Men, have you ever been falsely accused of violence to women?

[DrZoidberg]

Here's a question to the men of the forum. I personally think that a factor in us believing in #MeToo is if we've, ourselves, been falsely accused of something by women. So I think it's interesting to hear if you've been falsely accused of raping or assaulting a woman?

Poll results are anonymous.

It's happened to me twice.

First as a teenager. I was accused of rape. It was a girl who had been unfaithful to her boyfriend with me. When he found out about it, she accused me of rape. The good news, for me, was that nobody believed her. It was clearly bullshit. There's no possible grey area here. She took the initiative first and we saw each other several times over several months. Each time on her initiative. I ran into her years later and she was still telling people about my crime against her. Which was, of course, incredibly unsettling, since we were now properly adults in our 20'ies. So her initial childish handling of her indiscretion had led her to convince herself her obvious lies were true. Which is so bizarre I'm not sure what to think of it. I'm guessing she has some serious mental affliction that can explain it.

Then in my thirties I was in a depression and got into a relationship with an extremely emotionally manipulative woman. When I got out of my depression I realised what a nut she was, and broke up with her. She then accuses me of having assaulted her and beaten her throughout the relationship. She was into being spanked, so she had bruises. She took these to the police as evidence. I was incredibly lucky, because all her own best friends turned on her. All of them. They told the police about her sexual interests. I'm guessing any moron could figure out that her bruises were in no way compatible with actual physical assault. It was enough for the police to drop the case. But she spent a lot of energy contacting my friends, and anybody else I had contact with, and telling them about what I'd allegedly done to her. This caused a lot of trouble for me. The friends close to her never bought her bullshit. It was only people far removed from her, who didn't know her at all that turned on me. It's a long and sad story in itself. It did bring me a lot of trouble. Worth noting is that she tried to manipulate her closest friends into being witnesses to wholly made up situations of my violence against her. I was told that this is what turned her friends against her.

It got worse. She also managed to hack one of my messenger services (because I'd used the same password as for other stuff, she knew the password for). She sent herself a bunch of death threats and stuff. Reported me to the police again. This time around she got busted, because she'd used her own phone to send the messages and the messeging service she used saved this information. They gave it to the police. So now she's guilty of an extremely serious crime and there's evidence against her. The police asked me if I wanted to press charges. I didn't. To my knowledge she's still telling the world about what a violent person I am.

The reason why I'm sharing this is because I don't think I'm special. I don't think false accusations are all that rare. Most men I've spoken to about this have also, at some point, stories about being falsely accused. I don't think it's as rare as many at this forum assumes it is.

There's actually a third one. But that one is incredibly bizarre. I'd had sex with a woman in my 20'ies. It was a friend of a friend. We had been out partying the whole group of friends. At some point we ended up in her apartment, and had great consensual drunken sex. At the time her younger brother was visiting and was sleeping over on the couch. I remember that he was at this moment incredibly drunk. But so were we. We only had sex once. But we hung out in the same circles and ran into each other now and again. She clearly felt safe around me and we liked each other. We weren't close friends. But friends. Then I randomly run into her brother in a bar, who wanted to beat me up for having "manipulated" her sister into sex. He was convinced that I'd somehow twisted his sisters arm into sex against her will. I won that fight because he was too drunk to function, and I can actually fight. I later talked to her about it, and she apologised about her brother. She explained that he was a drug addict and probably mentally ill, and got crazy shit like this into his head all the time. The following years I met her brother several times and each time was similarly "interesting". Which wasn't at all fun whenever I was around people who didn't know me that well. God knows what they started thinking about me because of this idiot.

 

[Bronzeage]

I've been married 3 times, which by simple arithmetic means at least 2 women once held some animosity toward me. Before and in between these relationships, I had several women in my life. Since the age of around 16, I have been in a relationship with a woman that was exclusive.

What this means in blunt terms is, since 1974, I have had a regular sexual partner, and excepting the customary six week period(okay, it was 5 weeks) after childbirth, have never experienced celibacy for lack of a partner.

I will be sixty one years old in another week, which marks my 47th year of satisfactory sexual activity with the opposite sex. In all that time, all those girls and women, there has never been an accusation of rape or assault, false or otherwise. Even though, I have had some partners who could be called "crazy", I have never been concerned that any of my partners might falsely accuse me of anything.

 

[phands]

I've been married 3 times, which by simple arithmetic means at least 2 women once held some animosity toward me. Before and in between these relationships, I had several women in my life. Since the age of around 16, I have been in a relationship with a woman that was exclusive.

What this means in blunt terms is, since 1974, I have had a regular sexual partner, and excepting the customary six week period(okay, it was 5 weeks) after childbirth, have never experienced celibacy for lack of a partner.

I will be sixty one years old in another week, which marks my 47th year of satisfactory sexual activity with the opposite sex. In all that time, all those girls and women, there has never been an accusation of rape or assault, false or otherwise. Even though, I have had some partners who could be called "crazy", I have never been concerned that any of my partners might falsely accuse me of anything.

I'm just 60, married for the second time 3 months ago. Similar story - since I first started being active in 1975, there has never been even been a hint of an accusation, wrongful or otherwise....and no long periods of celibacy....all within mutual agreements. I was brought up to respect and value women, not just because they were women, but because they are intelligent interesting, valuable human beings in about the same proportions men are.

That said, I grew up with 2 sisters and now have 3 daughters. One of my sisters was in an abusive relationship for years, and one of my daughters was raped. I don't think the majority of men are rapists/abusers, but it's also clear that a fairly large proportion of us are. To me it's also clear that that large proportion is enabled by the tacit acceptance or selective ignoring of of toxic masculinity from birth.

So, in summary, I think this poll isn't the best way to view this issue...it will likely just confirm the truth that not all men are rapists, or accused as such. Maybe in a proportion that reflects society as a whole, indicating the scale of the problem, but in no way helping to address it.


There's a great song by 10,000 Maniacs, called "What's the matter here?", which deals with the similar problem of parental child abuse. The ending is

And instead of love, the feel of warmth you've given him these cuts and sores won't heal with time or ageAnd I want to say, I want to say "What's the matter here?"
But I don't dare say "What's the matter here?"

But I don't dare say

It's a beautiful song, well sung by Natalie Merchant, but it makes me sad every time I play it....which is often.

 

[Gun Nut]

a (female) security guard at my place of work was approached by her manager and asked why her performance was dropping off.
She said that someone verbally assaulted her... and that someone was me. The reality was that she was responsible for something that she wasn't doing, and I sent her an email asking her to copy me on further communications so I can monitor progress. That was the "verbal assault". We did have 1 conversation in person, but it was totally normal and pleasant. I have no idea if it was the face to face conversation (that would have been caught on security camera) or the email (which is also something that could be produced and analyzed).
BUT, the response from management was for me to go apologize to her for assaulting her.

No investigation. No one asked me anything about it. Just her word versus no one elses and the determination was instantly that this poor soul was not doing her job because she was scared of me (for asking her to copy me on an email that was about providing me with something that it was her job to do). It was a lie. No way was she "fearful" of me for asking her to send me an email.... and I don't even remember the conversation face to face, but it would be on camera and show my pleasant smiling face and passive body language, if not the actual audio.

So, for me, unfortunately for many women, I have a negative feeling about "Me2". And I now, for the first time ever (this happened less than 2 months ago) can totally understand what appears to be the Republican position that women should not be trusted on their word alone in these matters. Cause, well, in this only case I know everything about, they can't.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Falsely accused? Nope.

In seriousness, I haven't had any accusations against me. They get the same respect any other person does, in the public sphere; and in the private, I listen to and respect their feelings in the moment; their comfort is more important than my satisfaction. If they ain't into it, I wouldn't be able to get into it anyway, y'know?

As a retail manager, I've handled a couple of SH issues. In both cases, surveillance video verified the accuser's report.

 

[Gun Nut]

Falsely accused? Nope.

In seriousness, I haven't had any accusations against me. They get the same respect any other person does, in the public sphere; and in the private, I listen to and respect their feelings in the moment; their comfort is more important than my satisfaction. If they ain't into it, I wouldn't be able to get into it anyway, y'know?

As a retail manager, I've handled a couple of SH issues. In both cases, surveillance video verified the accuser's report.

Ever engage in conversation with a female, exactly how you described.. normal and respectful... and observe her cover herself up more than she was by pulling on her shirt? like, as if to say, "don't look at my tits"? I hate that. I find it disrespectful of me. It is like me engaging someone with another person and outright introducing them as our witness for my protection. I should fucking do that, actually. "Hi, I've come to meet with you about that topic. This is Fred, and his coworker Sally. They will be our witnesses today to ensure accurate reporting of this interaction. Thank you in advance for your civility"

 

[rousseau]

Falsely accused? Nope.

In seriousness, I haven't had any accusations against me. They get the same respect any other person does, in the public sphere; and in the private, I listen to and respect their feelings in the moment; their comfort is more important than my satisfaction. If they ain't into it, I wouldn't be able to get into it anyway, y'know?

As a retail manager, I've handled a couple of SH issues. In both cases, surveillance video verified the accuser's report.

Ever engage in conversation with a female, exactly how you described.. normal and respectful... and observe her cover herself up more than she was by pulling on her shirt? like, as if to say, "don't look at my tits"? I hate that. I find it disrespectful of me. It is like me engaging someone with another person and outright introducing them as our witness for my protection. I should fucking do that, actually. "Hi, I've come to meet with you about that topic. This is Fred, and his coworker Sally. They will be our witnesses today to ensure accurate reporting of this interaction. Thank you in advance for your civility"

But when a woman behaves in a way to protect herself from you she's doing it for her own safety, which is more important than your feelings of pride. Sure, you might be an a-ok guy, but she doesn't know that, and has to assume otherwise until she knows it's safe to be around you.

Women being polite and respectful to every guy they meet because they 'might' not be a threat isn't a good survival strategy. So as a respectful man it's your job to understand that and let them do whatever the fuck they want until you've proven you're not going to assault them.

 

[ruby sparks]

Ever engage in conversation with a female, exactly how you described.. normal and respectful... and observe her cover herself up more than she was by pulling on her shirt? like, as if to say, "don't look at my tits"? I hate that. I find it disrespectful of me.

I'ver had that, occasionally, not very often, but only when I have been looking at someone's tits. If they're nice tits, and sometimes even if they aren't, I find my eyes do sometimes briefly go there, despite my best intentions. No point in lying about it. I'm very attracted to women. But I do try hard not to, in for example work situations, in most situations in fact.

Anyways, if a woman does that, does something (consciously or unconsciously) which indicates she's noticed and not keen on it, I would definitely take the hint, feel that I'd been inappropriate, and catch myself on. I've never once thought it disrespectful towards me of a woman to mind.

 

[skepticalbip]

Falsely accused? Nope.

In seriousness, I haven't had any accusations against me. They get the same respect any other person does, in the public sphere; and in the private, I listen to and respect their feelings in the moment; their comfort is more important than my satisfaction. If they ain't into it, I wouldn't be able to get into it anyway, y'know?

As a retail manager, I've handled a couple of SH issues. In both cases, surveillance video verified the accuser's report.

Ever engage in conversation with a female, exactly how you described.. normal and respectful... and observe her cover herself up more than she was by pulling on her shirt? like, as if to say, "don't look at my tits"? I hate that. I find it disrespectful of me. It is like me engaging someone with another person and outright introducing them as our witness for my protection. I should fucking do that, actually. "Hi, I've come to meet with you about that topic. This is Fred, and his coworker Sally. They will be our witnesses today to ensure accurate reporting of this interaction. Thank you in advance for your civility"

Something I find hilarious is I have know women who wear low cut sweaters and push-up bras who complain about "men looking at their tits". A little reality, even hetro women will look at tits so prominently displayed, maybe for different reasons but they will still look at those tits.

 

[Angry Floof]

 

[GenesisNemesis]

As a male I've had many more issues with other males than I have had with women. Much of it coming down to insensitivity/over-aggression.

 

[Thumpalumpacus]

Falsely accused? Nope.

In seriousness, I haven't had any accusations against me. They get the same respect any other person does, in the public sphere; and in the private, I listen to and respect their feelings in the moment; their comfort is more important than my satisfaction. If they ain't into it, I wouldn't be able to get into it anyway, y'know?

As a retail manager, I've handled a couple of SH issues. In both cases, surveillance video verified the accuser's report.

Ever engage in conversation with a female, exactly how you described.. normal and respectful... and observe her cover herself up more than she was by pulling on her shirt? like, as if to say, "don't look at my tits"? I hate that. I find it disrespectful of me. It is like me engaging someone with another person and outright introducing them as our witness for my protection. I should fucking do that, actually. "Hi, I've come to meet with you about that topic. This is Fred, and his coworker Sally. They will be our witnesses today to ensure accurate reporting of this interaction. Thank you in advance for your civility"

No, I haven't experienced that sort of thing, at least not the I remember or noticed. I know I've had baseless assumptions made about me, had those assumptions voiced to me be the strangers making them, and I didn't like it. But in the end, their opinion of me is none of my business. I can worry about it or move on.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Falsely accused? Nope.

In seriousness, I haven't had any accusations against me. They get the same respect any other person does, in the public sphere; and in the private, I listen to and respect their feelings in the moment; their comfort is more important than my satisfaction. If they ain't into it, I wouldn't be able to get into it anyway, y'know?

As a retail manager, I've handled a couple of SH issues. In both cases, surveillance video verified the accuser's report.

Ever engage in conversation with a female, exactly how you described.. normal and respectful... and observe her cover herself up more than she was by pulling on her shirt? like, as if to say, "don't look at my tits"? I hate that. I find it disrespectful of me. It is like me engaging someone with another person and outright introducing them as our witness for my protection. I should fucking do that, actually. "Hi, I've come to meet with you about that topic. This is Fred, and his coworker Sally. They will be our witnesses today to ensure accurate reporting of this interaction. Thank you in advance for your civility"

I had a girlfriend who kept telling me that I was staring at women's breasts. I denied it, because I had no conscious awareness of doing so. Then it was caught on camera and I saw myself clearly doing it. Still no memory of it. I think it's just a thing some men do, and it's not a conscious thing. Or it's just me. Since it's outside my conscious control, I'm not sure how to not do it. But now when I am aware of this, if this is an issue and it's important not to, I just place myself in a physical position where I can't.

I think we all have all kinds of weird tics do all kinds of strangeness that we do that only other people know about us, but that we don't.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Falsely accused? Nope.

In seriousness, I haven't had any accusations against me. They get the same respect any other person does, in the public sphere; and in the private, I listen to and respect their feelings in the moment; their comfort is more important than my satisfaction. If they ain't into it, I wouldn't be able to get into it anyway, y'know?

As a retail manager, I've handled a couple of SH issues. In both cases, surveillance video verified the accuser's report.

Ever engage in conversation with a female, exactly how you described.. normal and respectful... and observe her cover herself up more than she was by pulling on her shirt? like, as if to say, "don't look at my tits"? I hate that. I find it disrespectful of me. It is like me engaging someone with another person and outright introducing them as our witness for my protection. I should fucking do that, actually. "Hi, I've come to meet with you about that topic. This is Fred, and his coworker Sally. They will be our witnesses today to ensure accurate reporting of this interaction. Thank you in advance for your civility"

Something I find hilarious is I have know women who wear low cut sweaters and push-up bras who complain about "men looking at their tits". A little reality, even hetro women will look at tits so prominently displayed, maybe for different reasons but they will still look at those tits.

I think it's easily explained. They want attention for their tits from the people they want attention from, and not others. I think that makes perfect sense. If a girl with big tits wants to bag a hot high status guy they'll pull out all their tricks. Why wouldn't they? Still doesn't mean they want attention from unattractive low status guys. I also get annoyed when women I'm not attracted to are heavy handed about their flirting, and just won't take a hint.

"Do you work out a lot?"

And I want to reply

"Hey, lady, I'm at the gym to work out, not entertain you, fuck off"

But I don't. Instead I say

"yes". And get back to lifting weights.

 

[skepticalbip]

Something I find hilarious is I have know women who wear low cut sweaters and push-up bras who complain about "men looking at their tits". A little reality, even hetro women will look at tits so prominently displayed, maybe for different reasons but they will still look at those tits.

I think it's easily explained. They want attention for their tits from the people they want attention from, and not others. I think that makes perfect sense. If a girl with big tits wants to bag a hot high status guy they'll pull out all their tricks. Why wouldn't they? Still doesn't mean they want attention from unattractive low status guys. I also get annoyed when women I'm not attracted to are heavy handed about their flirting, and just won't take a hint.

"Do you work out a lot?"

And I want to reply

"Hey, lady, I'm at the gym to work out, not entertain you, fuck off"

But I don't. Instead I say

"yes". And get back to lifting weights.

I didn't say that I didn't understand that they make a point of displaying their tits to attract attention (of those they want to attract). However, anyone with any sense at all would have to realize that they are doing exactly what will also attract the attention of those they are upset (or pretend to be upset) over. Reality sometimes sucks and intentionally doing something which they absolutely know will invite undesired responses (or at least responses they claim are undesired) would be a self inflected result.

If a man advertises that he is looking for a mate to marry. That he is 36 years old, six foot two inches tall, 175 pounds, has a seven figure income, a large estate in Southern California and a house in Aruba, etc. he would have no grounds to bitch if he gets responses from women that he finds undesirable.

 

[rousseau]

Something I find hilarious is I have know women who wear low cut sweaters and push-up bras who complain about "men looking at their tits". A little reality, even hetro women will look at tits so prominently displayed, maybe for different reasons but they will still look at those tits.

I think it's easily explained. They want attention for their tits from the people they want attention from, and not others. I think that makes perfect sense. If a girl with big tits wants to bag a hot high status guy they'll pull out all their tricks. Why wouldn't they? Still doesn't mean they want attention from unattractive low status guys. I also get annoyed when women I'm not attracted to are heavy handed about their flirting, and just won't take a hint.

"Do you work out a lot?"

And I want to reply

"Hey, lady, I'm at the gym to work out, not entertain you, fuck off"

But I don't. Instead I say

"yes". And get back to lifting weights.

I didn't say that I didn't understand that they make a point of displaying their tits to attract attention (of those they want to attract). However, anyone with any sense at all would have to realize that they are doing exactly what will also attract the attention of those they are upset (or pretend to be upset) over. Reality sometimes sucks and intentionally doing something which they absolutely know will invite undesired responses (or at least responses they claim are undesired) would be a self inflected result.

If a man advertises that he is looking for a mate to marry. That he is 36 years old, six foot two inches tall, 175 pounds, has a seven figure income, a large estate in Southern California and a house in Aruba, etc. he would have no grounds to bitch if he gets responses from women that he finds undesirable.

It's true, but I think as men we're often quick to give ourselves the benefit of the doubt, and not give women a pass.

Humans = Dumb
Women = Humans
Women = Dumb

At some point you just have to accept that most people, men or women, do a bunch of irrational, hypocritical shit in the name of many different things. Easy to point fingers at women and miss the completely dumb shit we're doing ourselves.

 

[DrZoidberg]

Something I find hilarious is I have know women who wear low cut sweaters and push-up bras who complain about "men looking at their tits". A little reality, even hetro women will look at tits so prominently displayed, maybe for different reasons but they will still look at those tits.

I think it's easily explained. They want attention for their tits from the people they want attention from, and not others. I think that makes perfect sense. If a girl with big tits wants to bag a hot high status guy they'll pull out all their tricks. Why wouldn't they? Still doesn't mean they want attention from unattractive low status guys. I also get annoyed when women I'm not attracted to are heavy handed about their flirting, and just won't take a hint.

"Do you work out a lot?"

And I want to reply

"Hey, lady, I'm at the gym to work out, not entertain you, fuck off"

But I don't. Instead I say

"yes". And get back to lifting weights.

I didn't say that I didn't understand that they make a point of displaying their tits to attract attention (of those they want to attract). However, anyone with any sense at all would have to realize that they are doing exactly what will also attract the attention of those they are upset (or pretend to be upset) over. Reality sometimes sucks and intentionally doing something which they absolutely know will invite undesired responses (or at least responses they claim are undesired) would be a self inflected result.

If a man advertises that he is looking for a mate to marry. That he is 36 years old, six foot two inches tall, 175 pounds, has a seven figure income, a large estate in Southern California and a house in Aruba, etc. he would have no grounds to bitch if he gets responses from women that he finds undesirable.

It's not about getting the attention at all. I think it has to do with how aggressive that attention is.

In my experience when somebody is randomly angry in a disproportionate way, it usually isn't me. But I just happened to do something that 20 people before me did. And she was nice and pleasant to those 20 guys, but eventually snaps. And it becomes my problem. In those cases I just apologise and go about my business.

I also think that aggressive flirtation is about the same for men and women. The difference is that women target a much smaller elite of men. They get, pretty much, all the attention from women.

I saw a statistic that showed that about 80% of men on Tinder get zero matches. Sounds about right.

 

[rousseau]

I didn't say that I didn't understand that they make a point of displaying their tits to attract attention (of those they want to attract). However, anyone with any sense at all would have to realize that they are doing exactly what will also attract the attention of those they are upset (or pretend to be upset) over. Reality sometimes sucks and intentionally doing something which they absolutely know will invite undesired responses (or at least responses they claim are undesired) would be a self inflected result.

If a man advertises that he is looking for a mate to marry. That he is 36 years old, six foot two inches tall, 175 pounds, has a seven figure income, a large estate in Southern California and a house in Aruba, etc. he would have no grounds to bitch if he gets responses from women that he finds undesirable.

It's not about getting the attention at all. I think it has to do with how aggressive that attention is.

In my experience when somebody is randomly angry in a disproportionate way, it usually isn't me. But I just happened to do something that 20 people before me did. And she was nice and pleasant to those 20 guys, but eventually snaps. And it becomes my problem. In those cases I just apologise and go about my business.

I also think that aggressive flirtation is about the same for men and women. The difference is that women target a much smaller elite of men. They get, pretty much, all the attention from women.

I saw a statistic that showed that about 80% of men on Tinder get zero matches. Sounds about right.

Mating is a different ball-game for women. Their aim is to make sure the guy is emotionally committed to them and will also be committed to their kids. That means waiting for guys to come to them (and stay with them) which is almost universally what we see. But yea I could see them putting in a little effort if the payback was high.

The thing a lot of men don't seem to understand about flirting, is that *not flirting* is actually how you flirt. You don't approach a stranger with a cheesy line, you take your opportunities to meet women in your vicinity and your flirtation is basically just getting to know them and enjoying their company without blatantly trying to get in their pants. The thing that annoys women is when complete strangers show no regard for them as thinking, autonomous people with thoughts and feelings, and instead just go straight for the gold. That's completely counter to what women want.

If you're one of those annoying persistent guys eventually you'll break some woman down, but the ones who are a little more selective are just going to want you to go away.

 

[skepticalbip]

It's true, but I think as men we're often quick to give ourselves the benefit of the doubt, and not give women a pass.

Humans = Dumb
Women = Humans
Women = Dumb

At some point you just have to accept that most people, men or women, do a bunch of irrational, hypocritical shit in the name of many different things. Easy to point fingers at women and miss the completely dumb shit we're doing ourselves.

I agree. That was sorta my original point. I find humor in observing the foibles of human nature. The low cut sweater and push-up bra example was just an apt response to the post I was responding to originally that mentioned women complained that men look at their tits. In the same vein of complaining about getting results other than those wished for, I bitch when I cast my bait out hoping to catch a trout and end up catching a catfish. But then I can also laugh at my bitching about it. In my post, both the tits and the seven figure income were simply bait hoping for the right catch.

 

[phands]

I think an interesting supplemental question for the misogynists hereabouts would be "Have you ever been genuinely accused, but got away with it?".