You yanks have a poor choice come November.

[fast]

[...] total batshit crazy.

Gosh, it's like you think he has a low probability of making America greater than it already is.

 

[whichphilosophy]

There you have it, in a nut shell. Clinton is a vote for the general political establishment that will put very good people on SCOTUS. Trump is a seriously sick and was infected by the alt-right virus that is his base.

- - - Updated - - -

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

I have been following US politics with varying degrees of nausea since Reagan. Even since Bill appeared on the scene (such promise but his lust brought him down) Hillary has given me the impression that she will do anything to push the family forward and get themselves in the limelight. Its all about them.

Your comment "Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody." is part of the problem. You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

Except Clinton is qualified for the job in several ways where as Trump is disqualifiable in almost all ways but the birth and age requirements.

This means they both seem to know nothing but give orders. Clinton is't that pleasant at times to her security staff even if they are one off incidents. I'm sure Trump is also abrupt.
I'm not sure how she is qualified for the job any more than anyone else. The US invasions of Arab countries backfired and the countries taken over are much worse off than before. Libya is one shining example.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

Amen. I would only add, that as a middle of the road progressive, I think HRC is a damn fine choice. I pretty much agree with her on most all issues, and I think she's experienced, intelligent, honest, and tough. Maybe she's too establishment type. Maybe she's not as inspirational as Sanders. But so what? Sanders was never likely to accomplish a tenth of what he wanted to do. Clinton has proven herself a basic competent leader who can manage the affairs of state. I for one have no problem voting FOR her, and not merely against Trump.

SLD

Experienced at doing things wrongly means bad habits. Intelligent no doubt; honest. I doubt this too much and tough is not much use when doing things incorrectly.
What a poor choice.

 

[Tigers!]

Two weevils crept from the crumbs. 'You see those weevils, Stephen?' said Jack solemnly.

'I do.'

'Which would you choose?'

'There is not a scrap of difference. Arcades ambo. They are the same species of curculio, and there is nothing to choose between them.'

'But suppose you had to choose?'

'Then I should choose the right-hand weevil; it has a perceptible advantage in both length and breadth.'

'There I have you, ' cried Jack. 'You are bit -- you are completely dished. Don't you know that in the Navy you must always choose the lesser of two weevils? Oh ha, ha, ha, ha!'

From Master and Commander.

I have always liked that line "Lesser of two weevils".

- - - Updated - - -

Whoever is voted in will have grave effects for the rest of the world. More's the pity.

I will regard that comment as an expression of genuine concern when you Aussies volunteer to take back Ken Ham, and pressure the Kiwis to do the same with Ray Comfort.

Ken Ham can come back any time he likes.

 

[iolo]

Well, fair play to America, it looks as if Mr Sanders would not only have been a better but a more successful Candidate. Like the Parliamentary Labour Party here, the Democratic officials had their careers to look after.

The UK labour party can sack or suspend members for being socialists or speaking the truth; Ken Livingstone re Zionists meeting with Nazis, George Galloway for telling the truth about Iraq.

We are trying, under hysterical attack from Murdoch and his mates, to restore Party democracy, now his puppet Bliar has pissed off to peddle the remains of his arse to the rich.

 

[whichphilosophy]

The UK labour party can sack or suspend members for being socialists or speaking the truth; Ken Livingstone re Zionists meeting with Nazis, George Galloway for telling the truth about Iraq.

We are trying, under hysterical attack from Murdoch and his mates, to restore Party democracy, now his puppet Bliar has pissed off to peddle the remains of his arse to the rich.

This is very true. He's still got a few rides left and I'm sure Murdoch can't wait. For his war crimes Blair will probably be sent to the House of Lords as I mentioned before. As for the U.S. it will be more borrowing.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

There you have it, in a nut shell. Clinton is a vote for the general political establishment that will put very good people on SCOTUS. Trump is a seriously sick and was infected by the alt-right virus that is his base.

- - - Updated - - -

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

I have been following US politics with varying degrees of nausea since Reagan. Even since Bill appeared on the scene (such promise but his lust brought him down) Hillary has given me the impression that she will do anything to push the family forward and get themselves in the limelight. Its all about them.

Your comment "Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody." is part of the problem. You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

Except Clinton is qualified for the job in several ways where as Trump is disqualifiable in almost all ways but the birth and age requirements.

This means they both seem to know nothing but give orders.

How you get from A to B there is completely unknown.

Clinton is't that pleasant at times to her security staff even if they are one off incidents. I'm sure Trump is also abrupt.
I'm not sure how she is qualified for the job any more than anyone else.

We know what you "think". What matters is what it actually true. Clinton has conflicts of interest, but has the experience to be President. Trump has conflicts of interest, can't stand any criticism (good luck with foreign leaders), he is ignorant of military strategy (yet says he knows more than the Generals... believe me), and he has terrible judgment.

 

[whichphilosophy]

There you have it, in a nut shell. Clinton is a vote for the general political establishment that will put very good people on SCOTUS. Trump is a seriously sick and was infected by the alt-right virus that is his base.

- - - Updated - - -

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

I have been following US politics with varying degrees of nausea since Reagan. Even since Bill appeared on the scene (such promise but his lust brought him down) Hillary has given me the impression that she will do anything to push the family forward and get themselves in the limelight. Its all about them.

Your comment "Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody." is part of the problem. You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

Except Clinton is qualified for the job in several ways where as Trump is disqualifiable in almost all ways but the birth and age requirements.

This means they both seem to know nothing but give orders.

How you get from A to B there is completely unknown.

Clinton is't that pleasant at times to her security staff even if they are one off incidents. I'm sure Trump is also abrupt.
I'm not sure how she is qualified for the job any more than anyone else.

We know what you "think". What matters is what it actually true. Clinton has conflicts of interest, but has the experience to be President. Trump has conflicts of interest, can't stand any criticism (good luck with foreign leaders), he is ignorant of military strategy (yet says he knows more than the Generals... believe me), and he has terrible judgment.

Going through the motions and causing chaos in places like Libya may be experience but not necessarily desirable experience. Trump of course can't keep his mouth shut. Maybe he would get on well with Duterte of the Philippines

 

[Elixir]

Ken Ham can come back any time he likes.

What would it take to get y'all to come get him?

 

[Deepak]

Ken Ham can come back any time he likes.

What would it take to get y'all to come get him?

A setup like this should work

 

[SLD]

There you have it, in a nut shell. Clinton is a vote for the general political establishment that will put very good people on SCOTUS. Trump is a seriously sick and was infected by the alt-right virus that is his base.

- - - Updated - - -

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

I have been following US politics with varying degrees of nausea since Reagan. Even since Bill appeared on the scene (such promise but his lust brought him down) Hillary has given me the impression that she will do anything to push the family forward and get themselves in the limelight. Its all about them.

Your comment "Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody." is part of the problem. You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

Except Clinton is qualified for the job in several ways where as Trump is disqualifiable in almost all ways but the birth and age requirements.

This means they both seem to know nothing but give orders. Clinton is't that pleasant at times to her security staff even if they are one off incidents. I'm sure Trump is also abrupt.
I'm not sure how she is qualified for the job any more than anyone else. The US invasions of Arab countries backfired and the countries taken over are much worse off than before. Libya is one shining example.

WTF is this meme about blaming Clinton for Libya? This is such bullshit. The Libyan people revolted against Qaddafi. It was a popular uprising fueled by the examples of both their neighbors, Egypt and Tunisia. The US, and Europe, i.e. NATO as a whole, decided on creating a no fly zone in the area to prevent him from bombing his own people. We sure as hell didn't invade Libya. What else would you have Clinton do? Stand back and say let Qaddafi bomb his people from the air? Do you really think if that had happened, her detractors today wouldn't be crucifying her? Do you really think that it would have turned out better for the Libyan people? Given what's happening in Aleppo, I'd say not. Libya is not a shining example of mideast stability granted, but it is not the utter hell hole that Syria is. Clinton was an early supporter of a no fly zone in Syria, and maybe if it had been implemented back then, we'd have a different outcome there too. It might still be unstable, but I suspect without Assad it would be far better off. Of course no matter what happened, someone would always point to something wrong and blame Clinton.

Furthermore, she's not responsible for the Iraq war. George W. Bush is. He is the one who pushed for the authorization for war, actually arguing that he didn't need it, and went hell bent into Iraq. Clinton voted for the resolution as did many other Senators, both Democratic and Republican. It was wrong, but her vote didn't make the difference.

SLD

 

[ZiprHead]

Yes, and we've brought it on ourselves.

What is a lepo?

 

[barbos]

There you have it, in a nut shell. Clinton is a vote for the general political establishment that will put very good people on SCOTUS. Trump is a seriously sick and was infected by the alt-right virus that is his base.

- - - Updated - - -

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

I have been following US politics with varying degrees of nausea since Reagan. Even since Bill appeared on the scene (such promise but his lust brought him down) Hillary has given me the impression that she will do anything to push the family forward and get themselves in the limelight. Its all about them.

Your comment "Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody." is part of the problem. You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

Except Clinton is qualified for the job in several ways where as Trump is disqualifiable in almost all ways but the birth and age requirements.

This means they both seem to know nothing but give orders. Clinton is't that pleasant at times to her security staff even if they are one off incidents. I'm sure Trump is also abrupt.
I'm not sure how she is qualified for the job any more than anyone else. The US invasions of Arab countries backfired and the countries taken over are much worse off than before. Libya is one shining example.

WTF is this meme about blaming Clinton for Libya? This is such bullshit. The Libyan people revolted against Qaddafi. It was a popular uprising fueled by the examples of both their neighbors, Egypt and Tunisia. The US, and Europe, i.e. NATO as a whole, decided on creating a no fly zone in the area to prevent him from bombing his own people. We sure as hell didn't invade Libya. What else would you have Clinton do? Stand back and say let Qaddafi bomb his people from the air? Do you really think if that had happened, her detractors today wouldn't be crucifying her? Do you really think that it would have turned out better for the Libyan people? Given what's happening in Aleppo, I'd say not. Libya is not a shining example of mideast stability granted, but it is not the utter hell hole that Syria is. Clinton was an early supporter of a no fly zone in Syria, and maybe if it had been implemented back then, we'd have a different outcome there too. It might still be unstable, but I suspect without Assad it would be far better off. Of course no matter what happened, someone would always point to something wrong and blame Clinton.

Furthermore, she's not responsible for the Iraq war. George W. Bush is. He is the one who pushed for the authorization for war, actually arguing that he didn't need it, and went hell bent into Iraq. Clinton voted for the resolution as did many other Senators, both Democratic and Republican. It was wrong, but her vote didn't make the difference.

SLD

You do realize that US intervened in both cases in Lybia and in Syria? with equally disastrous results.

 

[whichphilosophy]

There you have it, in a nut shell. Clinton is a vote for the general political establishment that will put very good people on SCOTUS. Trump is a seriously sick and was infected by the alt-right virus that is his base.

- - - Updated - - -

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

I have been following US politics with varying degrees of nausea since Reagan. Even since Bill appeared on the scene (such promise but his lust brought him down) Hillary has given me the impression that she will do anything to push the family forward and get themselves in the limelight. Its all about them.

Your comment "Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody." is part of the problem. You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

Except Clinton is qualified for the job in several ways where as Trump is disqualifiable in almost all ways but the birth and age requirements.

This means they both seem to know nothing but give orders. Clinton is't that pleasant at times to her security staff even if they are one off incidents. I'm sure Trump is also abrupt.
I'm not sure how she is qualified for the job any more than anyone else. The US invasions of Arab countries backfired and the countries taken over are much worse off than before. Libya is one shining example.

WTF is this meme about blaming Clinton for Libya? This is such bullshit. The Libyan people revolted against Qaddafi. It was a popular uprising fueled by the examples of both their neighbors, Egypt and Tunisia. The US, and Europe, i.e. NATO as a whole, decided on creating a no fly zone in the area to prevent him from bombing his own people. We sure as hell didn't invade Libya. What else would you have Clinton do? Stand back and say let Qaddafi bomb his people from the air? Do you really think if that had happened, her detractors today wouldn't be crucifying her? Do you really think that it would have turned out better for the Libyan people? Given what's happening in Aleppo, I'd say not. Libya is not a shining example of mideast stability granted, but it is not the utter hell hole that Syria is. Clinton was an early supporter of a no fly zone in Syria, and maybe if it had been implemented back then, we'd have a different outcome there too. It might still be unstable, but I suspect without Assad it would be far better off. Of course no matter what happened, someone would always point to something wrong and blame Clinton.

Furthermore, she's not responsible for the Iraq war. George W. Bush is. He is the one who pushed for the authorization for war, actually arguing that he didn't need it, and went hell bent into Iraq. Clinton voted for the resolution as did many other Senators, both Democratic and Republican. It was wrong, but her vote didn't make the difference.

SLD

Because she is blameworthy of her actions in Libya.
We are told this was the Arab Spring but in fact it was the Arab Winter.

Clinton stated, 'We came, we saw, he died'

What was the popular reason for the rebellion in Libya when in fact US secret involvement surfaced in the Media, which included careless handling of weapons which fell into the hands or Jihadis. Were these the reasons for the revolt in Libya:

Free Education through University
Free Healthcare
Free Electricity
Fresh water in nearly every household where before he took power there was virtually none (Man Made River Project)
Zero percent Bank loans for Libyan Citizens
Government subsidies for anyone who purchased a new car
For each marriage the government gave a grant of US$50,000.00 (but also discouraged polygamy)
The highest standard of Living in Africa
The highest standard of Literacy in Africa
A Secular society
Women had equal rights in education and jobs
He was the first Arab Nation to run its own oil production rather than receive cents on the dollar from the USA. Though unpopular with the West at the time, the Western oil companies did agree to do similar with other Nations.


He actually had an odd form of democracy without political parties and in several cases his own proposals were rejected by the grass roots committees.

It would have been better to let him die off and then maintain good relations with Libya for after all the war was not about freedom but about Oil.
Libya is much worse off after US involvement. There are two factions claiming to rule Libya with ISIS and other Jihadis also controlling sizable areas.
Migrants now continue to flood in from Syria, Iraq and Libya. If the US had really Liberated these areas, then there would have been exiles returning not refugees fleeing.



http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/feb/1/hillary-clinton-libya-war-push-armed-benghazi-rebe/

Reports also came out in the BBC, New York Times and other mainstream media plus alternate publications.

The war started with demonstrations and riots. Police posts were overrun and they were executed. With this and bombings of rebel locations the war soon flared up.
There was no popular uprising in Libya but it was popular in the USA.

The War in Iraq of course was by Bush as supported by both parties. Clinton in supporting it must share the blame with the others.

 

[whichphilosophy]

There you have it, in a nut shell. Clinton is a vote for the general political establishment that will put very good people on SCOTUS. Trump is a seriously sick and was infected by the alt-right virus that is his base.

- - - Updated - - -

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

I have been following US politics with varying degrees of nausea since Reagan. Even since Bill appeared on the scene (such promise but his lust brought him down) Hillary has given me the impression that she will do anything to push the family forward and get themselves in the limelight. Its all about them.

Your comment "Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody." is part of the problem. You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

Except Clinton is qualified for the job in several ways where as Trump is disqualifiable in almost all ways but the birth and age requirements.

This means they both seem to know nothing but give orders. Clinton is't that pleasant at times to her security staff even if they are one off incidents. I'm sure Trump is also abrupt.
I'm not sure how she is qualified for the job any more than anyone else. The US invasions of Arab countries backfired and the countries taken over are much worse off than before. Libya is one shining example.

WTF is this meme about blaming Clinton for Libya? This is such bullshit. The Libyan people revolted against Qaddafi. It was a popular uprising fueled by the examples of both their neighbors, Egypt and Tunisia. The US, and Europe, i.e. NATO as a whole, decided on creating a no fly zone in the area to prevent him from bombing his own people. We sure as hell didn't invade Libya. What else would you have Clinton do? Stand back and say let Qaddafi bomb his people from the air? Do you really think if that had happened, her detractors today wouldn't be crucifying her? Do you really think that it would have turned out better for the Libyan people? Given what's happening in Aleppo, I'd say not. Libya is not a shining example of mideast stability granted, but it is not the utter hell hole that Syria is. Clinton was an early supporter of a no fly zone in Syria, and maybe if it had been implemented back then, we'd have a different outcome there too. It might still be unstable, but I suspect without Assad it would be far better off. Of course no matter what happened, someone would always point to something wrong and blame Clinton.

Furthermore, she's not responsible for the Iraq war. George W. Bush is. He is the one who pushed for the authorization for war, actually arguing that he didn't need it, and went hell bent into Iraq. Clinton voted for the resolution as did many other Senators, both Democratic and Republican. It was wrong, but her vote didn't make the difference.

SLD

You do realize that US intervened in both cases in Lybia and in Syria? with equally disastrous results.

Bush cocked up in Libya and Clinton complimented this with Libya.

 

[KeepTalking]

There you have it, in a nut shell. Clinton is a vote for the general political establishment that will put very good people on SCOTUS. Trump is a seriously sick and was infected by the alt-right virus that is his base.

- - - Updated - - -

Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody.

Trump is incredibly ignorant. His father taught him how to make money in real estate and gave him a couple hundred million.

Trump has been a petty dictator his entire working life. He knows nothing but giving orders.

From your view they may appear similar.

From mine, one is not so good but pretty much business as usual and one is a horrific nightmare.

I have been following US politics with varying degrees of nausea since Reagan. Even since Bill appeared on the scene (such promise but his lust brought him down) Hillary has given me the impression that she will do anything to push the family forward and get themselves in the limelight. Its all about them.

Your comment "Clinton is actually very intelligent and understands how to work within the political system as well as anybody." is part of the problem. You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

Except Clinton is qualified for the job in several ways where as Trump is disqualifiable in almost all ways but the birth and age requirements.

This means they both seem to know nothing but give orders. Clinton is't that pleasant at times to her security staff even if they are one off incidents. I'm sure Trump is also abrupt.
I'm not sure how she is qualified for the job any more than anyone else. The US invasions of Arab countries backfired and the countries taken over are much worse off than before. Libya is one shining example.

WTF is this meme about blaming Clinton for Libya? This is such bullshit. The Libyan people revolted against Qaddafi. It was a popular uprising fueled by the examples of both their neighbors, Egypt and Tunisia. The US, and Europe, i.e. NATO as a whole, decided on creating a no fly zone in the area to prevent him from bombing his own people. We sure as hell didn't invade Libya. What else would you have Clinton do? Stand back and say let Qaddafi bomb his people from the air? Do you really think if that had happened, her detractors today wouldn't be crucifying her? Do you really think that it would have turned out better for the Libyan people? Given what's happening in Aleppo, I'd say not. Libya is not a shining example of mideast stability granted, but it is not the utter hell hole that Syria is. Clinton was an early supporter of a no fly zone in Syria, and maybe if it had been implemented back then, we'd have a different outcome there too. It might still be unstable, but I suspect without Assad it would be far better off. Of course no matter what happened, someone would always point to something wrong and blame Clinton.

Furthermore, she's not responsible for the Iraq war. George W. Bush is. He is the one who pushed for the authorization for war, actually arguing that he didn't need it, and went hell bent into Iraq. Clinton voted for the resolution as did many other Senators, both Democratic and Republican. It was wrong, but her vote didn't make the difference.

SLD

You do realize that US intervened in both cases in Lybia and in Syria? with equally disastrous results.

You do realize that the post to which you reply directly addresses the "zinger" you bring up?

 

[Tigers!]

Ken Ham can come back any time he likes.

What would it take to get y'all to come get him?

He has to come willingly otherwise it doesn't count.

- - - Updated - - -

What would it take to get y'all to come get him?

A setup like this should work

Is that to bring Ham up or down?

 

[Elixir]

What would it take to get y'all to come get him?

He has to come willingly otherwise it doesn't count.

- - - Updated - - -

What would it take to get y'all to come get him?

A setup like this should work

Is that to bring Ham up or down?

Just leave him dangling there, and let his god decide!

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

You need someone who can look beyond themselves and neither she nor Trump can do that.

That is an entirely different issue.

The choice is between business as usual and total batshit crazy.

But business as usual IS total batshit crazy.... It has gotten to a point where there is a valid argument to be made for burning it all down and starting over.

There are primaries for both the Democratic & Republican parties, so they were voted on by the people that bothered to show up for said primaries. Trump got the most votes in the Republican primary; Clinton got the most votes in the Democratic primary.

These were not fair democratic primaries. This was rigged from the start. The only way the people will actually decide anything is through a revolution and putting an actual democracy in change. We need regime change in the US.

 

[KeepTalking]

That is an entirely different issue.

The choice is between business as usual and total batshit crazy.

But business as usual IS total batshit crazy.... It has gotten to a point where there is a valid argument to be made for burning it all down and starting over.

There are primaries for both the Democratic & Republican parties, so they were voted on by the people that bothered to show up for said primaries. Trump got the most votes in the Republican primary; Clinton got the most votes in the Democratic primary.

These were not fair democratic primaries. This was rigged from the start. The only way the people will actually decide anything is through a revolution and putting an actual democracy in change. We need regime change in the US.

Who is this "we"? Fucking Canuck, can't even figure out which side of the border you live on.