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Morality in Bible stories that you don't understand

Thomas II said:

A Midianite Origin for YHWH?​

"Considering that, like the Sinai, volcanic activity is not attested in Israel either, some scholars have looked farther afield, and suggest that YHWH was formerly worshipped in northwestern Arabia, where a volcanic field is attested as having been active for millennia. Some even argue that Mount Sinai should be identified with one of the volcanoes on this peninsula, to which the Israelites would have gone when they left Egypt.[10] Jacob Dunn goes so far as to suggest that YHWH was formerly an Arabian volcano god.[11] All this connects to what scholars call the Midianite origin hypothesis for the cult of YHWH in Israel.[12]

This hypothesis is based on biblical hints that place the discovery of YHWH by Moses in Midian (Exodus 3:1–6), by the mountain of God located close to Jethro’s dwelling, to which God tells Moses to bring the Israelites to serve him after they leave Egypt (Exod 3:12). Moreover, Moses’ father-in-law is described as a “priest of Midian” (Exod 2:16, 18:1), implying that Moses may have learned local religious doctrine from him.[13]"
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Always hard to piece this stuff together. What we can parse is that the acts in Genesis have nearly no impact on Exodus, which presents a possibility of a completely different origin of the story. Moses is drafted into the story to bridge god to the people. I think you could deep dive into the literature until the cows come home, but the big question to ask oneself, why is Moses even necessary? Well, because Yahweh acts through intermediaries. But umm... Exo 4:10 anyone?
Exodus 4:10 said:
Then Moses told the Lord, “Please, Lord, I’m not eloquent. I never was in the past nor am I now since you spoke to your servant. In fact, I talk too slowly and I have a speech impediment.”
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Dude isn't circumcised and can't talk well. WTF?! Why is he even here? God says:
Exodus 4:11-12 said:
Don't worry, I'll get that guy that was in Quills to help you speak. He did wonders with the King of England.
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And Moses responds:
Exodus 4:13 said:
Pass.
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God got pissed, but then remembered about Aaron... and maybe should have gone there first.
Exodus 4:14 said:
Then the Lord was pissed and he said, “What about your brother, Aaron the Levite?" Then the Lord muttered under his breath, "I probably should have just went to him to start with."
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Moses, who didn't have a clue about his family back home, just nodded and went with it.

This is interesting because this presents the potential that Moses isn't even real and is a fictional guy that Aaron used to justify his standing. Kind of a Kiss Hank's Arse sort of scenario.
 
Jimmy Higgins said:
Thomas II said:

A Midianite Origin for YHWH?​

"Considering that, like the Sinai, volcanic activity is not attested in Israel either, some scholars have looked farther afield, and suggest that YHWH was formerly worshipped in northwestern Arabia, where a volcanic field is attested as having been active for millennia. Some even argue that Mount Sinai should be identified with one of the volcanoes on this peninsula, to which the Israelites would have gone when they left Egypt.[10] Jacob Dunn goes so far as to suggest that YHWH was formerly an Arabian volcano god.[11] All this connects to what scholars call the Midianite origin hypothesis for the cult of YHWH in Israel.[12]

This hypothesis is based on biblical hints that place the discovery of YHWH by Moses in Midian (Exodus 3:1–6), by the mountain of God located close to Jethro’s dwelling, to which God tells Moses to bring the Israelites to serve him after they leave Egypt (Exod 3:12). Moreover, Moses’ father-in-law is described as a “priest of Midian” (Exod 2:16, 18:1), implying that Moses may have learned local religious doctrine from him.[13]"
Click to expand...
Always hard to piece this stuff together. What we can parse is that the acts in Genesis have nearly no impact on Exodus, which presents a possibility of a completely different origin of the story. Moses is drafted into the story to bridge god to the people. I think you could deep dive into the literature until the cows come home, but the big question to ask oneself, why is Moses even necessary? Well, because Yahweh acts through intermediaries. But umm... Exo 4:10 anyone?
Exodus 4:10 said:
Then Moses told the Lord, “Please, Lord, I’m not eloquent. I never was in the past nor am I now since you spoke to your servant. In fact, I talk too slowly and I have a speech impediment.”
Click to expand...
Dude isn't circumcised and can't talk well. WTF?! Why is he even here? God says:
Exodus 4:11-12 said:
Don't worry, I'll get that guy that was in Quills to help you speak. He did wonders with the King of England.
Click to expand...
And Moses responds:
Exodus 4:13 said:
Pass.
Click to expand...
God got pissed, but then remembered about Aaron... and maybe should have gone there first.
Exodus 4:14 said:
Then the Lord was pissed and he said, “What about your brother, Aaron the Levite?" Then the Lord muttered under his breath, "I probably should have just went to him to start with."
Click to expand...
Moses, who didn't have a clue about his family back home, just nodded and went with it.

This is interesting because this presents the potential that Moses isn't even real and is a fictional guy that Aaron used to justify his standing. Kind of a Kiss Hank's Arse sort of scenario.
Click to expand...
This book is interesting "Moses: a life", by Jonathan Kirsch. (The link below shows a preview of the book to page 60). I liked it.

https://www.google.com/books/edition/Moses/x8hvDwAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&printsec=frontcover
 
Learner said:
Good Bye Doc. Godspeed.
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Indeed.

Some people leave, like Dennis MacDonald, other people are drawn to it, like Herman Mendoza.
(from your post)


"To everything turn, turn, turn
There is a season turn, turn, turn
And a time to every purpose under Heaven..."
 
And so we reach Revelation 2 : 22...

In Revelation, John labels a religious teacher in Thyatira ‘Jezebel’, stating that she is ‘teaching and beguiling [Christ’s] servants to practice fornication [πορνεῦσαι] and to eat food sacrificed to idols’ (Rev. 2.20). As punishment, John’s Christ throws her into a bed (βάλλω αὐτὴν εἰς κλίνην, Rev. 2.22).

In the letter to Thyatira (Rev. 2.18–29), the son of God character first graciously praises the community for its love, faith, service and endurance (2.19), then swiftly shifts toward making threats of violence against a woman and her associates. The punishment of the woman, who is charged with crimes of fornication, is to take place upon a bed. John describes the situation in Thyatira thus:
But I have this against you: you tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophet and is teaching and beguiling my servants to practice fornication and to eat food sacrificed to idols. I gave her time to repent, but she refuses to repent of her fornication. Beware, I am throwing her on a bed, and those who commit adultery with her I am throwing into great distress, unless they repent of her doings; and I will strike her children dead. And all the churches will know that I am the one who searches minds and hearts, and I will give to each of you as your works deserve. (Rev. 20–23)
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:oops:
 
If the biblical prophets were here today, some of them would probably be waving placards, shouting on street corners or kept in padded rooms, heavily medicated.
 
DBT said:
If the biblical prophets were here today, some of them would probably be waving placards, shouting on street corners or kept in padded rooms, heavily medicated.
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The Caves of Patmos

"First, let’s explore the natural structure and features of the environment John wrote Revelation in. Oddly enough, because the imagery within Revelation is so vivid, more than one scholar has suggested the structure of the cave in which John received his visions may have had more than a minor impact on his state of mind. This “more than a minor impact” reportedly could have been due to the inhalation of easily-verifiable cave gases. Although the cave has now been turned into a temple of sorts, one can still make out the original structure from old photos of the cave. Many theories surrounding Paleolithic cave art posited that the cave itself, the lighting, sound echoes, and so forth, would assist ancient Shaman, Priests, and Practitioners in entering trance and creating art, while also communicating with the rock walls."

"And, indeed, John was said to receive his revelations from a triple fissure in the rock, through which he was spoken to by his divine being. John is also said to have lain near the fissures, holding himself up, as he dictated the book, indicating perhaps physical discomfort. Was this discomfort caused by the consumption of an entheogen or perhaps the inhalation of certain cave gases leading to intoxication and trance?"

"Quite a number of recent studies concerning the Oracle at Delphi have concluded that the chamber into which the oracle entered was likely to contain methane, carbon dioxide, and hydrogen sulphide, large doses of which can cause euphoria and visions. Since John seemed to dictate from a spot within close vicinity of the fissures in the rock of the cave, perhaps he was inhaling some combination of gas which permitted him to enter a trance and receive his visions!"
 
So we see in Genesis that God "repented" of creating mankind and decided to wipe us out. I guess his ability to look into the future isn't so perfect after all.

Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 The Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved [e]in His heart.
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First off, I don't believe for one second that "every" thought of every person was evil. As Wikipedia says, [citation needed]. It's difficult to imagine any human society lasting more than a week if every single person's every thought was wicked. No one would be able to trade goods and services, no one would sleep lest they be attacked, no parent would provide food and shelter for their own children. It just doesn't seem possible.

I think the statement is the classic "Unlike us, those people are evil," combined with "Kid's these days," written by someone with petty grievances and no understanding of human nature. But whatever....

So YHWH decides that it's the death penalty for every man, woman, and newborn baby. Apologists tell me that this was the most moral, most just, most righteous decision that God could have made, and who are we to criticize, anyway? But whatever...

How does YHWH accomplish this? How to eliminate every wicked person? Does he give every person a heart attack? A fatal aneurysm? No, he sends a flood that not only kills all humanity, but every animal, insect, and bird on the earth. Why? The Genesis account doesn't say that every thought of every dragonfly was hopelessly wicked. Was every single rabbit bent toward evil? Were the actions of every living ostrich enough to break YHWH's heart?

And for that matter, what about the fish? Noah didn't collect two of every "kind" of fish or mammal that live in the ocean. Apologists tell me that that's because water is water, and a little more won't hurt dolphins and sharks. (Well, except the fresh-water fish like trout and salmon, who would suddenly find their freshwater habitats inundated with sea water, and those that live in shallow brackish pools, but whatever...)

So tell me, why did YHWH spare the fish?
 
https://ncse.ngo/yes-noahs-flood-may-have-happened-not-over-whole-earth
James Brown said:
So we see in Genesis that God "repented" of creating mankind and decided to wipe us out. I guess his ability to look into the future isn't so perfect after all.

Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 The Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved [e]in His heart.
Click to expand...

First off, I don't believe for one second that "every" thought of every person was evil. As Wikipedia says, [citation needed]. It's difficult to imagine any human society lasting more than a week if every single person's every thought was wicked. No one would be able to trade goods and services, no one would sleep lest they be attacked, no parent would provide food and shelter for their own children. It just doesn't seem possible.

I think the statement is the classic "Unlike us, those people are evil," combined with "Kid's these days," written by someone with petty grievances and no understanding of human nature. But whatever....

So YHWH decides that it's the death penalty for every man, woman, and newborn baby. Apologists tell me that this was the most moral, most just, most righteous decision that God could have made, and who are we to criticize, anyway? But whatever...

How does YHWH accomplish this? How to eliminate every wicked person? Does he give every person a heart attack? A fatal aneurysm? No, he sends a flood that not only kills all humanity, but every animal, insect, and bird on the earth. Why? The Genesis account doesn't say that every thought of every dragonfly was hopelessly wicked. Was every single rabbit bent toward evil? Were the actions of every living ostrich enough to break YHWH's heart?

And for that matter, what about the fish? Noah didn't collect two of every "kind" of fish or mammal that live in the ocean. Apologists tell me that that's because water is water, and a little more won't hurt dolphins and sharks. (Well, except the fresh-water fish like trout and salmon, who would suddenly find their freshwater habitats inundated with sea water, and those that live in shallow brackish pools, but whatever...)

So tell me, why did YHWH spare the fish?
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:)
https://www.gotquestions.org/fish-flood.html
 
Yes, that site seems to also feel that all fish are created equal.

Problems with a Global Flood

How did all the fish survive? Some require cool clear water, some need brackish water, some need ocean water, some need water even saltier. A flood would have destroyed at least some of these habitats.
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In any case, after reading and researching about John's crazy Revelations, and his experience with hallucinatory chemicals on Patmos, this came up...

 
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