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Morality in Bible stories that you don't understand

Sounds just like how the mighty Jehovah would talk. Really gets into the weeds with you.. Super fussy about the Holy Mobile Home of the Covenant. Wants the guys to trim a centimeter or two off their johnsons. Fussy about eating shellfish, but eat all the crickets you can cram in your mouth. And, okay, cow dung instead of human. For I am the mighty Oz.
 
Learner said:
I was just figuratively speaking
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No, you were talking nonsense, and hoping to get away with it.

Whenever you're unable to defend your utter tripe any longer, suddenly it transforms into "figuratively speaking"; Well, you might be able to fool yourself that you're not obviously and completely wrong, but you're not fooling anyone else.
 
Learner said:
if there were nuclear missiles coming towards you, retaliation (as it has been i n past wars World wars) would be likely.

These weapons may be deterrents and they certainly aren't decorations to merely look at and admire. They're there 'ready' to be used in the event of any attack.
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Deterrence isn't genocide, it's a bluff.

Actual use of a nuclear deterrent force would be genocide, and would represent utter failure; And everyone involved knows it.

Are you now admitting that your God is an utter failure?

The point of the deterrent is that it's only to be used when defeat is certain, to make that defeat mutual.

Are you saying that your God was also destroyed when He commanded genocide? Was He even under serious threat of being destroyed?
 
We are told, without irony, that God drowned the whole world because He was not happy with how sinful it had become...and centuries later, a solution that sure worked out well for his Son .
 
bilby said:
Learner said:
I was just figuratively speaking
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No, you were talking nonsense, and hoping to get away with it.
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Not sure why you thought you had something there, but that was being hopeful...
bilby said:
Whenever you're unable to defend your utter tripe any longer, suddenly it transforms into "figuratively speaking"; Well, you might be able to fool yourself that you're not obviously and completely wrong, but you're not fooling anyone else.
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.... being over zealous, diving eagerly into the usual futile castigation attempts, with the usual ridiculous notions.
 
Love yiur enies?

Does this mean love your enemy as yiu behead him?

Or does it mean hatig an enemy is mentally unhealthy
 
Jesus explains his own reasoning somewhat:

You have heard that it was said,

"‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect."

No one can claim 'goodness' while wallowing in old evils, and hatred of enemies is the door to many evils. He never claimed he was setting an easy path for his disciples, much though his intellectual descendants might hope for a more easily consumable Christianity.
 
And so, we get to Deuteronomy 23:2...

"2 No one born of a forbidden marriage[b] nor any of their descendants may enter the assembly of the Lord, not even in the tenth generation..." :unsure:

Hmmm...

And the question that came to mind is: Was Jesus affected in any way by this? And if so, in which ways?
 
Okay... so what is forbidden and what is the assembly of the Lord? And are we really supposed to know who married who eight generations ago? We are talking around 78 generations since this thing was written!
 
So, in the Garden of Eden, Adam and Eve break a rule, and here are the consequences:

To the woman he said,

“I will make your pains in childbearing very severe;
with painful labor you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you.”
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To Adam he said, “Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, ‘You must not eat from it,’

“Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat food from it
all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return.”
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So for Eve and every single woman in history, childbirth will be painful--well, let's be honest, childbirth will be deadly dangerous. Adam and everyone else now has to work himself every day into a sweat just to survive.

Does this seem like fitting punishment for an infraction? Does the punishment fit the crime?

Thankfully, the Industrial Revolution was the beginning of the end of these curses of YHWH. Today in the US, about 15 women die in pregnancy or childbirth out of 100,000 live births. That's 15 too many, but just a few centuries ago the rate was closer to 1200 deaths per 100,000 births. And more and more every year, people are able to earn a living without living hand-to-mouth performing sweaty, back-breaking work.

Apologists tell me that these curses were not random punishments handed down for minor infractions, but were in fact by-products of Adam and Eve eating the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge. The fruit was poisonous in some way, which somehow changed the very DNA of Eve (what, narrowing her pelvis to make childbirth incredibly painful and dangerous?) What's not explained is why Adam eating some fruit means that now once-fertile ground can only grow thorns and thistles, and now must be worked through sweaty toil.

If I told my young son not to eat rat poison, and he did anyway, should he and all his descendants be punished? Is that how I should behave if I'm to believe that God is the source of "Objective Morality"?

The ancient poet Hesiod also asked in his poem The Works, "Why do we have to work so hard to survive?" His explanation was that humanity wasn't directly responsible. The demigod Prometheus stole fire from Zeus on our behalf, which so enraged Zeus that he punished the human race. He did so by using the woman Pandora to open the box of evils, cursing everyone with sickness and death. Curious how in both tales a woman is blamed for the ills of the Earth.
 
Jimmy Higgins said:
Okay... so what is forbidden and what is the assembly of the Lord? And are we really supposed to know who married who eight generations ago? We are talking around 78 generations since this thing was written!
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. (2) Those of unknown parentage are excluded from the assembly of Israel (civil leadership in Israel).​

One of illegitimate birth shall not enter the assembly of the LORD; even to the tenth generation none of his descendants shall enter the assembly of the LORD.

a. One of illegitimate birth: It is difficult to define exactly what is meant by the term of illegitimate birth. Some later Jewish writers defined this as someone who was born of an incestuous relationship between Jews; others said it refers to those born of mixed marriages between the people of Israel and their pagan neighbors (as in Nehemiah 13:23).

(When they say 10 generations they basically mean for the longest time)
 
Politesse said:
Thomas II said:
Two issues: crushed testicles and Jesus' father.

https://thebiblesays.com/commentary/deut/deut-23/deuteronomy-231-8/
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That link is fascinating in its contradictions. "God had created a system of self-governance, under His law." In what universe would it make sense to describe a theocratic inherited monarchy as self-governing?
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https://www.pewresearch.org/religio...pecific-religions-officially-or-unofficially/

Many Countries Favor Specific Religions, Officially or Unofficially​

Islam is the most common state religion, but many governments give privileges to Christianity​


More than 80 countries favor a specific religion, either as an official, government-endorsed religion or by affording one religion preferential treatment over other faiths, according to a new Pew Research Center analysis of data covering 199 countries and territories around the world.1
Islam is the most common government-endorsed faith, with 27 countries (including most in the Middle East-North Africa region) officially enshrining Islam as their state religion. By comparison, just 13 countries (including nine European nations) designate Christianity or a particular Christian denomination as their state religion.
But an additional 40 governments around the globe unofficially favor a particular religion, and in most cases the preferred faith is a branch of Christianity. Indeed, Christian churches receive preferential treatment in more countries – 28 – than any other unofficial but favored faith.
 
James Brown said:
So, in the Garden of Eden, Adam and Eve break a rule, and here are the consequences:

To the woman he said,

“I will make your pains in childbearing very severe;
with painful labor you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you.”
Click to expand...

To Adam he said, “Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, ‘You must not eat from it,’

“Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat food from it
all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return.”
Click to expand...

So for Eve and every single woman in history, childbirth will be painful--well, let's be honest, childbirth will be deadly dangerous. Adam and everyone else now has to work himself every day into a sweat just to survive.

Does this seem like fitting punishment for an infraction? Does the punishment fit the crime?

Thankfully, the Industrial Revolution was the beginning of the end of these curses of YHWH. Today in the US, about 15 women die in pregnancy or childbirth out of 100,000 live births. That's 15 too many, but just a few centuries ago the rate was closer to 1200 deaths per 100,000 births. And more and more every year, people are able to earn a living without living hand-to-mouth performing sweaty, back-breaking work.

Apologists tell me that these curses were not random punishments handed down for minor infractions, but were in fact by-products of Adam and Eve eating the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge. The fruit was poisonous in some way, which somehow changed the very DNA of Eve (what, narrowing her pelvis to make childbirth incredibly painful and dangerous?) What's not explained is why Adam eating some fruit means that now once-fertile ground can only grow thorns and thistles, and now must be worked through sweaty toil.

If I told my young son not to eat rat poison, and he did anyway, should he and all his descendants be punished? Is that how I should behave if I'm to believe that God is the source of "Objective Morality"?

The ancient poet Hesiod also asked in his poem The Works, "Why do we have to work so hard to survive?" His explanation was that humanity wasn't directly responsible. The demigod Prometheus stole fire from Zeus on our behalf, which so enraged Zeus that he punished the human race. He did so by using the woman Pandora to open the box of evils, cursing everyone with sickness and death. Curious how in both tales a woman is blamed for the ills of the Earth.
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Hmmm...The French say "cherchez la femme" - look for the woman. French, literally "seek the woman," the reflexive notion that a woman, or passion for one, is behind whatever crime has been committed, first used by Alexandre Dumas père in "Les Mohicans de Paris" (1864) in the form cherchons la femme.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/arch...yndrome/50095e32-280a-441f-94d4-60c7c73eb11a/
 
https://bibleinterp.arizona.edu/articles/2005/10/chi298001

The Mamzer Jesus and His Birth​

So why did some people accuse Jesus of being born of fornication (porneia, John 8:41)? Was it for the same reason he was called "son of Mary" in his own town (Mark 6:3) rather than "son of Joseph"? What emerges from both Rabbinic literature (supplemented by Origen) and the New Testament is that Jesus' mother was clearly known and that the identity of his father was contested.
 

Punishing Patriarch​

I refuse to believe the narrative that describes God as a Punishing Patriarch who sends earth’s children to hell, either for sins they commit or simply for not believing. An earthly father who punishes his child by holding their hand to a candle flame would be charged with child abuse. But somehow, we’ve come to believe a loving God would burn human souls for eternity. This is completely incompatible with Jesus’ notion of love. He said, “If you earthly fathers know how to give good things to your children, even though you are sinful, how much more will God give good things to those who ask…(Matthew 7:11)?”
By the same token, whatever an abusive father might do could never be possible for God.
 
Thomas II said:
And then we get to Ezekiel 4...



​

4 “Now, son of man, take a block of clay, put it in front of you and draw the city of Jerusalem on it. 2 Then lay siege to it: Erect siege works against it, build a ramp up to it, set up camps against it and put battering rams around it. 3 Then take an iron pan, place it as an iron wall between you and the city and turn your face toward it. It will be under siege, and you shall besiege it. This will be a sign to the people of Israel.

4 “Then lie on your left side and put the sin of the people of Israel upon yourself.[a] You are to bear their sin for the number of days you lie on your side. 5 I have assigned you the same number of days as the years of their sin. So for 390 days you will bear the sin of the people of Israel.

6 “After you have finished this, lie down again, this time on your right side, and bear the sin of the people of Judah. I have assigned you 40 days, a day for each year. 7 Turn your face toward the siege of Jerusalem and with bared arm prophesy against her. 8 I will tie you up with ropes so that you cannot turn from one side to the other until you have finished the days of your siege.

9 “Take wheat and barley, beans and lentils, millet and spelt; put them in a storage jar and use them to make bread for yourself. You are to eat it during the 390 days you lie on your side. 10 Weigh out twenty shekels[b] of food to eat each day and eat it at set times. 11 Also measure out a sixth of a hin[c] of water and drink it at set times. 12 Eat the food as you would a loaf of barley bread; bake it in the sight of the people, using human excrement for fuel.” 13 The Lord said, “In this way the people of Israel will eat defiled food among the nations where I will drive them.”

14 Then I said, “Not so, Sovereign Lord! I have never defiled myself. From my youth until now I have never eaten anything found dead or torn by wild animals. No impure meat has ever entered my mouth.”

15 “Very well,” he said, “I will let you bake your bread over cow dung instead of human excrement.”

:oops:
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Cooking with... Yo What?

Human waste as a source of food and water

NASA's Given Researchers $200,000 to Turn Human Poop Into Food

​

Better imo to use waste as fuel, rather than the 'modern day idea' to turn human waste into food.

:oops:
 
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