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Tipping - Who are you actually going to be tipping?

Jimmy Higgins

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This isn't a thread about how people love not tipping. This is about the Department of Labor's proposed modification to the rules on tipping. Or more specifically, the distribution of tipping.

article said:
The Department of Labor (DOL) released a proposed rule that would allow restaurants to take the tips that servers earn and share them with untipped employees such as cooks and dishwashers. But, crucially, the rule doesn’t actually require that employers distribute “pooled” tips to workers. Under the administration’s proposed rule, as long as tipped workers earn minimum wage, employers could legally pocket those tips.
If this goes through, the first thing you need to ask your server is if they make at least minimum wage. Then if they say yes, what their Paypal account is. This is nuts. No one tips to give money to the owner.
 
Yeah, a couple of my kids have worked as servers at various times. At least at some places--and one of my kids has served at really nice places, It generally is considered to be good form to 'tip out' the bussers and dishwashers. But not mandatory. My kid made a point of it but noted not everyone does. There is ZERO excuse for back if the house not to be paid well enough to not need tips. Cooks, chefs, etc. should be well compensated. It's hard, high stress work. People need to get used to the idea that people who make stuff for them deserve to earn a decent wage.
 
I say abolish tipping altogether. Give the restaurant employees a decent wage commensurate with their job skills and productivity and be done with it. Also, what if the dishwasher is a grumpy, good-for-nothin' lazy bum, and the waiter is nice, works hard and gives good service to customers. Why should part of the waiter's tip be given to the scoundrel washing the dishes in the back? Just say no to redistribution of wealth!
 
Well, the main thing is we need to pass a bunch of laws to fix whatever I don't like.
 
Yeah, a couple of my kids have worked as servers at various times. At least at some places--and one of my kids has served at really nice places, It generally is considered to be good form to 'tip out' the bussers and dishwashers. But not mandatory. My kid made a point of it but noted not everyone does. There is ZERO excuse for back if the house not to be paid well enough to not need tips. Cooks, chefs, etc. should be well compensated. It's hard, high stress work. People need to get used to the idea that people who make stuff for them deserve to earn a decent wage.
I usually go all out for birthdays and Xmas for cooking and even while there is no official pressure, it is intense and consistent work, especially waking up early on Xmas morning to proof croissants. Having to do that day in and out has got to be tremendously intense.
 
Well, the main thing is we need to pass a bunch of laws to fix whatever I don't like.

So, apparently you think there should be no law against me robbing you.
Tips are money given to servers. Employers taking any of it is theft.

Trump's lackey is trying to make it legal for employers to steal money that belongs to the server to whom it was given.
 
How would the restaurant owner know that I handed my waiter a five dollar bill or told the bartender to keep the change?
 
Yeah, a couple of my kids have worked as servers at various times. At least at some places--and one of my kids has served at really nice places, It generally is considered to be good form to 'tip out' the bussers and dishwashers. But not mandatory. My kid made a point of it but noted not everyone does. There is ZERO excuse for back if the house not to be paid well enough to not need tips. Cooks, chefs, etc. should be well compensated. It's hard, high stress work. People need to get used to the idea that people who make stuff for them deserve to earn a decent wage.

I spent years working in restaurants. Everything from dishwasher to manager. The place where I was a server didn't 'tip out,' but more importantly with regards to this discussion, tips were treated as your money, not the restaurant's. This idea - having the business "pool" the tips - is idiotic. In addition to the fact that the business might just pocket the tips (managers are always under intense pressure to meet their numbers...especially labor) there's the possibility that the good tip you earned for taking extra special care of a table might be "split" and given to the lazy server who gives minimal service...or worse, one of those lousy dish dogs!
 
Yeah, a couple of my kids have worked as servers at various times. At least at some places--and one of my kids has served at really nice places, It generally is considered to be good form to 'tip out' the bussers and dishwashers. But not mandatory. My kid made a point of it but noted not everyone does. There is ZERO excuse for back if the house not to be paid well enough to not need tips. Cooks, chefs, etc. should be well compensated. It's hard, high stress work. People need to get used to the idea that people who make stuff for them deserve to earn a decent wage.
I usually go all out for birthdays and Xmas for cooking and even while there is no official pressure, it is intense and consistent work, especially waking up early on Xmas morning to proof croissants. Having to do that day in and out has got to be tremendously intense.

Ok, let me get this straight: You are making home made croissants on Christmas morning? Oh, my!

You need to PM me your address immediately. I haven't had a decent croissant in a very long time. And never home made. Also, I'm bringing hubby so he can learn your craft. He needs something to keep him busy....
 
Well, the main thing is we need to pass a bunch of laws to fix whatever I don't like.

So, apparently you think there should be no law against me robbing you.
Tips are money given to servers. Employers taking any of it is theft.

Trump's lackey is trying to make it legal for employers to steal money that belongs to the server to whom it was given.

Agreed. I believe that waiters in most states pay a 8% tip tax.
 
I'd think it's a nice idea if the employers were required it divide the tips evenly, but they were also privy to what servers were getting tipped or not.

And no, I have no mathematical equation to know that I'm right or wrong.

:EDIT:

And if you eat out, you always bring cash ;)
 
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I'd think it's a nice idea if the employers were required it divide the tips evenly, but they were also privy to what servers were getting tipped or not.

And no, I have no mathematical equation to know that I'm right or wrong.

:EDIT:

And if you eat out, you always bring cash ;)

Like Ford, I did every job at a restaurant. Serving is by the far the most difficult job. It's not easy keeping everyone happy. If tips were divided evenly, I would have bussed tables rather than wait all day long!
 
Yeah, a couple of my kids have worked as servers at various times. At least at some places--and one of my kids has served at really nice places, It generally is considered to be good form to 'tip out' the bussers and dishwashers. But not mandatory. My kid made a point of it but noted not everyone does. There is ZERO excuse for back if the house not to be paid well enough to not need tips. Cooks, chefs, etc. should be well compensated. It's hard, high stress work. People need to get used to the idea that people who make stuff for them deserve to earn a decent wage.

I spent years working in restaurants. Everything from dishwasher to manager. The place where I was a server didn't 'tip out,' but more importantly with regards to this discussion, tips were treated as your money, not the restaurant's. This idea - having the business "pool" the tips - is idiotic. In addition to the fact that the business might just pocket the tips (managers are always under intense pressure to meet their numbers...especially labor) there's the possibility that the good tip you earned for taking extra special care of a table might be "split" and given to the lazy server who gives minimal service...or worse, one of those lousy dish dogs!

Yes, the money is regarded as the server's money in the scenario I described. But it was also considered good form to tip out back of the house. My kid had a great relationship with everyone back of the house because she never neglected this, even on bad nights. In return, her orders were up pretty quick.

I admit that I am really torn regarding tips. I know how much my kids have depended upon tips for their livelihood. They were lucky enough to work in some pretty decent to extremely good places so that helped with the tips. I know that dishwashers get paid crap and cooks don't get paid decently either.

In my ideal world, everyone would earn a decent wage.

I've worked in anti-poverty programs before, so I've seen the problems low wages create (and have lived it, too, although I was lucky that it was brief). My town is extremely working class, with local employers paying very poorly and offering terrible benefits packages. When they can, they limit hours available to just under the minimum required to provide even those terrible benefits. What this does is create a large group of people who live so close to the edge that they often fall off of it, even working two or three part time jobs. The stress that this creates in their life simply makes their situation worse. It greatly increases the amount of substance abuse, mostly alcohol, but not entirely. It exacerbates mental health issues, physical health issues, weight issues, education issues and effectively robs their kids of parents who have the luxury of doing anything other than parking their kids in front of a screen while they try to recover from their day/night. It adds to instability of marriages and other relationships. It creates and maintains an underclass which needs the largess of the more fortunate just to survive. Employers use unreliability of workers to justify low wages, refusing to accept that their low wages create so much stress and financial insecurity that they must juggle multiple jobs, constantly worry about their kids, worry about losing phone and lights (in winter, you cannot have your heat cut in my area), their homes. And so, they drink. A lot. Which is not a good way to solve their problem and only creates more but it is easily available and lets them escape for a few hours from the unrelenting stress of not being able to make ends meet.

Access to better and affordable job training and educational programs would really help--but I know plenty of people with good degrees working some pretty low paying jobs.

- - - Updated - - -

I'd think it's a nice idea if the employers were required it divide the tips evenly, but they were also privy to what servers were getting tipped or not.

And no, I have no mathematical equation to know that I'm right or wrong.

:EDIT:

And if you eat out, you always bring cash ;)

I ALWAYS tip in cash, even if I am charging my meal. And I tip well. Applies to the wonderful woman who does my hair and any other tip-dependent person I encounter.
 
Well, the main thing is we need to pass a bunch of laws to fix whatever I don't like.

So, apparently you think there should be no law against me robbing you.
Tips are money given to servers. Employers taking any of it is theft.

Trump's lackey is trying to make it legal for employers to steal money that belongs to the server to whom it was given.

^^^ exactly that.

Back to cash tips only, and/or - as you noted - asking the server what the restaurant's policy is.
 
How would the restaurant owner know that I handed my waiter a five dollar bill or told the bartender to keep the change?

Most tipping nowadays is done through some sort of card. Also, you are required to report your tips, indeed, the IRS assumes servers are making 15% or something like that, so you are actually screwing a server by not tipping them at least that.
 
How would the restaurant owner know that I handed my waiter a five dollar bill or told the bartender to keep the change?

Most tipping nowadays is done through some sort of card. Also, you are required to report your tips, indeed, the IRS assumes servers are making 15% or something like that, so you are actually screwing a server by not tipping them at least that.

Yeah, a lot of younger folks do not carry cash. Ever. I actually had a co-worker who was offended that her MIL gave her a fifty dollar bill for her birthday. She wanted to know what she was supposed to do with that. I suggested that she take her hubby out to lunch. Or stop by a cosmetics counter or target. She just looked at me like I was nuts so I suggested she just give it to me. I could certainly use it.

My kids seem to think it is 'quaint' that I use cash and write checks.

I always, always, always tip in cash. It's nobody else's business what I choose to give to the person providing the service.
 
I always, always, always tip in cash. It's nobody else's business what I choose to give to the person providing the service.

Exactly. Me too. I also go out of my way to make sure the salesperson if they treated me well gets the commission and isn't scooped by some manager. That happens too often.
 
Over here, the crazy socialists in our government, totally failed to grasp the meaning of the phrase 'minimum wage', and insisted that all employees should have a set wage as the minimum that could be paid per hour.

By bizarrely not allowing some people to be paid less than the minimum, and by setting the minimum at a level sufficient for somebody who earns it to survive, they created a culture in which tips are a rarity, and only given or expected for extraordinary service.

This really sucks, if you are a moderately wealthy person who eats out a lot and really gets off on being surrounded by sycophants whose very livelihood is in your hands, and who you can therefore get away with treating like shit.

But it's pretty good for everyone else.

It's been said that there is nothing worse than doing, with great efficiency, that which should not be done at all. But the glorious land of the free has once again proven that one thing worse is to do it with great inefficiency.

Putting the remuneration of service staff in the hands of the customer almost sounds like a good idea, at least hypothetically. But to then force them to share that money, or even allow their employers to simply pocket it, renders it incapable of working as designed - even if it had been a sound hypothesis to begin with (which observation of reality suggests it was not).

This is an excellent example of how to make a bad situation even worse. Here's an idea - if someone is employed, have their employer pay them a wage equal to or greater than the "minimum wage". It works here; I fail to grasp how anyone can be confident that it wouldn't work anywhere else.
 
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