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Russian Invasion of Ukraine - tactics and logistics
- Thread starter Rhea
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Not as good as your previous fantasies if I'm honest. Maybe you need to take a break.
Yup. Whatever the outcome of the war Russia is basically committing suicide by brain drain. I just hope their nukes all degrade into uselessness before things fall apart too badly.
Any country that suffers mass emigration ends up a wreck. The problem is the ones that leave are the the ones who most trust their ability to land on their feet in a different society--the ones that rely on themselves and have marketable skills rather than rely on connections. While it might only be 10% of the workforce (so far....) it's a lot more than 10% of the production of that workforce. It's not like in the old days where they made it very hard to defect, now you can simply leave and don't have to make it political.
Ford
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It's hard for someone who lives in an alternate reality to simply take a break. Our intrepid Putin Fanboy spends his days consuming Russian state media and then coming here to wage a personal crusade to spread the Good News of the "Special Military Operation." He probably believes that the people of Ukraine...sorry...Western Province of Russia...have been begging for the highly competent Russian military to liberate them from that Nazi (Jewish) Zelenskyy and his government based in a city - Kyiv - which was only founded in 1991.
It has to be extra hard to reconcile the fact that Western Province of Russia was not immediately over-run by glorious Special Military Operation led by heroic man of peace Putin, so he decides that the only reason it lasted longer than a weekend has nothing to do with the Ukrainian people (who don't exist), and everything to do with Nazi weapons flowing in from the hated West.
The cognitive dissonance gets really deep, though, when trying to reconcile the fact that the great and powerful Russian military is failing. "Ah, you see...goal was never to topple Kyiv! That retreat is simply Russian forces advancing back towards Mother Russia so that ineffective western-supplied weapons are out of range! Brilliant strategy by Putin!"
barbos
Contributor
That's just in!
Ukrainian ambassador in Germany called german chancellor "offended liver sausage" Yep, that's what he called main guy in Germany
You ask why? because he refused to visit Kiev.
And why did he refuse to visit Kiev? because Ukraine did not let german president to visit Kiev he was not pro-ukrainian enough for them
Such a soap opera.
Ukrainian ambassador in Germany called german chancellor "offended liver sausage" Yep, that's what he called main guy in Germany
You ask why? because he refused to visit Kiev.
And why did he refuse to visit Kiev? because Ukraine did not let german president to visit Kiev
he was not pro-ukrainian enough for them Such a soap opera.
DrZoidberg
Contributor
I just want to say that I value Barbos perspective in this thread. I think it's wrong, bonkers and badly twisted. But it is the Russian version of the war narrative. A narrative that I don't think I would have fully understood without his input.
I always value learning other people's perspective. It's always good getting a reality check.
I always value learning other people's perspective. It's always good getting a reality check.
Barbos' blind devotion to a fascist dictator has a very real human life cost. Your take is a little naive.
TV and credit cards
Contributor
How much of that shit do you really need to read? I drew my conclusion pages ago. Barbos has been presented with enough evidence right here to put doubt in the mind of an honest individual, yet his posts have only gotten more absurd.
T.G.G. Moogly
Traditional Atheist
DrZoidberg
Contributor
What are you saying? It's always good to hear that other side in any conflict or disagreement. Step one for convincing anyone of anything is understanding their point of view. That would be true regardless of how morally reprehensible it is. If you fear learning an opinion, then that says something about how weak your own conviction is.
If your ideological oponents go silent, that doesn't mean you won the argument.
Harry Bosch
Contributor
I don't disagree. However, I do think that we're probably getting a good read on how a majority (who knows how much) of the Russians believe. I think that we are deluding ourselves if we think that Russians secretly prefer peace and that the entire deck of cards will crumble once or if Putin is deposed. I think that the average Russian really believes that they are the victim. They really believe that Ukrainians (and everyone else maybe) are Nazis. And that there really is very little chance at a peace. Russians who want peace are fleeing Russia.
SLD
Contributor
Sure. But Russian forces are the ones getting their butts kicked in Ukraine. What’s crazy is invading a sovereign country without provocation. Who gives a shit about their internal regime? IT’S THEIR FUCKING COUNTRY. They didn’t attack Russia, Russia attacked them, and no amount of reasoning by you, justifies what your fucked up country has done. You have destroyed decades of trust. People will condemn the Russian people for doing this for thousands of years. Just as Germany bears the shame of Hitler for launching WWII. You can rationalize it all you want. Nobody believes you. The whole world has condemned you. Your arguments will never erase your shame.
seriously, what fucking good has this war done for you? How is Russia’s security situation improved by having 1,000 tanks destroyed? How has it helped Russia that 15,000 of its young men lie dead?
You have never answered those questions! And now you’re fucked up leader is going to double down and fully mobilize the reserves, sending hundreds of thousands conscripted soldiers to the war and tens of thousands to their deaths. No matter what you do you will never conquer Ukraine. They don’t want you there. Go home.
TV and credit cards
Contributor
We‘ll just have to wait and see. Those who flee are those who can afford to flee. Copernicus has posted about how Russians answer polling questions and so have I. It’s passive. I believe many go along to get along.
Bombings within Russia and not just along the border with Ukraine have a psychological effect. It shows Putin is not as in control as he would have people believe. This, along with sons not coming home (not even their bodies) affect the mood of the community. Just as sure as a barbos can dutifully support Putin, one can turn on him.
Why Russians Swallow Propaganda (repeat post)
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You said you don't get your news from Russian media, you get it from youtube bloggers. Which is it now?
Elixir
Made in America
Whichever best promotes Pootler's agenda and messaging at the moment, of course.
Copernicus
Industrial Grade Linguist
I would also caution people against using barbos as some kind of expert on what Russians believe. There are no other Russians here to give their opinions, and one has to be exposed to a lot of them to even begin to get a sense of what public opinion is like in Russia. I can tell you that it is very diverse. Russians are not shy about giving their opinions in private conversations.
Barbos is seldom backs up what he says, and he sometimes seems to operate under the delusion that people will know what he is talking about if he just makes references to things he sees in his Russia-biased news sites. I find it a lot more informative to monitor TASS, RT, and some other propaganda outlets to get a better sense of what the Russian government wants people to believe. Some of the things that barbos refers to can be better understood that way, but he also seems to spend a lot of time on blog and social media sites that I don't monitor. It is not difficult to find Russians who disagree completely with his take on the war, but it is highly unlikely that any would be interested in posting here. Barbos has been with us for quite a few years, and he doesn't say anything that is likely to get him into trouble with the authorities. One should assume that everything he says here is being monitored.
Barbos is seldom backs up what he says, and he sometimes seems to operate under the delusion that people will know what he is talking about if he just makes references to things he sees in his Russia-biased news sites. I find it a lot more informative to monitor TASS, RT, and some other propaganda outlets to get a better sense of what the Russian government wants people to believe. Some of the things that barbos refers to can be better understood that way, but he also seems to spend a lot of time on blog and social media sites that I don't monitor. It is not difficult to find Russians who disagree completely with his take on the war, but it is highly unlikely that any would be interested in posting here. Barbos has been with us for quite a few years, and he doesn't say anything that is likely to get him into trouble with the authorities. One should assume that everything he says here is being monitored.
T.G.G. Moogly
Traditional Atheist
I think barbos is a good example of the survival strategy of clinging to an abusive guardian.
TV and credit cards
Contributor
Russian Offensive Howgozit Report
Opinions from various sources and good info in this RFE/RL story.
It looks like Russian troops are just trying to walk the line between following orders and staying alive. Attacks are coming piecemeal and there doesn't seem to be the ability for a major push now or in the future. Could be a dangerous time in these next few weeks. If Vlad sees this as a conventional bust across Ukraine, what does he do?
Hopefully May 9th will pass uneventfully.
Opinions from various sources and good info in this RFE/RL story.
It looks like Russian troops are just trying to walk the line between following orders and staying alive. Attacks are coming piecemeal and there doesn't seem to be the ability for a major push now or in the future. Could be a dangerous time in these next few weeks. If Vlad sees this as a conventional bust across Ukraine, what does he do?
Hopefully May 9th will pass uneventfully.
Elixir
Made in America
Maybe Vlad will declare Special Operation Z a mission accomplished, and just go home. Tell the people “Y’all don’t see any of those Ukranian Nazis around here any more, do you?” and stage a heroes’ welcome for his victorious boys.
The truth doesn’t have anything to do with anything else he says. Why start caring about it now?
The truth doesn’t have anything to do with anything else he says. Why start caring about it now?
T.G.G. Moogly
Traditional Atheist
That's too easy on Vladolph. I want him to have a stroke on the operating table and go vegetative. It would be nice to know it was accomplished by Ukrainian hackers or his inner circle. Then I want to see reparations made to Ukraine, the return of Crimea and the Donbass territories.