Poking my head out of the foxhole...no bullets flying...is it safe to come out?
It sure would be nice if people here would address the things I wrote on this thread instead of making things up, and forcing me to explain that I never said the things they just made up. That behavior only wastes everybody's time.
Some people have asked me about my motives for being here. I will take a little time to explain. I have been concerned about damage to the environment and resource depletion for a long time. In the latest issue of
Free Inquiry, there was an article saying the only hope for a stable environment was a substantial decrease in population. The article did not say how far we needed to decrease population, or how much time we had. That sparked my interest. In response, I wrote a draft for a letter to the editor. That draft is basically the opening post of this thread. I wanted to see what others thought about the questions I wanted to ask. I was completely caught off guard at the reaction I saw here.
I am concerned that we may be in population overshoot, and that could lead to drastic societal collapse. That collapse could affect the people reading this and their near descendants. It is serious. I would think all people would want to talk about it. Hence, my desire for civil discourse on the topic.
Some people here seem to be confused about the entire concepts of the Earth's carrying capacity and population overshoot. Exponential growth has slowed down, and we now have slow linear growth. Problem solved? No. We still need to worry about population overshoot that could have already happened. If that is a new term for you, you can learn more at
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrying_capacity and
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overshoot_(population) . There, for instance, you will read:
At the global scale, scientific data indicates that humans are living beyond the carrying capacity of planet Earth and that this cannot continue indefinitely. This scientific evidence comes from many sources. It was presented in detail in the Millennium Ecosystem Assessment of 2005, a collaborative effort involving more than 1,360 experts worldwide.[2] More recent, detailed accounts are provided by ecological footprint accounting,[3] and interdisciplinary research on planetary boundaries to safe human use of the biosphere.[4] The Sixth Assessment Report on Climate Change from the IPCC[5] and the First Assessment Report on Biodiversity and Ecosystem Services by the IPBES,[6] large international summaries of the state of scientific knowledge regarding climate disruption and biodiversity loss, also support this view. [Source:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrying_capacity]
So we find thousands of scientists concerned about population overshoot. There are plenty of links there to the concerned organizations.
And what do we read about these concerned scientists here on this thread? If you read the posts here you will find that these people are promoting genocide and that:
"Combating overpopulation" is always about favoring some groups over others.
So, if you are going to trust what you read here, those thousand of scientists are all racists trying to use eugenics to wipe out people they don't like. It is so sad to read the shameful, unjustified slander going on here about the many good people that are expressing a legitimate concern. The late Tom Flynn, Humanist luminary and editor of Free Inquiry, who actively wrote about the need to reduce population, must be turning over in his grave.
Many of you believe in evolution. Surely you have heard Creationists argue that all evolutionists are just using evolution to promote immoral behavior, abortion, atheism, or sexual liberty. Instead of addressing the issues, these Creationists resort to attacks on the motives of those expressing an opposing view. Their argument is invalid. Even if those Creationists know some people who used evolution to justify something wrong, that in no way proves that all evolutionists are doing this. And that in no way gives them justification to ignore the evidence.
Likewise, just because you have heard of somebody who uses concerns about overpopulation in term of racist policies, that does not prove that every person concerned about overpopulation is evil, and does not give you the right to ignore the evidence. If you can see the fallacy when Creationist argue by attacking your motives, then you should not use that argument yourself.
I wander if I should just shake my head in sorrow and walk away from the slander at this site. Are the debate tactics here no better than Creationist tactics?
If I decide to come back, I plan to address some of your questions and write about a) my opinion on the Earth's carrying capacity and the justification for my view; b) some of the ideas suggested here, including nuclear power, synthetic fuel, and exploiting space. and c) the hot button issue of what I think we should do. I wasn't planning on this being a platform for airing my views, so I wasn't prepared to do that. Now that people keep asking, I will see if I can respond.
Then I will probably write a post at my blog putting together what I have said here.
Meanwhile, I may send that letter to the editor of FI, but I can see that this issue is such a hot button issue, it might be better not even to ask my questions. Sometimes, sadly, it is safer to stay quiet about one's concerns.
I know that there are many good people here. I hope that we can somehow get beyond the slander and lies that have filled the last few posts of this thread, and move on to true intellectual debate on this important topic. To those here that do believe in treating people with honesty and respect, I wish you the best. Thank you for being here.
