June Election UK. Which Party do you think should win the election

[whichphilosophy]

The UK is heading for an election on 06 June 2017. The right of centre Conservative (Tory) Party is scheduled to win, even though its lead over Labour has closed.

The main parties are

Conservative (right of centre)
Labour (Left wing Socialist)
Liberal/Democrat (Centralist)
UK Independence Party (Called Right Wing but claims Liberarian)

It would be interesting to hear any views on this.

 

[bilby]

Labour should win.

But the voters are stupid (as evidenced by Brexit, and by the very existence of UKIP), the system favours the Tories (first past the post by constituency), and the Tories have deeper pockets (and are not averse to cheating). Add in the tabloid press being owned by people who will gain far more from the insane economic policies of the Cons than they gain from having basic services and proper funding of things like the NHS, and it will be a close run thing.

I expect the Tories to win a small majority; and that as a result, the current bad times (for which they are mostly to blame) will seem like a golden age in comparison to the nightmare to come.

I sincerely hope that Labour can pull off an unlikely win, and start to repair some of the damage caused by the insane policy of 'austerity'. But I doubt that the voting public are any less stupid now than they were in the recent past, so the turkeys will once again vote for Christmas.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Labour should win.

But the voters are stupid (as evidenced by Brexit, and by the very existence of UKIP), the system favours the Tories (first past the post by constituency), and the Tories have deeper pockets (and are not averse to cheating). Add in the tabloid press being owned by people who will gain far more from the insane economic policies of the Cons than they gain from having basic services and proper funding of things like the NHS, and it will be a close run thing.

I expect the Tories to win a small majority; and that as a result, the current bad times (for which they are mostly to blame) will seem like a golden age in comparison to the nightmare to come.

I sincerely hope that Labour can pull off an unlikely win, and start to repair some of the damage caused by the insane policy of 'austerity'. But I doubt that the voting public are any less stupid now than they were in the recent past, so the turkeys will once again vote for Christmas.

Teresa basically is doing nothing about the economy and disguising high unemployment by zero contracts, plus the fact when I checked out some people, a lot are working in part time jobs.
80% of young people in the UK do not believe they will ever buy a new house. Houses in London can easily cost £500,000 for a small 2 bedroom flat. Rents are also soaring. It is not unusual for a family to sleep in one room.
The UK is currently short of one million homes (Builder's Federation) though I think this figure could be higher since many families are packed into restricted spaces.

The Tories are still set to win but I believe Labour may catch up a bit (as it is already doing) since it seems to have a better manifesto. Of course after the elections promises tend to be watered down.

 

[Derec]

Labour should win.

Not with Comrade Jezza, friend of Hamas and Hezbollah, at the helm.

But the voters are stupid (as evidenced by Brexit, and by the very existence of UKIP),

Speaking of Brexit, Corbyn missed the opportunity to invite Remainers to vote Labour by committing to Brexit. His support for the Remain campaign was always quite tepid, and I suspect he may be a closet Brexiter anyway.

the system favours the Tories (first past the post by constituency), and the Tories have deeper pockets

What really screws Labour is the strength of SNP in Scotland. That used to be some of their most reliable areas.

(and are not averse to cheating).

Like what?

Add in the tabloid press being owned by people who will gain far more from the insane economic policies of the Cons than they gain from having basic services and proper funding of things like the NHS, and it will be a close run thing.

Not to mention reopening unprofitable coal mines (both Corbyn and Trump love coal, weird) or nationalizing the railways.

I expect the Tories to win a small majority; and that as a result, the current bad times (for which they are mostly to blame) will seem like a golden age in comparison to the nightmare to come.

Aren't the polls predicting more than a small majority? In any case, the worse Labour does in these elections (which Corbyn had to agree to, since they are ahead of schedule), the better for Labour's long term prospects, as an abysmal performance would give the party a reason to sack their radical leader.

I sincerely hope that Labour can pull off an unlikely win, and start to repair some of the damage caused by the insane policy of 'austerity'. But I doubt that the voting public are any less stupid now than they were in the recent past, so the turkeys will once again vote for Christmas.

As long as they vote to abolish Thanksgiving.

 

[bilby]

Not with Comrade Jezza, friend of Hamas and Hezbollah, at the helm.

But the voters are stupid (as evidenced by Brexit, and by the very existence of UKIP),

Speaking of Brexit, Corbyn missed the opportunity to invite Remainers to vote Labour by committing to Brexit. His support for the Remain campaign was always quite tepid, and I suspect he may be a closet Brexiter anyway.

the system favours the Tories (first past the post by constituency), and the Tories have deeper pockets

What really screws Labour is the strength of SNP in Scotland. That used to be some of their most reliable areas.

(and are not averse to cheating).

Like what?

Add in the tabloid press being owned by people who will gain far more from the insane economic policies of the Cons than they gain from having basic services and proper funding of things like the NHS, and it will be a close run thing.

Not to mention reopening unprofitable coal mines (both Corbyn and Trump love coal, weird) or nationalizing the railways.

I expect the Tories to win a small majority; and that as a result, the current bad times (for which they are mostly to blame) will seem like a golden age in comparison to the nightmare to come.

Aren't the polls predicting more than a small majority? In any case, the worse Labour does in these elections (which Corbyn had to agree to, since they are ahead of schedule), the better for Labour's long term prospects, as an abysmal performance would give the party a reason to sack their radical leader.

I sincerely hope that Labour can pull off an unlikely win, and start to repair some of the damage caused by the insane policy of 'austerity'. But I doubt that the voting public are any less stupid now than they were in the recent past, so the turkeys will once again vote for Christmas.

As long as they vote to abolish Thanksgiving.

Thanksgiving is already 'abolished' in the UK, inasmuch as it never existed there. The British eat turkey at Christmas. The rest of your points are similarly well informed about British conditions and politics. You are right about the SNP thing though. Labour really needs a coalition with SNP to form government if the Tories don't get a majority.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Not with Comrade Jezza, friend of Hamas and Hezbollah, at the helm.

But the voters are stupid (as evidenced by Brexit, and by the very existence of UKIP),

Speaking of Brexit, Corbyn missed the opportunity to invite Remainers to vote Labour by committing to Brexit. His support for the Remain campaign was always quite tepid, and I suspect he may be a closet Brexiter anyway.

the system favours the Tories (first past the post by constituency), and the Tories have deeper pockets

What really screws Labour is the strength of SNP in Scotland. That used to be some of their most reliable areas.

(and are not averse to cheating).

Like what?

Add in the tabloid press being owned by people who will gain far more from the insane economic policies of the Cons than they gain from having basic services and proper funding of things like the NHS, and it will be a close run thing.

Not to mention reopening unprofitable coal mines (both Corbyn and Trump love coal, weird) or nationalizing the railways.

I expect the Tories to win a small majority; and that as a result, the current bad times (for which they are mostly to blame) will seem like a golden age in comparison to the nightmare to come.

Aren't the polls predicting more than a small majority? In any case, the worse Labour does in these elections (which Corbyn had to agree to, since they are ahead of schedule), the better for Labour's long term prospects, as an abysmal performance would give the party a reason to sack their radical leader.

I sincerely hope that Labour can pull off an unlikely win, and start to repair some of the damage caused by the insane policy of 'austerity'. But I doubt that the voting public are any less stupid now than they were in the recent past, so the turkeys will once again vote for Christmas.

As long as they vote to abolish Thanksgiving.

While I believe in an Israeli state, I also believe in a Palestinian one and Hamas is a natural reaction from a nation where land and property is being taken over here and there by settlers. The issue is HAMAS being league with the Muslim Brotherhood

The problem with coal is Britain closed the mines down and then ever since we purchased what we need from Poland. While we did that minors were made redundant and many now still live on the State.

Leaving the EU should not mean ceasing Trade for the UK imports much more from the EU than the UK exports to it.

 

[bilby]

Not with Comrade Jezza, friend of Hamas and Hezbollah, at the helm.


Speaking of Brexit, Corbyn missed the opportunity to invite Remainers to vote Labour by committing to Brexit. His support for the Remain campaign was always quite tepid, and I suspect he may be a closet Brexiter anyway.

the system favours the Tories (first past the post by constituency), and the Tories have deeper pockets

What really screws Labour is the strength of SNP in Scotland. That used to be some of their most reliable areas.

(and are not averse to cheating).

Like what?

Add in the tabloid press being owned by people who will gain far more from the insane economic policies of the Cons than they gain from having basic services and proper funding of things like the NHS, and it will be a close run thing.

Not to mention reopening unprofitable coal mines (both Corbyn and Trump love coal, weird) or nationalizing the railways.

I expect the Tories to win a small majority; and that as a result, the current bad times (for which they are mostly to blame) will seem like a golden age in comparison to the nightmare to come.

Aren't the polls predicting more than a small majority? In any case, the worse Labour does in these elections (which Corbyn had to agree to, since they are ahead of schedule), the better for Labour's long term prospects, as an abysmal performance would give the party a reason to sack their radical leader.

I sincerely hope that Labour can pull off an unlikely win, and start to repair some of the damage caused by the insane policy of 'austerity'. But I doubt that the voting public are any less stupid now than they were in the recent past, so the turkeys will once again vote for Christmas.

As long as they vote to abolish Thanksgiving.

While I believe in an Israeli state, I also believe in a Palestinian one and Hamas is a natural reaction from a nation where land and property is being taken over here and there by settlers. The issue is HAMAS being league with the Muslim Brotherhood

The problem with coal is Britain closed the mines down and then ever since we purchased what we need from Poland. While we did that minors were made redundant and many now still live on the State.

Leaving the EU should not mean ceasing Trade for the UK imports much more from the EU than the UK exports to it.

Few voters in the UK give a flying fuck about the Israel/Palestine issue; it's simply not important in British politics. If anything, there is a minuscule benefit to a British politician in supporting the Palestinian side. But ultimately, nobody much cares - like Thanksgiving, it's thought to be important by Americans, but the British simply don't think about it at all.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...ternet-conservatives-government-a7744176.html

Theresa May is planning to introduce huge regulations on the way the internet works, allowing the government to decide what is said online.
Particular focus has been drawn to the end of the manifesto, which makes clear that the Tories want to introduce huge changes to the way the internet works.
"Some people say that it is not for government to regulate when it comes to technology and the internet," it states. "We disagree."
Senior Tories confirmed to BuzzFeed News that the phrasing indicates that the government intends to introduce huge restrictions on what people can post, share and publish online.
The plans will allow Britain to become "the global leader in the regulation of the use of personal data and the internet", the manifesto claims.
It comes just soon after the Investigatory Powers Act came into law. That legislation allowed the government to force internet companies to keep records on their customers' browsing histories, as well as giving ministers the power to break apps like WhatsApp so that messages can be read.


--------

Vote Labour now or regret it later.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Not with Comrade Jezza, friend of Hamas and Hezbollah, at the helm.


Speaking of Brexit, Corbyn missed the opportunity to invite Remainers to vote Labour by committing to Brexit. His support for the Remain campaign was always quite tepid, and I suspect he may be a closet Brexiter anyway.

the system favours the Tories (first past the post by constituency), and the Tories have deeper pockets

What really screws Labour is the strength of SNP in Scotland. That used to be some of their most reliable areas.

(and are not averse to cheating).

Like what?

Add in the tabloid press being owned by people who will gain far more from the insane economic policies of the Cons than they gain from having basic services and proper funding of things like the NHS, and it will be a close run thing.

Not to mention reopening unprofitable coal mines (both Corbyn and Trump love coal, weird) or nationalizing the railways.

I expect the Tories to win a small majority; and that as a result, the current bad times (for which they are mostly to blame) will seem like a golden age in comparison to the nightmare to come.

Aren't the polls predicting more than a small majority? In any case, the worse Labour does in these elections (which Corbyn had to agree to, since they are ahead of schedule), the better for Labour's long term prospects, as an abysmal performance would give the party a reason to sack their radical leader.

I sincerely hope that Labour can pull off an unlikely win, and start to repair some of the damage caused by the insane policy of 'austerity'. But I doubt that the voting public are any less stupid now than they were in the recent past, so the turkeys will once again vote for Christmas.

As long as they vote to abolish Thanksgiving.

While I believe in an Israeli state, I also believe in a Palestinian one and Hamas is a natural reaction from a nation where land and property is being taken over here and there by settlers. The issue is HAMAS being league with the Muslim Brotherhood

The problem with coal is Britain closed the mines down and then ever since we purchased what we need from Poland. While we did that minors were made redundant and many now still live on the State.

Leaving the EU should not mean ceasing Trade for the UK imports much more from the EU than the UK exports to it.

Few voters in the UK give a flying fuck about the Israel/Palestine issue; it's simply not important in British politics. If anything, there is a minuscule benefit to a British politician in supporting the Palestinian side. But ultimately, nobody much cares - like Thanksgiving, it's thought to be important by Americans, but the British simply don't think about it at all.

Actually this is an issue which is frequently in the press, if not in the headlines. George Galloway (Pro-Palestine) was elected a few times on this basis for the Respect Party. There are also communities of Jews and Muslims living side by side and there are rarely incidents.

 

[whichphilosophy]

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...ternet-conservatives-government-a7744176.html

Theresa May is planning to introduce huge regulations on the way the internet works, allowing the government to decide what is said online.
Particular focus has been drawn to the end of the manifesto, which makes clear that the Tories want to introduce huge changes to the way the internet works.
"Some people say that it is not for government to regulate when it comes to technology and the internet," it states. "We disagree."
Senior Tories confirmed to BuzzFeed News that the phrasing indicates that the government intends to introduce huge restrictions on what people can post, share and publish online.
The plans will allow Britain to become "the global leader in the regulation of the use of personal data and the internet", the manifesto claims.
It comes just soon after the Investigatory Powers Act came into law. That legislation allowed the government to force internet companies to keep records on their customers' browsing histories, as well as giving ministers the power to break apps like WhatsApp so that messages can be read.


--------

Vote Labour now or regret it later.

She talks a lot but based on her track record does little or nothing. As Home secretary she was supposed to regulate immigration from abroad and it increased the the highest figures on record. She might poodle around a bit with this or leave it to one of her ministers.

The main problem affecting immigration is a shortage of housing construction but particularly for social (affordable government housing). Like many other countries in the EU who are facing balance of payments issues and debts, the UK is undergoing some Austerity measures.

With the introduction of a minimum wage, some employers seem to interpret this as the only wage or the maximum wage. The majority of jobs in small offices, and driving etc hover between £7.50 and £9.50.

80% of young people believe they will never purchase their own home.

Voting Labour is a possibility even if it is an anti Tory Vote.

However after the election things are still very civil in the UK.


In 2014 the Builders' Federation estimated there is a shortage of one million houses which could be a higher considering immigration exceeding migration
There reason for this of course is a lack of construction.
.

This extends to Labour under Tony Blair.

Also since more people occupy one house than when I was last in the UK I believe the real figure (own opinion) could in London alone be much higher.

 

[iolo]

It is all a bit academic; the Brexit nutters will keep screaming about Ze Vill of Ze Peepul, and the tories will probably pick up enough mugvotes from the National Front or whatever it's called nowadays, while in the subsequent slump, God knows what'll happen. This is what you can look forward to when you allow Murdoch to rule your country.

 

[whichphilosophy]

It is all a bit academic; the Brexit nutters will keep screaming about Ze Vill of Ze Peepul, and the tories will probably pick up enough mugvotes from the National Front or whatever it's called nowadays, while in the subsequent slump, God knows what'll happen. This is what you can look forward to when you allow Murdoch to rule your country.

More than 50% voted for BREXIT despite the poor press against it. The current government, preceded by Blair's proved more than capable of driving the country bankrupt, BREXIT or no BREXIT.

Britain is at least one million houses short (per a report from the Builder's Federation 2014) and construction is well below the requirements for keeping up with the rising population. Young people especially are now commonly crowding 4 in a room that's so tiny they end up sleeping on top of each other every night.

 

[bilby]

It is all a bit academic; the Brexit nutters will keep screaming about Ze Vill of Ze Peepul, and the tories will probably pick up enough mugvotes from the National Front or whatever it's called nowadays, while in the subsequent slump, God knows what'll happen. This is what you can look forward to when you allow Murdoch to rule your country.

More than 50% voted for BREXIT despite the poor press against it. The current government, preceded by Blair's proved more than capable of driving the country bankrupt, BREXIT or no BREXIT.

Britain is at least one million houses short (per a report from the Builder's Federation 2014) and construction is well below the requirements for keeping up with the rising population. Young people especially are now commonly crowding 4 in a room that's so tiny they end up sleeping on top of each other every night.

Your obsession with housing shortages is noted.

Everyone here has read about it many times; all of those who are going to swing their support behind you on the topic now have. Can we please talk about something else now? Outside your head, this is not a big issue in the upcoming election, no matter how important you think it should be.

If you feel that it's worthy of more detailed discussion, then start a thread on it, and stop cluttering up unrelated threads with this tedious topic. Anyone who shares your belief that this is interesting can join in on your new thread.

 

[Philos]

Labour should win.

But the voters are stupid (as evidenced by Brexit, and by the very existence of UKIP), the system favours the Tories (first past the post by constituency), and the Tories have deeper pockets (and are not averse to cheating). Add in the tabloid press being owned by people who will gain far more from the insane economic policies of the Cons than they gain from having basic services and proper funding of things like the NHS, and it will be a close run thing.

I expect the Tories to win a small majority; and that as a result, the current bad times (for which they are mostly to blame) will seem like a golden age in comparison to the nightmare to come.

I sincerely hope that Labour can pull off an unlikely win, and start to repair some of the damage caused by the insane policy of 'austerity'. But I doubt that the voting public are any less stupid now than they were in the recent past, so the turkeys will once again vote for Christmas.

Blimey, bil, you've taken the words right out of my mouth!

Alex.

 

[Philos]

It is all a bit academic; the Brexit nutters will keep screaming about Ze Vill of Ze Peepul, and the tories will probably pick up enough mugvotes from the National Front or whatever it's called nowadays, while in the subsequent slump, God knows what'll happen. This is what you can look forward to when you allow Murdoch to rule your country.

iolo,

You're not wrong. Brexit has been a classic 'bait and switch' for the Tories to consolidate power, even though a lot of them didn't want it. However, Brexit is the Tory child now, and a "subsequent slump" will also be theirs.

Sadly, as another poster mentioned, Corbyn isn't the man for this moment in history and I am hoping to God that Labour can find someone half decent for next time. Maybe we will finally realise that Blair won three elections hands down, which does give us some idea of what the British electorate might actually want. IMHO the left in this country have hurt themselves badly by demonising their most successful politician since Clem Attlee.

A.

 

[whichphilosophy]

More than 50% voted for BREXIT despite the poor press against it. The current government, preceded by Blair's proved more than capable of driving the country bankrupt, BREXIT or no BREXIT.

Britain is at least one million houses short (per a report from the Builder's Federation 2014) and construction is well below the requirements for keeping up with the rising population. Young people especially are now commonly crowding 4 in a room that's so tiny they end up sleeping on top of each other every night.

Your obsession with housing shortages is noted.

Everyone here has read about it many times; all of those who are going to swing their support behind you on the topic now have. Can we please talk about something else now? Outside your head, this is not a big issue in the upcoming election, no matter how important you think it should be.

If you feel that it's worthy of more detailed discussion, then start a thread on it, and stop cluttering up unrelated threads with this tedious topic. Anyone who shares your belief that this is interesting can join in on your new thread.

Of course housing is an issue and very much so, along with healthcare, jobs and pensions.

 

[iolo]

It is all a bit academic; the Brexit nutters will keep screaming about Ze Vill of Ze Peepul, and the tories will probably pick up enough mugvotes from the National Front or whatever it's called nowadays, while in the subsequent slump, God knows what'll happen. This is what you can look forward to when you allow Murdoch to rule your country.

More than 50% voted for BREXIT despite the poor press against it. The current government, preceded by Blair's proved more than capable of driving the country bankrupt, BREXIT or no BREXIT.

Britain is at least one million houses short (per a report from the Builder's Federation 2014) and construction is well below the requirements for keeping up with the rising population. Young people especially are now commonly crowding 4 in a room that's so tiny they end up sleeping on top of each other every night.

Murdoch sees to it that tories rule, especially when pretending to be Labour, and tories look after the rich. Why the buggery should they care about the mugs?

 

[whichphilosophy]

It is all a bit academic; the Brexit nutters will keep screaming about Ze Vill of Ze Peepul, and the tories will probably pick up enough mugvotes from the National Front or whatever it's called nowadays, while in the subsequent slump, God knows what'll happen. This is what you can look forward to when you allow Murdoch to rule your country.

iolo,

You're not wrong. Brexit has been a classic 'bait and switch' for the Tories to consolidate power, even though a lot of them didn't want it. However, Brexit is the Tory child now, and a "subsequent slump" will also be theirs.

Sadly, as another poster mentioned, Corbyn isn't the man for this moment in history and I am hoping to God that Labour can find someone half decent for next time. Maybe we will finally realise that Blair won three elections hands down, which does give us some idea of what the British electorate might actually want. IMHO the left in this country have hurt themselves badly by demonising their most successful politician since Clem Attlee.

A.

Corbyn seems to be polishing his public speaking and presence and unlike Blair is not a war criminal. Out of the 2 main parties, Labour is the least useless.
If there is a slump both parties may simply blame it on Brexit.

Brexit is ideal for the UK. I certainly don't want the UK to go bankrupt like Greece, Portugal, Spain and Eire with France and Italy in difficulties.

- - - Updated - - -

More than 50% voted for BREXIT despite the poor press against it. The current government, preceded by Blair's proved more than capable of driving the country bankrupt, BREXIT or no BREXIT.

Britain is at least one million houses short (per a report from the Builder's Federation 2014) and construction is well below the requirements for keeping up with the rising population. Young people especially are now commonly crowding 4 in a room that's so tiny they end up sleeping on top of each other every night.

Murdoch sees to it that tories rule, especially when pretending to be Labour, and tories look after the rich. Why the buggery should they cre about the mugs?

Sounds about right. The government is also looking after the banksters.

 

[whichphilosophy]

The Poll result shows Donald Trump is entering the race and is now ahead of Teresa May with Corbyn in the lead.

 

[iolo]

iolo,

You're not wrong. Brexit has been a classic 'bait and switch' for the Tories to consolidate power, even though a lot of them didn't want it. However, Brexit is the Tory child now, and a "subsequent slump" will also be theirs.

Sadly, as another poster mentioned, Corbyn isn't the man for this moment in history and I am hoping to God that Labour can find someone half decent for next time. Maybe we will finally realise that Blair won three elections hands down, which does give us some idea of what the British electorate might actually want. IMHO the left in this country have hurt themselves badly by demonising their most successful politician since Clem Attlee.

A.

Corbyn seems to be polishing his public speaking and presence and unlike Blair is not a war criminal. Out of the 2 main parties, Labour is the least useless.
If there is a slump both parties may simply blame it on Brexit.

Brexit is ideal for the UK. I certainly don't want the UK to go bankrupt like Greece, Portugal, Spain and Eire with France and Italy in difficulties.

- - - Updated - - -

More than 50% voted for BREXIT despite the poor press against it. The current government, preceded by Blair's proved more than capable of driving the country bankrupt, BREXIT or no BREXIT.

Britain is at least one million houses short (per a report from the Builder's Federation 2014) and construction is well below the requirements for keeping up with the rising population. Young people especially are now commonly crowding 4 in a room that's so tiny they end up sleeping on top of each other every night.

Murdoch sees to it that tories rule, especially when pretending to be Labour, and tories look after the rich. Why the buggery should they cre about the mugs?

Sounds about right. The government is also looking after the banksters.

We agree - except that Mr Corbyn doesn't need to improve his public speaking, which has always been excellent. It is one of the many lies the newspapers tell about him that he hasn't, and people's hearing him is one of the reasons that the Murdoch-inspired tories are beginning to lose their big lead.