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Will Biden drop out? Who replaces him?

Do you think Democrats calling for Biden to withdraw are helping us beat Trump?
No. They should have played hardball long ago. Trying to do it now is a disaster. I have said as much multiple times in this thread alone.

Let's not forget that this is not just about defeating Donald Trump. It is also about electing Democrats in downballot races. That is why so many House Democrats are calling for him to resign. They need someone at the top of the ticket who can support them rather than them having to support him. It is hard enough to motivate Democratic voters to cast ballots at all, let alone for someone who is just not the worst candidate.
It IS absolutely necessary to eject Democrats down ballot. But it won’t matter much if Trump is elected. Just as Democrats have not Ben able to make much progress without majorities in the house and senate.
 
Do you think Democrats calling for Biden to withdraw are helping us beat Trump?
No. They should have played hardball long ago. Trying to do it now is a disaster. I have said as much multiple times in this thread alone.

Let's not forget that this is not just about defeating Donald Trump. It is also about electing Democrats in downballot races. That is why so many House Democrats are calling for him to resign. They need someone at the top of the ticket who can support them rather than them having to support him. It is hard enough to motivate Democratic voters to cast ballots at all, let alone for someone who is just not the worst candidate.
It IS absolutely necessary to eject Democrats down ballot. But it won’t matter much if Trump is elected. Just as Democrats have not Ben able to make much progress without majorities in the house and senate.
Watch. Trump don’t need no steenkin’ downballot majority.
He cheats. If Republicans can keep the House, they’ll fund whatever he wants. If not, he’ll take it from the military. Sure it’s illegal, so waddya gonna doaboudit? See ya in court. As far as legislation, he’s got the Supremes in his pocket, and will get anything he can’t pass federally relegated to the States, a la his abortion bans. And NOTHING the Dems send him will be signed no matter how large their majority. Meanwhile, he’ll be rampaging through the government replacing civil servants with drooling sycophants.
He will be just as dangerous with congressional opposition as without, if not more so.
 
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I think the more progressive members of the party are supporting Biden at least in part because he had supported some of their progressive goals
Which ones?
There are several related to health care including lowering the price of Insulin to 35 bucks per month, making premiums more affordable for the Affordable Health Care programs and I'm pretty sure Medicaid was expanded, at least temporarily. While SCOTUS shot down Biden's attempt to forgive most student loans, Biden did accomplish getting a lot of student loans forgiven or lowered for those with lower income.
Of this list, the only thing I see on it that is actually a progressive cause is the forgiveness of student loan debt, which Biden mostly failed to accomplish despite the grandiose claims both his allies and his detractors make about the matter. Preserving the ACA and keeping all significant medical decisions in the hands of fully private insurance companies is a centrist Democrat/neoliberal cause, not a progressive cause. We want a modern healthcare system, available to all citizens, as the entire rest of the developed world enjoys.
I'm not the only one who disagrees with you on that. I started to reply with a long post a couple of hours ago and then thought, what's the point, so I'll leave it at that. In fact, I wouldn't even consider forgiving school loans as necessarily progressive, although it was something that mostly younger progressives with school loans wanted. Most of my friends don't have college degrees and while they will vote blue no matter who because they are smart and realistic, they resent that people who they perceive as more privileged compared to themselves might getting loan forgiveness. I support loan forgiveness for those in need, but I'd prefer to see most paid off by working in a much needed area or by doing some type of public service. That builds character. I will leave it at that since I promised myself not to get into a long discussion about this issue. We just see things very differently.

You do know that it was SCOTUS that prevented Biden from forgiving most student loans, btw, Just sayin'.
 
You do know that it was SCOTUS that prevented Biden from forgiving most student loans, btw, Just sayin'.
Heh. Thinking about Emily’s “Biden could do that too” thing, I think the first place Sleepy Joe should send Seal Team 6, is to visit Thomas, Alito and maybe Gorsuch (since his seat was stolen).
Then on to Mag-a-Lardo!
 
You do know that it was SCOTUS that prevented Biden from forgiving most student loans, btw, Just sayin'.
As they should.
Of course someone living in a bubble like Santa Monica doesn’t want to pay one thin dime to raise the education level of the average ‘Murkin. Why should they? Their interactions with the masses are already well under control. It’s not like they’d be getting anything they need or want out of it; in fact it might hurt them even worse. It could raise the cost of gardeners, maids and dishwashers.
 
Do you think Democrats calling for Biden to withdraw are helping us beat Trump?
No. They should have played hardball long ago. Trying to do it now is a disaster. I have said as much multiple times in this thread alone.

Let's not forget that this is not just about defeating Donald Trump. It is also about electing Democrats in downballot races. That is why so many House Democrats are calling for him to resign. They need someone at the top of the ticket who can support them rather than them having to support him. It is hard enough to motivate Democratic voters to cast ballots at all, let alone for someone who is just not the worst candidate.
It IS absolutely necessary to eject Democrats down ballot. But it won’t matter much if Trump is elected. Just as Democrats have not Ben able to make much progress without majorities in the house and senate.

Obviously, you meant elect Democrats down ballot, not eject. The main disagreement in this thread is between those of us who think that Trump is more likely to get elected with Biden at the top of the ticket rather than a younger candidate and those who think he is less likely if Biden remains in place. I think that Republicans are happy to see Biden stay at the top of the ticket, because they stand a good chance of taking both houses of Congress now, not just the presidency. Whatever happens, Biden is going to be a liability in the presidential campaign, not an asset. He did a lot of damage with that unnecessary early debate, but he did expose a serious weakness early, as well. He demonstrated that he lacked the stamina and mental capacity to best Donald Trump under unscripted questioning from the press. He did reportedly do well in his most recent campaign rally in Michigan, but there is every reason to believe that he will have trouble keeping that level of performance up through November. He no longer has the respect of a considerable portion of the electorate in the US and foreign leaders. It is essential that a president has that respect in order to carry out the functions of his job, so a lot more people judge both him and Trump unfit for their office. The difference is only that Biden is perceived as far less unfit than Trump by Democrats. I'm not sure he is viewed that way by the public at large, but we'll find out in November.
 
Do you think Democrats calling for Biden to withdraw are helping us beat Trump?
No. They should have played hardball long ago. Trying to do it now is a disaster. I have said as much multiple times in this thread alone.

Let's not forget that this is not just about defeating Donald Trump. It is also about electing Democrats in downballot races. That is why so many House Democrats are calling for him to resign. They need someone at the top of the ticket who can support them rather than them having to support him. It is hard enough to motivate Democratic voters to cast ballots at all, let alone for someone who is just not the worst candidate.
It IS absolutely necessary to eject Democrats down ballot. But it won’t matter much if Trump is elected. Just as Democrats have not Ben able to make much progress without majorities in the house and senate.

Obviously, you meant elect Democrats down ballot, not eject. The main disagreement in this thread is between those of us who think that Trump is more likely to get elected with Biden at the top of the ticket rather than a younger candidate and those who think he is less likely if Biden remains in place. I think that Republicans are happy to see Biden stay at the top of the ticket, because they stand a good chance of taking both houses of Congress now, not just the presidency. Whatever happens, Biden is going to be a liability in the presidential campaign, not an asset. He did a lot of damage with that unnecessary early debate, but he did expose a serious weakness early, as well. He demonstrated that he lacked the stamina and mental capacity to best Donald Trump under unscripted questioning from the press. He did reportedly do well in his most recent campaign rally in Michigan, but there is every reason to believe that he will have trouble keeping that level of performance up through November. He no longer has the respect of a considerable portion of the electorate in the US and foreign leaders. It is essential that a president has that respect in order to carry out the functions of his job, so a lot more people judge both him and Trump unfit for their office. The difference is only that Biden is perceived as far less unfit than Trump by Democrats. I'm not sure he is viewed that way by the public at large, but we'll find out in November.
I make a lot of typos that I do not notice until after it is too late to edit.

I disagree re: Biden. I think that Biden demonstrated that he has command of facts and issues even when he is not feeling well, although obviously his voice was not strong on the evening of the debate. Trump's debate performance was loud and demonstrated that he does not have any grasp of relevant issues and will simply lie or stick to his stump favorites. Trump sounded like a less strong candidate to me. I fully admit my prejudice here: I cannot abide Trump and that has been the case since I first heard of him or more accurately, first heard him speak or read any quote of his. His sounds self assured but how much does that count if your grasp of facts is simply flat out wrong and wrong headed?

I don't know that Biden has lost respect internationally. My reading has been the opposite.

Trump, OTOH, has been or was absent for what 10-12 days? That does not speak to stamina and might very well speak to his campaign keeping him quiet and well rested and imo, likely pumped full of drugs to keep him on an even keel.

Personally, I've lost a tremendous amount of respect for a lot of the Democratic leadership for being willing to abandon Biden based on one evening. If there is more reason, then they should have been upfront about it. Frankly, I do not see how any candidate can emerge to out-perform Biden. If we want the Dems to take the presidency and Congress, then they need to start acting like Republicans in their support of their chosen leader.
 
Back to The 13 Keys to the White House | American University, Washington, D.C. - Allan Lichtman's theory that Presidential elections are referenda on the incumbent's party. Let's look at this election so far.
The problem with these analyses is that their sample size is inevitably small. There have only been 46 different presidents, and about 60 presidential elections, going back to the 18th century. Any election before maybe 1948 or so (and probably even later) has a country that is way too different for that data to be useful in drawing any conclusions about 2024.

This current kerfluffle in the Democratic Party threatens to falsify key 2, and if President Biden steps down, that will falsify key 3. Thus giving him a strong risk of defeat. So the Dems ought to settle their differences and accept the necessity of supporting him a few months more.
These keys do not consider the risk of incumbency, because we have never had an 81 year old incumbent. The fact that Biden is so old and so clearly shows his age diminishes the value of that key almost entirely I think.
 
I think the more progressive members of the party are supporting Biden at least in part because he had supported some of their progressive goals
Which ones?
There are several related to health care including lowering the price of Insulin to 35 bucks per month, making premiums more affordable for the Affordable Health Care programs and I'm pretty sure Medicaid was expanded, at least temporarily. While SCOTUS shot down Biden's attempt to forgive most student loans, Biden did accomplish getting a lot of student loans forgiven or lowered for those with lower income.
Of this list, the only thing I see on it that is actually a progressive cause is the forgiveness of student loan debt, which Biden mostly failed to accomplish despite the grandiose claims both his allies and his detractors make about the matter. Preserving the ACA and keeping all significant medical decisions in the hands of fully private insurance companies is a centrist Democrat/neoliberal cause, not a progressive cause. We want a modern healthcare system, available to all citizens, as the entire rest of the developed world enjoys.
I'm not the only one who disagrees with you on that. I started to reply with a long post a couple of hours ago and then thought, what's the point, so I'll leave it at that. In fact, I wouldn't even consider forgiving school loans as necessarily progressive, although it was something that mostly younger progressives with school loans wanted. Most of my friends don't have college degrees and while they will vote blue no matter who because they are smart and realistic, they resent that people who they perceive as more privileged compared to themselves might getting loan forgiveness. I support loan forgiveness for those in need, but I'd prefer to see most paid off by working in a much needed area or by doing some type of public service. That builds character. I will leave it at that since I promised myself not to get into a long discussion about this issue. We just see things very differently.

You do know that it was SCOTUS that prevented Biden from forgiving most student loans, btw, Just sayin'.
I am not certain I understand to what portion of my post you are disagreeing. Do you mean that you object to loan forgiveness? I did not advocate for it. I think college should be free for citizens, "loan forgiveness" (which under Biden has been mostly smoke and mirrors in any case) is chasing the bus, buying off the public with bribes so they do not question the wider system of institutionalized debt that drives the continued bifurcation of American wealth to ever more absurd extremes. But, it is a matter of fact that the Progressive Caucus in the legislature has advocated for loan forgiveness. If you yourself do not believe that loan forgiveness is a progressive cause, I'm confused as to why you offered it as an example of how President Biden "supported their progressive goals".
 
He also appointed many "progressives" to cabinet posts and to courts, including KBJ to SCOTUS.
Is KBJ supposed to be an abbreviation for Supreme Court Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson? If so, I approve of her appointment, but it has done little to change the situation of the Court. That said, kudos for thinking of a concrete example of Biden using his presidential prerogatives to support a progressive candidate, something the liberals in this thread have been struggling to do.
 
I couldn't finish the last post for some reason, so I'll try again. Biden also made some progress related to climate change, although considering the opposition party, he wasn't able to get everything he wanted done. All of these things are progressive, even if they aren't everything that the most progressive members of Congress wanted. I think members like AOC are starting to understand that progress doesn't happen over night. Oh, I forgot, birth control pills are now OTC too. I'm sure there is more, but these are a few that I recall. Biden is one of the more progressive presidents in my lifetime, and I think the smarter progressive members of Congress, including Bernie and AOC realize that, which is why they are supporting him, despite the recent debate fuck up.
He also basically decriminalized marijuana at the federal level.
 
Now reports says he was shat at but they missed.
Hit his ear. There was blood on his face.

"Shat" heh heh heh heh
I’ll believe it when I hear it from the shooter and they recover the slug and the gun.
Most likely there will be a tiny bandaid on the corner of his ear when he appears very soon, miraculously cured and mightier than ever, the sole focus of at least four news cycles (he was losing control there).
I hope I’m wrong, this was real and it drives him so far over the edge that even his MAGAts can’t deal. But I doubt it.
 
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