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The Virus - Are You Affected?

The link I will post discusses the "brain fog" that some people experience following being infected with COVID. It is very similar to dementia but we don't know if it is temporary or permanent. I also read this morning that some people experienced Parkinson's disease or other neurological conditions after the Flu Pandemic of 1918. Of course, it's hard to know how much of that was causation. It's just something that may have been due to that particular flu.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/11/health/covid-survivors.html






Brain fog’s cause is a mystery partly because symptoms are so varied.

“The simplest answer is people still have persistent immune activation after the initial infection subsided,” said Dr. Avindra Nath, chief of infections of the nervous system at the National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke.

Inflammation in blood vessels, or cells lining the vessels, may be involved, said Dr. Serena Spudich, chief of neurological infections and global neurology at Yale School of Medicine. Inflammatory molecules, released in effective immune responses, “can also be sort of toxins, particularly to the brain,” she said.

If you're unable to read the article, it includes the stories of some individuals, including an APRN who discusses how difficult it is to treat her patients due to memory loss and other neurological symptoms.

Any flu or fever can lead to temporary memory loss. So we'd expect Covid-19 to be the same.

I've never once known of a person who had an impaired memory for months after having the seasonal flu. There is just so much that we don't know yet about the long term effects of this virus, but it's doctors who are very concerned about those who are experiencing such severe "brain fog". I think they probably know a lot more about this than you or I do. Hopefully, this is a rare side effect.
 
Any flu or fever can lead to temporary memory loss. So we'd expect Covid-19 to be the same.

I've never once known of a person who had an impaired memory for months after having the seasonal flu. There is just so much that we don't know yet about the long term effects of this virus, but it's doctors who are very concerned about those who are experiencing such severe "brain fog". I think they probably know a lot more about this than you or I do. Hopefully, this is a rare side effect.

The brain fog terrifies me more than any other thing about the virus. To go into it myself and come out the other side with less, seeing as I'm a manager in a highly technical field requiring advanced knowledge and extremely sharp problem solving skills, it would end my career forever.
 
Any flu or fever can lead to temporary memory loss. So we'd expect Covid-19 to be the same.

I've never once known of a person who had an impaired memory for months after having the seasonal flu. There is just so much that we don't know yet about the long term effects of this virus, but it's doctors who are very concerned about those who are experiencing such severe "brain fog". I think they probably know a lot more about this than you or I do. Hopefully, this is a rare side effect.

Christopher Cross says Covid-19 paralyzed him temporarily

Cross said doctors diagnosed him with Guillain-Barre Syndrome, a rare neurological disorder in which the immune system attacks the nerves, that they believed was caused by his having Covid-19.

Cross said he continues to struggle to recover and said both his speech and memory have been affected and he has transitioned from having to use a wheelchair to now walking with a cane.
 
We barely know anything about the brain. Alzheimers is a family of diseases with similar symptoms but with a multitude of causes. We have no idea what causes it. We have a very superficial understanding of how it progresses or why.

On top of that we know very little about Covid-19. Too few people had SARS or MERS for us to be able to draw any strong conclusions about it. It will take years before we can make any reliable predictions about how Covid-19 will develop. Especially longterm. It's still wise to be cautious. But there's no reason to be hysterical.

Linking Covid-19 to Alzheimers is just clickbait tabloid journalism.
Medical researchers said that, not journalists.

I don't think they did.
Well, they did.
 
FFS, the insufferable prick Newsom rolls out yet more dumb restrictions/guidelines for Thanksgiving;

Ahead of Thanksgiving next month, California Gov. Gavin Newsom and the California Department of Public Health (CDPH) released new safety guidelines for all private gatherings amid the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic.

"All gatherings must include no more than three households, including hosts and guests, and must be held outdoors, lasting for two hours of less. The longer the duration [of the gathering], the risk of transmission increases. Gatherings that occur outdoors are significantly safer than indoor gatherings. All gatherings must be held outside. Attendees may go inside to use restrooms as long as the restrooms are frequently sanitized," the statement added.

The new rules state those at a gathering "may remove their face coverings briefly to eat or drink as long as they stay at least 6 feet away from everyone outside their own household, and put their face covering back on as soon as they are done with the activity."

Newsweek

What a bunch of irrational control freaks these people are.
 
FFS, the insufferable prick Newsom rolls out yet more dumb restrictions/guidelines for Thanksgiving;

Ahead of Thanksgiving next month, California Gov. Gavin Newsom and the California Department of Public Health (CDPH) released new safety guidelines for all private gatherings amid the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic.

"All gatherings must include no more than three households, including hosts and guests, and must be held outdoors, lasting for two hours of less. The longer the duration [of the gathering], the risk of transmission increases. Gatherings that occur outdoors are significantly safer than indoor gatherings. All gatherings must be held outside. Attendees may go inside to use restrooms as long as the restrooms are frequently sanitized," the statement added.

The new rules state those at a gathering "may remove their face coverings briefly to eat or drink as long as they stay at least 6 feet away from everyone outside their own household, and put their face covering back on as soon as they are done with the activity."

Newsweek

What a bunch of irrational control freaks these people are.

Yeah, the Republicans think it's irrational to try to save people from dying.
 
due to incompetent supervisors and officials who put infected people (ratlickers as you call them) into the general community.

Ratlickers are the ones who prance around without caution, going to bars and churches and crowded amusement parks.

Akin to licking rats during the time of the Black Plague; behaving in risky ways and blithely passing it on to others.

"Ratlickers"
The ones who are careless with masks, insist on going to bars, insist on going to church services, insist that amusement parks must open. And then go shopping, send their kids to schools, and visit their elderly parents.

"ratlickers", LOL. Your attempt at shaming folks for being normal says a lot about you and doesn't work. Nobody pays any attention to the finger waggers. You're just another control freak with no power.

Its not about shaming. It is about the selfishness, the lack of empathy, and the complete absence of common sense and good judgement that people like you exhibit that is being discussed here. When your actions jeopardize the lives of other people, as they demonstrably do in this case, we are free to point out this behavior for exactly what it is.
 
"ratlickers", LOL. Your attempt at shaming folks for being normal says a lot about you and doesn't work. Nobody pays any attention to the finger waggers. You're just another control freak with no power.

Its not about shaming. It is about the selfishness, the lack of empathy, and the complete absence of common sense and good judgement that people like you exhibit that is being discussed here. When your actions jeopardize the lives of other people, as they demonstrably do in this case, we are free to point out this behavior for exactly what it is.

Another control freak pops in to drop the usual tired clichés. It's October fella, almost November change the record.

"Ratlickers", fuck me, could it be any less about science. Get a grip.
 
I don't think I did. I think you seem to have a hobby horse. Perhaps you have read an article somewhere that has a specific agenda or has expressed themselves in a specific way, and you think everybody needs to use that terminology of they are wrong. Could that what be what is happening?

I think you definitely did. And I read a bunch of articles on this topic since the start of the pandemic.

It's more complicated than that. It's not as simple as a virus mutates into a new strain and then gets by the immune system again. The immune system is increadibly complicated. I'm no virologist. But I know this much.
Yes, the immune system is very complicated. Innate vs. adaptive immunity. Macrophages, natural killer cells, dendritic cells. B-cells and antigens, of which there are several types. T cells, where you have CD8, CD4 among others. Very complicated indeed and very Rube Goldbergesque too.

Here's how memory B-cells work.
Yes, I know the gist of that.

The most mindblowing aspect of immunology is that this system is present in bacteria. They have a similar immune system as we do. The scale of this is truly mindblowing.

While bacteria do have an antiviral defense system, it is nothing at all like human immune system.

I'm aware of this. But all that means is that the current situation will be permanent. Life expectancy will drop throughout the world.
I think you are wrong on this, and I also very much hope you are wrong on this.

The only realistic scenario I can see is that the scientifically minded people in the world lose their patience and measures will turn draconian.

Depends on the country. Can't really see US go draconian even if Biden wins. Too much federalism, too many dissenters doing their thing. And not just white consertatives either, even though MSM loves to focus on them to the exclusion of everything else.

I could more draconian lockdowns in Europe. Many European countries have had daily case numbers much higher than US recently. Some ridiculously high.
Belgium yesterday had over 16k cases. That is over 450k when adjusted to US population.

Sure. But I think the immunologists are already aware of this. It's factored into their predictions.
Maybe, maybe not. But you mentioned the Spanish flu. As bad as it was, people were not forced to socially distance and wear masks for years.
So I very much doubt we will have to wear masks and socially distance past this Spring.

I'd say chances that these trials are already being run in Chinese Uigur concentration camps is pretty high. Perhaps also somewhere in Russia. I know China ordered a regiment of soldiers to all take a vaccine candidate (on something they already knew was pretty safe from a limited trial). There are benefits of being a police state.

Hmm, maybe Europe can run trials on Lesbos and other mass migrant camps. :D :tonguea:

A mask in your pocket takes no space. Going on public transport without a mask is like driving a car without a seat belt. It's probably unnecessary. But why not?
If masks on public transit prove to be as life-saving outside pandemics as seat belts are on cars, I'd agree. But I doubt numbers would back you up.
Especially since only a fraction of flus etc. are passed on subways and buses.

I can't see it happening in fashion conscious Europe either. I hope I'm wrong though. I do see the possibility of it becoming a class thing. So the educated middle class wears masks while the working class don't. It becomes a way for the middle class to signal status. Like "sustainable" clothing and fabric shopping bags are today.

Maybe designer masks will become a fashion accessory for the pretentious "slaves to fashion" set.

That's not what I heard on Twiv. It's a podcast. So I don't recall the stats. But how hard a state is hit is mostly down to how populous it is. The more people are in close proximity with eachother the more Covid-19. That's why New York was so hard hit, in spite of wearing masks. But you can factor that out when calculating this.

COVID-19 hit NY(C) hard to great degree due to high population density, yes. Also due to it being a major destination for international travel.
But the virus did not spread in New York "in spite" of wearing masks. COVID hit New York in March and April. New cases actually peaked April 10th. Early in the pandemic, universal mask wearing wasn't yet recommended, and non-homemade masks were in short supply anyway. For example, see this article from March 31st:
Should you wear a mask? US health officials re-examine guidance amid coronavirus crisis

But that was then. New York was hit by US wavelet 1a. My own state and most of the well-populated areas in the country were hit most strongly by the wavelet 1b which peaked US-wide at the end of July. The current wavelet is mostly hitting areas not hit by 1a and 1b, which is mostly rural areas, especially in the Midwest.
Northeast Wisconsin, North and South Dakota and parts of many other states are rather hard hit, but no major metro areas are.

It would be interesting to see how, for example Austin Texas fares in comparrison with Texas in general.

You can find a US map granular by county here. You can see what I've been saying about it being mostly rural counties that are hit hard now. They have a more zoomed in map of Texas as well.
Austin is doing better than other Texan cities, but it is not as stark a difference as you probably expected.
Texas, like Georgia, was hit during 1b this Summer, btw.
 
Well, it's October and US has a new record for daily infections. Thank to ratlickers States.
Not a 7-day average record, at least not yet. We are still 5k shy of that. That is a lot more useful metric as it smooths out the daily noise.

Besides, things could be a lot worse. Just look at numbers coming out of France, Spain and Belgium.
 
Well, it's October and US has a new record for daily infections. Thank to ratlickers States.
Not a 7-day average record, at least not yet. We are still 5k shy of that. That is a lot more useful metric as it smooths out the daily noise.

Besides, things could be a lot worse. Just look at numbers coming out of France, Spain and Belgium.

Why? Why not insead look at the numbers coming out of Australia and New Zealand?

Things could be a lot better (or, judging from your choice of exemplars, a little worse).
 
Why? Why not insead look at the numbers coming out of Australia and New Zealand?

Things could be a lot better (or, judging from your choice of exemplars, a little worse).

Those three countries are right now doing a lot worse than US actually. New Zealand and Australia did very well though. I guess stopping boats works. ;)
 
Why? Why not insead look at the numbers coming out of Australia and New Zealand?

Things could be a lot better (or, judging from your choice of exemplars, a little worse).

Those three countries are right now doing a lot worse than US actually. New Zealand and Australia did very well though. I guess stopping boats works. ;)

Both Australia and New Zealand are doing well. Don't know about third country though.
 
Any flu or fever can lead to temporary memory loss. So we'd expect Covid-19 to be the same.

I've never once known of a person who had an impaired memory for months after having the seasonal flu. There is just so much that we don't know yet about the long term effects of this virus, but it's doctors who are very concerned about those who are experiencing such severe "brain fog". I think they probably know a lot more about this than you or I do. Hopefully, this is a rare side effect.

The brain fog terrifies me more than any other thing about the virus. To go into it myself and come out the other side with less, seeing as I'm a manager in a highly technical field requiring advanced knowledge and extremely sharp problem solving skills, it would end my career forever.

https://www.news-medical.net/news/2...-19-patients-exhibit-cognitive-deficits.aspx#

Participants who had recovered from COVID-19 exhibited significant cognitive deficits, even after GLM had controlled for age, gender, education level, income, occupational status, racial-ethnic group, country of residence, first language, and pre-existing medical conditions.

The effect size was not only substantial among those who had required hospitalization but also among those who had not needed hospital treatment and had not even reported breathing difficulties.

The only hope it's temporary, but I am afraid it's hopeless.
 
There definitely is a proven link between Alzheimer's and COVID-19.

See The Scientist article Alzheimer’s Gene Linked to Higher Risk of Severe COVID-19.

Two copies of the APOE4 variant, which confers a higher risk of dementia, doubles the risk of severe symptoms as a result of infection with SARS-CoV-2, according to a study.

See, also, this Harvard Medical School health blog article: The hidden long-term cognitive effects of COVID-19

The COVID pandemic has now claimed as many American lives as World War I, the Vietnam War, and the Korean War combined. Most of these deaths are due to the well-known pulmonary complications of the coronavirus. It has become increasingly recognized, however, that the virus also attacks the nervous system. Doctors in a large Chicago medical center found that more than 40% of patients with COVID showed neurologic manifestations at the outset, and more than 30% of those had impaired cognition. Sometimes the neurological manifestations can be devastating and can even lead to death.
 
Why? Why not insead look at the numbers coming out of Australia and New Zealand?

Things could be a lot better (or, judging from your choice of exemplars, a little worse).

Those three countries are right now doing a lot worse than US actually. New Zealand and Australia did very well though. I guess stopping boats works. ;)

Both Australia and New Zealand are doing well. Don't know about third country though.

The three countries refers to Belgium, France and Spain. Those countries have per capita new cases far worse than US right now. UK and Italy too for that matter. I mentioned them in the post bilby as replying to.
I already agreed that Aus and NZ did a very good job so far.
 
There definitely is a proven link between Alzheimer's and COVID-19.

See The Scientist article Alzheimer’s Gene Linked to Higher Risk of Severe COVID-19.

Two copies of the APOE4 variant, which confers a higher risk of dementia, doubles the risk of severe symptoms as a result of infection with SARS-CoV-2, according to a study.

See, also, this Harvard Medical School health blog article: The hidden long-term cognitive effects of COVID-19

The COVID pandemic has now claimed as many American lives as World War I, the Vietnam War, and the Korean War combined. Most of these deaths are due to the well-known pulmonary complications of the coronavirus. It has become increasingly recognized, however, that the virus also attacks the nervous system. Doctors in a large Chicago medical center found that more than 40% of patients with COVID showed neurologic manifestations at the outset, and more than 30% of those had impaired cognition. Sometimes the neurological manifestations can be devastating and can even lead to death.
The article I read found that C19 attacks the same brain cells play a role in Parkinson/Alzheimer.
Your article is about slightly different thing but could explain my article. C19 could start the processes in the brain in People who are already genetically predisposed to Alzheimer.
Good thing I have none of that in the family. All people die in their right mind without shaking hands.
The fact that only 30% had impaired cognition suggest that getting dumb may not be universal.
 
Both Australia and New Zealand are doing well. Don't know about third country though.

The three countries refers to Belgium, France and Spain. Those countries have per capita new cases far worse than US right now. UK and Italy too for that matter. I mentioned them in the post bilby as replying to.
I already agreed that Aus and NZ did a very good job so far.
Well, they are doing badly, especially considering that they managed to get it well under control before latest spike.
US had never had it under control. Same with Russia.
 
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