What should Israel do?

[Jayjay]

Purging Israel of long range weapons and extremists is good for the Palestinians, the region, and the west, too. Are you going to suggest it, or are you going to keep repeating offensive racist crap like the OP?

Purge Gaza of rockets and you'll see peace. Purge Israel of weapons and you'll see genocide.

Thee wasn't peace before Gaza had rockets. What makes you think there is going to be peace if the rockets were somehow magically removed, or that the rockets have anything to do with peace at all? Israel wants to ethnically cleanse and colonize the West Bank, and that is why it doesn't want peace. Rockets from Gaza are a lame excuse at best.

 

[arkirk]

Purging Israel of long range weapons and extremists is good for the Palestinians, the region, and the west, too. Are you going to suggest it, or are you going to keep repeating offensive racist crap like the OP?

Purge Gaza of rockets and you'll see peace. Purge Israel of weapons and you'll see genocide.

Are you paying attention Loren? What's the score in this slaughter at this time? Who is really doing the dying, the starving, and the bleeding?

As of a few minutes ago, the score was 1,100+ dead Palestinians versus zero Israelis. Some contest! This is an attack on civilians. This is a war crime...added onto the slow ethnic cleansing of Palestine by Israel in the first place. It is hard to see this attack by Israel as anything but part of a planned genocide...with a complicit United States military industrial complex supporting it.

The Israelis have destroyed how many Palestinian tanks and fighter aircraft? How many Weapons of Mass destruction have the Israelis destroyed? How many, Loren? How many? I heard that in one night, the Hamas launched about 100 rockets killing zero Israelis. Wow! There is nothing fueling this so much as the hyperbolic rhetoric of Netanyahu and the racist position of the U.S. (once upon a time peacenick) Secretary of State, John Kerry.

More people die in Los Angeles in traffic every day than Hamas has killed in this non war. It really is simply the execution of a civilian population and not a war. I do not know how a person who does not accept either of the religious factions involved can support either side and want to know how Loren can justify his support of Israel's murderous government.

Even if you absolutely love war, what is happening is Gaza does not meet the requirements to call it a war. It is a criminal act of a racist government. This is not something a humanist can support, but our tax money has armed this out of control government.

What is the basis of the U.S. alliance with Israel in the first place? This ethnic cleansing has been going on since the late 40's. Is it the racist bible that is being used? I think in many minds it is the notion that Israel is a continuation of the book of Exodus. For modern people, this is unacceptable as a justification for anything, let alone this horror.

 

[Jayjay]

Here is what Israel should not do: drop leaflets to ask residents of Northern Gaza to leave, and then do nothing. Sure not everyone believed the fliers and stayed back anyway, but by giving a warning and then not going through with whatever operation they had planned only means that the next time Israel uses fliers, the people will not take it seriously. Saving some lives today will cost more lives tomorrow.

Second, they should negotiate the inevitable ceasefire with the PA. Not with fucking Egypt or any other foreign country. The only long term way to stop the attacks is to undermine Hamas, and that means propping up Abbas and the moderates. Let them take the credit for stopping the killing for now.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Here is what Israel should not do: drop leaflets to ask residents of Northern Gaza to leave, and then do nothing. Sure not everyone believed the fliers and stayed back anyway, but by giving a warning and then not going through with whatever operation they had planned only means that the next time Israel uses fliers, the people will not take it seriously. Saving some lives today will cost more lives tomorrow. Second, they should negotiate the inevitable ceasefire with the PA. Not with fucking Egypt or any other foreign country. The only long term way to stop the attacks is to undermine Hamas, and that means propping up Abbas and the moderates. Let them take the credit for stopping the killing for now.

Totally agree with Jay.

 

[arkirk]

Here is what Israel should not do: drop leaflets to ask residents of Northern Gaza to leave, and then do nothing. Sure not everyone believed the fliers and stayed back anyway, but by giving a warning and then not going through with whatever operation they had planned only means that the next time Israel uses fliers, the people will not take it seriously. Saving some lives today will cost more lives tomorrow. Second, they should negotiate the inevitable ceasefire with the PA. Not with fucking Egypt or any other foreign country. The only long term way to stop the attacks is to undermine Hamas, and that means propping up Abbas and the moderates. Let them take the credit for stopping the killing for now.

Totally agree with Jay.

So what you and jayjay are saying is once the pamphlets are dropped you gotta drop bombs? Israel's problem is that it is a criminal enterprise and needs reorganization before it can negotiate anything at all. As for the pamphlets, they dropped them and followed by bombardment of civilian populations....a crime against humanity. Israel is a racist nation and I feel they probably teach that racism in their schools, so democratic processes have little chance of working for peace in Palestine. Israel has to learn to withdraw and give the Palestinians a chance to put their world back together. They are the ones who need to make the initial concession necessary for peace. Instead, we just get more talk about the lazy worthless religious fanatic Palestinians who are squatting on land that should belong to good Jews. There is no tempering the Israeli hatred of Palestinians who stand in the way of an ALL JEWISH STATE. We should not be supporting Israel. I do not buy anything that comes from there and will not till there is actual peace there. Unfortunately, my government takes good tax money and spends it on the wrong side of this conflict.

 

[Jayjay]

So what you and jayjay are saying is once the pamphlets are dropped you gotta drop bombs? Israel's problem is that it is a criminal enterprise and needs reorganization before it can negotiate anything at all. As for the pamphlets, they dropped them and followed by bombardment of civilian populations....a crime against humanity.

The pamphlets told residents of northern Gaza to evacuate by noon on sunday. However I'm not aware of any bombing campaign since then. The problem is that if Israel drops pamphlets and then doesn't drop the bombs, nobody is going to believe the pamphlets next time. I'm not saying Israel has to drop bombs, but they shouldn't give empty warnings.

 

[untermensche]

Here is what Israel should not do: drop leaflets to ask residents of Northern Gaza to leave, and then do nothing. Sure not everyone believed the fliers and stayed back anyway, but by giving a warning and then not going through with whatever operation they had planned only means that the next time Israel uses fliers, the people will not take it seriously. Saving some lives today will cost more lives tomorrow.

Second, they should negotiate the inevitable ceasefire with the PA. Not with fucking Egypt or any other foreign country. The only long term way to stop the attacks is to undermine Hamas, and that means propping up Abbas and the moderates. Let them take the credit for stopping the killing for now.

You assume Israel actually wants peace, when it's clear they don't.

Israel wants to continue on it's current course. Abusing the Palestinians as state policy and taking land from them.

Peace would mean Israel has to stop this.

 

[Jayjay]

Here is what Israel should not do: drop leaflets to ask residents of Northern Gaza to leave, and then do nothing. Sure not everyone believed the fliers and stayed back anyway, but by giving a warning and then not going through with whatever operation they had planned only means that the next time Israel uses fliers, the people will not take it seriously. Saving some lives today will cost more lives tomorrow.

Second, they should negotiate the inevitable ceasefire with the PA. Not with fucking Egypt or any other foreign country. The only long term way to stop the attacks is to undermine Hamas, and that means propping up Abbas and the moderates. Let them take the credit for stopping the killing for now.

You assume Israel actually wants peace, when it's clear they don't.

Israel wants to continue on it's current course. Abusing the Palestinians as state policy and taking land from them.

Peace would mean Israel has to stop this.

Well that's another thing entirely. I did not say use the word "peace" at all, did I?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Purge Gaza of rockets and you'll see peace. Purge Israel of weapons and you'll see genocide.

Thee wasn't peace before Gaza had rockets. What makes you think there is going to be peace if the rockets were somehow magically removed, or that the rockets have anything to do with peace at all? Israel wants to ethnically cleanse and colonize the West Bank, and that is why it doesn't want peace. Rockets from Gaza are a lame excuse at best.

They're throwing rockets because Israel has basically stopped other attacks with the wall.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Purge Gaza of rockets and you'll see peace. Purge Israel of weapons and you'll see genocide.

Are you paying attention Loren? What's the score in this slaughter at this time? Who is really doing the dying, the starving, and the bleeding?

As of a few minutes ago, the score was 1,100+ dead Palestinians versus zero Israelis. Some contest! This is an attack on civilians. This is a war crime...added onto the slow ethnic cleansing of Palestine by Israel in the first place. It is hard to see this attack by Israel as anything but part of a planned genocide...with a complicit United States military industrial complex supporting it.

1) You have a zero error.

2) You haven't been paying attention--"keeping score" is not a measure of who is right or wrong, but rather who is dying.

3) I suggest looking up "genocide". You obviously don't know what it means. The population of Palestine grows more in a single day than have died in the current round of fighting.

The Israelis have destroyed how many Palestinian tanks and fighter aircraft? How many Weapons of Mass destruction have the Israelis destroyed? How many, Loren? How many? I heard that in one night, the Hamas launched about 100 rockets killing zero Israelis. Wow! There is nothing fueling this so much as the hyperbolic rhetoric of Netanyahu and the racist position of the U.S. (once upon a time peacenick) Secretary of State, John Kerry.

How about some actual scorekeeping: The number of weapons Israel has fired at Palestine in this fracas is about the same as the number that Palestine has fired at Israel.

More people die in Los Angeles in traffic every day than Hamas has killed in this non war. It really is simply the execution of a civilian population and not a war. I do not know how a person who does not accept either of the religious factions involved can support either side and want to know how Loren can justify his support of Israel's murderous government.

Because I'm not deluded into thinking dying makes right.

What is the basis of the U.S. alliance with Israel in the first place? This ethnic cleansing has been going on since the late 40's. Is it the racist bible that is being used? I think in many minds it is the notion that Israel is a continuation of the book of Exodus. For modern people, this is unacceptable as a justification for anything, let alone this horror.

Israel is a western democracy. We get along with western democracies.

 

[untermensche]

Israel is a western democracy. We get along with western democracies.

We get along with all kinds of tyrants.

From the so-called royal family in Saudi Arabia, to the totalitarian government of China.

Being a democracy is not a prerequisite to get along with the US.

So the fact that the US gets along with Israel and protects Israel from the consequences of its crimes is meaningless.

 

[laughing dog]

Because I'm not deluded into thinking dying makes right.

You think killing makes right.

 

[tupac chopra]

Israel is a western democracy. .

Israel is an apartheid state

 

[laruan]

Well for starters Israel could pull back to the borders of their state as established at it's founding, end the settlements, and stop treating the Palestinians as subhumans.

It will not change anything.

in agreement with Egypt Israel withdrew from Gaza and dismantled settlements with Palestinians having self determination..

Unrelated to Israel Fatah and Hamas ended up in civil war slaughtering each other.

Israel is actually a relatively small part of the regional conflict.

Even if Israel disappeared not much would change.

Since 1947 Israel has been occupied by Israelis, in several subsequent battles they have acquired occupied and repatriated all sorts of land and territories.
Ever since history began invaders have been claiming ownership of lands forcibly taken from previous inhabitants; Columbus, Cook and thousands of others, ( UK has been invaded by so many raiders they do not know who their forefathers are). So if international law is -all rights and privileges go to invaders and victors- why should the Middle East countries have to abide by different rules?

ie. Israel can occupy and keep any lands they have taken by force since 1945 , by the same token if their enemies have the wherewithal to strike back they are entitled to invade and occupy the current lands under the Israeli flag .

Not very civilised but that’s how many countries have been formed over the years.

So if the Israelis are happy accept the consequences of an inevitable invasion by Saudis, Iranians, Iraqis, Palestinians then they are perfectly entitled to molest encroach and keep all the occupied lands that they have sized, whilst they wait.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Because I'm not deluded into thinking dying makes right.

You think killing makes right.

No. I'm saying the death toll says nothing about right or wrong.

 

[Underseer]

It is clear there is no political solution. The Palestinians. Persians, and Arabs in general can't get along with each other let alone make peace with Israel.

Libya, Lebanon, Syria, and Iraq are a mess. Iran is supplying Hamas and trying to destabilize the Arab monarchies.

Israel is an in Alamo existential battle.

Whatever your criticisms are o Israel, it is the only stable state with western style freedoms in theregion. If Israel falls or becomes diminished it opens the way for connected extremists from Libya to Syria to Gaza to ISIS in Iraq, andthat would be the greatest tragedy.

The rain of rockets is unbearable.

If I were POTUS I would support aggressive Israeli action to end the attacks from Gaza once and for all, and offer to provide air support and offshore naval assistance.

Obama's approach of foreign policy by reason, negotiation, and talk has failed. The only currency is power.

So the only possible options are to wipe out the Palestinians or be wiped out? No wonder you would ask a question like that.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Israel is a western democracy. .

Israel is an apartheid state

1) The two are not incompatible.

2) Repeating this propaganda ad nauseum won't make it true.

 

[laughing dog]

You think killing makes right.

No. I'm saying the death toll says nothing about right or wrong.

From your advocacy for and defense of IDF actions, you think killing makes right.

 

[Ford]

Israel is an apartheid state

1) The two are not incompatible.

2) Repeating this propaganda ad nauseum won't make it true.

I'd say that what makes it true is that if you're a Palestinian who happens to live in the West Bank, your property can be seized and handed over to Jewish settlers and you have no recourse whatsoever. For all intents and purposes the state of Israel treats land upon which Palestinians are living to be Israeli property, and when the presence of Palestinians on that property becomes a problem, they are evicted and the land is given to Jewish settlers.

 

[angelo]

The question not answered here is this. Is Hamas a terrorist organisation or is it not? What about Hezbolah? I8s that a terrorist outfit or is it not?
Is the present Israeli government not a democratically elected government elected to protect it's citizens?
For that idiot that claims Israel is an apartheid state you are talking out of your arse. You wouldn't know apartheid if it bit you on the arse.
Go for a walk in down town Tel Aviv and watch Arabs and Jews doing business together in the shops and restaurants.