Will Trump finally be indicted in Georgia?

[Copernicus]

I expect some screaming and shouting from Trump and his fellow crooks, due to the date

Sheesh. So the ex-dog catcher is brought up on charges of kidnapping, killing and eating other people’s dogs, both during and after his tenure as dog catcher. A date is scheduled for trial, but the accused says no, can’t make it; too busy running for dog catcher.

Seriously? Don’t the locals deserve to know if this guy is going to kidnap, kill and eat their dogs, before deciding whether or not to vote for him?

Don't you realize that the dogcatcher is entitled to a presumption of innocence? Sheesh!

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I think moving it to a Federal Court venue provides them something huge... a larger docket to squeeze the case into. I'm presuming Georgia can manage this case quicker than a Federal Court.

I don't know. The other high profile RICO case that the Fulton County/Fanni Willis is prosecuting has been dragging on for over a year without a single juror being seated - the jury selection alone has taken eight months so far!
Young Thug denied bond again in RICO case as jury selection enters 8th month

I think these two cases have a lot more in common than the case against cheating teachers about a decade ago, which was also a RICO case prosecuted by Fanni Willis (then an ADA).
How and why convicted Atlanta teachers cheated on standardized tests
By the way, some black supremacist and other far left activists (like Egyptian Sarah Abdelaziz) do not think these teachers should have been prosecuted. SMH.

She already requested a date March 2024. The rest of your typical stuff isn't relevant.

 

[lpetrich]

Thanx to Copernicus for linking to the text of the indictment

Who is charged with what in it:

THE STATE OF GEORGIA
V.
DONALD JOHN TRUMP -- Counts 1, 5, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19, 27-29, 38-39
RUDOLPH WILLIAM LOUIS GIULIANI -- Counts 1-3, 6-7, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19, 23-24
JOHN CHARLES EASTMAN -- Counts 1-2, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19, 27
MARK RANDALL MEADOWS -- Counts 1, 28
KENNETH JOHN CHESEBRO -- Counts 1, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19
JEFFREY BOSSERT CLARK -- Counts 1, 22
JENNA LYNN ELLIS -- Counts 1-2
RAY STALLINGS SMITH III -- Counts 1-2, 4, 6, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19, 23, 25
ROBERT DAVID CHEELEY -- Counts 1, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19, 23, 26, 41
MICHAEL A. ROMAN -- Counts 1, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19
DAVID JAMES SHAFER -- Counts 1, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, 18, 40
SHAWN MICAH TRESHER STILL -- Counts 1, 8, 10, 12, 14, 16, 18
STEPHEN CLIFFGARD LEE -- Counts 1, 20-21, 30-31
HARRISON WILLIAM PRESCOTT FLOYD -- Counts 1, 30-31
TREVIAN C. KUTTI -- Counts 1, 30-31
SIDNEY KATHERINE POWELL -- Counts 1, 32-37
CATHLEEN ALSTON LATHAM -- Counts 1, 10, 12, 14, 32-37
SCOTT GRAHAM HALL -- Counts 1,32-37
MISTY HAMPTON AKA EMILY MISTY HAYES -- Counts 1, 32-37

 

[lpetrich]

The charges themselves:

1 VIOLATION OF THE GEORGIA RICO (RACKETEER INFLUENCED AND CORRUPT ORGANIZATIONS) ACT -- O.C.G.A § 16-14-4(c)
2 SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-7 & 16-10-1
3 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
4 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
5 SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-7 & 16-10-1
6 SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-7 & 16-10-1
7 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A cop 16-10-20
8 IMPERSONATING A PUBLIC OFFICER -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-23
9 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT IMPERSONATING A PUBLIC OFFICER -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8 & 16-10-23
10 FORGERY IN THE FIRST DEGREE -- O.C.G.A § 16-9-1(b)
11 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FORGERY IN THE FIRST DEGREE -- O.C.G.A & cO 16-4-8 & 16-9-1(b)
12 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
13 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8 & 16-10-20
14 CRIMINAL ATTEMPT TO COMMIT FILING FALSE DOCUMENTS -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-1 & 16-10-20.1(b)(1)
15 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FILING FALSE DOCUMENTS -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8 & 16-10-20.1(b)(1)
16 FORGERY IN THE FIRST DEGREE -- O.C.G.A co? 16-9-1(b)
17 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FORGERY IN THE FIRST DEGREE -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8 & 16-9-1(b)
18 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
19 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8 & 16-10-20
20 CRIMINAL ATTEMPT TO COMMIT INFLUENCING WITNESSES -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-1 & 16-10-93(b)(1)(A)
21 CRIMINAL ATTEMPT TO COMMIT INFLUENCING WITNESSES -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-1 & 16-10-93(b)(1)(A)
22 CRIMINAL ATTEMPT TO COMMIT FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-1 & 16-10-20
23 SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-7 & 16-10-1
24 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
25 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
26 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
27 FILING FALSE DOCUMENTS -- O.C.G.A con 16-10-20.1(b)(1)
28 SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-7 & 16-10-1
29 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
30 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT SOLICITATION OF FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8, 16-4-7 & 16-10-20
31 INFLUENCING WITNESSES -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-93(b)(1)(A)
32 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT ELECTION FRAUD -- O.C.G.A §§ 21-2-603 & 21-2-566
33 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT ELECTION FRAUD -- O.C.G.A §§ 21-2-603 & 21-2-574
34 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT COMPUTER THEFT -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8 & 16-9-93(a)
35 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT COMPUTER TRESPASS -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8 & 16-9-93(b)
36 CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT COMPUTER INVASION OF PRIVACY -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-8 & 16-9-93(c)
37 CONSPIRACY TO DEFRAUD THE STATE -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-21
38 SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- O.C.G.A §§ 16-4-7 & 16-10-1
39 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
40 FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-20
41 PERJURY -- O.C.G.A § 16-10-70(a)

 

[lpetrich]

Quite a lot.

1 of violation of RICO, the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act.

11 counts of false statements and writings, 1 of filing false documents, 2 of forgery in the first degree, 1 of perjury, 1 of impersonating a public officer, 1 of influencing witnesses, 6 of solicitation of violation of oath by a public officer.

4 of various criminal attempts to commit: 1 of false statements and writings, 1 of filing false documents, 2 of influencing witnesses.

13 of various conspiracies: 1 of computer invasion of privacy, 1 of computer theft, 1 of computer privacy, 2 of election fraud, 2 of false statements and writings, 1 of filing false documents, 2 of forgery in the first degree, 1 of impersonating a public officer, 1 of solicitation of false statements and writings, and 1 of defrauding the state.


I'm thinking of looking for correlations between what the various defendants are charged with.

 

[Derec]

She already requested a date March 2024.

The date that the prosecutor requests and the date on which the trial actually begins are very different things.

The rest of your typical stuff isn't relevant.

Comparing one RICO case with a high-profile main defendant with another, ongoing, RICO case with a high-profile defendant in the same jurisdiction is not relevant? How so?

 

[ZiprHead]

 

[hurtinbuckaroo]

View attachment 43996

Did they bury her without a casket? Or was she killed by the Roadrunner?

 

[Elixir]

Quite a lot.

1 of violation of RICO, the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act.

11 counts of false statements and writings, 1 of filing false documents, 2 of forgery in the first degree, 1 of perjury, 1 of impersonating a public officer, 1 of influencing witnesses, 6 of solicitation of violation of oath by a public officer.

4 of various criminal attempts to commit: 1 of false statements and writings, 1 of filing false documents, 2 of influencing witnesses.

13 of various conspiracies: 1 of computer invasion of privacy, 1 of computer theft, 1 of computer privacy, 2 of election fraud, 2 of false statements and writings, 1 of filing false documents, 2 of forgery in the first degree, 1 of impersonating a public officer, 1 of solicitation of false statements and writings, and 1 of defrauding the state.


I'm thinking of looking for correlations between what the various defendants are charged with.

Make your flowchart out of silk thread, and you’ll have a priceless piece of Chantilly lace.

 

[southernhybrid]

Trump is so desperate that he's trying to get Georgia's Republicans to change pardoning rules. Not gonna happen Orange man.

https://www.ajc.com/politics/politi...ange-pardon-rules/5HTMB46BDFBC5KWAHMXOLTPVAM/

Georgia’s most powerful Republican politicians rejected pro-Donald Trump calls to change the state constitution to give the governor direct authority to pardon those convicted of crimes.

Far-right Trump supporters have pressed Kemp and other GOP leaders to pursue an overhaul of pardon rules after the former president was charged this week with orchestrating a far-ranging “criminal enterprise” to overturn his defeat in Georgia’s 2020 election.

Such a move would involve a constitutional amendment, which requires a two-thirds vote in the General Assembly and support from a majority of voters in a referendum. It can’t pass without significant Democratic support, rendering it a political impossibility.

The law dates to 1943, when Georgia voters adopted a constitutional amendment after former Gov. E.D. Rivers was indicted on a slate of corruption charges that included accusations that he sold pardons.

It created a state Board of Pardons and Paroles whose five-member panel is appointed by the governor. The law limits who can seek a reprieve, permitting only those who have completed their sentence and “lived a law-abiding life” for at least five years to apply for a pardon.

Even those who are granted pardons by the Georgia board aren’t exonerated of wrongdoing.

 

[lpetrich]

I've extracted the numbers and put them into Mathematica-friendly format. It should be easy to convert to Matlab or Python or whatever other format one might want.

{{"DONALD JOHN TRUMP", {{1}, {5}, {9}, {11}, {13}, {15}, {17}, {19}, {27, 29}, 
   {38, 39}}}, {"RUDOLPH WILLIAM LOUIS GIULIANI", {{1, 3}, {6, 7}, {9}, {11}, {13}, 
   {15}, {17}, {19}, {23, 24}}}, {"JOHN CHARLES EASTMAN", 
  {{1, 2}, {9}, {11}, {13}, {15}, {17}, {19}, {27}}}, 
 {"MARK RANDALL MEADOWS", {{1}, {28}}}, {"KENNETH JOHN CHESEBRO", 
  {{1}, {9}, {11}, {13}, {15}, {17}, {19}}}, {"JEFFREY BOSSERT CLARK", {{1}, {22}}}, 
 {"JENNA LYNN ELLIS", {{1, 2}}}, {"RAY STALLINGS SMITH III", 
  {{1, 2}, {4}, {6}, {9}, {11}, {13}, {15}, {17}, {19}, {23}, {25}}}, 
 {"ROBERT DAVID CHEELEY", {{1}, {9}, {11}, {13}, {15}, {17}, {19}, {23}, {26}, {41}}}, 
 {"MICHAEL A. ROMAN", {{1}, {9}, {11}, {13}, {15}, {17}, {19}}}, 
 {"DAVID JAMES SHAFER", {{1}, {8}, {10}, {12}, {14}, {16}, {18}, {40}}}, 
 {"SHAWN MICAH TRESHER STILL", {{1}, {8}, {10}, {12}, {14}, {16}, {18}}}, 
 {"STEPHEN CLIFFGARD LEE", {{1}, {20, 21}, {30, 31}}}, 
 {"HARRISON WILLIAM PRESCOTT FLOYD", {{1}, {30, 31}}}, 
 {"TREVIAN C. KUTTI", {{1}, {30, 31}}}, {"SIDNEY KATHERINE POWELL", {{1}, {32, 37}}}, 
 {"CATHLEEN ALSTON LATHAM", {{1}, {10}, {12}, {14}, {32, 37}}}, 
 {"SCOTT GRAHAM HALL", {{1}, {32, 37}}}, {"MISTY HAMPTON AKA EMILY MISTY HAYES", 
  {{1}, {32, 37}}}}

How many charges against each defendant:

13: DONALD JOHN TRUMP -- 13: RUDOLPH WILLIAM LOUIS GIULIANI -- 12: RAY STALLINGS SMITH III -- 10: CATHLEEN ALSTON LATHAM -- 10: ROBERT DAVID CHEELEY -- 9: JOHN CHARLES EASTMAN -- 8: DAVID JAMES SHAFER -- 7: KENNETH JOHN CHESEBRO -- 7: MICHAEL A. ROMAN -- 7: MISTY HAMPTON AKA EMILY MISTY HAYES -- 7: SCOTT GRAHAM HALL -- 7: SHAWN MICAH TRESHER STILL -- 7: SIDNEY KATHERINE POWELL -- 5: STEPHEN CLIFFGARD LEE -- 3: HARRISON WILLIAM PRESCOTT FLOYD -- 3: TREVIAN C. KUTTI -- 2: JEFFREY BOSSERT CLARK -- 2: JENNA LYNN ELLIS -- 2: MARK RANDALL MEADOWS

Donald Trump might try to claim ignorance and blame his underlings, but that will be hard for him to do here.

How many defendants were charged with each charge:

19: VIOLATION OF THE GEORGIA RICO (RACKETEER INFLUENCED AND CORRUPT ORGANIZATIONS) ACT -- 7: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 7: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 7: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FILING FALSE DOCUMENTS -- 7: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FORGERY IN THE FIRST DEGREE -- 7: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT FORGERY IN THE FIRST DEGREE -- 7: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT IMPERSONATING A PUBLIC OFFICER -- 4: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT COMPUTER INVASION OF PRIVACY -- 4: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT COMPUTER THEFT -- 4: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT COMPUTER TRESPASS -- 4: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT ELECTION FRAUD -- 4: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT ELECTION FRAUD -- 4: CONSPIRACY TO DEFRAUD THE STATE -- 4: SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- 3: CONSPIRACY TO COMMIT SOLICITATION OF FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 3: CRIMINAL ATTEMPT TO COMMIT FILING FALSE DOCUMENTS -- 3: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 3: FORGERY IN THE FIRST DEGREE -- 3: INFLUENCING WITNESSES -- 3: SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- 2: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 2: FILING FALSE DOCUMENTS -- 2: FORGERY IN THE FIRST DEGREE -- 2: IMPERSONATING A PUBLIC OFFICER -- 2: SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- 2: SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- 1: CRIMINAL ATTEMPT TO COMMIT FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: CRIMINAL ATTEMPT TO COMMIT INFLUENCING WITNESSES -- 1: CRIMINAL ATTEMPT TO COMMIT INFLUENCING WITNESSES -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: FALSE STATEMENTS AND WRITINGS -- 1: PERJURY -- 1: SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER -- 1: SOLICITATION OF VIOLATION OF OATH BY PUBLIC OFFICER

The Georgia version of the  Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act is the big winner, with the conspiracy charges next in line. Most of the specific actions had only a small number of the defendants charged with each one of them, so the RICO and conspiracy charges are about them working together on their election-fraud scheme.

 

[ZiprHead]

It's guessed that Trump will turn himself into the Fulton County courts during the Republican debate to draw attention away from it.

 

[lpetrich]

Will any of the Georgia defendants try to cop a plea? That is, do plea bargaining, pleading guilty to some of what they were charged with to avoid going through a trial. Will some of their plea bargaining include willingness to testify against the others?

If Donald Trump himself does plea bargaining, what might the deal include? Withdrawal from the Presidential race and being forbidden from ever holding any elected position? Any appointed or administrative position also? House arrest at Mar-a-Lago?

 

[Derec]

Did they bury her without a casket? Or was she killed by the Roadrunner?

Looks like it could be a green burial. A strange thing for an Antifa nutter to make fun of.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Rachel Maddow tonight (8/21/23) - Georgia Republican legislators gave themselves the power in May to remove prosecutors. Fani Willis may be looking at being removed when this power is invoked. Fat Bastard might actually ride this one out.

 

[Ford]

Rachel Maddow tonight (8/21/23) - Georgia Republican legislators gave themselves the power in May to remove prosecutors. Fani Willis may be looking at being removed when this power is invoked. Fat Bastard might actually ride this one out.

I would be surprised if they did that, and it is worth noting that removing the judge who just slapped Trump with a "shut the fuck up, Donnie" order might be a little bit more difficult to summarily remove. Georgia Republicans have a bit of a tightrope to walk. It would be a 180 for folks like Kemp and Raffensberger to say "oops, sorry...no harm no foul. We're team MAGA" at this point. The true believers wouldn't believe them, Trump would savage them on his little social media site, and folks like Marjorie Trailer Queen would be unforgiving as well. They need to hold onto the state for the GOP while at the same time rejecting Mr. "I just need to find 11,780 votes."

 

[Rhea]

View attachment 43996

I feel like this violates the “Don’t be a Dick” belief, tho.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Rachel Maddow tonight (8/21/23) - Georgia Republican legislators gave themselves the power in May to remove prosecutors. Fani Willis may be looking at being removed when this power is invoked. Fat Bastard might actually ride this one out.

I would be surprised if they did that, and it is worth noting that removing the judge who just slapped Trump with a "shut the fuck up, Donnie" order might be a little bit more difficult to summarily remove. Georgia Republicans have a bit of a tightrope to walk. It would be a 180 for folks like Kemp and Raffensberger to say "oops, sorry...no harm no foul. We're team MAGA" at this point. The true believers wouldn't believe them, Trump would savage them on his little social media site, and folks like Marjorie Trailer Queen would be unforgiving as well. They need to hold onto the state for the GOP while at the same time rejecting Mr. "I just need to find 11,780 votes."

I wish I could believe that. But Trumpworld is so shameless that most of his political allies have done 180s on him. Lindsey Graham back in early '16 was saying, "You want to make America great again? Tell Donald Trump to go to hell!" He was calling Trump a loony who didn't represent the standards of the party; that Trump would destroy the party if they chose him as their candidate. Tucker Carlson called Trump a demonic force and a destroyer in his no-longer-private emails -- but he now gets special access to Trump, the man he "hate(s) passionately."
Georgia repubs could make a case for firing Willis -- effortlessly. They'd figure it will all go away and be forgotten in the next few news cycles, and more importantly, the base will be happy. (Even would-be lynching victim Mike Pence has a mealy-mouthed line about Trump not following the Constitution, but that somehow he shouldn't be prosecuted, because that's not the American way.) I'd be willing to bet that Fani's out sometime in the fall, and that a new prosecutor announces that the original indictment is faulty and the case must be dismissed. The fix is in.

 

[ZiprHead]

 

[Elixir]

Rachel Maddow tonight (8/21/23) - Georgia Republican legislators gave themselves the power in May to remove prosecutors. Fani Willis may be looking at being removed when this power is invoked. Fat Bastard might actually ride this one out.

I would be surprised if they did that, and it is worth noting that removing the judge who just slapped Trump with a "shut the fuck up, Donnie" order might be a little bit more difficult to summarily remove. Georgia Republicans have a bit of a tightrope to walk. It would be a 180 for folks like Kemp and Raffensberger to say "oops, sorry...no harm no foul. We're team MAGA" at this point. The true believers wouldn't believe them, Trump would savage them on his little social media site, and folks like Marjorie Trailer Queen would be unforgiving as well. They need to hold onto the state for the GOP while at the same time rejecting Mr. "I just need to find 11,780 votes."

I wish I could believe that. But Trumpworld is so shameless that most of his political allies have done 180s on him. Lindsey Graham back in early '16 was saying, "You want to make America great again? Tell Donald Trump to go to hell!" He was calling Trump a loony who didn't represent the standards of the party; that Trump would destroy the party if they chose him as their candidate. Tucker Carlson called Trump a demonic force and a destroyer in his no-longer-private emails -- but he now gets special access to Trump, the man he "hate(s) passionately."
Georgia repubs could make a case for firing Willis -- effortlessly. They'd figure it will all go away and be forgotten in the next few news cycles, and more importantly, the base will be happy. (Even would-be lynching victim Mike Pence has a mealy-mouthed line about Trump not following the Constitution, but that somehow he shouldn't be prosecuted, because that's not the American way.) I'd be willing to bet that Fani's out sometime in the fall, and that a new prosecutor announces that the original indictment is faulty and the case must be dismissed. The fix is in.

They'll let it go once they've wrung all the performative value out of it that they can.