Obama has done it now - Nine Shot dead in church

[RavenSky]

Really? Which professionals? Because the professionals teaching the active shooter (law enforcement, Homeland Security) response training say differently. You might want to actually take a look at the links I provided or research "active shooter response". It also includes methods for not getting shot if you are armed and the police arrive. (They state not to expect them to tell the difference between you - the good guy with the gun or the shooter - the bad guy with the gun. They just will be going for the guy with the gun.)

They're saying evacuate, hide, fight--in that order.

Since neither evacuate nor hide is viable in this situation that leaves fight.

Since quite a few people did survive (by hiding and/or playing dead) it looks like you are wrong

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Enough that we know about it.

Perhaps you could cite some examples or statistics to give those of us who have never heard of this outside of the movies or TV some real life context.

This is not the first shooting where it has been mentioned the shooter reloaded during the shooting.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Perhaps you could cite some examples or statistics to give those of us who have never heard of this outside of the movies or TV some real life context.

This is not the first shooting where it has been mentioned the shooter reloaded during the shooting.

How many shootings end with the intended victims bum rushing the shooter? Is it the majority?

 

[Toni]

I can't help but to believe that behind this multi-day "coulda, shoulda" nonsense are three people trying to imply that the victims were cowards. None of these three will come right out and say that, of course; and I am certain they will vehemently deny it. But that is what it looks like to me.

Maybe. I was thinking that the intimation was that the victims were not smart enough to know how to deal with a known 'friend' who turned out to be a crazed racist killer who came into their place of worship to murder them and that somehow they deserved to die.

I figure that they just have forgotten to post the details of the time they avoided certain death and saved the world by disarming crazed gunmen.

JK about the last part.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

How many times? I know about people going to the moon, doesn't make it a regular occurrence or likely to happen. So I will ask again, how often does it occur?

Red herring. The fact is that it does happen and when a shooter is reloading he's vulnerable.

Just because you would like to pretend all victims everywhere are utterly helpless that's not the case.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Perhaps you could cite some examples or statistics to give those of us who have never heard of this outside of the movies or TV some real life context.

This is not the first shooting where it has been mentioned the shooter reloaded during the shooting.

How fucking long does it take to reload the weapon he had? How long?

 

[Ford]

How many times? I know about people going to the moon, doesn't make it a regular occurrence or likely to happen. So I will ask again, how often does it occur?

Red herring. The fact is that it does happen and when a shooter is reloading he's vulnerable.

Just because you would like to pretend all victims everywhere are utterly helpless that's not the case.

Well you're pretending the opposite. That anyone being shot at by a killer need only "man up" and jump the guy when he's reloading. Furthermore, you're making the case that going on the offensive against the shooter is not just possible, but the preferred response as directed by professionals.

Now, since nobody else is providing much more than speculation, I'll go with more personal experience.

I work in radio, so I've had some experience with crazed "fans" and other associated threats. Worked at one station that was shot at. Worked at another where a bomb threat was called in. Had people threaten me, my co-workers, and the station(s) with violence. Had to deal with stalkers. Had crazy people in the lobby - fortunately not armed , but certainly disturbing. Thanks to incidents such as these, the place I work has a protocol. If a threatening or violent person shows up in the lobby, the receptionist hits the alarm and gets under her desk. When the alarm goes off, everyone is expected to rush the crazy person and tackle him.


Actually that's not true. Our company's security consultants told us in no uncertain terms that the safest thing to do is to find the nearest lockable office, get inside, lock the door, get down, and stay down until the all clear is given. The alarm sends a signal to the police, of course.

The reasons for these procedures are twofold. First off, it is a liability to the company if we don't have some system in place to protect employees in the event of a threat. The second is that the professionals we hired to develop the procedures and beef up building security made it clear that confronting an attacker is the absolute last thing you want to do...especially if he is armed and you are not.


So when the alarm goes off, I don't put on my hero hat and wander out towards the lobby looking for an opening. I lock my doors, and get behind my very thick soundproof walls.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Red herring. The fact is that it does happen and when a shooter is reloading he's vulnerable.

Just because you would like to pretend all victims everywhere are utterly helpless that's not the case.

Well you're pretending the opposite. That anyone being shot at by a killer need only "man up" and jump the guy when he's reloading. Furthermore, you're making the case that going on the offensive against the shooter is not just possible, but the preferred response as directed by professionals.

Now, since nobody else is providing much more than speculation, I'll go with more personal experience.

I work in radio, so I've had some experience with crazed "fans" and other associated threats. Worked at one station that was shot at. Worked at another where a bomb threat was called in. Had people threaten me, my co-workers, and the station(s) with violence. Had to deal with stalkers. Had crazy people in the lobby - fortunately not armed , but certainly disturbing. Thanks to incidents such as these, the place I work has a protocol. If a threatening or violent person shows up in the lobby, the receptionist hits the alarm and gets under her desk. When the alarm goes off, everyone is expected to rush the crazy person and tackle him.


Actually that's not true. Our company's security consultants told us in no uncertain terms that the safest thing to do is to find the nearest lockable office, get inside, lock the door, get down, and stay down until the all clear is given. The alarm sends a signal to the police, of course.

The reasons for these procedures are twofold. First off, it is a liability to the company if we don't have some system in place to protect employees in the event of a threat. The second is that the professionals we hired to develop the procedures and beef up building security made it clear that confronting an attacker is the absolute last thing you want to do...especially if he is armed and you are not.


So when the alarm goes off, I don't put on my hero hat and wander out towards the lobby looking for an opening. I lock my doors, and get behind my very thick soundproof walls.

You are forgetting one thing... magic negros! See, they can tell instantly when a gun has fired the last bullet in a clip. They also know how long it takes to reload. And most important, blacks are fucking fast. You've seen Usain Bolt. They are all like that. So in the 3 or 4 seconds it takes to reload a clip, a black man can dart easily from any distance to take down the shooter. Doesn't matter if there are any obstructions in the way, they can do it.

So the only reason why they must not of is simply straightforward, the welfare state. Yup, deal with it Athena! I know you don't want to hear the truth, but those blacks were just waiting for Uncle Sam to come in and rescue them because they are just too fucking lazy. Sad state of affair really. All President Johnson's fault! Honestly, I think LP and Derec are wrong to place blame of the death toll on the blacks in the church. We are the ones that failed them. We didn't meet the call of our White Man's Burden. We thought we were helping them, giving them assistance for food, housing, even heat. But in the end we should have taught them how to fend for themselves. If we had, if instead of a hand up, we gave them a sense of pride, they wouldn't have just waited for the Federal Government to step in and save them. They would have risen up, charged the shooter because they would have known then, that they need to be in charge of their own destiny. Not big government!

So us white folk really need to look inside of ourselves and recognize that ultimately, this is all our fault. Not the shooter. Not the victims. Just our shallow pride telling us we could help better a race of people by just giving them free shit. All is not lost though. We can learn from this lesson and maybe, just maybe, if we cut this safety net, we can help the next target of a massacre be instilled with pride and rise up and defeat the shooter, so that the only person that dies is the man with the gun.

God bless America.

 

[laughing dog]

Perhaps you could cite some examples or statistics to give those of us who have never heard of this outside of the movies or TV some real life context.

This is not the first shooting where it has been mentioned the shooter reloaded during the shooting.

I will rephrase in order to give you a chance to give a relevant response. Perhaps you could cite some examples or statistics to give those of us who have never heard of people rushing and disarming a shooter while he or she reloads outside of the movies or TV in order to give some real life context. Just to be clear, this means an example (or examples) that occurred in real life.

- - - Updated - - -

How many times? I know about people going to the moon, doesn't make it a regular occurrence or likely to happen. So I will ask again, how often does it occur?

Red herring. The fact is that it does happen and when a shooter is reloading he's vulnerable.

Just because you would like to pretend all victims everywhere are utterly helpless that's not the case.

Jesus Tap Dancing Christ - you really are blaming the victims.

 

[laughing dog]

Now I am just waiting to see someone blame the "welfare state" from sapping the initiative from these people so they wouldn't rush the shooter while he reloaded.

 

[fast]

And most important, blacks are fucking fast.

I'm starting to feel a little violated by that comment.

 

[Derec]

Was Sean Connery there? He could take a man down with his thumb. Also, according to his Untouchables philosophy, if they pull a knife, you pull a gun, therefore if they pull out a gun, you pull out a tank.

Of course he died in that movie because they brought a bigger gun - the knife was just subterfuge.

 

[Derec]

So we are changing the subject now?

No, you and RavenSky are. I am merely responding to what Malintent wrote about anti-death penalty activists. You do know that a single thread can contain several distinct conversations, right?

And while Mumia Abi-Jamal apparently has anti-death penalty supporters, this is the first time I've ever heard his name.

That racist cop killer is a cause celebre among the far left. It is pretty inconceivable you never heard his name. He is pretty well known, infamous even.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

How many times? I know about people going to the moon, doesn't make it a regular occurrence or likely to happen. So I will ask again, how often does it occur?

Red herring. The fact is that it does happen and when a shooter is reloading he's vulnerable.

But you have no idea how often people charge the shooter or if this ia the normal occurence, right? If it is not the norm, you have to reason to think it would happened or should have happened in Charleston.

Just because you would like to pretend all victims everywhere are utterly helpless that's not the case.

I'm not the one pretending and you know it. Once again you asserted the wrong thing and rather than just saying "my bad" and moving on, you ONCE AGAIN are trying to dig your way out of hole.

Just post the stats that say people usually charge the shooter and you're golden.

 

[RavenSky]

How come we did not have a days-long derail from Loren or Derec or Credo implying that the writers at Charlie Hebo were cowards for being killed by shooters?

 

[Tom Sawyer]

No, you and RavenSky are. I am merely responding to what Malintent wrote about anti-death penalty activists. You do know that a single thread can contain several distinct conversations, right?

And while Mumia Abi-Jamal apparently has anti-death penalty supporters, this is the first time I've ever heard his name.

That racist cop killer is a cause celebre among the far left. It is pretty inconceivable you never heard his name. He is pretty well known, infamous even.

Maybe on the right. I'm another leftie who's never heard of how much I admire and am inspired by him.

 

[RavenSky]

And while Mumia Abi-Jamal apparently has anti-death penalty supporters, this is the first time I've ever heard his name.

That racist cop killer is a cause celebre among the far left. It is pretty inconceivable you never heard his name. He is pretty well known, infamous even.

I think you would agree that I am "far left" yet I have never heard of this guy either, much less advocated for sentencing leniency.

As for being against the death penalty, that does not in any way correlate to thinking that everyone convicted of a crime can be rehabilitated, nor to having any sort of anti-white race bias in sentencing.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

No, you and RavenSky are. I am merely responding to what Malintent wrote about anti-death penalty activists. You do know that a single thread can contain several distinct conversations, right?

I used a particular pronoun there. I recognized you didn't start the derail.

And while Mumia Abi-Jamal apparently has anti-death penalty supporters, this is the first time I've ever heard his name.

That racist cop killer is a cause celebre among the far left.

I appreciate your candor there. "far left". Not many of us here on the far left here.

It is pretty inconceivable you never heard his name.

Never in my life.

He is pretty well known, infamous even.

Apparently to you and the "far left". The wiki page seems to imply that he is quite guilty. That they never tried to explain away the missing casings in his gun.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

How come we did not have a days-long derail from Loren or Derec or Credo implying that the writers at Charlie Hebo were cowards for being killed by shooters?

Technically there was a discussion about the woman who let them in. She had her daughter with her when they threatened her at the door.

 

[Toni]

I'm definitely far left for an American although I actually consider myself to be sensible and middle ground.

I don't believe in capital punishment. Period. If it is wrong to murder, then it is wrong for the state to murder, no matter the 'justification.'

I've almost never heard of any case that Derec links until he links it here. I think he must subscribe to some site or database that links specifically black and female criminal cases, to prove that white men are under siege and should arm themselves accordingly and do whatever is necessary to maintain control.