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The Virus - Are You Affected?

What do you mean "full immunity"? Sterilizing immunity? Sometimes not even vaccines give you that, even if they are effective, for example with polio.

Yes, I mean sterilizing immunity. Most likely having had Covid-19 will give you a partial immunity to disease. So somebody who has had it once will become sick, will spread it, but will suffer a much milder form of the disease themselves. Which is awful news for anybody in a high risk category. Knowing human behaviour, these people will probably go about their business as usual making a bad problem worse.

At the same time, there is evidence that previous infections with other coronaviruses provide some limited protection.

How would that be studied? Every living human being today, over one year of age, has had previous infections with other Coronaviruses. What's the control group?

But for the other Corona viruses it only gives short term immunity. Maximum a year. Soon the first infected will be able to get infected again. And around and around it goes.
Even if humoral immunity (circulating antibodies) wanes after a year, or even after several months, there is cellular immunity through memory T and B cells. Memory B cells can proliferate upon a new exposure to the virus and produce a new batch of antibodies. That response is not as quick as with already circulating antibodies, but much quicker than with an exposure of an individual who hasn't been exposed previously.

Yes, that is what partial immunity means.

Sure, it'll slow the spread. But only a little bit. Without a vaccine herd immunity is not going to happen.
Since we are talking about Florida, look at their graph.
View attachment 29531
New cases dropped precipitously through August. Why? No new distancing measures have been implemented that I am aware of. The weather did not significantly change. I think the new cases dropped because of the partial herd immunity.

Thanks to idiot meddling in testing procedures by Trump (or rather his CDC appointee) the American numbers mean nothing any longer.

But the case numbers going up or down... we don't actually know. The other Coronaviruses are seasonal. Meaning that they die out in summer, and come back in winter. Even on the equator. We have no idea why this happens. It baffles science still. It's going to take years before we understand the ins and outs of Covid-19 spread.

Sure, a vaccine would be better, but a vaccine cannot confer more immunity than a real infection. It both cases it's about immune response and the immune system "remembering" it. The advantage of the vaccine is priming the immune system without triggering disease (which in this case can have nasty consequences including cardiac effects). So I'd much rather not get infected of course. At the same time, these overly pessimistic (or optimistic, as some posters sound positively gleeful when talking about red states getting it bad) scenarios are baseless I think.

Based on what I've heard/read, when the vaccine arrives, everybody will need to get boosted once ever two months. And this will be ongoing for more than a year. Since the idiotic anti-vaxxers will keep Covid-19 in circulation it might take many years of us having to do this. Chances are that the situation now is a permament situation, even with a vaccine.
 
Positivity = 10.6% so the average ballpark figure is that every 10th person you encounter in Florida will be infected. Of course that figure may be higher for the types folks who can't resist or avoid frequenting those venues. See you on Fiddler's Green.

It doesn't work that way. The people being tested are nowhere near a random sample of the population. Positivity rates are a good measure of how well you are testing, they say nothing about how many are infected overall.
 
Same governor who proposes making protesting illegal but immunity for people running down protesters with their cars because obviously they're "scared" of protesters.
Many of these "protesters" bang against the cars trying to drive on public thoroughfares. In one instance in Austin, a car was approached by a "protester" with an AK47 - didn't turn out too well for the "protester".
So I can definitely see how some drivers would reasonably feel afraid by the "protesters".

Yup, there's a lot of this problem--the protesters think they have impunity to engage in low level criminal activity. Once in a while things go badly--and note that if you're part of a group surrounding a car and one person in the group acts in a fashion that crosses the line into lethal force territory anyone else in the group that gets run down from the driver escaping is too bad. In less than half of car vs protester incidents is the driver charged.

In general I think that "protests" that blockade major roads (and even interstates), especially when they do so for days or weeks on end, are not legitimate forms of protest anyway.

It depends on what they are doing to me. A big march down a road, tolerable. Sitting around blocking a road, not acceptable. Attacking (even by pounding) any car that wishes to pass through when you're standing around in the road, not acceptable.
 
Sure, it'll slow the spread. But only a little bit. Without a vaccine herd immunity is not going to happen.

Aggressive use of masks and prohibiting the sorts of things that can't be done without masks unless they're essential (medical treatment) could give us herd immunity now. It's just people won't comply.
 
Since we are talking about Florida, look at their graph.
View attachment 29531
New cases dropped precipitously through August. Why? No new distancing measures have been implemented that I am aware of. The weather did not significantly change. I think the new cases dropped because of the partial herd immunity.

Bullshit. That graph reflects some substantial messing with the data. The excess mortality numbers tell a different story:

Florida Excess Mortality.PNG
 
Sure, a vaccine would be better, but a vaccine cannot confer more immunity than a real infection.
This isn't really super important, but actually, a vaccine can provide better immunity than a normal infection. One basic way is by simply providing higher concentrations of accessible antigens than would occur during a normal infection. Vaccines can also use immunologic adjuvants.
 
Sure, it'll slow the spread. But only a little bit. Without a vaccine herd immunity is not going to happen.

Aggressive use of masks and prohibiting the sorts of things that can't be done without masks unless they're essential (medical treatment) could give us herd immunity now. It's just people won't comply.

Yeah, exactly. The scientific consensus is even with a vaccine we'll still need to wear masks. But since some people won't, we're fucked.
 
Yes, I mean sterilizing immunity. Most likely having had Covid-19 will give you a partial immunity to disease.
There are highly effective vaccines that do not provide sterilizing immunity. I.e. they allow the pathogen to spread for a while, but enable the immune system to arrest the infection before the actual illness sets in.

So somebody who has had it once will become sick, will spread it, but will suffer a much milder form of the disease themselves.
Somebody like that would also have less (and in best case negligible) virus reproduction and therefore much lower viral loads in their upper respiratory system. That means less viral shedding and therefore less chance of infecting anybody else.

How would that be studied? Every living human being today, over one year of age, has had previous infections with other Coronaviruses. What's the control group?
This is where I got it from.
Immune cells for common cold may recognize SARS-CoV-2

Obviously there are still many known unknowns and unknown unknowns with this virus. But only ~15% of colds are due to coronaviruses, and it seems you need to have been infected with a strain that is genetically close to SARS-CoV-2 to have significant cross-immunity. That said, of course many people will have had such an infection. But that may explain why so many people are asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic while others, some of them young healthy people get seriously ill and sometimes, like this student, even die.

Thanks to idiot meddling in testing procedures by Trump (or rather his CDC appointee) the American numbers mean nothing any longer.
Why? They seem realistic to me. Certainly more realistic than for example Spain.

But the case numbers going up or down... we don't actually know. The other Coronaviruses are seasonal. Meaning that they die out in summer, and come back in winter. Even on the equator. We have no idea why this happens. It baffles science still. It's going to take years before we understand the ins and outs of Covid-19 spread.
It seems that superspreader events are key. I.e. transmission is highly inconsistent. As far as seasonality, it is really weird. SARS-CoV-2 exploded down south in the Summer. Southern US gets really hot and most people flee for air conditioned indoor spaces, where the virus has easier time spreading. Fall is really pleasant around here, when it's not raining, so I expect more people to spend time outside.

Based on what I've heard/read, when the vaccine arrives, everybody will need to get boosted once ever two months. And this will be ongoing for more than a year. Since the idiotic anti-vaxxers will keep Covid-19 in circulation it might take many years of us having to do this. Chances are that the situation now is a permament situation, even with a vaccine.
There are many vaccine candidates. We shall see what the first approved vaccine requires as far as boosting and how effective it is. But yeah, idiot antivaxxers are a real problem.
 
Since we are talking about Florida, look at their graph.
View attachment 29531
New cases dropped precipitously through August. Why? No new distancing measures have been implemented that I am aware of. The weather did not significantly change. I think the new cases dropped because of the partial herd immunity.

Bullshit. That graph reflects some substantial messing with the data. The excess mortality numbers tell a different story:
Positivity rate above 10%, if memory serves, which definitely means undertesting.

Also, where did you get that graph?
 
Positivity rate above 10%, if memory serves, which definitely means undertesting.

Also, where did you get that graph?

That looks like the NYT graph. They write in their note below it that it is handicapped by state reporting methods, some of which are nearly fraudulent.
 
Caught URTI. I hope it's coronavirus variety and I get some cross-immunity.
Pretty much clear of symptoms now. But first 3 days were not great. Is there a chance of having COVID with symptoms exactly like common cold?
I mean none of the specific covid symptoms, just common cold symptoms.
 
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