Politics Where are you really from?

[Metaphor]

Frankly, I don't see how contradicting someone when they tell you where they are from, and demanding a "real" answer, could be seen as anything other than extremely rude. Like, accusing people of lying at all is rude, let alone about something as conversationally trivial but personally important as one's place of birth.

If there weren't a racial element, the conversation would be baffling. "Where are you from?" "Chicago" "No where are you REALLY from" is a conversation only ever had between a white person and a non-white, because it would not make sense to randomly accuse someone of lying about their place of origin unless you're a racist trying to make someone feel out of place.

So, when I've had the same conversation hundreds of times in my life, but I'm white, what are the people trying to do to me?

Really now? Because you're white, people rudely insist that you're "really" from England and thus do not belong?

No. People ask where I come from when they hear my non-Anglo name. Now, at this point, I know what they are asking me. They are not asking me: what city in Australia were you born in? They are asking me: what is your ethnic and cultural heritage. I tend to answer both questions in my response, and so either way, they are satisfied.

White people, even in white-majority countries, are often asked where they came from. If you are white but with a non-Australian accent, I would ask you where you came from. (I'm sure Canadians get a bit pissed off when they are mistaken for American, but that's the Canadian problem for not having a distinctive enough accent). If you are white with an Australian accent but with a marked name (anything other than bog standard Anglo-Celtic), I would also probably ask your ethnic and cultural heritage.

When people ask, I rarely think they are asking because they think I do not belong. They are asking because it is likely that my recent ethnic and cultural heritage is not Australian, and they're curious, or perhaps not even curious but are making polite small talk.

Then you don't know what the hell you're talking about, do you? You've never had a remotely similar social experience.

Of course I have--hundreds of times.

Well, no. If you've never been targeted for discrimination by such conversations, all you ever had was some charming small talk about your place of origin. That's not even sort of equivalent.

Oh, I see. Fulani was the target of discrimination, and I was the target of small talk.

You weren't targeted by anything, by your own admission.

So if instead I said I had been the target of 'reverse discrimination', you'd have believed me?

 

[TomC]

You weren't targeted by anything, by your own admission.

Based on the OP, I'm not sure Fulani was either.

But her account of the event sure worked out well for her.
Tom

 

[Politesse]

You weren't targeted by anything, by your own admission.

Based on the OP, I'm not sure Fulani was either.

But her account of the event sure worked out well for her.
Tom

She's being torn to shreds for no reason by the right wing mob, how is that "working out well"?

 

[Metaphor]

You weren't targeted by anything, by your own admission.

Based on the OP, I'm not sure Fulani was either.

But her account of the event sure worked out well for her.
Tom

She's being torn to shreds for no reason by the right wing mob, how is that "working out well"?

Torn to shreds by a "mob"?

It is working out well for her because she packaged her 'racism' narrative to a receptive social media audence, and then had multiple appearances on UK national media selling her narrative, and she has not had any appreciable challenge to that narrative from the mainstream media, the palace, or Hussey.

I'm still curious about Fulani's total recall. I remember the gist of conversations but I'd never remember the detail that Fulani did. I wonder what her secret is.

 

[Arctish]

Well, Lady Hussey reportedly asked Fulani where she was ‘really’ from. Clear implication that Fulani isn’t ‘really’ British.

Hussey wanted to know Fulani's ethnic and cultural heritage, which was not British but something else.

Furlani's ethnic heritage is unknown and the reason for that is exactly as she said. Records of which ethnicity/tribes her ancestors came from weren't retained.

Furlani's cultural heritage is British. Her family moved from one British Commonwealth nation (Barbados) to another British Commonwealth nation (England) in the 1950s, where she was born and raised.

I doubt Barbados describes itself as "British".

Australia is a Commonwealth nation, King Charles is the King of Australia, and I was born and raised here, but I do not call myself "British".

So what?

British culture is deeply imbedded in both Barbados and Australia. The official language is English, King Charles is the official Head of State, etc.

And even if Barbados wasn't part of the Commonwealth, Furlani was born and raised in the United Kingdom. Her cultural heritage is British.

Tell that to Fulani, who said:

No lady, I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

She said that after Hussey continued to badger her after she had already said "I am born here and am British".

Hussey refused to accept "I am British" as an answer, and apparently you do too.

British is Fulani's nationality.

It's also her cultural heritage. She was born and raised in British culture and appears to have fully participated in it her entire life.

Are both your parents immigrants to the country you were born in?

No, but that was true for my father and he's definitely American.

Had his parents been born and raised in a U.S. territory and then moved to the U.S. before he was born, there would be even less reason to doubt his American cultural heritage.

She is a British citizen as I am an Australian citizen.

My ethnic heritage? Not "Australian" in any conceivable sense.

My cultural heritage is the admixture of the prevailing Anglo-Australian majority of the country I was raised in, and the Slavic, eastern European culture of my parents.

I don't know your personal circumstances, Arctish, but it sounds like you were not marked as different from the majority.

EDIT: Also, it beggars belief that you think Fulani and Hussey have the same cultural heritage. They clearly do not. Hussey is part of the indigenous white Anglo-Celtic, aristocratic classes of Britain. A class so privileged, she worked for free for sixty years, because what else is a woman of the moneyed classes going to do? Fulani is the daughter of African-ethnicity immgrants from Barbados to Britain.

They don't have the same life experiences due to racism and classism in their culture, but it's the same culture.

As I said: tell that to Fulani, who provided a different answer to yours.

Fulani said that after she had already answered "I am born here and am British" and was badgered by Hussey into giving a different answer. I've seen that same tactic used here on this discussion board and its predecessors. It's just a way to reject someone's statements out of hand and IMO it's pretty obnoxious.

Hussey appears to believe Fulani isn't really British and cannot possibly have a British cultural heritage despite her being born and raised in the UK, and the same is true of you. You and she are both wrong.

 

[Metaphor]

Well, Lady Hussey reportedly asked Fulani where she was ‘really’ from. Clear implication that Fulani isn’t ‘really’ British.

Hussey wanted to know Fulani's ethnic and cultural heritage, which was not British but something else.

Furlani's ethnic heritage is unknown and the reason for that is exactly as she said. Records of which ethnicity/tribes her ancestors came from weren't retained.

Furlani's cultural heritage is British. Her family moved from one British Commonwealth nation (Barbados) to another British Commonwealth nation (England) in the 1950s, where she was born and raised.

I doubt Barbados describes itself as "British".

Australia is a Commonwealth nation, King Charles is the King of Australia, and I was born and raised here, but I do not call myself "British".

So what?

British culture is deeply imbedded in both Barbados and Australia. The official language is English, King Charles is the official Head of State, etc.

And even if Barbados wasn't part of the Commonwealth, Furlani was born and raised in the United Kingdom. Her cultural heritage is British.

Tell that to Fulani, who said:

No lady, I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

She said that after Hussey continued to badger her after she had already said "I am born here and am British".

Hussey refused to accept "I am British" as an answer, and apparently you do too.

British is Fulani's nationality.

It's also her cultural heritage. She was born and raised in British culture and appears to have fully participated in it her entire life.

Are both your parents immigrants to the country you were born in?

No, but that was true for my father and he's definitely American.

I do not doubt he is an American citizen. But is that how he would describe his cultural and ethnic heritage?

Had his parents been born and raised in a U.S. territory and then moved to the U.S. before he was born, there would be even less reason to doubt his American cultural heritage.

She is a British citizen as I am an Australian citizen.

My ethnic heritage? Not "Australian" in any conceivable sense.

My cultural heritage is the admixture of the prevailing Anglo-Australian majority of the country I was raised in, and the Slavic, eastern European culture of my parents.

I don't know your personal circumstances, Arctish, but it sounds like you were not marked as different from the majority.

EDIT: Also, it beggars belief that you think Fulani and Hussey have the same cultural heritage. They clearly do not. Hussey is part of the indigenous white Anglo-Celtic, aristocratic classes of Britain. A class so privileged, she worked for free for sixty years, because what else is a woman of the moneyed classes going to do? Fulani is the daughter of African-ethnicity immgrants from Barbados to Britain.

They don't have the same life experiences due to racism and classism in their culture, but it's the same culture.

As I said: tell that to Fulani, who provided a different answer to yours.

Fulani said that after she had already answered "I am born here and am British" and was badgered by Hussey into giving a different answer. I've seen that same tactic used here on this discussion board and its predecessors. It's just a way to reject someone's statements out of hand and IMO it's pretty obnoxious.

Hussey appears to believe Fulani isn't really British and cannot possibly have a British cultural heritage despite her being born and raised in the UK by citizens of the British Commonwealth, and the same is true of you. You and she are both wrong.

Hussey believed (in my opinion)--correctly--that Fulani was not of recent British origin. Her heritage, in her own words, again for your edification:

No lady, I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

Fulani described her own heritage and descent differently to 'British'. Since you don't know what Hussey believes is 'really' British, it seems to me you don't know what she thinks or thought about Fulani. If you think Fulani was lying to get Hussey off her back, that too is an opinion and not one I share. I have no reason to believe Fulani was lying.

 

[Toni]

Well, Lady Hussey reportedly asked Fulani where she was ‘really’ from. Clear implication that Fulani isn’t ‘really’ British.

Hussey wanted to know Fulani's ethnic and cultural heritage, which was not British but something else.

Furlani's ethnic heritage is unknown and the reason for that is exactly as she said. Records of which ethnicity/tribes her ancestors came from weren't retained.

Furlani's cultural heritage is British. Her family moved from one British Commonwealth nation (Barbados) to another British Commonwealth nation (England) in the 1950s, where she was born and raised.

I doubt Barbados describes itself as "British".

Australia is a Commonwealth nation, King Charles is the King of Australia, and I was born and raised here, but I do not call myself "British".

So what?

British culture is deeply imbedded in both Barbados and Australia. The official language is English, King Charles is the official Head of State, etc.

And even if Barbados wasn't part of the Commonwealth, Furlani was born and raised in the United Kingdom. Her cultural heritage is British.

Tell that to Fulani, who said:

No lady, I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

She said that after Hussey continued to badger her after she had already said "I am born here and am British".

Hussey refused to accept "I am British" as an answer, and apparently you do too.

British is Fulani's nationality.

It's also her cultural heritage. She was born and raised in British culture and appears to have fully participated in it her entire life.

Are both your parents immigrants to the country you were born in?

No, but that was true for my father and he's definitely American.

I do not doubt he is an American citizen. But is that how he would describe his cultural and ethnic heritage?

Had his parents been born and raised in a U.S. territory and then moved to the U.S. before he was born, there would be even less reason to doubt his American cultural heritage.

She is a British citizen as I am an Australian citizen.

My ethnic heritage? Not "Australian" in any conceivable sense.

My cultural heritage is the admixture of the prevailing Anglo-Australian majority of the country I was raised in, and the Slavic, eastern European culture of my parents.

I don't know your personal circumstances, Arctish, but it sounds like you were not marked as different from the majority.

EDIT: Also, it beggars belief that you think Fulani and Hussey have the same cultural heritage. They clearly do not. Hussey is part of the indigenous white Anglo-Celtic, aristocratic classes of Britain. A class so privileged, she worked for free for sixty years, because what else is a woman of the moneyed classes going to do? Fulani is the daughter of African-ethnicity immgrants from Barbados to Britain.

They don't have the same life experiences due to racism and classism in their culture, but it's the same culture.

As I said: tell that to Fulani, who provided a different answer to yours.

Fulani said that after she had already answered "I am born here and am British" and was badgered by Hussey into giving a different answer. I've seen that same tactic used here on this discussion board and its predecessors. It's just a way to reject someone's statements out of hand and IMO it's pretty obnoxious.

Hussey appears to believe Fulani isn't really British and cannot possibly have a British cultural heritage despite her being born and raised in the UK by citizens of the British Commonwealth, and the same is true of you. You and she are both wrong.

Hussey believed (in my opinion)--correctly--that Fulani was not of recent British origin. Her heritage, in her own words, again for your edification:

No lady, I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

Fulani described her own heritage and descent differently to 'British'. Since you don't know what Hussey believes is 'really' British, it seems to me you don't know what she thinks or thought about Fulani. If you think Fulani was lying to get Hussey off her back, that too is an opinion and not one I share. I have no reason to believe Fulani was lying

You seem to have changed opinions about Fulani. In your OP, you imply that Fulani's recall of the conversation was too accurate to be genuine--in other words that she was lying.

 

[Metaphor]

You seem to have changed opinions about Fulani. In your OP, you imply that Fulani's recall of the conversation was too accurate to be genuine--in other words that she was lying.

I have treated Fulani's reproduced conversation as genuine for discussion purposes, as I have already stated. Arctish's conjecture, that Fulani would have or should described her own cultural and ethnic heritage as British, is inconsistent with Fulani's own testimony. So, either Arctish is claiming Fulani is mistaken about her own cultural and ethnic heritage, or Fulani is lying about it.

 

[Arctish]

Well, Lady Hussey reportedly asked Fulani where she was ‘really’ from. Clear implication that Fulani isn’t ‘really’ British.

Hussey wanted to know Fulani's ethnic and cultural heritage, which was not British but something else.

Furlani's ethnic heritage is unknown and the reason for that is exactly as she said. Records of which ethnicity/tribes her ancestors came from weren't retained.

Furlani's cultural heritage is British. Her family moved from one British Commonwealth nation (Barbados) to another British Commonwealth nation (England) in the 1950s, where she was born and raised.

I doubt Barbados describes itself as "British".

Australia is a Commonwealth nation, King Charles is the King of Australia, and I was born and raised here, but I do not call myself "British".

So what?

British culture is deeply imbedded in both Barbados and Australia. The official language is English, King Charles is the official Head of State, etc.

And even if Barbados wasn't part of the Commonwealth, Furlani was born and raised in the United Kingdom. Her cultural heritage is British.

Tell that to Fulani, who said:

No lady, I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

She said that after Hussey continued to badger her after she had already said "I am born here and am British".

Hussey refused to accept "I am British" as an answer, and apparently you do too.

British is Fulani's nationality.

It's also her cultural heritage. She was born and raised in British culture and appears to have fully participated in it her entire life.

Are both your parents immigrants to the country you were born in?

No, but that was true for my father and he's definitely American.

I do not doubt he is an American citizen. But is that how he would describe his cultural and ethnic heritage?

Yes.

The only part of American culture my grandfather didn't embrace was eating corn. My grandmother had faint memories of her original home but had been raised as an American in Virginia. The only part of her ethnicity she maintained was some family recipes and being able to speak the language her parents spoke. She passed on the cooking but not the language. They raised their kids to be 100% Americans.

Had his parents been born and raised in a U.S. territory and then moved to the U.S. before he was born, there would be even less reason to doubt his American cultural heritage.

She is a British citizen as I am an Australian citizen.

My ethnic heritage? Not "Australian" in any conceivable sense.

My cultural heritage is the admixture of the prevailing Anglo-Australian majority of the country I was raised in, and the Slavic, eastern European culture of my parents.

I don't know your personal circumstances, Arctish, but it sounds like you were not marked as different from the majority.

EDIT: Also, it beggars belief that you think Fulani and Hussey have the same cultural heritage. They clearly do not. Hussey is part of the indigenous white Anglo-Celtic, aristocratic classes of Britain. A class so privileged, she worked for free for sixty years, because what else is a woman of the moneyed classes going to do? Fulani is the daughter of African-ethnicity immgrants from Barbados to Britain.

They don't have the same life experiences due to racism and classism in their culture, but it's the same culture.

As I said: tell that to Fulani, who provided a different answer to yours.

Fulani said that after she had already answered "I am born here and am British" and was badgered by Hussey into giving a different answer. I've seen that same tactic used here on this discussion board and its predecessors. It's just a way to reject someone's statements out of hand and IMO it's pretty obnoxious.

Hussey appears to believe Fulani isn't really British and cannot possibly have a British cultural heritage despite her being born and raised in the UK by citizens of the British Commonwealth, and the same is true of you. You and she are both wrong.

Hussey believed (in my opinion)--correctly--that Fulani was not of recent British origin.

Then Hussey and you are wrong. Barbados had been in British hands since 1625, with the first permanent English settlements established in 1627. I don't know when or how Fulani's family was brought there, but if you're trying to argue a British colony full of British subjects wasn't really British, you're going to have to show your work.

Her heritage, in her own words, again for your edification:

No lady, I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

Again, for your edification, she said that after her initial statement was rejected out of hand and her interrogator demanded a different answer. Her attempt to clarify her ancestry for the pushy old lady has unfortunately given you the opportunity to call her a liar for claiming to be British, apparently out of the utterly racist belief that a black person can't really be British.

Fulani described her own heritage and descent differently to 'British'. Since you don't know what Hussey believes is 'really' British, it seems to me you don't know what she thinks or thought about Fulani. If you think Fulani was lying to get Hussey off her back, that too is an opinion and not one I share. I have no reason to believe Fulani was lying.

You accused Fulani of "making a mountain out of a molehill" and "deliberately playing dumb" in order to "put Hussey in her place", that she was "rude in public", and have decided that Fulani did not want to state her ethnic and cultural heritage despite Fulani having pointed out she could not know her ethnic ancestry and that Fulani did, indeed, state her cultural heritage.

You simply refuse to believe she considers herself British.

 

[Metaphor]

Yes.

The only part of American culture my grandfather didn't embrace was eating corn. My grandmother had faint memories of her original home but had been raised as an American in Virginia. The only part of her ethnicity she maintained was some family recipes and being able to speak the language her parents spoke. She passed on the cooking but not the language. They raised their kids to be 100% Americans.

That your grandfather completely jettisoned his previous heritage to become "100% American" does not mean that other immigrants do the same.

Had his parents been born and raised in a U.S. territory and then moved to the U.S. before he was born, there would be even less reason to doubt his American cultural heritage.

Well, Fulani does not describe her own heritage as British, so your conjecture that anyone whose parents were raised in Barbados would describe their heritage as British is false.

Again, for your edification, she said that after her initial statement was rejected out of hand and her interrogator demanded a different answer. Her attempt to clarify her ancestry for the pushy old lady has unfortunately given you the opportunity to call her a liar for claiming to be British, apparently out of the utterly racist belief that a black person can't really be British.

I did not call Fulani a liar for claiming to be British; your slanderous remark is baseless. I do not doubt anything about Fulani's British nationality.

You accused Fulani of "making a mountain out of a molehill"
.

Correct

and "deliberately playing dumb" in order to "put Hussey in her place",

Correct

that she was "rude in public",

Much worse than just rude in public, though certainly at least that. Fulani took an awkward conversation and blasted it on social media, and then blasted it on national television and radio. That's as public as it gets.

and have decided that Fulani did not want to state her ethnic and cultural heritage despite Fulani having pointed out she could not know her ethnic ancestry and that Fulani did, indeed, state her cultural heritage.

You simply refuse to believe she considers herself British.

I absolutely believe Fulani considers herself, and in fact is British, notwithstanding your phantasias.

 

[Arctish]

Yes.

The only part of American culture my grandfather didn't embrace was eating corn. My grandmother had faint memories of her original home but had been raised as an American in Virginia. The only part of her ethnicity she maintained was some family recipes and being able to speak the language her parents spoke. She passed on the cooking but not the language. They raised their kids to be 100% Americans.

That your grandfather completely jettisoned his previous heritage to become "100% American" does not mean that other immigrants do the same.

Had his parents been born and raised in a U.S. territory and then moved to the U.S. before he was born, there would be even less reason to doubt his American cultural heritage.

Well, Fulani does not describe her own heritage as British, so your conjecture that anyone whose parents were raised in Barbados would describe their heritage as British is false.

Again, for your edification, she said that after her initial statement was rejected out of hand and her interrogator demanded a different answer. Her attempt to clarify her ancestry for the pushy old lady has unfortunately given you the opportunity to call her a liar for claiming to be British, apparently out of the utterly racist belief that a black person can't really be British.

I did not call Fulani a liar for claiming to be British; your slanderous remark is baseless. I do not doubt anything about Fulani's British nationality.

You accused Fulani of "making a mountain out of a molehill"
.

Correct

and "deliberately playing dumb" in order to "put Hussey in her place",

Correct

that she was "rude in public",

Much worse than just rude in public, though certainly at least that. Fulani took an awkward conversation and blasted it on social media, and then blasted it on national television and radio. That's as public as it gets.

and have decided that Fulani did not want to state her ethnic and cultural heritage despite Fulani having pointed out she could not know her ethnic ancestry and that Fulani did, indeed, state her cultural heritage.

You simply refuse to believe she considers herself British.

I absolutely believe Fulani considers herself, and in fact is British, notwithstanding your phantasias.

Do you believe that her ethnic ancestry is unknown and her cultural heritage is British?

 

[Metaphor]

Yes.

The only part of American culture my grandfather didn't embrace was eating corn. My grandmother had faint memories of her original home but had been raised as an American in Virginia. The only part of her ethnicity she maintained was some family recipes and being able to speak the language her parents spoke. She passed on the cooking but not the language. They raised their kids to be 100% Americans.

That your grandfather completely jettisoned his previous heritage to become "100% American" does not mean that other immigrants do the same.

Had his parents been born and raised in a U.S. territory and then moved to the U.S. before he was born, there would be even less reason to doubt his American cultural heritage.

Well, Fulani does not describe her own heritage as British, so your conjecture that anyone whose parents were raised in Barbados would describe their heritage as British is false.

Again, for your edification, she said that after her initial statement was rejected out of hand and her interrogator demanded a different answer. Her attempt to clarify her ancestry for the pushy old lady has unfortunately given you the opportunity to call her a liar for claiming to be British, apparently out of the utterly racist belief that a black person can't really be British.

I did not call Fulani a liar for claiming to be British; your slanderous remark is baseless. I do not doubt anything about Fulani's British nationality.

You accused Fulani of "making a mountain out of a molehill"
.

Correct

and "deliberately playing dumb" in order to "put Hussey in her place",

Correct

that she was "rude in public",

Much worse than just rude in public, though certainly at least that. Fulani took an awkward conversation and blasted it on social media, and then blasted it on national television and radio. That's as public as it gets.

and have decided that Fulani did not want to state her ethnic and cultural heritage despite Fulani having pointed out she could not know her ethnic ancestry and that Fulani did, indeed, state her cultural heritage.

You simply refuse to believe she considers herself British.

I absolutely believe Fulani considers herself, and in fact is British, notwithstanding your phantasias.

Do you believe that her ethnic ancestry is unknown and her cultural heritage is British?

I believe her ethnic ancestry/descent is exactly as Fulani described: African.

I believe her cultural ancestry/descent is also as Fulani describes: Caribbean. But with the added note that that describes her parents and other ancestors. The culture she was raised in was an admixture of the prevailing British culture she was born and raised in (it could not be other), as well as whatever her parents kept from their own upbringing.

 

[Arctish]

I absolutely believe Fulani considers herself, and in fact is British, notwithstanding your phantasias.

Do you believe that her ethnic ancestry is unknown and her cultural heritage is British?

I believe her ethnic ancestry/descent is exactly as Fulani described: African.

African in large part, most likely. A lot of Caribbean folks have mixed ethnic ancestries. But since she doesn't know the personal histories of her ancestors, she really can't say how much of her ancestry is or is not African.

I believe her cultural ancestry/descent is also as Fulani describes: Caribbean. But with the added note that that describes her parents and other ancestors. The culture she was raised in was an admixture of the prevailing British culture she was born and raised in (it could not be other), as well as whatever her parents kept from their own upbringing.

So you believe her cultural heritage is an admixture of United Kingdom British and the West African influenced British culture of Barbados?

At what point is the British part so great that one can simply say "my cultural heritage is British" and not have some toff question it?

Lady SH: Where are you from?
Me: Sistah Space.
SH: No, where do you come from?
Me: We're based in Hackney.
SH: No, what part of Africa are you from?
Me: I don't know, they didn't leave any records.
SH: Well, you must know where you're from, I spent time in France. Where are you from?
Me: Here, the UK.
SH: No, but what nationality are you?
Me: I am born here and am British. <---- Hussey's line of questioning should have ended right here

 

[Metaphor]

At what point is the British part so great that one can simply say "my cultural heritage is British" and not have some toff question it?

I don't know.

Lady SH: Where are you from?
Me: Sistah Space.
SH: No, where do you come from?
Me: We're based in Hackney.
SH: No, what part of Africa are you from?
Me: I don't know, they didn't leave any records.
SH: Well, you must know where you're from, I spent time in France. Where are you from?
Me: Here, the UK.
SH: No, but what nationality are you?
Me: I am born here and am British. <---- Hussey's line of questioning should have ended right here

I never at any point said Hussey's line of questioning was competent. Indeed, I have said many times Hussey was oblivious to the social signals Fulani sent with her answers, and Hussey's persistence was rude.

 

[Arctish]

At what point is the British part so great that one can simply say "my cultural heritage is British" and not have some toff question it?

I don't know.

Lady SH: Where are you from?
Me: Sistah Space.
SH: No, where do you come from?
Me: We're based in Hackney.
SH: No, what part of Africa are you from?
Me: I don't know, they didn't leave any records.
SH: Well, you must know where you're from, I spent time in France. Where are you from?
Me: Here, the UK.
SH: No, but what nationality are you?
Me: I am born here and am British. <---- Hussey's line of questioning should have ended right here

I never at any point said Hussey's line of questioning was competent. Indeed, I have said many times Hussey was oblivious to the social signals Fulani sent with her answers, and Hussey's persistence was rude.

You said:

Hussey wanted to know Fulani's ethnic and cultural heritage, which was not British but something else.

That is the point I am focusing on. You and Hussey are wrong in thinking that Fulani's cultural heritage isn't British. I don't know why you can't accept that simple truth. Perhaps it's because you think culture is determined by class or something. Or perhaps it's because you don't know what constitutes culture or that the elements of a culture (social organization, government, language, food, art, architecture, shared beliefs and values, etc.) can be held in common among people of different ethnicities. I don't know what it is, but whatever it is, we disagree.

 

[Toni]

As much as it must pain Metaphor to hear this: Fulani, a black person, was not playing dumb or being rude in public. Fulani was being more polite and more clever and more professional and socially appropriate than Hussey, a white person. No one is obligated to ask intrusive questions by a stranger, particularly in a professional setting, or to provide the exact answers in the manner anticipated by the questioner. As far as any of us know, Fulani answered truthfully and honestly. Hussey was obviously looking for a reply that would confirm her suspicion that Fulani is not 'really British,' which disappointingly for her, is inaccurate and untrue. Hussey, an elderly lady of a certain class in Great Britain, having enjoyed many decades of privilege that her status as a wealthy woman and intimate of the royal family provided, was not clever or socially adroit enough to recognize that the old racist ways such as those which prevailed when England very nearly joined Germany in WWII while Lord Halifax was Foreign Secretary had since long passed.

I'm certain that Metaphor has his own reasons for clinging to that position but I do not think they are based on his belief that he has faced the exact same circumstances as Fulani faced with Hussey and doubtless, in other situations.

 

[ZiprHead]

Because we all know what those people are like.
Tom

I'm just going to leave this here for the irony.

 

[Rhea]

My husband’s parents were immigrants. He was born here but learned English in kindergarten.
His “culture” is 100% American. His life learnings are American. There are stories and books and a smattering of remembered language, but his “culture” is not some other location. It’s the one he grew up in.


Part of that is, as pointed out previously, that he was not kept from belonging by appearing different. Metaphor seems to be saying that because Fulani looks different, she cannot become Bristish culture, she must always identify with some other place, because she does not, and will never, “fit in” even in the place where she spent her entire life. He seems to dispute that there is a Black British culture, and that she belongs to it. Or that there is a british culture, and it includes the british people who are Black.

 

[ZiprHead]

But even if she wasn't messing with Hussey, Fulani seized the opportunity to shame her on social media and then on national television for being rude and oblivious. And still, Fulani is regarded as being the blameless party.

Black people shouldn't publicly complain about rude and bigoted people.

 

[Toni]

But even if she wasn't messing with Hussey, Fulani seized the opportunity to shame her on social media and then on national television for being rude and oblivious. And still, Fulani is regarded as being the blameless party.

Black people shouldn't publicly complain about rude and bigoted people.

Because that's reverse discrimination and makes them look rude and bigoted.