loose wires and a timer to other people is they might think it's a bomb?

(which is exactly what happened)

If they thought is was a bomb, why didn't they evacuate the school? Why wasn't the police bomb disposal unit dispatched?

As far as I can tell from googling the news reports, nobody thought it was an actual bomb, at least not long enough to run away or evacuate the school, but either a hoax bomb or a part of it (i.e. timer without explosives).

 

[fromderinside]

Begins the campaign to make iWatches illegal in public places.

 

[laughing dog]

Doesn't zero tolerance also include zero tolerance for anything that remotely looks like said item?

Not only can you not bring any real guns to school, but you'll be suspended for bringing in anything that remotely resembles a gun.

Here is an article with some examples:

6 School Suspensions Over Obviously Fake Guns

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/21/6-school-suspensions_n_4136563.html

Here is how the administration of the Irving High School in question interprets "zero tolerance"

We cannot allow items on campus that can be perceived to pose a threat.

So the rationale for the suspension is that we have zero tolerance for you making us look like imbecilic jackasses.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

As to the OP case, it seems more another example of "zero tolerance" overreaction than anything to do with Muslims.

Except for the cop that leaned back in his chair and said "figured it would be you" to a kid who has never been in trouble with the law or the school.

Or maybe the cop was talking about reality--from a history of encounters that weren't enough to cause an arrest.

- - - Updated - - -

Here is the clock in question:



I suspect you would have some trouble getting that through airport security.

Same with this:View attachment 4136

Of course you would have trouble!

it's a kids product. It's got a revealing and sexy image on it.

Pedophile, get out of here!!!

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I wouldn't make a good patent clerk because I think the most plausible reason the engineering teacher told the kid not to show his case full of loose wires and a timer to other people is they might think it's a bomb?

(which is exactly what happened)

Even if it's true that this is exactly what happened with the engineering teacher, the response overall was totally inappropriate. No one actually believed the kid had a bomb and that's why they never once responded as if they believed he had a bomb. They did respond as if they wanted to punish a Muslim boy and his family.

I disagree. I don't think this is about his religion. Rather, I think it's the same sort of insanity behind the pop-tart gun case. They're freaking at anything that resembles, however slightly, a weapon.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

If they thought is was a bomb, why didn't they evacuate the school? Why wasn't the police bomb disposal unit dispatched?

As far as I can tell from googling the news reports, nobody thought it was an actual bomb, at least not long enough to run away or evacuate the school, but either a hoax bomb or a part of it (i.e. timer without explosives).

Jebus! Better keep them out of the computer lab!

Without explosives? That is like a car without a chassis. An NFL franchise with no chance in hell of winning a Super Bowl (The Cleveland Browns).

A bomb without explosives is not a bomb.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

For all you people who keep claiming this is due to zealous "zero tolerance", after the school knew there was no bomb and no threat, what in zero tolerance was driving the 3 day suspension?

Nobody thought the pop-tart was a real gun.

 

[laughing dog]

For all you people who keep claiming this is due to zealous "zero tolerance", after the school knew there was no bomb and no threat, what in zero tolerance was driving the 3 day suspension?

Nobody thought the pop-tart was a real gun.

Thank you for the koan.

 

[whichphilosophy]

I am not sure as to the sequence of events after the teacher thought the clock was a bomb, but I would have thought that the school would have been evacuated and a bomb squad brought into the premises
while there are no students as others.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

I see. The political climate of the region is relevant when you believe it supports your argument but irrelevant when you see that it doesn't.

AthenaAwakened, I thank you for your comments. I will not waste anymore time here.

I'm not the one who is trying to make this about the region.

Actually you are, but go on.

I'm trying to correct the lazy ignorance and bigotry of people who are trying to make it about the region.

You are failing miserably.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

As far as I can tell from googling the news reports, nobody thought it was an actual bomb, at least not long enough to run away or evacuate the school, but either a hoax bomb or a part of it (i.e. timer without explosives).

Jebus! Better keep them out of the computer lab!

Without explosives? That is like a car without a chassis. An NFL franchise with no chance in hell of winning a Super Bowl (The Cleveland Browns).

Jimmy, that was hurtful.

Accurate, but hurtful.

A bomb without explosives is not a bomb.

 

[Jayjay]

As far as I can tell from googling the news reports, nobody thought it was an actual bomb, at least not long enough to run away or evacuate the school, but either a hoax bomb or a part of it (i.e. timer without explosives).

Jebus! Better keep them out of the computer lab!

Without explosives? That is like a car without a chassis. An NFL franchise with no chance in hell of winning a Super Bowl (The Cleveland Browns).

A bomb without explosives is not a bomb.

Right. And that's why they didn't evacuate the school.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Jebus! Better keep them out of the computer lab!

Without explosives? That is like a car without a chassis. An NFL franchise with no chance in hell of winning a Super Bowl (The Cleveland Browns).

A bomb without explosives is not a bomb.

Right. And that's why they didn't evacuate the school.

Which brings us to the "hoax bomb" excuse.

EXCEPT the kid never said it was bomb. He always said it was a clock. If it is a clock AND the kid says it's a clock, where is the hoax?

 

[Jayjay]

Right. And that's why they didn't evacuate the school.

Which brings us to the "hoax bomb" excuse.

EXCEPT the kid never said it was bomb. He always said it was a clock. If it is a clock AND the kid says it's a clock, where is the hoax?

You are going around in circles, this was addressed a few pages ago. If someone did make a hoax bomb, and when caught, claimed it was a clock, why should the police take his word for it? Note that it wasn't found due to Ahmed strapping it into a vest and shouting Allah Akbar... it was found when the alarm (or something else) started beeping and the teacher asked him to take it out.

Unrelated to that point, someone figured out based on the photo what model the clock was exactly:

Barbos was right, it was just an existing clock in a new case. I know it's bad to put down kids for trying, but come on, this isn't some undiscovered technical genius, it's a kid who's taking his first steps taking stuff apart and seeing how it works. I fear the hullabaloo around the incident might actually be detrimental to his hobby: imagine being invited to white house to meet some of the top scientists in the world, when all you did was take apart an alarm clock, but nobody seems to realize it and they're hailing you as the next Leonardo Da Vinci or something? That's got to be a lot of pressure for a 14-year old kid.

 

[untermensche]

To be fair, he took apart an alarm clock, then some ignorant people became frightened by it.

He at least stands head and shoulders above those so stupid they feared it.

 

[Axulus]

Which brings us to the "hoax bomb" excuse.

EXCEPT the kid never said it was bomb. He always said it was a clock. If it is a clock AND the kid says it's a clock, where is the hoax?

You are going around in circles, this was addressed a few pages ago. If someone did make a hoax bomb, and when caught, claimed it was a clock, why should the police take his word for it? Note that it wasn't found due to Ahmed strapping it into a vest and shouting Allah Akbar... it was found when the alarm (or something else) started beeping and the teacher asked him to take it out.

Unrelated to that point, someone figured out based on the photo what model the clock was exactly:

Barbos was right, it was just an existing clock in a new case. I know it's bad to put down kids for trying, but come on, this isn't some undiscovered technical genius, it's a kid who's taking his first steps taking stuff apart and seeing how it works. I fear the hullabaloo around the incident might actually be detrimental to his hobby: imagine being invited to white house to meet some of the top scientists in the world, when all you did was take apart an alarm clock, but nobody seems to realize it and they're hailing you as the next Leonardo Da Vinci or something? That's got to be a lot of pressure for a 14-year old kid.

I don't think anyone is claiming he's a genius. What we are claiming is that his kind of tinkering and curiousity should be actively encouraged as it can lead to greater things, even if what he did here was pretty basic from an engineering standpoint.

What's missing from this whole story are comments from the engineering teacher, whom was the person that Ahmed showed it to. Why did he say not to show it to anyone else? What did Ahmed tell him was the purpose of the project?

Despite all that, what again was the purpose of the 3 day suspension and the involvement of the police when a simple phone call to the engineering teacher should've cleared it all up? Send him home with a warning to be careful in the future as these things can be misconstrued as suspicious. Congratulate him for his interest in electronics and tinkering, but tell him to get the OK from the engineering teacher in the future before bringing new projects to school.

In other words, basic common sense and decency.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Which brings us to the "hoax bomb" excuse.

EXCEPT the kid never said it was bomb. He always said it was a clock. If it is a clock AND the kid says it's a clock, where is the hoax?

You are going around in circles, this was addressed a few pages ago. If someone did make a hoax bomb, and when caught,

But he wasn't caught. He volunteered the information to his engineering teacher when he got to school. AND this even is NOT a hypothetical. THIS actually happened. So put the ifs away. We won't be needing them.

claimed it was a clock, why should the police take his word for it?

Why shouldn't they? What did this kid do to say he was lying? Other than the crime of possessing a clock while Muslim, what did this kid do to warrant what happened to him?

Note that it wasn't found due to Ahmed strapping it into a vest and shouting Allah Akbar... it was found when the alarm (or something else) started beeping and the teacher asked him to take it out.

Which he did and he explained what happened and what it was.

Unrelated to that point, someone figured out based on the photo what model the clock was exactly:

Barbos was right, it was just an existing clock in a new case.

Which has what to with what except supposed adults trying to piss on a 14 year old kid?

I know it's bad to put down kids for trying, but come on, this isn't some undiscovered technical genius, it's a kid who's taking his first steps taking stuff apart and seeing how it works. I fear the hullabaloo around the incident might actually be detrimental to his hobby: imagine being invited to white house to meet some of the top scientists in the world, when all you did was take apart an alarm clock, but nobody seems to realize it and they're hailing you as the next Leonardo Da Vinci or something? That's got to be a lot of pressure for a 14-year old kid.

as opposed to the police pressure of treating him like the next Osama Bin Laden.

 

[RavenSky]

This is a patently absurd argument. If you think something might be a bomb you don't automatically believe the bomber when he says it's a clock.

If you think something might be a bomb, you evacuate the school, you call the bomb squad. No one involved thought this was a bomb and this is evidenced by the fact that no actions were taken to disposed of the bomb and get people to safety.

Exactly

 

[RavenSky]

This is true. Uh, yeah, I'm sure the reason Mark Zuckerberg invited Ahmed to FB HQ is because he's Muslim.

He was invited to to police headquarters because that is the established policy when a "bomb threat" is called in by the school.

While leaving the rest of the students in the building with the "bomb"? There was no bomb. They knew it as evidenced by their lack of evacuation action. They had no plausible reason to believe this was a "bomb hoax" either.