-
Features
Rape culture: British Style
- Thread starter ksen
- Start date
The Paul
Member
I can see the victim blaming and I can see why it's a problem.
Still not half as ugly as American style rape culture, though:
AthenaAwakened
Contributor
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2003
- Messages
- 5,338
- Location
- Right behind you so ... BOO!
- Basic Beliefs
- non-theist, anarcho-socialist
1 out of 1 rapes come about due to the actions of rapists.
EricK
Senior Member
That is true. And it is also true that 1 out of 1 burglaries come about by the actions of burglars. But that doesn't make it wrong or 'victim blaming' to point out that 1 in 3* burglary victims went out of the house but left a window open.
*Or whatever the proportion is.
This site for instance isn't victim blaming is it?: http://content.met.police.uk/Site/crimepreventionbumblebee
Derec
Contributor
That was my point. Burglars will not be deterred by "1 out of 1 burglaries ..." poster but homeowners might be affected by a similar poster telling them what they can do to protect themselves. Athena, I think stuff flew over your head instead.
AthenaAwakened
Contributor
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2003
- Messages
- 5,338
- Location
- Right behind you so ... BOO!
- Basic Beliefs
- non-theist, anarcho-socialist
if 100% of burglary victims leave their door standing wide open, does that mean the burglars aren't burglars? That the burglary isn't their fault?
If everyhouse is locked properly, think burglary will stop? I don't think so. I think that locks help keep honest people honest but don't do a thing about a crook determined to get you flat screen.
Derec
Contributor
It is. What does that have to do with people protecting themselves though?
One can call to people to take reasonable precautions without saying that burglars aren't responsible for burglaries.
Well if you are going to steal from an unlocked house you weren't that honest to begin with. Not any more than a man who would take advantage of a passed out woman.
repoman
Contributor
A related thing would be the signs warning about car prowlers in parks or underpasses. If you had an expensive or precious item stolen from that car would the insurance be justified in refusing to cover the loss?
I think that will all the money that bars make from serving people enough drinks to get plastered that they should pitch in to help people get home or to a safe way station.
Barring that, reminding women to be careful when drinking and to have support system around is a good thing. They can't be unraped or unassaulted once it is already done.
I think that will all the money that bars make from serving people enough drinks to get plastered that they should pitch in to help people get home or to a safe way station.
Barring that, reminding women to be careful when drinking and to have support system around is a good thing. They can't be unraped or unassaulted once it is already done.
Toni
Contributor
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2011
- Messages
- 19,893
- Basic Beliefs
- Peace on Earth, goodwill towards all
But but but: why doesn't that also apply to men? Why not warn men to avoid drinking too much to protect themselves from a) rape and b)accusations of rape?
If you think there is a woman out there who doesn't realize that she's more vulnerable if she's been drinking, then you are very much mistaken. But people--male and female people-often misjudge how much alcohol they can handle and even how much they've had to drink not to mention their own state of drunkenness.
Why not impose drink limits and curfews on men as they are more likely to be rapists and women more likely to be victims? Why continue to punish victims/potential victims by forcing them to limit their own actions? Why not encourage men to limit their own actions and alcohol consumption and keep us all safer?
EricK
Senior Member
Of course not. As I say, 1 out of 1 burglaries come about due to the action of burglars.
Locks keep honest people out - and less than determined burglars. Or as the proverb says "Never call a man honest, just because he hasn't had the opportunity to steal"
Is there an equivalent in the rape scenario to a less than determined i.e. opportunistic burglar? If so, then presumably there is some preventative action one can take to prevent oneself becoming the victim of that opportunistic crime.
My house has never been broken into - which certainly means there has never been a truly determined burglar who has wanted to get in. Now it's possible that if I had left the door or window open every day I would still have not been the victim of a crime - but that seems unlikely. I suspect my precautions have prevented my house being burgled (although I can't be 100% certain of that, of course).
AthenaAwakened
Contributor
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2003
- Messages
- 5,338
- Location
- Right behind you so ... BOO!
- Basic Beliefs
- non-theist, anarcho-socialist
uh
This is tiring
My post isn't meant for rapists, but for well meaning people who erroneously believe that rapist won't rape if their intended victims do all the right things. If that were true, babies would not get raped. Rape is the act of the rapist, period. And not matter what the victim did or didn't do, the rape is the rapist fault 100%.
The moment you say, "if s/he had just done this..." you are saying the rapist somehow wasn't in control of his actions and the victim was.
The discussion before a rape and the discussion after a rape are two different things. It is common prudence to be aware when one is the prey and there are predators about.
On one hand, we encourage actions which make things more difficult for the predator and on the other, we decide what to do about the predator.
Toni
Contributor
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2011
- Messages
- 19,893
- Basic Beliefs
- Peace on Earth, goodwill towards all
When will the conversation be about the predators?
EricK
Senior Member
eg here:http://www.wecanstopit.co.uk/
or here: http://www.bristol.gov.uk/sites/def.../abuse_or_neglect/abuse-myths-booklet_web.pdf
or lots of places really.
AthenaAwakened
Contributor
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2003
- Messages
- 5,338
- Location
- Right behind you so ... BOO!
- Basic Beliefs
- non-theist, anarcho-socialist
Never.
My freshman year in college I went to four workshops for women on rape prevention in my dorm alone. My boyfriend lived in the same dorm. He went to no workshops for men because no workshops for men were offered. yet, the vast majority of rapists then, as now, were men.
You would think we as a society would put the burden of prevention on the people most likely to break the law.
AthenaAwakened
Contributor
- Joined
- Sep 17, 2003
- Messages
- 5,338
- Location
- Right behind you so ... BOO!
- Basic Beliefs
- non-theist, anarcho-socialist
It always is about predators.
This always goes back to the same old disputes. Rape is a spectrum and we recognize this by defining different degrees of punishment for those who rape, depending on various factors, but most of all, the violence involved in the crime. The more violent the act, the worse the punishment. We even include a factor for the victims vulnerability, especially when the victim is a child.
There is little dispute about what constitutes rape at the far end of the spectrum. These days, most arguments are at the lighter end. We end up trying to find the line where sexual contact crosses from the mutually consenting, into the non-consenting on one person's part.
The standards which classify violent rape offer little help on the opposite end.
EricK
Senior Member
Their are no posters or workshops telling people how not to break into houses, or that leaving a window open is not an invitation for them to come in. Why aren't we putting the burden of prevention on the burglars?
The Paul
Member
Well, if all you're saying is that a paticular obviously unsecured building is more likely to be robbed than one that has been secured, all things being equal, you're not wrong.
If you try to suggest that if people were to do a better job of keeping their windows and doors locked there'd be fewer burglaries overall, though, you're probably wrong.