What has conservatism given America?

[Patooka]

I'm just wondering why there are still people using words like "pinko" and "commie" unironically. What year is it?

If you're talking about thebeave and me, we were using them for humorous effect. Did you miss the ?

Because I hate myself I sometimes watch RSBN and Newsmax. A lot of your tribe genuinely mean it.

 

[Bomb#20]

I'm just wondering why there are still people using words like "pinko" and "commie" unironically. What year is it?

If you're talking about thebeave and me, we were using them for humorous effect. Did you miss the ?

Because I hate myself I sometimes watch RSBN and Newsmax. A lot of your tribe genuinely mean it.

My tribe? Which tribe is that? Something tells me you don't mean "Homo sapiens".

 

[Patooka]

My tribe? Which tribe is that? Something tells me you don't mean "Homo sapiens".

That's right. I meant you Americans. Calling people commie pinkos without a sense of irony is still a big thing in US media, politics and among some US voters. What did you think I meant?

 

[Bomb#20]

My tribe? Which tribe is that? Something tells me you don't mean "Homo sapiens".

That's right. I meant you Americans. Calling people commie pinkos without a sense of irony is still a big thing in US media, politics and among some US voters. What did you think I meant?

You appear to be getting a skewed impression of the US from nonrandom sampling from far away. I've lived here and followed politics for over forty years and no, it isn't a big thing. When we hear those terms at all it's because somebody's clowning. That isn't to say there aren't still subcultures where people sloganize like the fifties, but they aren't big. I was today years old when I first heard of RSBN; I've heard of Newsmax but never watched it in my life and neither have most of the rest of us.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

In 2016 most people didn't realize how much of a criminal he was. He wasn't elected in 2020. You would be right if we elect him in 2024--we would be showing that we had gone nuts. I don't see how you're attacking the Democrats, though.

Anybody who had paid even a tiny bit of attention knew he was a self centered misanthropic, misogynist racist cheat who failed to honor contracts he negotiated, left workers unpaid, employed undocumented workers, cheated on his wives and was plausibly accused of sexual assault by multiple women.

Didn't realize how much of a criminal he was. Yeah, anyone who paid attention would know he was a bad person but that's very different than realizing he's going to see how many felonies he can rack up.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Can conservatism take credit for the rapid collapse of communism back in the late '80's and early '90's? Some might say that was a good thing for the world (though I know many of you pinko commie bastards would disagree ).

I think the primary blame there is the copy machine and the fax machine.

'splain, Lucy.

They made it very easy to disseminate information.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Consevatives: "I like the original Ghostbusters. It's the traditional one. Enough of this identity politics."

Also, conservatives: "Hey have you heard the new version of Fast Car yet?"

 

[TomC]

I'm just wondering why there are still people using words like "pinko" and "commie" unironically. What year is it?

If you're talking about thebeave and me, we were using them for humorous effect. Did you miss the ?

Because I hate myself I sometimes watch RSBN and Newsmax. A lot of your tribe genuinely mean it.

Why do Australians have so much interest in such things? To me, it's like sticking your nose in the butthole of Trump or something. I never do it. I've never watched New$-M---(I'm not entering that in my phone). I've never even heard of RS-BN, why do Australians and Danes try to tell me about the USA?

Then you tell us who "our tribe" is?

Don't you Aussies have a polite way of saying "Fuck Off"?

Tom

 

[Politesse]

What we need are men of bold ideas and uncompromising principles, like our forefathers of old. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, James Madison, that guy who hosted that one reality show where he fires people... You know, visionaries!

 

[Bomb#20]

So you think affirmative action is a zero-sum game? ...

Well, duh, it has to be zero sum! Affirmative action is inherently discrimination and thus inherently a bad thing. ...

You say that as though zero-sum-ness follows analytically from pure math. It doesn't work that way. Whether any given variety of discrimination is zero sum is an empirical question. Consider the obvious counterexample -- a lot of universities discriminate heavily in favor of the children of rich parents who make massive donations to the university in exchange for letting in their undeserving kids who couldn't make the grades to get in without a boost. The big donations enlarge their endowments, which makes it possible for the universities to hire more professors, build more classrooms, and admit more students. So nobody is losing out on an education because of that sort of discrimination; quite the reverse.

The universities that want to have lower admission standards for athletes and legacy admissions will undoubtedly claim justification from an analogous non-zero-sum effect -- that those practices increase alumni donation in general. No idea whether they're right -- whether the effect is really big enough to create a whole additional slot per unfairly favored admittee. If they want to rely on that argument they should of course be required to prove it. But the point is, whether it's zero-sum is an empirical question.

 

[Tigers!]

I'm just wondering why there are still people using words like "pinko" and "commie" unironically. What year is it?

If you're talking about thebeave and me, we were using them for humorous effect. Did you miss the ?

Because I hate myself I sometimes watch RSBN and Newsmax. A lot of your tribe genuinely mean it.

Why do Australians have so much interest in such things? To me, it's like sticking your nose in the butthole of Trump or something. I never do it. I've never watched New$-M---(I'm not entering that in my phone). I've never even heard of RS-BN, why do Australians and Danes try to tell me about the USA?

Because unfortunately what happens in your country has a disturbing tendency to pop up in our countries within a very few years. Most often not for the better. In Australia we seem to have a Stockholm Syndrome-like tendenc to to think that the USA is the be-all to end-all. Ridiculous I know.

Then you tell us who "our tribe" is?

Don't you Aussies have a polite way of saying "Fuck Off"?

You need to go to a taxidermist.

Tom

Tigers

 

[Tigers!]

What we need are men of bold ideas and uncompromising principles, like our forefathers of old. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, James Madison, that guy who hosted that one reality show where he fires people... You know, visionaries!

Sanders doesn't do it for you?

 

[Elixir]

What we need are men of bold ideas and uncompromising principles, like our forefathers of old. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, James Madison, that guy who hosted that one reality show where he fires people... You know, visionaries!

Sanders doesn't do it for you?

Sanders is great. Sure he’s on the fringe, but he still supports whatever moves us away from the threat of the right. Not like Manchin or Sinema on the other fringe.

 

[Patooka]

Why do Australians have so much interest in such things? To me, it's like sticking your nose in the butthole of Trump or something. I never do it. I've never watched New$-M---(I'm not entering that in my phone). I've never even heard of RS-BN, why do Australians and Danes try to tell me about the USA?

I've been asked this so many times I've bookmarked my answer. I would add there is a transactional relationship between rightwing media from both countries as well. For example FOX loves using Miranda Devine and Greg Sheridan to promote an idea and claim it has international support. Avi Yemeni and Sydney Watson would also be examples of this.

I'll point out the head of RSBN is currently fucking the Jewish Space Laser Lady so it's basically the unofficial MAGA network; it's big and well known amongst people who love red baseball caps.

Then you tell us who "our tribe" is?

I could be facetious and say "I was only using such language for humourous effect and didn't you miss my wink emoji", but you are missing a lot of context in what I was saying. Firstly, I was talking about bomb#20's "tribe". And secondly I instinctively doubt anyone who only criticises one ideological side whilst claiming ignorance of the extreme elements of one's own ideology. It would be like me "claiming" to have never heard of antifa or George Soros.

Don't you Aussies have a polite way of saying "Fuck Off"?

Yes we do! Some countries say "please" or "thanks" as examples of politeness. In Australia it's a little different. So instead of saying "Fuck off please", or "Fuck off thanks", you would say "Fuck off cunt". But seeing that's against the forum rules (for the record it wouldn't upset me personally), I would just point out my tribe comment wasn't directed at you and you misconstrued what I said.

 

[Politesse]

What we need are men of bold ideas and uncompromising principles, like our forefathers of old. Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, James Madison, that guy who hosted that one reality show where he fires people... You know, visionaries!

Sanders doesn't do it for you?

Sanders is pretty close to a Franklin-type, I think.

 

[Bomb#20]

My tribe? Which tribe is that? Something tells me you don't mean "Homo sapiens".

That's right. I meant you Americans.

Then you tell us who "our tribe" is?

I could be facetious and say "I was only using such language for humourous effect and didn't you miss my wink emoji", but you are missing a lot of context in what I was saying. Firstly, I was talking about bomb#20's "tribe". ... I would just point out my tribe comment wasn't directed at you and you misconstrued what I said.

Did he? What makes you think Americans are my "tribe" and not Tom's? Are you under the impression California is the real America and the Midwestern USA doesn't count? If you meant Americans then you were talking about his "tribe" every bit as much as about mine.

Or were you being facetious when you said you meant Americans? I didn't miss your wink emoji but at the time it seemed premature to make an issue of it; now the issue seems to have matured. If you have something to say about my "tribe" that isn't about Tom's "tribe", which tribe is that? Something tells me you don't mean "Americans".

And secondly I instinctively doubt anyone who only criticises one ideological side whilst claiming ignorance of the extreme elements of one's own ideology. It would be like me "claiming" to have never heard of antifa or George Soros.

Whom are you talking about? If you mean me, you need to go to a taxidermist.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Why do Australians have so much interest in such things? To me, it's like sticking your nose in the butthole of Trump or something. I never do it. I've never watched New$-M---(I'm not entering that in my phone). I've never even heard of RS-BN, why do Australians and Danes try to tell me about the USA?

I've been asked this so many times I've bookmarked my answer.

While I am risking some of my fellow Americans ripping off my head and shitting down my throat, I am going to admit that your response is reasonable anyway. Before I even read your response, I was already thinking it makes sense for non-Americans to be very knowledgeable about what happens in America and what Americans do and think. The US is still the most critical superpower in the world and as such our actions and directions impact the rest of the world the most. You have outlined one way in which our movements, direction, and policies impact your country, really in a way I was somewhat aware of but not really focusing on how much of a priority that could be. Your explanation is appreciated.

 

[bilby]

The US is still the most critical superpower in the world and as such our actions and directions impact the rest of the world the most.

It's also notable that Americans are massively over represented on social media, so the American political discourse (much of it pure propaganda) inevitably bleeds through into our own culture as utterly misguided public opinion.

We have plenty of people here who believe things that they heard on Twitter or Facebook, which were originally penned to suit a US political agenda, but which were not contained to US audiences because of the fundamental nature of the Internet.

There's also a certain amount of British and even Russian nonsense seeping into the brains of Australians in this way. But the overwhelming majority comes from America, simply because more Americans are online.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

So you think affirmative action is a zero-sum game? ...

Well, duh, it has to be zero sum! Affirmative action is inherently discrimination and thus inherently a bad thing. ...

You say that as though zero-sum-ness follows analytically from pure math. It doesn't work that way. Whether any given variety of discrimination is zero sum is an empirical question. Consider the obvious counterexample -- a lot of universities discriminate heavily in favor of the children of rich parents who make massive donations to the university in exchange for letting in their undeserving kids who couldn't make the grades to get in without a boost. The big donations enlarge their endowments, which makes it possible for the universities to hire more professors, build more classrooms, and admit more students. So nobody is losing out on an education because of that sort of discrimination; quite the reverse.

That is at least the theory. I would like to see some real world data, though. It's not zero-sum because it brings in extra money. Race doesn't.

The universities that want to have lower admission standards for athletes and legacy admissions will undoubtedly claim justification from an analogous non-zero-sum effect -- that those practices increase alumni donation in general. No idea whether they're right -- whether the effect is really big enough to create a whole additional slot per unfairly favored admittee. If they want to rely on that argument they should of course be required to prove it. But the point is, whether it's zero-sum is an empirical question.

I dislike college athletics. It seriously distorts the system.

 

[Patooka]

Did he? What makes you think Americans are my "tribe" and not Tom's? Are you under the impression California is the real America and the Midwestern USA doesn't count? If you meant Americans then you were talking about his "tribe" every bit as much as about mine.

Trust me. You have a tribe and it is not geographical.

Or were you being facetious when you said you meant Americans? I didn't miss your wink emoji but at the time it seemed premature to make an issue of it; now the issue seems to have matured. If you have something to say about my "tribe" that isn't about Tom's "tribe", which tribe is that? Something tells me you don't mean "Americans".

Pretty much.

Whom are you talking about? If you mean me, you need to go to a taxidermist.

I'm sorry that this confuses you. By the way;