Why are we here?

[David123]

So your answer to the question of "why are we here?" is that it is as a result of random noise?

"I don't know, and neither does anyone else"

No mention of 'random noise' there.

You don't know; I don't know; Nobody knows.

It's really that simple.

Why is this so hard for you to accept?

What separates us from the lower animals is that we question EVERYTHING. Our nature is to look for patterns in EVERYTHING. I see no reason not to ask the question and no reason not to expect to find an answer to the question (SOMEDAY). So far, all I'm getting is a bunch of evasive answers. This is the General Religion forum, so it would seem a reasonable place to ask the fundamental question. Note, I have never said that I am religious (I am not) or that I believe in God (maybe I'm agnostic, maybe I'm atheistic). With respect to religions, I think they've all gotten the answer to this fundamental question WRONG as most answers that I've heard basically reduce to "God has a divine plan that is too complex for us to understand". Whether you believe that some "random noise" caused something to be created from nothing (I believe Stephen Hawking has the math on this) or that there was some "divine" influence (ie. God or gods), this fundamental question begs for an answer as not only does it talk about where we came from, but also where we might be going. I see a possible answer to the fundamental question that is both religious and scientific, but I'm not going to reveal it yet (that sounds like I'm making myself out to be special, but its not my intent). I'd rather see if others have a useful answer to the fundamental question that maybe I didn't think of or if others come to the same conclusion I have.

 

[Sheshbazzar]

With an unknown and unknowable number of possibilities (dozens? millions?) picking or positing any particular one is a total crap shoot.
Only you would have much better odds at any Vegas Casino.

 

[Mageth]

The fundamental question you speak of ("why are we here?") is pointless, meaningless, a waste of time. The brute fact is that we are here. There is no ultimate or universal reason as to why we are here. You or I might find our personal reasons or puposes in or for our life, but the universe is cold and impersonal and doesn't give a damn about you, me, or all of humankind.

How we came to be here is a question that science may address. You seem to be conflating or confusing that question with "why", which science doesn't presume to answer. A common mistake.

 

[none]

"I don't know, and neither does anyone else"

No mention of 'random noise' there.

You don't know; I don't know; Nobody knows.

It's really that simple.

Why is this so hard for you to accept?

What separates us from the lower animals is that we question EVERYTHING. Our nature is to look for patterns in EVERYTHING. I see no reason not to ask the question and no reason not to expect to find an answer to the question (SOMEDAY). So far, all I'm getting is a bunch of evasive answers. This is the General Religion forum, so it would seem a reasonable place to ask the fundamental question. Note, I have never said that I am religious (I am not) or that I believe in God (maybe I'm agnostic, maybe I'm atheistic). With respect to religions, I think they've all gotten the answer to this fundamental question WRONG as most answers that I've heard basically reduce to "God has a divine plan that is too complex for us to understand". Whether you believe that some "random noise" caused something to be created from nothing (I believe Stephen Hawking has the math on this) or that there was some "divine" influence (ie. God or gods), this fundamental question begs for an answer as not only does it talk about where we came from, but also where we might be going. I see a possible answer to the fundamental question that is both religious and scientific, but I'm not going to reveal it yet (that sounds like I'm making myself out to be special, but its not my intent). I'd rather see if others have a useful answer to the fundamental question that maybe I didn't think of or if others come to the same conclusion I have.

we are here to not use proper formatting of our posts and run our thoughts in to a giant wall of text that no one wants to read.

 

[Horatio Parker]

I didn't say so... I asked.

But that's not what I said.

Then what do you think you said? "To understand" is vague, to say the least. To understand all the function keys on my universal remote?

I would say understanding your remote may be a sort of fractal. If that helps you, go for it.

Several posts in now and still I'm no closer to understanding what is is you think we're supposed to understand, or why you think that why we are here is to understand whatever it is that you can't or won't say we're supposed to understand.

I don't think you're serious.

I'm serious. You gave "to understand" as the answer to the question "why are we here?" That's vague as hell, and it would be nice if you could clarify. So I'm asking what is it you think we're supposed to understand, and why do you think that the reason why we are here is to understand.

Ok.

To consider the question indicates desire to understand. To answer it, is to understand, or attempt to understand. You are a materialist, apparently. Was that a revelation from a dream, or a command from an authority? Or a conclusion drawn by using your reason to attempt to answer the question? IOW, an understanding.

 

[Mageth]

" I see a possible answer to the fundamental question that is both religious and scientific..."

Since you don't even seem to understand the question, mixing "how" with "why" willy-nilly, I don't hold much hope to find any wisdom or enlightenment in your future ramblings.

 

[Mageth]

I didn't say so... I asked.

But that's not what I said.

Then what do you think you said? "To understand" is vague, to say the least. To understand all the function keys on my universal remote?

I would say understanding your remote may be a sort of fractal. If that helps you, go for it.

Several posts in now and still I'm no closer to understanding what is is you think we're supposed to understand, or why you think that why we are here is to understand whatever it is that you can't or won't say we're supposed to understand.

I don't think you're serious.

I'm serious. You gave "to understand" as the answer to the question "why are we here?" That's vague as hell, and it would be nice if you could clarify. So I'm asking what is it you think we're supposed to understand, and why do you think that the reason why we are here is to understand.

Ok.

To consider the question indicates desire to understand. To answer it, is to understand, or attempt to understand. You are a materialist, apparently. Was that a revelation from a dream, or a command from an authority? Or a conclusion drawn by using your reason to attempt to answer the question? IOW, an understanding.

What?

Can you answer my questions or not?

 

[Kharakov]

You don't know; I don't know; Nobody knows.

It's really that simple.

You don't know that. It's really that simple. Why is it so hard for you to accept?

 

[Kharakov]

Why indeed.

And isn't it wonderful, this mystery? No magical spooks required!

Magic is all smoke and mirrors, just like natural law. Only not all of us fall for it.

 

[Sheshbazzar]

this fundamental question begs for an answer as not only does it talk about where we came from, but also where we might be going.

Came from star dust and in a few short years turn back into dust. pffft The END


Like sparks from a campfire, we rise up, shine briefly, and are extinguished evermore. pffft The END


Like the leaves of a tree, we have our season in the sun, wither and fall, returning to the earth from wence we came. dead evermore. pffft The END


"Vanity of vanities saith Koheleth, (and Sheshbazzar) Vanity of vanities; All is vanity....

Behold that which I have seen: it is good and comely for one to eat and to drink,
and to enjoy the good of all his labour that he taketh under the sun all the days of his life....

Then I commended mirth, because a man hath no better thing under the sun,
than to eat, and to drink, and to be merry: for that shall abide with him of his labour the days of his life."

Good enough for me. Then I lay down in death, stepping aside for all those who shall come after, returning to the dust evermore. pffft The END

 

[Horatio Parker]

I didn't say so... I asked.

But that's not what I said.

Then what do you think you said? "To understand" is vague, to say the least. To understand all the function keys on my universal remote?

I would say understanding your remote may be a sort of fractal. If that helps you, go for it.

Several posts in now and still I'm no closer to understanding what is is you think we're supposed to understand, or why you think that why we are here is to understand whatever it is that you can't or won't say we're supposed to understand.

I don't think you're serious.

I'm serious. You gave "to understand" as the answer to the question "why are we here?" That's vague as hell, and it would be nice if you could clarify. So I'm asking what is it you think we're supposed to understand, and why do you think that the reason why we are here is to understand.

Ok.

To consider the question indicates desire to understand. To answer it, is to understand, or attempt to understand. You are a materialist, apparently. Was that a revelation from a dream, or a command from an authority? Or a conclusion drawn by using your reason to attempt to answer the question? IOW, an understanding.

What?

Can you answer my questions or not?

You are proving your own point about pointlessness. I'll get off here, thanks.

 

[Mageth]

To consider the question indicates desire to understand. To answer it, is to understand, or attempt to understand. You are a materialist, apparently. Was that a revelation from a dream, or a command from an authority? Or a conclusion drawn by using your reason to attempt to answer the question? IOW, an understanding.

Soooo...looking at this again...
Why I am here is to understand why I am here?

When I asked that earlier, you said you didn't say that. Now, well, you seem to be saying just about that. ("To consider the question indicates desire to understand. To answer it, is to understand, or attempt to understand.")

 

[Mageth]

I didn't say so... I asked.

But that's not what I said.

Then what do you think you said? "To understand" is vague, to say the least. To understand all the function keys on my universal remote?

I would say understanding your remote may be a sort of fractal. If that helps you, go for it.

Several posts in now and still I'm no closer to understanding what is is you think we're supposed to understand, or why you think that why we are here is to understand whatever it is that you can't or won't say we're supposed to understand.

I don't think you're serious.

I'm serious. You gave "to understand" as the answer to the question "why are we here?" That's vague as hell, and it would be nice if you could clarify. So I'm asking what is it you think we're supposed to understand, and why do you think that the reason why we are here is to understand.

Ok.

To consider the question indicates desire to understand. To answer it, is to understand, or attempt to understand. You are a materialist, apparently. Was that a revelation from a dream, or a command from an authority? Or a conclusion drawn by using your reason to attempt to answer the question? IOW, an understanding.

What?

Can you answer my questions or not?

You are proving your own point about pointlessness. I'll get off here, thanks.

You gave a vague answer ("to understand") to the question "why are we here?" that you can't back up with anything meaningful when called on it. I don't blame you for bailing.

 

[bilby]

"I don't know, and neither does anyone else"

No mention of 'random noise' there.

You don't know; I don't know; Nobody knows.

It's really that simple.

Why is this so hard for you to accept?

What separates us from the lower animals is that we question EVERYTHING. Our nature is to look for patterns in EVERYTHING.

This is true. But some questions cannot be answered. This is one of the things we can prove to be true - that some things cannot possibly be known.

I see no reason not to ask the question and no reason not to expect to find an answer to the question (SOMEDAY).

Why? Not all questions have answers. This question is one of them.

So far, all I'm getting is a bunch of evasive answers.

Not from me. I have been very explicit and direct. The answer is 'Nobody knows'. That means I don't know, and you don't know, and nor does anybody else.

This is the General Religion forum, so it would seem a reasonable place to ask the fundamental question.

Indeed. And you did ask it. And I answered it. I am not responsible for you not liking the answer; the truth need not be satisfying, just true.

Note, I have never said that I am religious (I am not) or that I believe in God (maybe I'm agnostic, maybe I'm atheistic).

I have made no assumptions about whether you are a theist, and atheist or an agnostic; it is not relevant to the question under consideration.

With respect to religions, I think they've all gotten the answer to this fundamental question WRONG as most answers that I've heard basically reduce to "God has a divine plan that is too complex for us to understand".

I agree. Anyone who has an answer other than 'I don't know' or 'nobody knows' or similar is giving the wrong answer.

Whether you believe that some "random noise" caused something to be created from nothing (I believe Stephen Hawking has the math on this) or that there was some "divine" influence (ie. God or gods), this fundamental question begs for an answer as not only does it talk about where we came from, but also where we might be going.

The question can beg for an answer on its bended knee, it can plead, cajole and whinge, it can whine, whimper and complain. The fact remains that the only correct answer is 'Nobody knows'. Anything else is a guess; and the more detailed the guess, the more likely it is to be wrong. Guessing doesn't get us answers, only evidence can do that. There is no evidence that can help answer this question, and so the answer is, and must remain, 'Nobody knows'.

I see a possible answer to the fundamental question that is both religious and scientific, but I'm not going to reveal it yet (that sounds like I'm making myself out to be special, but its not my intent).

If the answer isn't "I don't know' or 'Nobody knows' or something to that effect, then no matter what you might think of it, and no matter whether or not you are 'special', or trying to be 'special', or are just some guy, it is still wrong.

I'd rather see if others have a useful answer to the fundamental question that maybe I didn't think of or if others come to the same conclusion I have.

Nothing is more useful than the truth. The truth is, nobody knows.

Now we can move on.

 

[Keith&Co.]

What separates us from the lower animals is that we question EVERYTHING. Our nature is to look for patterns in EVERYTHING. I see no reason not to ask the question and no reason not to expect to find an answer to the question (SOMEDAY).

Our nature to look for patterns also leads us to find significance where there isn't any. Gamblers who figure a certain number is 'due.' Or a team 'deserves' a win.

Why do you assume that there must be an answer, just because you're asking a question?

So far, all I'm getting is a bunch of evasive answers.

Because you're asking presuppositionist questions, and we're trying to suss out exactly what you're asking.

This is the General Religion forum, so it would seem a reasonable place to ask the fundamental question.

Sure. Just don't pretend that there MUST be an answer.
I'm also curious how you divided all of the possibilities down to the two options you chose.

Note, I have never said that I am religious (I am not) or that I believe in God (maybe I'm agnostic, maybe I'm atheistic).

Heh. And you called us evasive.
If you're maybe this, maybe that, then i would find it suspicious that you refer to God with a capital G. And refer to He.
Why not god, gods, they, it, her?

 

[DBT]

Originally Posted by David123
What separates us from the lower animals is that we question EVERYTHING. Our nature is to look for patterns in EVERYTHING. I see no reason not to ask the question and no reason not to expect to find an answer to the question (SOMEDAY).

Considering faith, something that many happen to live by, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Christianity, countless political ideology, etc, etc, apparently not everything is being questioned. At least not by those who should be questioning the foundation of their faith.

 

[Philos]

Folks,

I think we are here in order to discuss things.

Alex.

 

[Playball40]

To watch Dr. Who.

 

[KeepTalking]

I think there are only two possible answers to this question - random noise or the whim of the one above all. If you accept the first, then there is no further questions. If you accept the second, then the next question is what was His purpose? It would be hard to believe that all reality was done on a mere whim. Consider that...

I have considered it, and find it lacking in imagination. There are certainly more than two possibilities.

 

[KeepTalking]

In the immortal words of Buckaroo Banzai:

Because, no matter where you go, there you are.

I like it.

It is a quote from The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension, a sci-fi movie from the '80's. It can be a bit corny in places, but is well worth watching if you haven't seen it yet, and if you enjoy that kind of movie.