The Soul

[Sarpedon]

Sorry, Sarpedon, but this sort of explanation, to me, sounds like scientific speculation. Science is really bad at trying to guess these sort of spiritual matters. That has been my experience.

Speculation is it? Au contraire, I believe it is proven. If you think otherwise, please explain the following:

According to religion, the soul is: Immortal, indestructible, and contains the essence of one's personality, correct?

If that is so, why can a person's behavior and personality change when they suffer brain injuries? Don't tell me it doesn't, because I have seen it.

Moreover, why do we need a brain, at all, if we have a soul? What is the brain for?

Furthermore, religious people use 'out of the body' hallucinations as evidence that the soul exists and can move and act independently from the body. They say that people's impression of 'seeing' their own body from the outside is evidence that the soul can move about and see on its own. I ask that if the soul can 'see' by itself, why do we have eyes? Why do people who lose their eyes become blind, if their soul can see without them?

 

[Keith&Co.]

Most of the advances in modern technology were made by the military industrial complex, not science.

What a load of horse shit. The MI complex did nothing except pay for the science research that provided the advances. Jeez, what a weird thing to claim.

 

[Kharakov]

I wouldn't know about spacetime, Kharakov, but as for comparing the soul to matter or plants and wood and the many things that breath isn't the same. The soul has experiences.

How would you distinguish between a well trained soul acting like an electron and an actual electron (that experiences nothing)?
How do you know that electrons (or other smallest individual units) do not experience anything?

If we are talking about the biblical soul, it isn't a metaphysical concept, its a practical concept. If your soul is resurrected it isn't your body, it isn't a mystical immortal entity apart from you, so what is it? Matter? Energy? No. It's you.

You're aware that you'll have more than a few individuals here who postulate that if you remove a part of someone's brain, you remove a part of their memories. They won't look beyond at the possibility that there is a being, or system of being, that has access to the whole information pattern of an individual's existence (both before and after the removal of the section of brain tissue).

Are you defining a soul as a 4 dimensional "block" individual, that includes all of the experiences the individual has had, including any brain transplants?

 

[DLH]

How would you distinguish between a well trained soul acting like an electron and an actual electron (that experiences nothing)?

I think that we would have to establish what you yourself might think a soul is, since what I have defined what I think it is and we don't seem to agree. As for an electron, I wouldn't know an electron if it bit me on the ass.

How do you know that electrons (or other smallest individual units) do not experience anything?

That is an excellent point, I do not know that.

You're aware that you'll have more than a few individuals here who postulate that if you remove a part of someone's brain, you remove a part of their memories. They won't look beyond at the possibility that there is a being, or system of being, that has access to the whole information pattern of an individual's existence (both before and after the removal of the section of brain tissue).

Are you defining a soul as a 4 dimensional "block" individual, that includes all of the experiences the individual has had, including any brain transplants?

Again, you are speculating on what a soul, the pagan idea of a soul, might be in a more metaphysical or possibly even philosophical theoretical possibility, which is cool and interesting but the Bible's idea of the soul, that is the English word the soul being, unfortunately, the closest word to convey a similar but far more concrete and practical concept.

According to the Bible the soul ends. It dies, it can be destroyed. It doesn't go to heaven, there is no hell, it didn't exist before your body, it isn't a part of you separate from your body that leaves with your consciousness into some other form etc.

 

[DLH]

Most of the advances in modern technology were made by the military industrial complex, not science.

What a load of horse shit. The MI complex did nothing except pay for the science research that provided the advances. Jeez, what a weird thing to claim.

What is science?

 

[dystopian]

What a load of horse shit. The MI complex did nothing except pay for the science research that provided the advances. Jeez, what a weird thing to claim.

What is science?

The thing the military industrial complex used to make those advances in technology.

Here, knock yourself out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science

 

[DLH]

Speculation is it? Au contraire, I believe it is proven. If you think otherwise, please explain the following:

According to religion, the soul is: Immortal, indestructible, and contains the essence of one's personality, correct?

I suppose, yes. But that comes from the influence Greek philosophers such as Plato and Socrates had on Jewish thinking after the conquest of Alexander The Great. The Bible's position on the soul is in stark contrast to that philosophical concept.

If that is so, why can a person's behavior and personality change when they suffer brain injuries? Don't tell me it doesn't, because I have seen it.

Moreover, why do we need a brain, at all, if we have a soul? What is the brain for?

Furthermore, religious people use 'out of the body' hallucinations as evidence that the soul exists and can move and act independently from the body. They say that people's impression of 'seeing' their own body from the outside is evidence that the soul can move about and see on its own. I ask that if the soul can 'see' by itself, why do we have eyes? Why do people who lose their eyes become blind, if their soul can see without them?

Well, there you go.

 

[abaddon]

According to the Bible the soul ends. It dies, it can be destroyed. It doesn't go to heaven, there is no hell, it didn't exist before your body, it isn't a part of you separate from your body that leaves with your consciousness into some other form etc.

Is this supposed to be of general interest, or is it merely an academic point? Why am I supposed to care what ancient jews thought about anything?

 

[Sarpedon]

Apparently he expects us to be shocked and flabbergasted that a religious person doesn't believe in the immortality of the soul. It's odd, to be sure, but if I had a buck for every bizarre one man-cult who blew through here I'd be able to afford to do something more interesting with my spare time.

 

[Keith&Co.]

What a load of horse shit. The MI complex did nothing except pay for the science research that provided the advances. Jeez, what a weird thing to claim.

What is science?

It's a methodology for acquiring knowledge.

 

[Keith&Co.]

but if I had a buck for every bizarre one man-cult who blew through here

There's the kickstarter i'd support....

 

[braces_for_impact]

Some interesting notes on the topic.

Book Here

The Podcast

People used to think we had multiple souls. The concept of it has changed over time. It's a superstition that we can discard as we grow as a species.

 

[DLH]

According to the Bible the soul ends. It dies, it can be destroyed. It doesn't go to heaven, there is no hell, it didn't exist before your body, it isn't a part of you separate from your body that leaves with your consciousness into some other form etc.

Is this supposed to be of general interest, or is it merely an academic point? Why am I supposed to care what ancient jews thought about anything?

If I ask you what the soul is according to the Bible and you respond that there is no such thing as a soul then you probably would be only one in perhaps millions that are mistaken. I've corrected that mistake. You are right, most skeptics, atheists, etc. don't care. They will go on in ignorance promoting the world view in the name of science. However . . . I've still corrected it and it stands corrected. Whether you care or not.

 

[Keith&Co.]

They will go on in ignorance promoting the world view in the name of science.

Atheists are not atheistic 'in the name of science.'

You've been corrected on this and the correction stands, whether you understand it enough to update your bias or not.

 

[none]

maybe I am mistaken but isn't this whole thread based on an arbitrary definition, what truly does soul mean and why should anybody care? especially when it is widely accepted that a soul is part of a person not a person?

 

[DLH]

They will go on in ignorance promoting the world view in the name of science.

Atheists are not atheistic 'in the name of science.'

You've been corrected on this and the correction stands, whether you understand it enough to update your bias or not.

Well, I disagree. IMO science is the misused crutch of the militant atheist. Just look around you old buddy.

 

[DLH]

maybe I am mistaken but isn't this whole thread based on an arbitrary definition, what truly does soul mean and why should anybody care? especially when it is widely accepted that a soul is part of a person not a person?

The definition would depend upon the source. Christendom has adopted the pagan definition, the Bible disagrees. A Christian, even the typical Christian 'scholar' will say the soul is immortal. Ezekiel 18:4 and other passages say it isn't.

 

[none]

maybe I am mistaken but isn't this whole thread based on an arbitrary definition, what truly does soul mean and why should anybody care? especially when it is widely accepted that a soul is part of a person not a person?

The definition would depend upon the source. Christendom has adopted the pagan definition, the Bible disagrees. A Christian, even the typical Christian 'scholar' will say the soul is immortal. Ezekiel 18:4 and other passages say it isn't.

so if I say the soul is a lexical tool to promote a greater truth, you'd agree?
what is the greater truth you are trying to argue?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

If that is so, why can a person's behavior and personality change when they suffer brain injuries? Don't tell me it doesn't, because I have seen it.

Moreover, why do we need a brain, at all, if we have a soul? What is the brain for?

Furthermore, religious people use 'out of the body' hallucinations as evidence that the soul exists and can move and act independently from the body. They say that people's impression of 'seeing' their own body from the outside is evidence that the soul can move about and see on its own. I ask that if the soul can 'see' by itself, why do we have eyes? Why do people who lose their eyes become blind, if their soul can see without them?

Well, there you go.

That was a rude response. Care to address any of it?

 

[Sarpedon]

Rude it may be, but in the context, I gathered it to mean that he does not believe in the immortality of the soul.

Which raises the question, 'Why even talk about soul? Why not just say 'brain?' What is the difference between the brain and a mortal soul?'

I'll save my other questions for the next immortal soul believing guy who blows through here. They are among my favorites to ask.