• Welcome to the new Internet Infidels Discussion Board, formerly Talk Freethought.

"Protester" Misconduct Catch All Thread

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
22,104
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
"Look like"? Most people when they find themselves in a hole, stop digging.
I suggest you take your own advice. The suggestion that these three, and other #BLM/Antifa extremists must really be Proud Bois in disguise is almost Trumpian in ridiculousness.

Why do some people feel the need to jump so quickly to conclusions.

It's not jumping quickly, more like strolling leisurely toward a conclusion.

They look more like Sad Sacks to me which means they are probably Proud Boys false flagging.

How is being a "sad sack" not compatible with being a left wing extremist? And I have never seen a male right winger with pink hair.
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
22,104
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist

laughing dog

Contributor
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
21,350
Location
Minnesota
Gender
IT
Basic Beliefs
Dogs rule
I suggest you take your own advice. The suggestion that these three, and other #BLM/Antifa extremists must really be Proud Bois in disguise is almost Trumpian in ridiculousness.
I did not say anything about Proud Bois. I said it was possible (which, to anyone familiar with the English language does not mean "must") it was false flag. Moreover, I did not justify my suggestion by the bigoted and stupid tactic of their appearance.
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
22,104
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
I did not say anything about Proud Bois. I said it was possible (which, to anyone familiar with the English language does not mean "must") it was false flag. Moreover, I did not justify my suggestion by the bigoted and stupid tactic of their appearance.

Many things are possible. You have presented zero evidence of these attacks being "false flags". As such, your ramblings are no different than those of Rudi Giuliani or Sidney Powell.
 

laughing dog

Contributor
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
21,350
Location
Minnesota
Gender
IT
Basic Beliefs
Dogs rule
I did not say anything about Proud Bois. I said it was possible (which, to anyone familiar with the English language does not mean "must") it was false flag. Moreover, I did not justify my suggestion by the bigoted and stupid tactic of their appearance.

Many things are possible. You have presented zero evidence of these attacks being "false flags". As such, your ramblings are no different than those of Rudi Giuliani or Sidney Powell.
That one blew the irony meter. You jump to a conclusion based on a picture of graffiti and then bootstrap that conclusion by the appearance of the suspects. You are making Guiliani and Powell appear rational.
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
22,104
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
That one blew the irony meter.
How would you know? You can't own an irony meter as every one you ever had blows up the instant you write something.

You jump to a conclusion based on a picture of graffiti and then bootstrap that conclusion by the appearance of the suspects. You are making Guiliani and Powell appear rational.

The graffiti that accompanied the other vandalism at the bank fits the far-left opinions about Thanksgiving. I see no reason to suspect that it was a "false flag" attack and you have not articulated such reasons either. Just like Guiliani [sic] and voter fraud.
 

laughing dog

Contributor
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
21,350
Location
Minnesota
Gender
IT
Basic Beliefs
Dogs rule
The graffiti that accompanied the other vandalism at the bank fits the far-left opinions about Thanksgiving. I see no reason to suspect that it was a "false flag" attack
Of course. You jump to a conclusion based on the scanty evidence that is consistent with your biases. And then try to confirm it with the ludicrous attempt to connect the suspects looks with their ideology. Really, it embarrassing to read such dreck. There was no reason to jump to a conclusion so early, especially since vandalism is vandalism regardless of the motives of the perpetrators.
 

Loren Pechtel

Super Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Sep 16, 2000
Messages
36,704
Location
Nevada
Gender
Yes
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
That one blew the irony meter.
How would you know? You can't own an irony meter as every one you ever had blows up the instant you write something.

You jump to a conclusion based on a picture of graffiti and then bootstrap that conclusion by the appearance of the suspects. You are making Guiliani and Powell appear rational.

The graffiti that accompanied the other vandalism at the bank fits the far-left opinions about Thanksgiving. I see no reason to suspect that it was a "false flag" attack and you have not articulated such reasons either. Just like Guiliani [sic] and voter fraud.

Graffiti is easy to false-flag.

I'm thinking of a photo that was posted a while back showing gear supposedly taken from anarchists--but with a easily-made anarchist symbol and a professionally made 3% symbol.
 

blastula

Contributor
Joined
Apr 14, 2006
Messages
8,131
Gender
Late for dinner
Basic Beliefs
Gnostic atheist
[TWEET][FONT=&quot]https://twitter.com/Phil_Lewis_/status/1335766211687313409?s=20[/FONT][/TWEET]
 

Elixir

Made in America
Joined
Sep 23, 2012
Messages
20,876
Location
Mountains
Basic Beliefs
English is complicated
[TWEET][FONT="]https://twitter.com/Phil_Lewis_/status/1335766211687313409?s=20[/FONT][/TWEET]

That there ain't no miss conduct! Them is PATRIOTZ!!

(Of course if they were black, the gutters would be running with blood)
 

RVonse

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Messages
2,330
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
that people in the US are living in the matrx
We demand that the people with the power and the weapons to brutalize almost anyone, and who do so on a regular basis, especially now and over the last four years as their authority figure has given them permission from the highest office in the land, be held to the strictest and highest standards possible. In this country, we hold poor and powerless people accountable at the level we should be holding police and politicians and corporations accountable. We've got it backwards, and those of us who do not lick boots will continue to scrutinize every even mildly violent thing cops do until they are held accountable to a degree befitting the power they hold and the trust the public needs to have in them.
I agree with you this time Floof, so very true indeed!

But who is it that votes for exactly this kind of government? Its you and the liberals! Take the last POTUS election for example, I'm just betting you voted for Biden and Harris who are in love with the CCP and the same kind of authoritative central boot licking government! Look at their history. It was not Trump who trained our police and gave them the military weapons he just wanted to restore order.

All I can say is that you guys are making the bed that everyone else like Derec has to sleep in too.
 

Angry Floof

Tricksy Leftits
Staff member
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
14,348
Location
Sector 001
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
We demand that the people with the power and the weapons to brutalize almost anyone, and who do so on a regular basis, especially now and over the last four years as their authority figure has given them permission from the highest office in the land, be held to the strictest and highest standards possible. In this country, we hold poor and powerless people accountable at the level we should be holding police and politicians and corporations accountable. We've got it backwards, and those of us who do not lick boots will continue to scrutinize every even mildly violent thing cops do until they are held accountable to a degree befitting the power they hold and the trust the public needs to have in them.
I agree with you this time Floof, so very true indeed!

But who is it that votes for exactly this kind of government? Its you and the liberals! Take the last POTUS election for example, I'm just betting you voted for Biden and Harris who are in love with the CCP and the same kind of authoritative central boot licking government! Look at their history.

All I can say is that you guys are making the bed that everyone else like Derec has to sleep in too.

From the guy who believes that no information can be trusted and therefore the only way to discern truth is go with your animal brain instincts.

No, U.S. Democrats are not communists. For fuck's sake, this is one of the stupidest of right wing falsehoods, and that is a high bar of stupidity!
 

RVonse

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Messages
2,330
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
that people in the US are living in the matrx
We demand that the people with the power and the weapons to brutalize almost anyone, and who do so on a regular basis, especially now and over the last four years as their authority figure has given them permission from the highest office in the land, be held to the strictest and highest standards possible. In this country, we hold poor and powerless people accountable at the level we should be holding police and politicians and corporations accountable. We've got it backwards, and those of us who do not lick boots will continue to scrutinize every even mildly violent thing cops do until they are held accountable to a degree befitting the power they hold and the trust the public needs to have in them.
I agree with you this time Floof, so very true indeed!

But who is it that votes for exactly this kind of government? Its you and the liberals! Take the last POTUS election for example, I'm just betting you voted for Biden and Harris who are in love with the CCP and the same kind of authoritative central boot licking government! Look at their history.

All I can say is that you guys are making the bed that everyone else like Derec has to sleep in too.

From the guy who believes that no information can be trusted and therefore the only way to discern truth is go with your animal brain instincts.

No, U.S. Democrats are not communists. For fuck's sake, this is one of the stupidest of right wing falsehoods, and that is a high bar of stupidity!

No matter how offended you may be, you can not deny the police were indoctrinated long before Trump. All he ever did at best was attempt to restore law and order after the start of chaos.
 

GenesisNemesis

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2006
Messages
3,796
Location
California
Basic Beliefs
Secular Humanist, Scientific Skepticism, Strong Atheism
But who is it that votes for exactly this kind of government? Its you and the liberals! Take the last POTUS election for example, I'm just betting you voted for Biden and Harris who are in love with the CCP

Any evidence at all that Biden and Harris are "in love with the CCP"? Or do you just have right wing memes to back up your points?
 

Angry Floof

Tricksy Leftits
Staff member
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
14,348
Location
Sector 001
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
From the guy who believes that no information can be trusted and therefore the only way to discern truth is go with your animal brain instincts.

No, U.S. Democrats are not communists. For fuck's sake, this is one of the stupidest of right wing falsehoods, and that is a high bar of stupidity!

No matter how offended you may be, you can not deny the police were indoctrinated long before Trump.

I'm not offended by willful ignorance. It's just stupid, and it's the kind of stupid that has consequences.

There are better ways to discern truth than conveniently waving off information as unreliable so you can continue just going with what you already believe. I encourage you to find them and learn them and use them.

And of course corrupt, bigoted police culture existed before Trump. Can you show where anyone has said that corrupt, bigoted police culture did not exist before Trump? Did you just pull that out of your ass because it's easier to attack than the things we are actually saying?

So maybe it's a point of nuance, although it doesn't seem that complicated to me, Trump's over the top narcissism, dog whistling, and utter lack of conscience simply unleashed, amplified, and gave authoritative permission to the previously existing though somewhat suppressed worst tendencies of law enforcement as well as those of civilians given to bigotry and tribalism.
 

RVonse

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Messages
2,330
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
that people in the US are living in the matrx
But who is it that votes for exactly this kind of government? Its you and the liberals! Take the last POTUS election for example, I'm just betting you voted for Biden and Harris who are in love with the CCP

Any evidence at all that Biden and Harris are "in love with the CCP"? Or do you just have right wing memes to back up your points?
Look at everything the Democrats stand for. They want free and unfettered unfair global trade with China. And they want everyone to lose basic liberty with the shutdown of business and personal mask wearing like they do in China.

Do I think not wearing a mask is smart? No. But I do not think the way the liberals prefer our government to clamp down on individual liberty is worth it. And that is what the Democrats stand for.
 

RVonse

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Messages
2,330
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
that people in the US are living in the matrx
There are better ways to discern truth than conveniently waving off information as unreliable so you can continue just going with what you already believe.

You mean like Bidens 3 strikes you are out law and Harris's deeds as attorney general? Those kind of unreliable facts of history I am going on?
 

Angry Floof

Tricksy Leftits
Staff member
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
14,348
Location
Sector 001
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
But who is it that votes for exactly this kind of government? Its you and the liberals! Take the last POTUS election for example, I'm just betting you voted for Biden and Harris who are in love with the CCP

Any evidence at all that Biden and Harris are "in love with the CCP"? Or do you just have right wing memes to back up your points?
Look at everything the Democrats stand for. They want free and unfettered unfair global trade with China. And they want everyone to lose basic liberty with the shutdown of business and personal mask wearing like they do in China.

Do I think not wearing a mask is smart? No. But I do not think the way the liberals prefer our government to clamp down on individual liberty is worth it. And that is what the Democrats stand for.

All of that is so distorted and misrepresented as to be useless. You might as well listen to right wing media if that bullshit seems true to you.

Oh, wait... you already do that. Well, then, of course you would have no realistic view of either Democrats, the policies they support, or their reasons for doing so.
 

Angry Floof

Tricksy Leftits
Staff member
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
14,348
Location
Sector 001
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
There are better ways to discern truth than conveniently waving off information as unreliable so you can continue just going with what you already believe.

You mean like Bidens 3 strikes you are out law and Harris's deeds as attorney general? Those kind of unreliable facts of history I am going on?

And? So what? They've both said and done a lot of things I don't agree with, but 100% of those things I don't agree with are distorted and twisted and outright lied about by right wing authoritarian morons on a daily basis, so how would you know what's actually true about past actions or stances of Biden or Harris?

I'm not a right wing authoritarian follower, so I do not hold that black and white, good vs. evil, absolutist view of candidates that you do. I don't need to even like a particular candidate in order to vote for them. They just have to support policies and principles that most closely reflect my own. No candidate will ever be 100% perfect for anyone. It's like riding the subway, you take the stop that is closest to where you're going.

I didn't vote for either Biden or Harris in the primaries, but their not being my closer-to-ideal candidate doesn't make them evil enemies. Again, I'm not a right wing authoritarian follower, so I'm not bound to that stupid and unhelpful black and white framework.
 

Elixir

Made in America
Joined
Sep 23, 2012
Messages
20,876
Location
Mountains
Basic Beliefs
English is complicated
No, U.S. Democrats are not communists.
It is undeniable that they support the CCP.

Bullshit. I deny it.
You are wrong (being charitable and not calling it a lie)
QED

Show me PROOF that "they support the CCP". Not one or two of them - ALL of them since syntactically THAT is what you have asserted.
 

Angry Floof

Tricksy Leftits
Staff member
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
14,348
Location
Sector 001
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
No, U.S. Democrats are not communists.
It is undeniable that they support the CCP.

Bullshit. I deny it.
You are wrong (being charitable and not calling it a lie)
QED

Show me PROOF that "they support the CCP". Not one or two of them - ALL of them since syntactically THAT is what you have asserted.

Once you've swallowed the trumpity doctrine of "it's too hard to tell what's true or false in media, so the only option is to go with your gut," (which, of course, is guided by whatever authoritative ideological identity mouthpieces have hijacked your animal brain prejudices), anything, any belief at all, no matter how magical or false or ignorant, is truuuuuuuuuuue!
:joy:

Must be such a relief! Developing a conscience is hard.
 

Elixir

Made in America
Joined
Sep 23, 2012
Messages
20,876
Location
Mountains
Basic Beliefs
English is complicated
Bullshit. I deny it.
You are wrong (being charitable and not calling it a lie)
QED

Show me PROOF that "they support the CCP". Not one or two of them - ALL of them since syntactically THAT is what you have asserted.

Once you've swallowed the trumpity doctrine of "it's too hard to tell what's true or false in media, so the only option is to go with your gut," (which, of course, is guided by whatever authoritative ideological identity mouthpieces have hijacked your animal brain prejudices), anything, any belief at all, no matter how magical or false or ignorant, is truuuuuuuuuuue!
:joy:

Must be such a relief! Developing a conscience is hard.

The killer for me is the blithe use of vacuous declarations and calling them "undeniable".
I mean... free speech is free, but worth less than its cost in many cases.
 

ZiprHead

Loony Running The Asylum
Staff member
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
Messages
31,354
Location
Frozen in Michigan
Gender
Old Fart
Basic Beliefs
Democratic Socialist Atheist
There are better ways to discern truth than conveniently waving off information as unreliable so you can continue just going with what you already believe.

You mean like Bidens 3 strikes you are out law and Harris's deeds as attorney general? Those kind of unreliable facts of history I am going on?

First of all, it wasn't Biden's law. It was actually introduced by a Texas Republican and had huge support on both sides of the aisle, including the Congressional Black Caucus.
 

ZiprHead

Loony Running The Asylum
Staff member
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
Messages
31,354
Location
Frozen in Michigan
Gender
Old Fart
Basic Beliefs
Democratic Socialist Atheist

Angry Floof

Tricksy Leftits
Staff member
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
14,348
Location
Sector 001
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
And of course, it's Portland.

A bunch of radicals "protesting" against Thanksgiving have vandalized businesses.

Group breaks windows, tags SE Portland businesses with graffiti

I wonder if pro-Antifa Multnomah County DA will actually prosecute the three who were arrested for this.

View attachment 30643

And when you just don't have the conscience or humanity to reevaluate your inhumane world view, you just dehumanize and demonize the poor and marginalized even harder!
 

Jimmy Higgins

Contributor
Joined
Feb 1, 2001
Messages
37,031
Basic Beliefs
Calvinistic Atheist
There are better ways to discern truth than conveniently waving off information as unreliable so you can continue just going with what you already believe.

You mean like Bidens 3 strikes you are out law and Harris's deeds as attorney general? Those kind of unreliable facts of history I am going on?

First of all, it wasn't Biden's law. It was actually introduced by a Texas Republican and had huge support on both sides of the aisle, including the Congressional Black Caucus.
The misremembrance of that law is incredible. It had widespread Republican support and the GOP want to drop this on Biden as if he came up with an idea to incarerate all black people. It certainly seemed like it made a little sense at the time, and thankfully, like science, when data and experience tells us it didn't work or is wrong, we can actually move forward, recognize it, and try to fix it.
 

RVonse

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Messages
2,330
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
that people in the US are living in the matrx
No, U.S. Democrats are not communists.
It is undeniable that they support the CCP.

Bullshit. I deny it.
You are wrong (being charitable and not calling it a lie)
QED

Show me PROOF that "they support the CCP". Not one or two of them - ALL of them since syntactically THAT is what you have asserted.

There is plenty of proof to be found starting with the Clinton Administration and the introduction of China into the WTO. But rather than googling and pasting all that history just consider this. The trade agreements with China and the slide of American middle class decline began simultaneously together and was no accident. It took both agency and direction of the establishment to make that happen. Both Biden and Obama clearly wanted further TPP agreements with the CCP which became a primary platform for Trump. I can not say that Trumps tariffs were successful or not at this point but they were a clear indication of where he stood. And it is also clear that Biden is and always has been the establishment and will clearly take the tariffs down as soon as he begins his term.

There are tin foilers in the Trump camp who believe China interfered in the last election for Biden. I'm not willing to go that far with that statement. But if you only look at the Global Times (Chinese publication edited by the CCP) there are numerous articles admitting that the CCP clearly wanted Biden.
 

RVonse

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Messages
2,330
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
that people in the US are living in the matrx
First of all, it wasn't Biden's law. It was actually introduced by a Texas Republican and had huge support on both sides of the aisle, including the Congressional Black Caucus.
The misremembrance of that law is incredible. It had widespread Republican support and the GOP want to drop this on Biden as if he came up with an idea to incarerate all black people. It certainly seemed like it made a little sense at the time, and thankfully, like science, when data and experience tells us it didn't work or is wrong, we can actually move forward, recognize it, and try to fix it.

There is footage out there where Biden bragged about it.
 

RVonse

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2005
Messages
2,330
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
that people in the US are living in the matrx
And when you just don't have the conscience or humanity to reevaluate your inhumane world view, you just dehumanize and demonize the poor and marginalized even harder!
Good point.

If you think this through though, you really can not have life (or a good life) unless the state respects private property. Because if the state does not respect and/or protect private property there can be no individual liberty. With no property right you are nothing but a slave to the state. And as a slave to the state what is your life really worth? No much IMHO. When the United States was founded Patrick Henry said "give me liberty or give me death". That statement is easily glossed over now days but it is still as true today as it was then.
 

Angry Floof

Tricksy Leftits
Staff member
Joined
Jul 17, 2008
Messages
14,348
Location
Sector 001
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
And when you just don't have the conscience or humanity to reevaluate your inhumane world view, you just dehumanize and demonize the poor and marginalized even harder!
Good point.

If you think this through though, you really can not have life (or a good life) unless the state respects private property. Because if the state does not respect and/or protect private property there can be no individual liberty. With no property right you are nothing but a slave to the state. And as a slave to the state what is your life really worth? No much IMHO. When the United States was founded Patrick Henry said "give me liberty or give me death". That statement is easily glossed over now days but it is still as true today as it was then.

Without humane principles and some awareness of all the people with whom you share a society, that bullshit means nothing. No rich person's property, or anyone's property for that matter, is worth defending if human well being isn't. And here's a hint: "human well being" means a lot more than just the well being of the things you own.
 

ZiprHead

Loony Running The Asylum
Staff member
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
Messages
31,354
Location
Frozen in Michigan
Gender
Old Fart
Basic Beliefs
Democratic Socialist Atheist
Bullshit. I deny it.
You are wrong (being charitable and not calling it a lie)
QED

Show me PROOF that "they support the CCP". Not one or two of them - ALL of them since syntactically THAT is what you have asserted.

There is plenty of proof to be found starting with the Clinton Administration and the introduction of China into the WTO. But rather than googling and pasting all that history just consider this. The trade agreements with China and the slide of American middle class decline began simultaneously together and was no accident. It took both agency and direction of the establishment to make that happen. Both Biden and Obama clearly wanted further TPP agreements with the CCP which became a primary platform for Trump. I can not say that Trumps tariffs were successful or not at this point but they were a clear indication of where he stood. And it is also clear that Biden is and always has been the establishment and will clearly take the tariffs down as soon as he begins his term.

There are tin foilers in the Trump camp who believe China interfered in the last election for Biden. I'm not willing to go that far with that statement. But if you only look at the Global Times (Chinese publication edited by the CCP) there are numerous articles admitting that the CCP clearly wanted Biden.

China was accepted into the WTO almost a year after Clinton left office. And NAFTA was negotiated by the Bush I administration.

As for the TPP:
The Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP), also called the Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement, was a proposed trade agreement between Australia, Brunei, Canada, Chile, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore, Vietnam, and the United States signed on 4 February 2016. After the newly elected US president Donald Trump withdrew the US signature from TPP in January 2017,[5] the agreement could not be ratified as required and did not enter into force. The remaining countries negotiated a new trade agreement called Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership, which incorporates most of the provisions of the TPP and which entered into force on 30 December 2018.

The TPP began as an expansion of the Trans-Pacific Strategic Economic Partnership Agreement (TPSEP or P4) signed by Brunei, Chile, New Zealand and Singapore in 2005. Beginning in 2008, additional countries joined the discussion for a broader agreement: Australia, Canada, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, Peru, the United States, and Vietnam, bringing the negotiating countries to twelve. In January 2017, the United States withdrew from the agreement.[6] The other 11 TPP countries agreed in May 2017 to revive it[7][8] and reached agreement in January 2018. In March 2018, the 11 countries signed the revised version of the agreement, called Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership.[9] After ratification by six of them (Australia, Canada, Japan, Mexico, New Zealand and Singapore), the agreement came into force for those countries on 30 December 2018.

And our trade deficit with China has gone nowhere but up under Trump.
 

ZiprHead

Loony Running The Asylum
Staff member
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
Messages
31,354
Location
Frozen in Michigan
Gender
Old Fart
Basic Beliefs
Democratic Socialist Atheist
First of all, it wasn't Biden's law. It was actually introduced by a Texas Republican and had huge support on both sides of the aisle, including the Congressional Black Caucus.
The misremembrance of that law is incredible. It had widespread Republican support and the GOP want to drop this on Biden as if he came up with an idea to incarerate all black people. It certainly seemed like it made a little sense at the time, and thankfully, like science, when data and experience tells us it didn't work or is wrong, we can actually move forward, recognize it, and try to fix it.

There is footage out there where Biden bragged about it.

Probably every politician that signed onto that legislation bragged about it.
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,602
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
First of all, it wasn't Biden's law. It was actually introduced by a Texas Republican and had huge support on both sides of the aisle, including the Congressional Black Caucus.
The misremembrance of that law is incredible. It had widespread Republican support and the GOP want to drop this on Biden as if he came up with an idea to incarerate all black people. It certainly seemed like it made a little sense at the time, and thankfully, like science, when data and experience tells us it didn't work or is wrong, we can actually move forward, recognize it, and try to fix it.

There is footage out there where Biden bragged about it.

This in no way contradicts what Higgins and Zipr said. "Tough on Crime" was a big thing. Almost every politician jumped on that bandwagon.
Tom
 

Loren Pechtel

Super Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Sep 16, 2000
Messages
36,704
Location
Nevada
Gender
Yes
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
No, U.S. Democrats are not communists.
It is undeniable that they support the CCP.

Bullshit. I deny it.
You are wrong (being charitable and not calling it a lie)
QED

Show me PROOF that "they support the CCP". Not one or two of them - ALL of them since syntactically THAT is what you have asserted.

And note that not buying into the right-wing conspiracy theories about China isn't the same thing as supporting them.
 

GenesisNemesis

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2006
Messages
3,796
Location
California
Basic Beliefs
Secular Humanist, Scientific Skepticism, Strong Atheism
Look at everything the Democrats stand for. They want free and unfettered unfair global trade with China.

LOL. This is just amoral capitalism at work. That's how capitalism works.

And they want everyone to lose basic liberty with the shutdown of business and personal mask wearing like they do in China.

LOL. Obviously this because there's a pandemic, and also you're talking out of your ass. Has nothing to do with democrats loving China. Your arguments are so dogshit, it's fucking embarrassing.
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
22,104
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
Without humane principles and some awareness of all the people with whom you share a society, that bullshit means nothing. No rich person's property, or anyone's property for that matter, is worth defending if human well being isn't. And here's a hint: "human well being" means a lot more than just the well being of the things you own.
Whose wellbeing is defended exactly when a Target store in Minneapolis is looted or when a car dealership is destroyed in Kenosha?
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
22,104
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
The misremembrance of that law is incredible. It had widespread Republican support and the GOP want to drop this on Biden as if he came up with an idea to incarerate all black people. It certainly seemed like it made a little sense at the time, and thankfully, like science, when data and experience tells us it didn't work or is wrong, we can actually move forward, recognize it, and try to fix it.

Of course it had bipartisan support. But now actually incarcerating dangerous criminals is controversial in the Democratic Party, not the Republican Party.

Of course, not everything about the Crime Bill was right. But it got more right than claimed by the leftist critics of the law. I think the pendulum is swinging way too far the other way now. Take the new LA DA who will refuse to prosecute any minor as an adult, among other criminal justice deforms he has announced.

That means that a 16 or 17 year old banger can commit murder and all he or she has to fear is a few years in juvie. Guess whom the Bloods and the Crips will not increasingly use as enforcers now.
LA's New DA George Gascón Promises Sweeping Changes, Less Punitive Approach to Crime

It's idiotic overreach that will make LA less safe, not more.

Back to the Crime Bill, as Zipr said, many black lawmakers supported it as well. And for a good reason. Even while blacks are committing crimes at a higher rate, they are also victims of these crimes at higher rates too. Not going forcefully against for example street gangs will harm the predominately black neighborhoods most severely.
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
22,104
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
[Some twit's (goes by Aren LeBrun) idiotic tweet]

Vandalism is considered a crime because it is in fact a crime - not sure if it legally has a "violent" crime designation, but it in either case needs to be prosecuted. It is an issue completely unrelated to the policy question of what health care coverage should be guaranteed by law.
To defend criminals breaking windows or destroying ATMs because of an unrelated policy issue is truly idiotic.

By the way, some car thieves in Atlanta today got their just deserts. Or desserts; flambéed.
1 dead, 1 critical after stolen car crashes in Midtown, police say

Not politically motivated crime, but still. Aren LeBrun would think this a non-crime because it's just them stealing somebody else's property, and 'property is theft" or something. :rolleyes:
The thieves almost got away with it due to City of Atlanta's no chase policy, but two heroic utility poles stopped this latter day Bonnie and Clyde. Just too bad an innocent Jag was destroyed. :( Glad they didn't hit anybody else though...
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
22,104
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
Graffiti is easy to false-flag.
That may be so, but no evidence is no evidence. You, fromderinside and the hound have zero evidence that these attacks were "false flag". No matter how much you wish to exonerate #BLMers and Antifas.

Note that these particular graffiti fit the leftist "stolen land/Thanksgiving celebrates genocide" narrative but that narrative is less well known among the general public. If it was false flag, I'd expect something more obvious like "Fuck Trump" or "Abolish police".

Note also the people who were arrested. They look more like #BLM and Antifas than false flag rightists. While there are black right wingers, many more are left wing. Particularly ones who dye their hair pink. :)

I'm thinking of a photo that was posted a while back showing gear supposedly taken from anarchists--but with a easily-made anarchist symbol and a professionally made 3% symbol.
You don't think Antifas can make a stencil? The "false flag" argument can cut both ways ...
 

marc

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2008
Messages
1,874
Location
always on the move
Basic Beliefs
Atheist, skeptic, nerd
Look at everything the Democrats stand for. They want free and unfettered unfair global trade with China.

LOL. This is just amoral capitalism at work. That's how capitalism works.

And they want everyone to lose basic liberty with the shutdown of business and personal mask wearing like they do in China.

LOL. Obviously this because there's a pandemic, and also you're talking out of your ass. Has nothing to do with democrats loving China. Your arguments are so dogshit, it's fucking embarrassing.

wait.... free and unfettered global trade with China, I would guess for goods... which we would do what with since we can't sell anything because the businesses are all shut down?
and isn't free trade the republican's big talking points?
 

Elixir

Made in America
Joined
Sep 23, 2012
Messages
20,876
Location
Mountains
Basic Beliefs
English is complicated
...isn't free trade the republican's big talking points?

Yeah it is if they do it, but not if Dems do it.
Just like deficit spending. It's a great economic boost to give away trillions of taxpayer dollars to billionaires, but for the love of God and Country, don't even suggest trying to keep people out of poverty.
 

GenesisNemesis

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2006
Messages
3,796
Location
California
Basic Beliefs
Secular Humanist, Scientific Skepticism, Strong Atheism
Y'know, I'm starting to think that since 200k+ Americans are dead and that's not a big deal, then Antifa committing violence isn't such a big deal either. After all it's only a few people who are affected. That's virtually nobody.
 

Loren Pechtel

Super Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Sep 16, 2000
Messages
36,704
Location
Nevada
Gender
Yes
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
Graffiti is easy to false-flag.
That may be so, but no evidence is no evidence. You, fromderinside and the hound have zero evidence that these attacks were "false flag". No matter how much you wish to exonerate #BLMers and Antifas.

Note that these particular graffiti fit the leftist "stolen land/Thanksgiving celebrates genocide" narrative but that narrative is less well known among the general public. If it was false flag, I'd expect something more obvious like "Fuck Trump" or "Abolish police".

Note also the people who were arrested. They look more like #BLM and Antifas than false flag rightists. While there are black right wingers, many more are left wing. Particularly ones who dye their hair pink. :)

I'm thinking of a photo that was posted a while back showing gear supposedly taken from anarchists--but with a easily-made anarchist symbol and a professionally made 3% symbol.
You don't think Antifas can make a stencil? The "false flag" argument can cut both ways ...

You missed the point. Note: "professionally made 3% symbol." Which is more likely, that antifi put a small 3% patch on their packs with big As, or that a 3%er forgot about the patch when they painted a big A on the pack?
 

blastula

Contributor
Joined
Apr 14, 2006
Messages
8,131
Gender
Late for dinner
Basic Beliefs
Gnostic atheist
[TWEET]https://twitter.com/Fahrenthold/status/1336483828349751296?s=20[/TWEET]
 

Elixir

Made in America
Joined
Sep 23, 2012
Messages
20,876
Location
Mountains
Basic Beliefs
English is complicated
Top Bottom