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Mar-a-Largo raided by FBI?

Jarhyn

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I agree. 100%. Your tribe is a fucking cancer to humanity.
Lets get back on topic and off the intentional derail.

Judge Cannon... maybe upset at how the Eleventh District thoroughly torn her ruling down, in a stay of the decision... got a bit uppity in her latest ruling and instruction to Special Master Dearie... after Trump's lawyers (who nominated Dearie to be Special Master), didn't like to be instructed to put some stuff down in writing.

Of course, the tiny issue here is that the Justice Department probably doesn't give a flip about the remaining documents as the 11th gave them permission to flip Cannon the bird on the classified documents.
So the "Loose Cannon" ruling is a tempest in a teapot.

Loose Cannon is now apparently lending ear to formal arguments that the evidence was planted.
 

ZiprHead

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According to court documents filed Tuesday, the department asked the special master Raymond Dearie for an additional day to turn over nonclassified documents in the investigation. Federal prosecutors said they needed until Wednesday because none of the five vendors they suggested to digitize the cache of documents "were willing to be engaged by Plaintiff."

"Plaintiff informed us this morning that none of the five document-review vendors proposed by the government before last Tuesday's preliminary conference were willing to be engaged by Plaintiff," Justice Department lawyers said in the filing. "To avoid further delay in the vendor's scanning and processing of the Seized Materials (defined to exclude 'documents bearing classification markings'), the government issued a request for a task order this afternoon with a deadline of tomorrow (Wednesday, September 28, 2022) at noon."

Prosecutors said they'd be willing to engage the vendors, adding: "The government is highly confident at least one vendor will respond."

They added that Trump should be expected to pay for the process and they estimated that between the selection of a vendor and scanning of the files, the turnover could be concluded by October 7.
So basically the DOJ will hire the vendor and bill the Trump team.
 

ZiprHead

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Are they actually admitting they have more documents?
 

Elixir

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According to court documents filed Tuesday, the department asked the special master Raymond Dearie for an additional day to turn over nonclassified documents in the investigation. Federal prosecutors said they needed until Wednesday because none of the five vendors they suggested to digitize the cache of documents "were willing to be engaged by Plaintiff."

"Plaintiff informed us this morning that none of the five document-review vendors proposed by the government before last Tuesday's preliminary conference were willing to be engaged by Plaintiff," Justice Department lawyers said in the filing. "To avoid further delay in the vendor's scanning and processing of the Seized Materials (defined to exclude 'documents bearing classification markings'), the government issued a request for a task order this afternoon with a deadline of tomorrow (Wednesday, September 28, 2022) at noon."

Prosecutors said they'd be willing to engage the vendors, adding: "The government is highly confident at least one vendor will respond."

They added that Trump should be expected to pay for the process and they estimated that between the selection of a vendor and scanning of the files, the turnover could be concluded by October 7.
So basically the DOJ will hire the vendor and bill the Trump team.
So basically …. We’re going to front him the money and hope to get paid back?
Fat chance.
 

Patooka

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So basically …. We’re going to front him the money and hope to get paid back?
Fat chance.
Wouldn't the courts step in? I mean Trump's strategy has always been to litigate until the other side runs out of steam. It's just that this time the DOJ is an entity with a significant warchest. I'm not sure his usual method is going to work this time.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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Are they actually admitting they have more documents?

No, it sounds like an opening for Cannon to scold the DoJ for "lying" about how many documents they took.

Also, 200,000 pages? A packet of printer paper is 500 pages... and are sold in 10 pack boxes. So 400 reams, or 40 printer paper boxes.

And that is tightly packed paper, not loose documents. How many boxes would have been removed for that?! Is it even legitimate to say that the golf course had 200,000 pages in it to begin with?
 

Elixir

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Are they actually admitting they have more documents?

No, it sounds like an opening for Cannon to scold the DoJ for "lying" about how many documents they took.

You’re expecting the trumpsucker judge to accuse DOJ of failing to list stuff they seized on the receipt? That sounds pretty risky.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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Are they actually admitting they have more documents?

No, it sounds like an opening for Cannon to scold the DoJ for "lying" about how many documents they took.

You’re expecting the trumpsucker judge to accuse DOJ of failing to list stuff they seized on the receipt? That sounds pretty risky.

It is a red herring to "expose" some minor and irrelevant issue.

*FBI recounts.*
DoJ: It was 11,012 instead of 11,003, but that is now including used hamburger wrappers, which accounts for 50% of the new docs.
Judge Cannon: You lied! You can't look at the classified docs again.
DoJ: Hamburger wrappers.
Judge Cannon: Well, I'm going to make a convoluted ruling that'll leave most justices scratching their head and the 11th Court of Appeals will stay and reverse it in a scathing ruling... but until then, I'm ordering the entire DoJ to go to prison via my analysis and use of shoddy legal references and misquotes. I start out quoting Tucker Carlson...

Cannon's latest thing with the Special Master really eliminated any attempt for this to look professional and judicial and she was doing her best to make certain this unprecedented situation was absolutely clean. Her earlier rulings already had exposed her of favoritism or incompetence.
 

steve_bank

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1. Trump got caught with classified material, some folders n a desk were empty.
2. Trump is udsig his usual legal and propaganda tactics.
3. Pundits say the government may not be able to male a legal case.
4. Trump might beat the rap.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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1. Trump got caught with classified material, some folders n a desk were empty.
2. Trump is udsig his usual legal and propaganda tactics.
3. Pundits say the government may not be able to male a legal case.
4. Trump might beat the rap.
While a certain number of these documents might not be easy to make a case for, there are human asset documents he was in possession of that included nuclear related information. That stuff falls under a different law, and mere possession is convictable. The trouble the Government has is that some of the other documents, they'd need to show intent to steal. The nuclear docs, he doesn't have that cover.
 

steve_bank

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1. Trump got caught with classified material, some folders n a desk were empty.
2. Trump is udsig his usual legal and propaganda tactics.
3. Pundits say the government may not be able to male a legal case.
4. Trump might beat the rap.
While a certain number of these documents might not be easy to make a case for, there are human asset documents he was in possession of that included nuclear related information. That stuff falls under a different law, and mere possession is convictable. The trouble the Government has is that some of the other documents, they'd need to show intent to steal. The nuclear docs, he doesn't have that cover.
Summarizing what I heard.

The pundits say the govt may have a hard time making a felony case. It could end up being something trivial like mishandling documents. Was there an intent to circumvent laws? Hard to prove. Or was it just ineptness that classified documcts ended up in boxes.

The loosely defined presidential privilege factors in.

You and I have probably both handled classed documents. When I was at Lockheed leaving a file cabinet unlocked or a document out in the open was big deal.

When I went to Navy C school on a system the classes were in a locked cage. The manuals were checked page by page before we were allowed to leave.

What Trump did was serious and may even be treason if he handed over info to people. He has a history of beating legal issues.

I have to wonder if Tump passed info on our nuclear weapons and command polciess to Putin. Trump is about as amoral as it gets.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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1. Trump got caught with classified material, some folders n a desk were empty.
2. Trump is udsig his usual legal and propaganda tactics.
3. Pundits say the government may not be able to male a legal case.
4. Trump might beat the rap.
While a certain number of these documents might not be easy to make a case for, there are human asset documents he was in possession of that included nuclear related information. That stuff falls under a different law, and mere possession is convictable. The trouble the Government has is that some of the other documents, they'd need to show intent to steal. The nuclear docs, he doesn't have that cover.
Summarizing what I heard.

The pundits say the govt may have a hard time making a felony case. It could end up being something trivial like mishandling documents. Was there an intent to circumvent laws? Hard to prove. Or was it just ineptness that classified documcts ended up in boxes.

The loosely defined presidential privilege factors in.
He has no privilege unless Biden says he does. The issue isn't about privilege anyway, it is about possession and INTENT of possession. And repeatedly lying that you don't have these types of documents does help imply intent to remain in illegal possession of them. But as stated, the nuclear documents fall under a different law and he has serious legal jeopardy there.

And this is ignoring the elephant in the room, the person who's testimony led to the unprecedented search of a former President's residence. Granted, I'm going with one of his lawyers who is covering their arse, but it could be sexier than that. Not in an Ivanka sort of way, but a espionage sort of way.
What Trump did was serious and may even be treason if he handed over info to people. He has a history of beating legal issues.

I have to wonder if Tump passed info on our nuclear weapons and command polciess to Putin. Trump is about as amoral as it gets.
We don't know if this was merely trophy hunting. But taking highly classified human intel, after having already leaked (because he is a fucking idiot) to the Russians... I don't think anyone wants to give this guy the benefit of the doubt.
 

Swammerdami

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I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.
Jill Biden thinks I'm a breakfast taco.
No Biden, no KKK, no Fascist USA
The word "know" has one silent k.
The word "knuckle" has two silent k's.
The word "Democrat" has three silent k's.

I'll need a cite for the claim I've reddened. If your cite is Jimmy's post(s) I'll need to see the relevant excerpt(s) from Jimmy's posts.

Remember that misquoting a fellow Infidel is against the rules.

I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.
Jill Biden thinks I'm a breakfast taco.
No Biden, no KKK, no Fascist USA
The word "know" has one silent k.
The word "knuckle" has two silent k's.
The word "Democrat" has three silent k's.
I agree. 100%. Your tribe is a fucking cancer to humanity.
My tribe? You've got to be kidding me.
Jill Biden thinks I'm a breakfast taco.
No Biden, no KKK, no Fascist USA
The word "know" has one silent k.
The word "knuckle" has two silent k's.
The word "Democrat" has three silent k's.

Comedy gold.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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I'll need a cite for the claim I've reddened. If your cite is Jimmy's post(s) I'll need to see the relevant excerpt(s) from Jimmy's posts.
You are wasting your time. JH... umm... the other JH already has gone past the point of mistaken impression to willful deceit on that one. They seem bored and desperate for attention.
 

starwater

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Does anyone know how Mar-a lago faired in the hurricane? All I can think about is flying classified documents floating out in the street for anyone to pick up.
 

steve_bank

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Does anyone know how Mar-a lago faired in the hurricane? All I can think about is flying classified documents floating out in the street for anyone to pick up.
Haa Haa .. a great metaphor Trump, being underwater.
 

Jason Harvestdancer

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I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.

I'll need a cite for the claim I've reddened. If your cite is Jimmy's post(s) I'll need to see the relevant excerpt(s) from Jimmy's posts.

I'll do even better and show Jimmy isn't the only one doing that.

This (Trump stealing and probably selling or at least sharing Top Secret info with our enemies) affects US and potentially endangers every one in the US and also the world.

As to why Donald Trump kept those documents, consider his personality. He is not much of a reader, and he has little interest in anything other than himself. So he would likely want to sell those documents to some buyer with a lot of $$$ for him. Saudi Arabia? Russia? China? North Korea?

So, is this the largest security breach in the nation's history? World history?

Probably. In my opinion, the next move the FBI makes will confirm the severity. If for example, they decide to subpoena all communications and exchange of data in relation to the files retrieved my answer changes from probably to definitely.
Yeah, that would be hard to dismiss. But still no telling who Cheato already leaked, sold or gave what.

The first thing that I thought about was that 2 billion $ the Saudis “gave” Jared for no apparent reason other than endorsing Keshoggi’s murder …

I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.
I agree. 100%. Your tribe is a fucking cancer to humanity.
My tribe? You've got to be kidding me.
Comedy gold.

Is intentionally mislabeling someone against the rules that you wish to cite?
 

Jarhyn

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I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.

I'll need a cite for the claim I've reddened. If your cite is Jimmy's post(s) I'll need to see the relevant excerpt(s) from Jimmy's posts.

I'll do even better and show Jimmy isn't the only one doing that.

This (Trump stealing and probably selling or at least sharing Top Secret info with our enemies) affects US and potentially endangers every one in the US and also the world.

As to why Donald Trump kept those documents, consider his personality. He is not much of a reader, and he has little interest in anything other than himself. So he would likely want to sell those documents to some buyer with a lot of $$$ for him. Saudi Arabia? Russia? China? North Korea?

So, is this the largest security breach in the nation's history? World history?

Probably. In my opinion, the next move the FBI makes will confirm the severity. If for example, they decide to subpoena all communications and exchange of data in relation to the files retrieved my answer changes from probably to definitely.
Yeah, that would be hard to dismiss. But still no telling who Cheato already leaked, sold or gave what.

The first thing that I thought about was that 2 billion $ the Saudis “gave” Jared for no apparent reason other than endorsing Keshoggi’s murder …

I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.
I agree. 100%. Your tribe is a fucking cancer to humanity.
My tribe? You've got to be kidding me.
Comedy gold.
<A discussion of forum rules>
None of those posts say they did, they only speculate that it is likely he could have.

Everyone says he committed the crime of having them, nobody has said that he actually sold them except you. Only that he PROBABLY sold them.

One is a statement of a definite crime and the other is a statement of a  probable crime.

You have transformed this probable crime into a statement of definite knowledge, and then attacked the statement of definite knowledge AS a statement of definite knowledge, when that statement was only ever your own.

This argument of yours is a straw man argument.
 

ZiprHead

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DOJ was always going to appeal Judge Aileen Cannon’s order establishing a special master. It was such an aberrant, bizarre, and unworkable procedure that there was no chance that DOJ would let the precedent be established. But as a matter of timing, if Judge Dearie was moving quickly and assertively, DOJ likely felt better served by having Dearie just mow through the documents and tangential issues and then appeal later. But on Thursday, Judge Cannon signaled that she’s not going to let Dearie do the job that she theoretically asked him to do. With two years of experience and grossly unqualified from the start, Judge Cannon overruled a Reagan-appointed judge who is esteemed by the NYC Bar. She even lengthened the timeline. So it was that late Friday, DOJ filed an expedited appeal of Cannon’s special master ruling. They need this case out of Cannon’s hands as soon as possible. This appeal could do it.
More in the link.
 

Jarhyn

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L
DOJ was always going to appeal Judge Aileen Cannon’s order establishing a special master. It was such an aberrant, bizarre, and unworkable procedure that there was no chance that DOJ would let the precedent be established. But as a matter of timing, if Judge Dearie was moving quickly and assertively, DOJ likely felt better served by having Dearie just mow through the documents and tangential issues and then appeal later. But on Thursday, Judge Cannon signaled that she’s not going to let Dearie do the job that she theoretically asked him to do. With two years of experience and grossly unqualified from the start, Judge Cannon overruled a Reagan-appointed judge who is esteemed by the NYC Bar. She even lengthened the timeline. So it was that late Friday, DOJ filed an expedited appeal of Cannon’s special master ruling. They need this case out of Cannon’s hands as soon as possible. This appeal could do it.
More in the link.
Loose Cannon Fires More Shells Into Hull of USS US.

Let's just hope that loose lips don't sink this ship.
 

Swammerdami

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I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.

I'll need a cite for the claim I've reddened. If your cite is Jimmy's post(s) I'll need to see the relevant excerpt(s) from Jimmy's posts.

I'll do even better and show Jimmy isn't the only one doing that.

This (Trump stealing and probably selling or at least sharing Top Secret info with our enemies) affects US and potentially endangers every one in the US and also the world.

As to why Donald Trump kept those documents, consider his personality. He is not much of a reader, and he has little interest in anything other than himself. So he would likely want to sell those documents to some buyer with a lot of $$$ for him. Saudi Arabia? Russia? China? North Korea?


Is intentionally mislabeling someone against the rules that you wish to cite?

You appear unable to distinguish between proven allegations and speculations. "I think George Zimmerman was a murderer" and "George Zimmerman was convicted of murder" are two different statements — surely your English skill is good enough to understand that?

Also, in "First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated" you have confused the two opposite political camps. It is the QOPAnoners (cf DeSantis) who want to force people to report on their political stances.

Do I think Trump intended to sell, or has already sold, secrets to foreign powers? Unlike Jason who seems adamant that that was the intent, or that that intent had been proven, I have serious doubts. A good spy or criminal would surely have found a better hiding place, no? Jason and I seem to agree that the Trump family is a criminal organization, but I am particularly impressed by their incompetence. Now that criminals know what is possible, I dread the next Republican Administration.

Were privileged Mar-a-Lago visitors invited to browse the secret documents? That doesn't strike me as unlikely, but in this thread only Jason Harvestdancer has suggested that that allegation has been proven.
 

steve_bank

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Jimmy might be right, the documents are trophies for Trump.

Having the classified documents, some in his desk, suports his fabasy of still being president.
 
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Jarhyn

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Jimmy might be right, the documents are trophies for Trump.

Having the classified documents, some in his desk, suports his fabasy of still being president.
...And is also ridiculously illegal.

Edit: the whole point of a president rather than a king is that presidents are under rather than above the law.

They are not kept in check by the decisions of oligarchs, they are kept in check by the decisions of the duly elected representatives of the people, which bind all people and those in power particularly so!
 

steve_bank

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Jimmy might be right, the documents are trophies for Trump.

Having the classified documents, some in his desk, suports his fabasy of still being president.
...And is also ridiculously illegal.

Edit: the whole point of a president rather than a king is that presidents are under rather than above the law.

They are not kept in check by the decisions of oligarchs, they are kept in check by the decisions of the duly elected representatives of the people, which bind all people and those in power particularly so!
For a long time congress has gradually ceded power to POTUS. The autority to depoy American troops without getting congressional approval. Liberal use of executive privilege.

In partce the power of POTUS has always been a fuzzy line. COTUS does not have a lot of hard bounds beyond generalizations. 'High crimes and misdemeanors' is open to interpretaion.

Reining in a president requires congress to act, which the republicans refused to do with Trump. With Nixon it was bipartisan.

Oba,a pushed executive orders to the limit. He said publicly on executve oders giveif you need something me a call I have a pen in hnad. He also sent troops toASfrica omder the radar.

Trump has gone farther tha any other POTUS, but all of them do it.

FDR tries to pack SCOTUS to get his New Deal agneda past COTUS objections.
 

Patooka

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Jimmy Higgins

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Jimmy might be right, the documents are trophies for Trump.
It was a potential interpretation, not a conclusion.
Having the classified documents, some in his desk, suports his fabasy of still being president.
And the fact he was President. But having documents on the nuclear capabilities of another nation... that is absurdly secret.
 

Jarhyn

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Jimmy might be right, the documents are trophies for Trump.
It was a potential interpretation, not a conclusion.
Having the classified documents, some in his desk, suports his fabasy of still being president.
And the fact he was President. But having documents on the nuclear capabilities of another nation... that is absurdly secret.
And illegal, when you're not in a secure room designed for viewing those documents, or when you are not authorized to be in that room for viewing those documents.

Trump's desk in Mierde-Lardo is not that place, and Trump is not so authorized. He lost that when Biden cut off his clearance, and "re-classified them with his mind" (they were already classified, and never stopped being so).
 

Jimmy Higgins

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I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.

I'll need a cite for the claim I've reddened. If your cite is Jimmy's post(s) I'll need to see the relevant excerpt(s) from Jimmy's posts.

I'll do even better and show Jimmy isn't the only one doing that.
Except, you didn't do what was asked.
Is intentionally mislabeling someone against the rules that you wish to cite?
Well yeah. So is "calling out" members as well. How many rules do you want to cop out breaking?
 

Swammerdami

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Jimmy might be right, the documents are trophies for Trump.
It was a potential interpretation, not a conclusion.
Having the classified documents, some in his desk, suports his fabasy of still being president.
And the fact he was President. But having documents on the nuclear capabilities of another nation... that is absurdly secret.

Trump is a semi-literate goon who probably cheated just to get his BS degree. (He doesn't even have an MBA.) The Higgins-Bank hypothesis is very consistent with his spoiled-brat persona.

Still, this is the man who charged Don Jr's Boy Scout membership to a charity, pilfered heirlooms from the White House, and used the recent death of his first wife to sell MAGA hats. It seems quite likely he'd have an urge to monetize the secret documents. But there may not have been anyone in his inner circle smart enough to price the documents and set up bidders. Most likely a few foreign agents were allowed to browse the collection in return for donations to Trump or "investments" in a Kushner grift.
 

marc

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Well, it looks like some of the non-classified docs might be as interesting as the classified ones.

According to court filings, there appears to be 39 pages of notes on the president's calls. Now the Jan 6 committee had said some of the call logs from that day were missing. Perhaps they are included in this pile, and what might they show?
 

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Well, it looks like some of the non-classified docs might be as interesting as the classified ones.

According to court filings, there appears to be 39 pages of notes on the president's calls. Now the Jan 6 committee had said some of the call logs from that day were missing. Perhaps they are included in this pile, and what might they show?
As much as that would be awesome, I can't imagine any notes were taken on January 6th. That'd be dumber than recording the Watergate conversations. And only one President in US history would have been that...

...well, I guess there is a chance then.

Notes on President calls isn't classified, usually, but they aren't his property either.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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Trump lawyer Alex Cannon refused to tell the National Archives that Trump had returned all documents. I'll put him on the suspect list for whistleblower who told the DOJ that there were more documents.

ETA: More at the Washington Post, but I can't get through their paywall.
Link through paywall. Certainly, Trump lawyer seemed a logical choice for whistleblower. They'd be a witness a judge would believe before signing off on a warrant to invade a former President's property. They'd also likely have some skin in the game based on documents or statements they were involved in that had legal weight and significance that could burn them.
 

Artemus

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Trump lawyer Alex Cannon refused to tell the National Archives that Trump had returned all documents. I'll put him on the suspect list for whistleblower who told the DOJ that there were more documents.

ETA: More at the Washington Post, but I can't get through their paywall.
Link through paywall. Certainly, Trump lawyer seemed a logical choice for whistleblower. They'd be a witness a judge would believe before signing off on a warrant to invade a former President's property. They'd also likely have some skin in the game based on documents or statements they were involved in that had legal weight and significance that could burn them.

Thank you for the link, Jimmy. That article contains this line: "Other Trump advisers also encouraged Cannon not to make such a definitive statement, people familiar with the matter said." Sounds like at least a few people knew what was going on, anyone of which may be DOJ source. I'm somewhat surprised that hasn't leaked out yet.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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Plaintiff (yeah, Trump is the fucking Plaintiff in this portion of the case): I didn't steal that coat. I can prove it!

Judge: Do you have the receipt?

Plaintiff: Providing a receipt could be detrimental to our case.

Judge: *drops anvil on lawyers*

So, Special Master says these documents aren't privileged because Trump didn't show cause for that, and they appeal eventually to SCOTUS? Seems like a massive delay strategy.
I'll take "called it" for $1600 Mayim. Except, we didn't even get that far.
article said:
But Trump wants those documents included in what the special master is reviewing, after the appeals court exempted them from the special master process.

In the new filing, Trump’s attorneys said “any limit on the comprehensive and transparent review of materials seized in the extraordinary raid of a President’s home erodes public confidence in our system of justice.”
So they want to pause the investigation, but the Special Master needs to have to review it to delay the FBI and DoJ. So appeal.

And then after Special Master says "this shit ain't privileged"... appeal that. Or I ponder maybe the idiot judge can just ignore the Special Master and rule it privileged -> 11th Appeals -> SCOTUS.

I can't imagine SCOTUS is going to even look at this. If they do, that might be the moment to start packing to leave the country.
 

Jason Harvestdancer

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I read a rumor that he had something much worse than nuclear documents in his possession, something so dangerous that the government took the unprecedented step of sending the FBI to raid his residence.

The rumor said he had the Epstein client list, and was going to drop it should he lose in '24.

If true, this is certainly more dangerous to those in power than any mere nuclear documents.
 

Hermit

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I read a rumor that he had something much worse than nuclear documents in his possession, something so dangerous that the government took the unprecedented step of sending the FBI to raid his residence.

The rumor said he had the Epstein client list, and was going to drop it should he lose in '24.

If true, this is certainly more dangerous to those in power than any mere nuclear documents.
Epstein systematically recorded the names, phone numbers and addresses of everyone he ever met in what is known as his Black Book.
According to an FBI affidavit, Rodriguez described the address book and the information contained within it as the "Holy Grail" or "Golden Nugget" to unraveling Epstein's sprawling child-sex network.
Gawker published every name contained therein. You can find the list here.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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I read a rumor that he had something much worse than nuclear documents in his possession, something so dangerous that the government took the unprecedented step of sending the FBI to raid his residence.

The rumor said he had the Epstein client list, and was going to drop it should he lose in '24.

If true, this is certainly more dangerous to those in power than any mere nuclear documents
A rumor. Like how you read a "rumor" but just let it lay there, passive aggressively.

I know, it must be hard to realize, Trump is a fucking con artist.
 

Toni

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I read a rumor that he had something much worse than nuclear documents in his possession, something so dangerous that the government took the unprecedented step of sending the FBI to raid his residence.

The rumor said he had the Epstein client list, and was going to drop it should he lose in '24.

If true, this is certainly more dangerous to those in power than any mere nuclear documents
A rumor. Like how you read a "rumor" but just let it lay there, passive aggressively.

I know, it must be hard to realize, Trump is a fucking con artist.
Yeah but the Democrats are as bad or worse.... (ironic not sincere)
 

Gun Nut

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I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.

I'll need a cite for the claim I've reddened. If your cite is Jimmy's post(s) I'll need to see the relevant excerpt(s) from Jimmy's posts.

I'll do even better and show Jimmy isn't the only one doing that.

This (Trump stealing and probably selling or at least sharing Top Secret info with our enemies) affects US and potentially endangers every one in the US and also the world.

As to why Donald Trump kept those documents, consider his personality. He is not much of a reader, and he has little interest in anything other than himself. So he would likely want to sell those documents to some buyer with a lot of $$$ for him. Saudi Arabia? Russia? China? North Korea?


Is intentionally mislabeling someone against the rules that you wish to cite?

You appear unable to distinguish between proven allegations and speculations. "I think George Zimmerman was a murderer" and "George Zimmerman was convicted of murder" are two different statements — surely your English skill is good enough to understand that?

Also, in "First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated" you have confused the two opposite political camps. It is the QOPAnoners (cf DeSantis) who want to force people to report on their political stances.

Do I think Trump intended to sell, or has already sold, secrets to foreign powers? Unlike Jason who seems adamant that that was the intent, or that that intent had been proven, I have serious doubts. A good spy or criminal would surely have found a better hiding place, no? Jason and I seem to agree that the Trump family is a criminal organization, but I am particularly impressed by their incompetence. Now that criminals know what is possible, I dread the next Republican Administration.

Were privileged Mar-a-Lago visitors invited to browse the secret documents? That doesn't strike me as unlikely, but in this thread only Jason Harvestdancer has suggested that that allegation has been proven.
The DoJ has the security camera footage around the locked door that led to the storage area... if they are proposing that people were allowed to peruse, or even take documents, then they have it on video.
 

Toni

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I think it is clear now that there is now that since Trump had nuclear secrets and was going to sell them to Russia, it is time to take a hard line on Trump and his supporters. Thank you Jimmy for explaining that part to me about what Trump had in his possession and his intention.

We need to give Biden emergency powers to deal with the whole MAGA movement.

They need to be removed from society. First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated. Those who can be rehabilitated can eventually be readmitted to society. The rest, well, there is no hope for them and they should be eliminated.

I'll need a cite for the claim I've reddened. If your cite is Jimmy's post(s) I'll need to see the relevant excerpt(s) from Jimmy's posts.

I'll do even better and show Jimmy isn't the only one doing that.

This (Trump stealing and probably selling or at least sharing Top Secret info with our enemies) affects US and potentially endangers every one in the US and also the world.

As to why Donald Trump kept those documents, consider his personality. He is not much of a reader, and he has little interest in anything other than himself. So he would likely want to sell those documents to some buyer with a lot of $$$ for him. Saudi Arabia? Russia? China? North Korea?


Is intentionally mislabeling someone against the rules that you wish to cite?

You appear unable to distinguish between proven allegations and speculations. "I think George Zimmerman was a murderer" and "George Zimmerman was convicted of murder" are two different statements — surely your English skill is good enough to understand that?

Also, in "First thing would be hearings to determine if a suspect has ever supported Trump. Those who have should be sent away to be reeducated" you have confused the two opposite political camps. It is the QOPAnoners (cf DeSantis) who want to force people to report on their political stances.

Do I think Trump intended to sell, or has already sold, secrets to foreign powers? Unlike Jason who seems adamant that that was the intent, or that that intent had been proven, I have serious doubts. A good spy or criminal would surely have found a better hiding place, no? Jason and I seem to agree that the Trump family is a criminal organization, but I am particularly impressed by their incompetence. Now that criminals know what is possible, I dread the next Republican Administration.

Were privileged Mar-a-Lago visitors invited to browse the secret documents? That doesn't strike me as unlikely, but in this thread only Jason Harvestdancer has suggested that that allegation has been proven.
The DoJ has the security camera footage around the locked door that led to the storage area... if they are proposing that people were allowed to peruse, or even take documents, then they have it on video.
I'm not certain that it is true that the DOJ had cameras on Mar A Lago premises. Do you have a source?
 

Ruth Harris

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I'm not certain that it is true that the DOJ had cameras on Mar A Lago premises. Do you have a source?

The DOJ is not the one with the cameras; they were security cameras in Mar-A-Lago, as specified in this article (gift link, no account required). The relevant quote from the article:

The Justice Department obtained at least one more subpoena, for security camera footage from inside Mar-a-Lago...

Ruth
 

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I'd wager that since both the Department of Justice and the Department of Homeland Security are under the executive branch, someone in one department simply needs to ask the other for footage? It's like a Walmart store manager reaching out to a Walmart distribution center accept with a lot of red tape. I'm probably wrong.
 

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WASHINGTON, Oct 5 (Reuters) - A U.S. appeals court on Wednesday granted the Justice Department's request to expedite its appeal of a lower court order appointing a special master to review records the FBI seized from former President Donald Trump's Florida estate.

The decision by the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 11th Circuit to fast-track the government's appeal represents a setback for Trump, who had opposed the request.

Last week, the Justice Department had asked the 11th Circuit to address concerns it still has with U.S. District Judge Aileen Cannon's appointment of Senior Judge Raymond Dearie, who is tasked with reviewing more than 11,000 records the FBI found inside Mar-a-Lago in order to weed out anything that may be privileged.


Cannon's order blocks the Justice Department from relying on those records for its ongoing criminal investigation until Dearie's review is complete.
 

Jason Harvestdancer

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A rumor. Like how you read a "rumor" but just let it lay there, passive aggressively.

I know, it must be hard to realize, Trump is a fucking con artist.

Don't worry, I haven't lost faith in your version of events wherein you described to me Top Secret Nuclear Documents.

Yeah but the Democrats are as bad or worse.... (ironic not sincere)

Your response makes no sense. (sincere)
 

Toni

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A rumor. Like how you read a "rumor" but just let it lay there, passive aggressively.

I know, it must be hard to realize, Trump is a fucking con artist.

Don't worry, I haven't lost faith in your version of events wherein you described to me Top Secret Nuclear Documents.

Yeah but the Democrats are as bad or worse.... (ironic not sincere)

Your response makes no sense. (sincere)
I'm sorry for your irony impairment. Helpful hint: It means the opposite of what was actually said or typed.
 
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