Merged Fauci Should Be In Prison - Senator Rand Paul

[Loren Pechtel]

Paul is frustrated because he asked Fauci questions about the origins of the virus during the pandemic and knew he was lying then. Biden must have also secretly known this as well. Or he would not have pardoned Fauci for crimes that were not even charged yet.

No, he knew Fauci didn't say what he wanted to hear. That's not saying he's lying. Paul wants to blame China. The genetics say otherwise.

It is entirely possible this was a lab "leak" in that some test animal they brought in was infected. But there's no biosafety at that level, this would not be wrongdoing. Biosafety applies to materials believed hazardous.

And the genetics say that there are at least two separate zoonotic jumps. Anecdotes from the time suggest to me there were likely more, but this is something that almost certainly can never be proven one way or the other. That makes it something in some animal, not a human virus. And the presentation is something my wife learned about many decades ago--but not something with a risk of spread. And note we have never found the origin of SARS. And we have another incident with 50% mortality but no spread.

Add all this up and the only reasonable conclusion is there's something out there that lives somewhere in nature. It generally does not infect humans but transmission is possible. Some variant emerged that was better at infecting humans--but not enough so that anyone took note. Looks like atypical pneumonia, doesn't raise any alarm bells. Then a variant of that emerged that we know as the Wuhan strain--it's really the second variant, not the original. SARS wasn't Wuhan, SARS wasn't associated with a virology lab.

And there's no reason to think that the presence of a level 4 lab in the city where it started is anything but a coincidence. The thing is the majority of Chinese cities of that size have level 4 labs.

Yes, this could just be lawfare. But when the public trust is at stake they should go forward to learn the truth if it is possible to do so. Let the truth tell us that Paul was wrong and Fauci was right. But Fauci pleading the 5th proves nothing except Fauci is a pussy. And does nothing to reveal the truth letting it look like Paul was originally correct.

The combination of a pardon and pleading the 5th looks extremely troubling for Fauci.

We have no evidence of hidden truth. We have Fauci distilling nuanced material into sound bites--but that's what you would expect. The average person does not want to think about the nuances, they want to know what to do. Anyone with a specialized knowledge base will simplify things when talking to someone who doesn't have that knowledge base. I've even seen it directly--talking to fellow IT people and it being confusing or incomprehensible to others.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Hmmm
We have two possibilities here. One is a top scientist trying to protect the people. The other is a politician trying to score points with the least moral administration that the US has ever had.

Easy peasy
Unless you are trying to further a political agenda .
Tom

Why make a guess about this when both people are still alive and the facts are there to observe. What is wrong with finding out who is telling the truth?

Paul is not trying to find truth. He's trying to find a pretext to use to shoot the messenger.

When the truth is hidden, bad things can happen because people lose the facts they need to stay safe and make good choices. Lies and secrets let harm grow without anyone stopping it. What happens during our next pandemic when another Fauci we can not trust tells us whats good for us?

Then tell your idiots to quit hiding the truth.

And in this case the truth matters to all of us. In this case we are not talking about who is lying about who has a bigger crowd size or Trump's penis size. We are talking about biological mass weapons of death. We are talking about life on earth.

The idea that Covid was a bioweapon is preposterous. China can be stubborn about abandoning paths that have failed--but we see the same thing to a lesser degree even here. China will lie about things, but in a sensible fashion. They don't tell Baghdad Bob type lies. But China is sensible--they would not use an unstable virus for a bioweapon. Period.

Note, also, that the things they keep being accused of lying are being taken improperly. China did not say that it is not airborne, they said there was no evidence that it was airborne. Science works on a basis of known true/unknown/known false. And unknowns default to the null hypothesis. When this sort of thing gets reported on the nuance is generally lost--not proven true is reported as false. This is a failing of the reporting, not the scientists lying. I understood back in January, thus the information was there. And "droplet" vs "airborne" turned out to be a mistake the entire medical community had been making for a very long time--"droplet" was TB--actually, airborne but doesn't stay in the air well and needs many to get through to actually infect. The Wuhan strain had the same many need to get through pattern, thus it looked like TB type spread. Since everyone got it wrong the concept of lying doesn't make sense.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Responsibility for what exactly? I did not vote for Fauci or Paul. I do not know who is lying but I fear that Fauci probably is.

I just want to know the truth. Don't you?

Will you testify under oath about your role in the sinking of the Titanic?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

In your video it mentions the pathogeon Fauci was working on could not have been covid since it was different on a molecular level. That actually sounds like he might be telling the truth be we will never know since the information is shut down now. If Fauci wasn't working on covid what was he working on? A cure for acne? I want to know why our government was engineering bio research in China. Fauci could actually tell us that. More to the point, is our government going against the geneva convention behind our backs?

Because you study things which could become a threat.

Look at how this played out--we had a vaccine in a year. But we didn't, actually--that was more than a decade of work studying SARS. They developed a vaccine against SARS, took it all the way through animal testing but since there was no wild SARS at that point it got put on the shelf. Covid comes along, they take the SARS vaccine off the shelf, reprogram the target slightly. One day of work to make the Covid vaccine, followed by testing to ensure it worked as expected. Every Covid vaccine except the Chinese one has been based on that same underlying research, just using different delivery methods. (And the Chinese one proved to not work nearly as well against variants--which is exactly why that approach had been rejected.)

There has been a lot thrown around in this thread that still makes little sense to me. For example many of you think this is Trump lawfare. But why would Trump be doing anything to hurt Fauci politically when Fauci was a part of his original term? That just makes Trump look stupid and incompetent for retaining Fauci during his 1st term. It does not make sense to me that Trump is behind this but even if he is who cares anyway.

Because it's all about shooting the messenger. The Felon wants to blame China, Fauci is a major voice in saying that's not what happened. And note that shoot the messenger tactics are basically an admission the facts don't agree with you.

Then I hear the argument that Fauci has to take the 5th because he is scared some detail gets him thrown in contempt. Didn't Hillary Clinton show us all how it is done for the lawyers? Just pre-empt every statement with " I think I remember it was like this" and then you are covered for a detail getting you hooked. Personally, I think Fauci is taking the 5th because someone in real power wants to send the public a message. The message "that we don't care if you are a puny senator or not. You will not question anything we want to do or anything we are up to. Because if we want to run a bio weapons lab that is our business and not yours."

It was made very clear that he would be prosecuted if he didn't say what Paul wanted him to say.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Does it hurt your head much to come up with such wild conspiracy theories?

In my lifetime I have seen:

1) Our government cover up the USS Liberty deaths of American soldiers

1) Where's the conspiracy?

2) Fog of war happens. Yes, the USS Liberty identified itself as American. But Israel thought it was an Egyptian ship pretending to be American--thus the claims of being American were a ruse.

2) Our government tell us there were weapons of mass destruction in Iraq when there weren't

1) There were. We destroyed a lot.

2) The long goose chase was due to Saddam's commanders lying to Saddam. We kept coming up dry--but listened to the reports of the commanders successfully slipping it away. In hindsight, said commanders were lying, the material that kept getting away existed only on paper.

I see no conspiracy. The commanders were lying to Saddam but that was each acting out of self preservation, not a coordinated effort. And it wasn't directed at us, anyway.

3) Our government tell us a story about 911 that the hijackers were from Iraq

Huh? Most were Saudi--but they weren't acting on Saudi Arabia's behalf. The government had made the mistake of trying to deal with it's radicals by directing them outward, but this was deflection, not specific targeting nor specific operations. They have since recognized how this backfires. Pakistan is getting a lesson on the same thing from the Taliban--the Taliban was Pakistan directing it's radicals outward, now they're turning around and want to go after Pakistan.

4) Numerous POTUS telling lies only to be exposed later

Politicians lie. Water is wet.

5) Operation Mockingbird

Under that set of historical precedence its a wild conspiracy theory if you trust what the government tells us without further inquiry of the facts.

Note that it's alleged. Some of it certainly is true--governments do try to influence popular opinion. But if you want to see a whole bunch of it, look at your sources.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Its bad enough to have to put up with lying politicians like Trump and congress. But Fauci was supposed to be a part of the government healthcare apparatus that the citizens should have faith in. And by Fauci lying and single handily destroying that faith, practically no one will believe a real pandemic threat in the future.

The problem is that congress is out for a scapegoat. They are out to get Fauci, not expose the truth. If congress wanted to get at the truth, they would have offered Fauci immunity.

Immunity? He's already got a blanket pardon, although nobody can tell me what he was pardoned for.

Pardons are for past acts, not future acts. Thus the attempt to get Fauci to testify--and then prosecute him for perjury if that testimony was not to their liking.

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing. This was a preemptive action based on expected lawfare attacks, not about any actual wrongdoing.

 

[Toni]

Please give an example of Fauci lying.

Taking the 5th in testimony means the truth will put him in jeopardy.

No. They were going to prosecute him for telling the truth. The process is the punishment.

Of course they’d love to force him to pay some enormous fine and preferably, do some time. May they all rot in hell.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing.

"Here's your pardon for doing nothing." What an odd statement.

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

It seems Fauci's defenders are trying to have it both ways. He can take the 5th for what he did, but he didn't do anything.

 

[Shadowy Man]

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing.

"Here's your pardon for doing nothing." What an odd statement.

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

Only for federal crimes. He could still potentially be charged by state AGs based on anything he said in Congress.

So there still exists fear of punishment.

It seems Fauci's defenders are trying to have it both ways. He can take the 5th for what he did, but he didn't do anything.

You can always take the fifth even if you didn’t do anything.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing.

"Here's your pardon for doing nothing." What an odd statement.

It's for whatever wrongs he might have committed in his government actions. It names no wrongs because none have been identified.

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

It seems Fauci's defenders are trying to have it both ways. He can take the 5th for what he did, but he didn't do anything.

That's what Paul would have you believe, doesn't make it so.

This isn't about what happened back then. This is about prosecuting him for perjury now (which would not be covered by the pardon) without regard for the truth. Thus the only defense is not to testify and the only option for doing so is the fifth.

 

[ZiprHead]

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

He is still subject to state charges.

 

[ZiprHead]

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing.

"Here's your pardon for doing nothing." What an odd statement.

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

It seems Fauci's defenders are trying to have it both ways. He can take the 5th for what he did, but he didn't do anything.

The bullshit crap they tried to blamed Fauci for is plenty of proof the pardon was necessary. Trump has brought about the age of lawfare.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing.

"Here's your pardon for doing nothing." What an odd statement.

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

It seems Fauci's defenders are trying to have it both ways. He can take the 5th for what he did, but he didn't do anything.

The bullshit crap they tried to blamed Fauci for is plenty of proof the pardon was necessary. Trump has brought about the age of lawfare.

*Checks the last 30 years of history.* Yes, so Trump did this. Uh-huh.

Now saying "but he could be charged under state law" as some have done brings us back to what could he be charged for if he was pardoned for doing nothing?

 

[ZiprHead]

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing.

"Here's your pardon for doing nothing." What an odd statement.

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

It seems Fauci's defenders are trying to have it both ways. He can take the 5th for what he did, but he didn't do anything.

The bullshit crap they tried to blamed Fauci for is plenty of proof the pardon was necessary. Trump has brought about the age of lawfare.

*Checks the last 30 years of history.* Yes, so Trump did this. Uh-huh.

Now saying "but he could be charged under state law" as some have done brings us back to what could he be charged for if he was pardoned for doing nothing?

You think states can't practice lawfare? Ken Paxton? DeSantis?

Why don't you slap on a pair and tell us what you think Fauci should be prosecuted for?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing.

"Here's your pardon for doing nothing." What an odd statement.

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

It seems Fauci's defenders are trying to have it both ways. He can take the 5th for what he did, but he didn't do anything.

The bullshit crap they tried to blamed Fauci for is plenty of proof the pardon was necessary. Trump has brought about the age of lawfare.

*Checks the last 30 years of history.* Yes, so Trump did this. Uh-huh.

Now saying "but he could be charged under state law" as some have done brings us back to what could he be charged for if he was pardoned for doing nothing?

As long as we examine your question in a bubble free of the overly aggressive to unethical legal actions taken by Trump in 20 months in office against law firms, person who threw a sandwich, colleges, media entities, Fed chairman, person who picked up a piece of delaminated pool liner, the entire US District Court of the Maryland District, etc... your question doesn't look nearly as preposterous as it is.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Didn't Nixon spy on his political opponents? Never mind, everything Trump did is without precedent.

Which brings us back to "he did nothing and he took the 5th to avoid being prosecuted for what he did", this time by the states instead of the fed. Unless you think he might be tried for crimes against humanity which cannot be pardoned.

 

[laughing dog]

Nobody can tell you what he was pardoned for because there is nothing.

"Here's your pardon for doing nothing." What an odd statement.

Even so, now that he has the pardon he should be able to talk about what he did during that time period without fear of punishment for it. There is a legal theory that says if you are immune you can't take the 5th.

It seems Fauci's defenders are trying to have it both ways. He can take the 5th for what he did, but he didn't do anything.

The bullshit crap they tried to blamed Fauci for is plenty of proof the pardon was necessary. Trump has brought about the age of lawfare.

*Checks the last 30 years of history.* Yes, so Trump did this. Uh-huh.

Now saying "but he could be charged under state law" as some have done brings us back to what could he be charged for if he was pardoned for doing nothing?

If he hadn’t been pardoned , he could be charged with any trumped up charge.

 

[ZiprHead]

Didn't Nixon spy on his political opponents? Never mind, everything Trump did is without precedent.

Which brings us back to "he did nothing and he took the 5th to avoid being prosecuted for what he did", this time by the states instead of the fed. Unless you think he might be tried for crimes against humanity which cannot be pardoned.

Please stop with the chicken shit and, again, strap on a pair and tell us what crimes you think Fauci should be charged with.

 

[Patooka]

Didn't Nixon spy on his political opponents? Never mind, everything Trump did is without precedent.

Which brings us back to "he did nothing and he took the 5th to avoid being prosecuted for what he did", this time by the states instead of the fed. Unless you think he might be tried for crimes against humanity which cannot be pardoned.

Please stop with the chicken shit and, again, strap on a pair and tell us what crimes you think Fauci should be charged with.

I truly admire your optimism.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

Didn't Nixon spy on his political opponents? Never mind, everything Trump did is without precedent.

Which brings us back to "he did nothing and he took the 5th to avoid being prosecuted for what he did", this time by the states instead of the fed. Unless you think he might be tried for crimes against humanity which cannot be pardoned.

Please stop with the chicken shit and, again, strap on a pair and tell us what crimes you think Fauci should be charged with.

There's no way to know, any investigation that could have been performed was preempted with a pardon. The Justice Department can do nothing.

In the letter explaining the pardons, Biden defended the choice, saying, “baseless and politically motivated investigations wreak havoc on the lives, safety, and financial security of targeted individuals and their families.” Even when those individuals have done nothing wrong, Biden’s ghostwriters reason, “the mere fact of being investigated or prosecuted can irreparably damage reputations and finances.” It’s revealing that the primary public reason presented for the pardons was to avoid investigations.