Statehood for Puerto Rico and DC?

[zorq]

I do not want PR as a state. They are patently unable to manage their own affairs, on an island of about 5 million people. They can not maintain the power grid. It will be a federal sink hole. It already is.

If made a te in the long run I do not think the PR people will like it. A simple example is current suppression of cock fighting, a long established PR tradition. If t becomes a state it means any American citizen can move there and buy land or open a busness. There will be a inevitable culture clash.

Dude, any American citizen can move there and buy land and open businesses ALREADY. Puerto Rico is already part of the US. PR culture IS American culture. When a PR native opens a business in PR they are an AMERICAN CITIZEN opening a business in PR.

And the reason they can't manage their own affairs is because they physically CAN'T manage their own affairs. Many of their affairs are out of their control because they are in the control of the US house of representatives.

Statehood would give them the power to handle their affairs.

 

[steve_bank]

I do not want PR as a state. They are patently unable to manage their own affairs, on an island of about 5 million people. They can not maintain the power grid. It will be a federal sink hole. It already is.

If made a te in the long run I do not think the PR people will like it. A simple example is current suppression of cock fighting, a long established PR tradition. If t becomes a state it means any American citizen can move there and buy land or open a busness. There will be a inevitable culture clash.

Dude, any American citizen can move there and buy land and open businesses ALREADY. Puerto Rico is already part of the US. PR culture IS American culture. When a PR native opens a business in PR they are an AMERICAN CITIZEN opening a business in PR.

And the reason they can't manage their own affairs is because they physically CAN'T manage their own affairs. Many of their affairs are out of their control because they are in the control of the US house of representatives.

Statehood would give them the power to handle their affairs.

Youare right on owing land. It woud not be the same. They will loose their unique identy ..

I can seefuture reporting, PR objects to mainland gentrification.

Out of their control? Bullshit. It is always someone else's fault. Money and investment went into PR. When I worked for Intel they had a manufacturing facility in PR n the 80s. They are chronically riddled with corruption.

What is preventing them from maintaining an electrical grid?

At some point the people of PR have to pick up the ball and run with it.

https://www.finance.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/Arthur%20MacEwan%20and%20J.%20Tomas%20Hexner%20(Submission%204).pdf

Department of the Treasury. However, and unfortunately, the former of these sources
has not been published since 2010, and the data it contained are not available for later
years.
Nonetheless, the two tables below, present the “net” figures for 2004 and 2010.
The tables show that in 2004 and 2010, seventeen states and the District of Columbia
received more in net federal expenditures per capita than did Puerto Rico. That is, in
more than one-third of all the states, in these two years, the net amount per capita
received from the federal government—federal expenditures minus federal taxes—was
greater than the net amount per capita received in Puerto Rico from the federal
government. The reality demonstrated in the tables, then, belies the conventional
wisdom and indicates that, by a reasonable comparative standard, Puerto Rico is not
treated “generously” by the federal government.2
It would be desirable to have data for years since 2010. The data for these two
years, however, suggest a high degree of stability in the financial relation between
Puerto Rico and the federal government as compared to the states and D.C. There is
no apparent reason to believe that this relation of how Puerto Rico compares to the
states and D.C. has changed significantly since 2010.

Puerto Rico’s position in the two tables might seem odd. After all, Puerto Ricans
do not pay federal income taxes, and U.S. firms operating in Puerto Rico do not pay
federal corporate taxes. Puerto Ricans, however, do pay Social Security and Medicare
taxes at the same rates as do people in the states. Also, Puerto Rico is excluded from
some major federal expenditure programs (e.g., the Earned Income Tax Credit) and is
treated less favorably than states in some others (e.g. Medicare). Further, Puerto Rico
is virtually excluded from federal procurement and employment expenditures. These
various exclusions from federal expenditures appear to more than balance the privilege
of not paying personal and corporate taxes.

NAICU - Puerto Rico

www.naicu.edu

Students across Puerto Rico benefit from federal student aid.


Follow the links below for data on the number of awards and total dollar amounts, broken out by Pell Grants, campus-based programs (SEOG, Federal Work-Study, and Perkins Loans), and federal loan programs. Data are for students at all institutions of higher education (public, private nonprofit, for-profit; four-year, two-year, and less than two-year) in the state that participate in the federal student aid programs.

 

[Jarhyn]

Wow, they would lose their "unique identity"

I wonder if the house slave worried about losing "their unique house slave identity" when they became "yet another normally paid servant to the house".

 

[lpetrich]

House passes bill calling for binding vote on statehood for Puerto Rico - The Washington Post

The legislation would authorize a vote in Puerto Rico to chose whether to become a state, an independent nation, or a country “in free association with the United States.” The island has been a territory since 1898, and residents there were granted citizenship in 1917.

The White House signaled its strong support for the bill earlier Thursday, but the measure is unlikely to make it through the Senate, where 60 votes would be required for it to advance, by the end of the year. And prospects for passage in the House next year, with Republicans in control, are significantly diminished.

The legislation would authorize a vote in Puerto Rico to chose whether to become a state, an independent nation, or a country “in free association with the United States.” The island has been a territory since 1898, and residents there were granted citizenship in 1917.

The White House signaled its strong support for the bill earlier Thursday, but the measure is unlikely to make it through the Senate, where 60 votes would be required for it to advance, by the end of the year. And prospects for passage in the House next year, with Republicans in control, are significantly diminished.

They'd have to find 10 Republicans who would be willing to break a filibuster.

During House debate on the bill, proponents argued that the 3.3 million U.S. citizens in Puerto Rico deserve greater self-determination, including the option of statehood. Only Congress can decide on statehood.

“Because we are a territory we are treated as a second-class citizen,” argued Resident Commissioner Jenniffer González-Colón (R-Puerto Rico). Underscoring that point, she noted that she is a nonvoting member of the House and therefore was unable to vote on the bill.

Rep. Darren Soto (D-Fla.) said “It’s time to set our people free,” as he recalled his late grandmother, who “lived in a colonial territory as a second-class citizen in the greatest democracy in the world. What a tragedy. What an irony.”

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-N.Y.) sought to put the issue in historical context. “Today, for the first time in our nation’s history, the United States will acknowledge its role as a colonizing force and Puerto Rico’s status as an extended colony.”

However,

Republicans countered that the bill would short-circuit a deliberative process.

Rep. Bruce Westerman (R-Ark.) said “we’ve abrogated all of our responsibilities and authority because it doesn’t come back to Congress for any kind of approval.”

Rep. Tom McClintock (R-Calif.) said the island territory has struggled for years with high debt, low employment and poor academic performance. “So, how does it benefit America to admit a state that would be the most indebted, uneducated, poorest and least employed state in the nation?” he asked.

 

[lpetrich]

The bill: H.R.8393 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Puerto Rico Status Act | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

This bill provides for a plebiscite to be held on November 5, 2023, to resolve Puerto Rico's political status.

Specifically, such plebiscite shall offer eligible voters a choice of independence, sovereignty in free association with the United States, or statehood.

The Puerto Rico State Elections Commission shall carry out a nonpartisan voter education campaign through traditional paid media and make available at all voting locations voter education materials related to the plebiscites.

All voter educational materials and ballots used to carry out this bill shall be made available in English and Spanish.

The bill sets forth transition and implementation provisions for each choice offered in the plebiscite.

Sponsor: Rep. Grijalva, Raúl M. [D-AZ-3] (Introduced 07/15/2022)
The bill's 62 cosponsors include 9 Republicans, the 4 original ones include one R.

Yesterday (December 14):
H.Res.1519 - 117th Congress (2021-2022): Providing for consideration of the bill (H.R. 8393) to enable the people of Puerto Rico to choose a permanent, nonterritorial, fully self-governing political status for Puerto Rico and to provide for a transition to and the implementation of that permanent, nonterritorial, fully self-governing political status, and for other purposes. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

Back when it was introduced: Congressional Record | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

Constitutional Authority Statement for H.R. 8393; Congressional Record Vol. 168, No. 117
(House - July 15, 2022)

[Page H6680]
From the Congressional Record Online through the Government Publishing Office [www.gpo.gov]

By Mr. GRIJALVA:
H.R. 8393.
Congress has the power to enact this legislation pursuant to the following:

Article. IV. Section. 3. Clause 2. ``The Congress shall have Power to dispose of and make all of the needful Rules and Regulations respecting the Territory or the Property belonging to the United States; and nothing in this Constitution shall be so construed as to Prejudice any Claims of the United States, or of any particular State.''

 

[lpetrich]

Roll Call 527 | Bill Number: H. Res. 1519 - Dec 15, 2022, 10:23 AM | 117th Congress, 2nd Session - Providing for consideration of the bill (H.R. 8393) the Puerto Rico Status Act
D: Y 217
R: N 201 nv 12
Tot: Y 217 N 201 nv 12

Roll Call 528 | Bill Number: H. R. 8393 - Dec 15, 2022, 12:58 PM | 117th Congress, 2nd Session - Vote Question: On Motion to Recommit (last-minute obstruction)
D: N 216 nv 1
R: Y 209 N 1 nv 3
Tot: Y 209 N 217 nv 4

Liz Cheney was the only Republican to vote against it.

Roll Call 529 | Bill Number: H. R. 8393 - Dec 15, 2022, 01:12 PM | 117th Congress, 2nd Session - On Passage (the bill itself)
D: Y 217
R: Y 16 N 191 nv 6
Tot: Y 233 N 191 nv 6

The Republicans to vote in favor: Bacon, Dan NE, Cheney, Liz WY, Davis, Rodney IL, Fitzpatrick PA, Flores, Mayra TX, Garbarino NY, Gonzalez, Anthony OH, Herrera Beutler, Jaime WA, Huizenga MI, Joyce OH, Katko, John NY, Newhouse WA, Posey FL, Salazar, Maria Elvira FL, Smucker PA, Upton MI

 

[lpetrich]

Anthony Adragna on Twitter: "New: House passes historic self-determination legislation for Puerto Rico with Republicans voting in support.
Final vote was 233-191 with 16 Republican yeses. (One member voted late.)
@AOC, a main negotiator of the package, presided. (vid link)" / Twitter

criandocuervos on Twitter: ""Today, for the first time in out nation's history, the U.S. will recognize it's role as a colonizing force," Rep. Ocasio-Cortez's whopping opener." / Twitter

Andrew J. Padilla on Twitter: "Final comment ..." / Twitter

Final comment on #HR8393 by @AOC

"Yo si soy Boricua, pa' que tu lo sepas"

She is immediately instructed to provide a translation for the House

What a symbolic & hilarious moment

Puerto Rico 's elected govt runs in Spanish, legislature, political debate etc

@AOC said 1 phrase in Spanish on the US House floor (denoting her pride to be Puerto Rican) in a debate on #PRStatusAct #HR8393

& was immediately instructed to provide English translation

Puerto Rico 's elected* govt carries it's business in Spanish

The US appointed colonial junta that rules over PR 's govt, they run in English

What is "La Junta"?

@CPDAction rpt

https://populardemocracy.org/sites/default/files/%5BENGLISH%5D%20PROMESA%20Has%20Failed%20Report%20CPD%20ACRE%209-14-2021%20FINAL.pdf

Long over last yr of la junta's rule

Andrew J. Padilla on Twitter: "Puerto Rico isn’t a “democracy” as long as a US appointed colonial junta rules over PR
@Remmanuelli atty for teachers who lost their pension to la junta’s cuts said the US has
“allowed the Board to legislate & deprived Puerto Rico’s Government of one its few remaining powers”" / Twitter

 

[lpetrich]

AOC: "Yo si soy Boricua, pa' que tu lo sepas." - Google Translate from Spanish: "Yes I'm Boricua, so that you know."

Rep. Ocasio-Cortez on Instagram: “For the first time in history, …”

For the first time in history, the House acknowledged the United States’ role as a colonizing force in Puerto Rico. That and several major breakthroughs were included in the Puerto Rico Status Act, which passed the House today.

This self-determination bill is a first-of-its-kind – it lays out a process to start ending colonization and allow Puerto Ricans to decide their own future. This bill is not perfect — no one bill is. In this vote we acknowledge the grassroots push for an enhanced, more transparent process and we pledge to expand on that fight in the Senate. That said, there are several gains in this bill that are historic:

Formal recognition that Puerto Rico is an extended colony
Strongest terms ever defined for independence and free association
10 years of compensatory finance in the event of free association
Agreement to accept international election observers
New bill does NOT favor statehood, independence, nor free association. It allows Puerto Ricans to choose from those 3. And for the first time, ends the option to continue the island’s current territorial status.
Clarifies that existing US citizenship cannot be stripped in the event of any status outcome, and children of US citizens are eligible for citizenship too — just as they are anywhere else.
Ensures that voter educational materials and ballots will be in Spanish and English.

I want to be clear: there are many critical issues this bill does NOT address, such as reparations (though we do have compensatory finance), Act 20, PROMESA, and LUMA. We must continue our struggle alongside the people to demand justice in these areas. However, the bill’s passage *does* lock in the watershed gains listed above and sets this as a new floor for any future negotiations.

Finally, I would like to give special thanks to Representative Nydia Velázquez, a mentor and inspiration who has fought for the people of Puerto Rico her entire life, as well as Chairman Grijalva for elevating this issue, Leader Hoyer for making this a priority, Resident Commissioner González-Colón, and all our negotiating colleagues.

Pa’lante

 

[Shadowy Man]

Rep. Tom McClintock (R-Calif.) said the island territory has struggled for years with high debt, low employment and poor academic performance. “So, how does it benefit America to admit a state that would be the most indebted, uneducated, poorest and least employed state in the nation?” he asked.

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

 

[bilby]

Rep. Tom McClintock (R-Calif.) said the island territory has struggled for years with high debt, low employment and poor academic performance. “So, how does it benefit America to admit a state that would be the most indebted, uneducated, poorest and least employed state in the nation?” he asked.

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

The answer to his rhetorical question is, of course, that it would lift all those deep red, deep South states, like Alabama, one rung further from the bottom of the ladder on those measures.

His fellow republicans should be happy about being second worst, rather than worst...

 

[lpetrich]

budpuertorico on Twitter: "Today is a good day to remind everyone that our nation #PuertoRico was invaded, occupied, and colonized by the #UnitedStates. It has been 124+ years of US colonialism and counting. We deserve a real, serious, democratic, & inclusive decolonization process now!" / Twitter

AOC presided over the House for the vote on the bill.
C-SPAN on Instagram: “Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY), …”

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY), who is of Puerto Rican heritage, presided over the House vote Thursday to approve the Puerto Rico Status Act, which would allow Puerto Ricans to decide the political future of the territory.

The bill would establish a binding process for a referendum in Puerto Rico to decide whether to become an independent nation, a U.S. state, or a sovereign government in free association with the U.S.

The vote was 233–191, with 16 Republicans joining all voting Democrats in supporting the measure.

“Today, for the first time in our nation’s history, the United States will acknowledge its role as a colonizing force, and Puerto Rico’s status as an extended colony,” Rep. Ocasio-Cortez said ahead of the vote.

“Never before have terms for independence and free association been so clearly defined, including ramifications for citizenship. This bill excludes the current, unsustainable colonial status.”

The Puerto Rico Status Act now heads to the Senate, where it holds little chance of getting over the 60-vote threshold to break a filibuster.

Watch the House debate and vote by tapping the link in our bio.

#puertorico #puertorico #ushouse #houseofrepresentatives #alexandriaocasiocortez #aoc @aoc

Rep. Nydia M. Velázquez on Instagram: “The Puerto Rico Status Act has passed 233-191. We did it!” - AOC with Rep. NV, a fellow Puerto Rican from a nearby NYC district.

Metro Puerto Rico on Instagram: “La congresista Alexandria Ocasio Cortez terminó su discurso sobre el proyecto de estatus de Puerto Rico con esta frase tras ataques de Jenniffer González.”
"Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio Cortez ended her speech on Puerto Rico's draft status with this phrase after attacks by Jenniffer González."

"Yo si soy Boricua, pa' que tu lo sepas" - "Yes I am a Boricua, so that you know"

Jenniffer Aydin González Colón - Resident Commissioner of Puerto Rico and a Republican

 

[steve_bank]

My solution.

There are 4 or 5 million Puerto Ricans. Give each one of them one million dollars and cut the island loose. They can run their island by themseves.

 

[Jayjay]

I hope the referendum will have a runoff if no option gets 50% in the first round.

 

[Swammerdami]

Rep. Tom McClintock (R-Calif.) said the island territory has struggled for years with high debt, low employment and poor academic performance. “So, how does it benefit America to admit a state that would be the most indebted, uneducated, poorest and least employed state in the nation?” he asked.

"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"

The answer to his rhetorical question is, of course, that it would lift all those deep red, deep South states, like Alabama, one rung further from the bottom of the ladder on those measures.

His fellow republicans should be happy about being second worst, rather than worst...

Out of curiosity, I checked  List of U.S. states and territories by infant mortality rates, a useful developmental measure.
Puerto Rico has lower infant mortality than 24 of the 50 states.

(This statistic was not "cherry-picked." It was the first and only such list I Googled for just now.)

 

[Elixir]

Wouldn’t a bunch of unemployed workers be a valuable asset to whoever invested in PR? For a few bucks you should be able to get some things done!

 

[steve_bank]

There have been tax incentives and tax breaks since at least the 80s to invest in PR. Don't know about now.

When I worked at Intel in the 80s they had a manufacturing facility in PR, back when they made computers and boards. If you bought Intel ecletronics it was fulfilled from PR with no sales tax.

There has been a nationalist movement and there was violence over hear in the past by nationalists.

A lot of maney and aid has gobe into PR and a lot of it went to corruption. They are only around 5 million people. and are unable to manage there own affairs. All the money that has gone there and they can't maintain an electric power grid for their small population.

They can't hide behind the excuse of past colonialism forever.

Statehood might make it worse. They would have to follow the constitution. They would loose their identity as an independentt culture. A major cultural issue was cockfighting being banned by the US government.

Puerto Ricans have citizen status in the USA, I don't know if it is currently reciprocal. Can a US citizen go to PR and take up residemce as as easily as any stste?

There have been PR referendums.