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Chris Christie: I would track immigrants like FedEx packages

I wonder if Christie realizes that other countries could and would do the same to american visitors including his voters and him himself.

Brazil requires a thumbprint from Americans who enter there. They put ink on your thumb and require you to press the thumb into a small square of paper. Then they throw the small square of paper away because they have nothing else to do with it. They only do it because we require Brazilian citizens to give their thumbprint when they enter the US.
 
So your comment earlier about being concerned for the well-being of people and human rights (people was non-specified) was all fluff.

Having made thousands of posts "earlier", I have no idea which comment you are alluding to. However, I let context speak for itself. As such the well being of the American people has always been my primary focus, not those of upper volta.

Burkina Faso.

Hasn't been 'Upper Volta' since 1984.
 
I wonder if Christie realizes that other countries could and would do the same to american visitors including his voters and him himself.

Brazil requires a thumbprint from Americans who enter there. They put ink on your thumb and require you to press the thumb into a small square of paper. Then they throw the small square of paper away because they have nothing else to do with it. They only do it because we require Brazilian citizens to give their thumbprint when they enter the US.
Couldn't we just dump green slime on immigrants, like they did on Nickelodeon a while ago? That'd be American!

Of course assuming they made it safer.
 
Having made thousands of posts "earlier", I have no idea which comment you are alluding to. However, I let context speak for itself. As such the well being of the American people has always been my primary focus, not those of upper volta.

Burkina Faso.

Hasn't been 'Upper Volta' since 1984.

You see? If I had cared I would have noted that they changed their name to make themselves feel better. I don't.
 
I've got good news. Most immigrants aren't trying to steal your stuff.


I wouldn't even classify them as "guests." They're employees. We pay them to come here, pay them to stay, and then treat them like criminals when they take us up on our offer of employment. The vast majority don't steal stuff because they're too busy working the millions of jobs they fill.

Who is "them" and who is this "we"?

The collective "we" who make them illegals employees and protect them in sanctuary cities and counties usually aren't the ones who 'then' treat them as criminals. That's a rather unkind thing to say about your own side. What do you tell them, that the coyotes are government licensed travel agents and tour guides?

I suspect they know who is paying, encouraging and shielding them ARE NOT the same folks who wants them them fired, removed from sanctuary cities and counties, and to be treated as criminals. Don't you?
 
I wouldn't even classify them as "guests." They're employees. We pay them to come here, pay them to stay, and then treat them like criminals when they take us up on our offer of employment. The vast majority don't steal stuff because they're too busy working the millions of jobs they fill.

Who is "them" and who is this "we"?

The collective "we" who make them illegals employees and protect them in sanctuary cities and counties usually aren't the ones who 'then' treat them as criminals. That's a rather unkind thing to say about your own side. What do you tell them, that the coyotes are government licensed travel agents and tour guides?

I suspect they know who is paying, encouraging and shielding them ARE NOT the same folks who wants them them fired, removed from sanctuary cities and counties, and to be treated as criminals. Don't you?


Well there ARE people such as yourself who want millions of brown people loaded into concentration camps, but fortunately such folks are few and far between.

"We" refers to the American people generally, who are more than happy to eat the produce the immigrants pick, sleep in the hotels the immigrants clean, live in the houses the immigrants build, and have those immigrants keep their yards nice and pretty.

"Then" when it comes time for an election, Americans are generally opposed to illegal immigration, and a good half of them (usually falling on the right side of the political fence) will wail and gnash their teeth about all the "criminals" that ILLEGALLY entered the country.

"Them" are the immigrants themselves, who come here because "we" (collectively) pay and encourage them to do so. When they get here, "we" (collectively) treat them like second class citizens (because they aren't even citizens) and elect politicians who claim to "get tough on illegal immigration" but then once in office don't do a damned thing about immigration because fine folks from the Chamber of Commerce and the business community make it clear that if the flow of cheap immigrant labor is cut off, so are the campaign contributions.


On that subject, I notice that in all your anti-immigrant (dangerously close to "final solution" type) rhetoric, you don't mention loading the employers into box cars. Businesses large and small - from corporate to individual owners - shell out hundreds of millions of dollars every year in wages to these immigrants that have you so vexed.

You want to punish the folks who overstay a visa or jump the border as harshly as inhumanely possible, then close the borders and force every foreigner who arrives here for business or pleasure to wear a device usually reserved for convicts, but in all your nativist fury I don't detect even a little bit of disdain for the people who make the entire illegal economy possible.
 
Burkina Faso.

Hasn't been 'Upper Volta' since 1984.

You see? If I had cared I would have noted that they changed their name to make themselves feel better. I don't.

If you want to suggest a policy, but admit that you don't care enough about the subject to understand it, then you can expect your proposal to be met with derision.

You admit to knowing nothing, and caring less, about non-Americans; Why should anyone bother to give a fuck what your opinions are on immigration policy?
 
You see? If I had cared I would have noted that they changed their name to make themselves feel better. I don't.

If you want to suggest a policy, but admit that you don't care enough about the subject to understand it, then you can expect your proposal to be met with derision.

You admit to knowing nothing, and caring less, about non-Americans; Why should anyone bother to give a fuck what your opinions are on immigration policy?

You see? If I had cared I would have noted that they changed their name to make themselves feel better. I don't.

If you want to suggest a policy, but admit that you don't care enough about the subject to understand it, then you can expect your proposal to be met with derision.

You admit to knowing nothing, and caring less, about non-Americans; Why should anyone bother to give a fuck what your opinions are on immigration policy?

So intentionally using the name of, and not caring about, "Upper Volta" is actually admitting I know nothing about US immigration policy? (That non-sequitur provided my morning laugh).

"Knowing something" about any immigration policy includes knowing that every national people have a right to control or eliminate immigration to protect its well being. It "gives a fuck' that Australians, Canadians, Hungarians, New Zealanders, Venezuelans, and every other national people has (and uses) that right

But I agree, you shouldn't "g-a-f" about such opinions if you consider it an undebatable 'a priori' assumption that immigration policy must serve the needs of the foreign nationals over that of the rights and needs of any host nation's people. Heck, absent a principled defense of your "feelings", you needn't even offer us another illogical denunciation.
 
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Only when it comes to Murica.

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there is nothing morally objectionable to making foreign nationals wear anklets or submit to chipping.

Except for the whole treating them like property or nothings instead of human beings part, but you don't know what a human being is, and I bet you don't even know what an American is.

They are being treated as human beings with a free will, in other words they are owned by no other than themselves. They have a choice, they can either agree to the tagging requirements for visitation or they can decline. If they decline, they must go elsewhere or go home. If they avoid border controls and tagging, and enter, they forfeit their liberty for having violated a rightful law and are either punished and/or deported.

The are free to come, but on the terms of the host nation.

That'll do wonders for our economy: "America, stay the fuck out and do business elsewhere."

I would hold you and anyone else supporting this criminally responsible for the ensuing recession and general economic decline of the country.

Nonsense.

First, I have been speaking of the morality of tagging (microchipping or bracelet wearing) those who "visit". I have argued that there is nothing wrong with it. But whether or not I would do so, and to whom it would apply, is a different question. Most likely it would only need to be applied to high risk categories (e.g. Mexicans) or exempted for low risk categories ( professionals with employment in their country of origin).

Second, it would have little effect on the economy. Immigration in general has added little to the economy, and illegals have added nothing of substance. It would only result in some symbolic and token protest from whining Euro-progressives - people that have enough to worry about with their out of control immigration troubles.

Third, why don't you hold anyone criminally responsible for the social-welfare costs, crime, wage impact, and environmental impact from 10s of millions of legal and illegal immigration? Why do you support redistribution of well being from the working class to foreign nationals?
 
Who is "them" and who is this "we"?

The collective "we" who make them illegals employees and protect them in sanctuary cities and counties usually aren't the ones who 'then' treat them as criminals. That's a rather unkind thing to say about your own side. What do you tell them, that the coyotes are government licensed travel agents and tour guides?

I suspect they know who is paying, encouraging and shielding them ARE NOT the same folks who wants them them fired, removed from sanctuary cities and counties, and to be treated as criminals. Don't you?


Well there ARE people such as yourself who want millions of brown people loaded into concentration camps, but fortunately such folks are few and far between.

"We" refers to the American people generally, who are more than happy to eat the produce the immigrants pick, sleep in the hotels the immigrants clean, live in the houses the immigrants build, and have those immigrants keep their yards nice and pretty.

"Then" when it comes time for an election, Americans are generally opposed to illegal immigration, and a good half of them (usually falling on the right side of the political fence) will wail and gnash their teeth about all the "criminals" that ILLEGALLY entered the country.

"Them" are the immigrants themselves, who come here because "we" (collectively) pay and encourage them to do so.

Why should anyone accept the notion of there should be a collectivized guilt for the differing opinions and the differing conduct of millions? I am no more responsible for sanctuary cities than you are responsible for Sheriff Arapaio's policy of arrest and detention of illegals. Illegals know who is sending different messages, which is why they head to sanctuary cities.

In general, people are not hypocrites - if anything, they tend to align their politics with their self-interest. Valley farmers, small business owners, and Malibu liberals agree - they want more nannies and farm hands, and push for open borders and lax enforcement.

On the other hand, older and native born working class communities don't employ them (most can't afford nannies). "We" as a people don't represent any treatment collectively, except as represented by our national government. And the only "mixed message" hypocrisy I see are from those politicians who claim to want to enforce the law, establish greater border control, and are opposed to amnesty when in fact they don't.

When they get here, "we" (collectively) treat them like second class citizens (because they aren't even citizens) and elect politicians who claim to "get tough on illegal immigration" but then once in office don't do a damned thing about immigration because fine folks from the Chamber of Commerce and the business community make it clear that if the flow of cheap immigrant labor is cut off, so are the campaign contributions.
We agree, but more accurately you mean "when they get here" by various illegal and fraudulent means, they know that once pass the border zone, the enforcement will largely disappear. Yes, that is hypocritical - which is why we ought to employ more robust means of detection, arrest, punishment, and deportation.

The collective "we" is the government, and the federal government leadership responsible for any mixed messages.

On that subject, I notice that in all your anti-immigrant (dangerously close to "final solution" type) rhetoric, you don't mention loading the employers into box cars. Businesses large and small - from corporate to individual owners - shell out hundreds of millions of dollars every year in wages to these immigrants that have you so vexed.

You want to punish the folks who overstay a visa or jump the border as harshly as inhumanely possible, then close the borders and force every foreigner who arrives here for business or pleasure to wear a device usually reserved for convicts, but in all your nativist fury I don't detect even a little bit of disdain for the people who make the entire illegal economy possible.

The thread was about the morality of 'Fed Ex' methods of tracking, but I am more than happy to convey my opinions on other goals and methods of immigration control. In brief, the other measures I support include:

- Targeted use of microchipping.

- A border wall-security fence system from gulf to the pacific, with guard towers spaced within visual range of each section. The Israeli model ought to serve as a template. Deadly force should be employed, if necessary.

- There should be not be a "safe" zone from deportation. Sanctuary cities and counties should be outlawed and/or defunded. If outlawed, any public official refusing to comply should be convicted of a federal crime.

- Family reunification and chain migration should end.

- Anyone who knowingly employs (or who should have known) illegals should be arrested and charged with a crime.

- A merit based immigration system, based on skills and abilities, should be instituted. The emphasis should be on professionals and highly skilled workers.

- The quota should be no more than 1/2 to 1 million a year.

- Citizenship law should exclude "anchor babies" (estimated to be 340,000 a year).
 
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Third, why don't you hold anyone criminally responsible for the social-welfare costs, crime, wage impact, and environmental impact from 10s of millions of legal and illegal immigration? Why do you support redistribution of well being from the working class to foreign nationals?
Question, are we talking about the illegals that make veggies so cheap?
 
Third, why don't you hold anyone criminally responsible for the social-welfare costs, crime, wage impact, and environmental impact from 10s of millions of legal and illegal immigration? Why do you support redistribution of well being from the working class to foreign nationals?
Question, are we talking about the illegals that make veggies so cheap?

Max is just a xenophobe who appears very conscious of the unscrupulous way in which the white man took this place from the Indians. He knows that dispossession started with a huge immigration from outside...like we are seeing today. What we are seeing here and in Europe these days are large numbers of refuges from the ruins of colonial operations all over the world. I suspect that if we don't end up killing off the human race with nukes, the end product will be some sort of mutual assimilation resulting in a lot more rigidly controlled lifestyle for all of us. A lot of us are still hating where world events are taking us...still hating the fact that we have to change our ways and attitudes in order to survive. We are at the dawn of an age that will require us to learn to cooperate with each other and sack this imaginary notion that only cut throat competition will produce happiness. It really is selfish and childish to think that way. Hating these helpless victims of international intrigue makes no sense to people seeking ACTUAL SOLUTIONS.
 
In general, people are not hypocrites

I don't even.

II do. We're all hypocrites! That being so how does it relate to this thread?

For instance, does that mean Christie, a politician, is just a normal person, or, does that mean that those who want to come here to stay will say anything to get in?

BTW: I like the idea for anyone coming in to the country, citizen or not, be required to have injected under their skin next to their carotid a chip indicating their 'from elsewhere' status which stays active for a year.
 
Only when it comes to Murica.

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there is nothing morally objectionable to making foreign nationals wear anklets or submit to chipping.

Except for the whole treating them like property or nothings instead of human beings part, but you don't know what a human being is, and I bet you don't even know what an American is.

They are being treated as human beings with a free will, in other words they are owned by no other than themselves. They have a choice, they can either agree to the tagging requirements for visitation or they can decline. If they decline, they must go elsewhere or go home. If they avoid border controls and tagging, and enter, they forfeit their liberty for having violated a rightful law and are either punished and/or deported.

The are free to come, but on the terms of the host nation.

That'll do wonders for our economy: "America, stay the fuck out and do business elsewhere."

I would hold you and anyone else supporting this criminally responsible for the ensuing recession and general economic decline of the country.

Nonsense.

First, I have been speaking of the morality of tagging (microchipping or bracelet wearing) those who "visit". I have argued that there is nothing wrong with it. But whether or not I would do so, and to whom it would apply, is a different question. Most likely it would only need to be applied to high risk categories (e.g. Mexicans) or exempted for low risk categories ( professionals with employment in their country of origin).

Second, it would have little effect on the economy. Immigration in general has added little to the economy, and illegals have added nothing of substance. It would only result in some symbolic and token protest from whining Euro-progressives - people that have enough to worry about with their out of control immigration troubles.

Third, why don't you hold anyone criminally responsible for the social-welfare costs, crime, wage impact, and environmental impact from 10s of millions of legal and illegal immigration? Why do you support redistribution of well being from the working class to foreign nationals?

It's not just immigration. Tourism would have a severe decline that would make the post 9-11 PATRIOT ACT decline look like a piece of statistical noise in comparison. Many companies would want to stop doing business here due to the type of bullshit you propose. What executive that doesn't have shit for brains would want to undergo that kind of treatment when coming here for a business meeting?
 
Only when it comes to Murica.

- - - Updated - - -

there is nothing morally objectionable to making foreign nationals wear anklets or submit to chipping.

Except for the whole treating them like property or nothings instead of human beings part, but you don't know what a human being is, and I bet you don't even know what an American is.

They are being treated as human beings with a free will, in other words they are owned by no other than themselves. They have a choice, they can either agree to the tagging requirements for visitation or they can decline. If they decline, they must go elsewhere or go home. If they avoid border controls and tagging, and enter, they forfeit their liberty for having violated a rightful law and are either punished and/or deported.

The are free to come, but on the terms of the host nation.

That'll do wonders for our economy: "America, stay the fuck out and do business elsewhere."

I would hold you and anyone else supporting this criminally responsible for the ensuing recession and general economic decline of the country.

Nonsense.

First, I have been speaking of the morality of tagging (microchipping or bracelet wearing) those who "visit". I have argued that there is nothing wrong with it. But whether or not I would do so, and to whom it would apply, is a different question. Most likely it would only need to be applied to high risk categories (e.g. Mexicans) or exempted for low risk categories ( professionals with employment in their country of origin).

Second, it would have little effect on the economy. Immigration in general has added little to the economy, and illegals have added nothing of substance. It would only result in some symbolic and token protest from whining Euro-progressives - people that have enough to worry about with their out of control immigration troubles.

Third, why don't you hold anyone criminally responsible for the social-welfare costs, crime, wage impact, and environmental impact from 10s of millions of legal and illegal immigration? Why do you support redistribution of well being from the working class to foreign nationals?

It's not just immigration. Tourism would have a severe decline that would make the post 9-11 PATRIOT ACT decline look like a piece of statistical noise in comparison. Many companies would want to stop doing business here due to the type of bullshit you propose. What executive that doesn't have shit for brains would want to undergo that kind of treatment when coming here for a business meeting?

So you are a foreign first time visitor. How many shots, how many visits to immigration, how much in bribes, do you think are required just to do that. Business do that all the time so there will be no effect on business or immigration.
 
Only when it comes to Murica.

- - - Updated - - -

there is nothing morally objectionable to making foreign nationals wear anklets or submit to chipping.

Except for the whole treating them like property or nothings instead of human beings part, but you don't know what a human being is, and I bet you don't even know what an American is.

They are being treated as human beings with a free will, in other words they are owned by no other than themselves. They have a choice, they can either agree to the tagging requirements for visitation or they can decline. If they decline, they must go elsewhere or go home. If they avoid border controls and tagging, and enter, they forfeit their liberty for having violated a rightful law and are either punished and/or deported.

The are free to come, but on the terms of the host nation.

That'll do wonders for our economy: "America, stay the fuck out and do business elsewhere."

I would hold you and anyone else supporting this criminally responsible for the ensuing recession and general economic decline of the country.

Nonsense.

First, I have been speaking of the morality of tagging (microchipping or bracelet wearing) those who "visit". I have argued that there is nothing wrong with it. But whether or not I would do so, and to whom it would apply, is a different question. Most likely it would only need to be applied to high risk categories (e.g. Mexicans) or exempted for low risk categories ( professionals with employment in their country of origin).

Second, it would have little effect on the economy. Immigration in general has added little to the economy, and illegals have added nothing of substance. It would only result in some symbolic and token protest from whining Euro-progressives - people that have enough to worry about with their out of control immigration troubles.

Third, why don't you hold anyone criminally responsible for the social-welfare costs, crime, wage impact, and environmental impact from 10s of millions of legal and illegal immigration? Why do you support redistribution of well being from the working class to foreign nationals?

It's not just immigration. Tourism would have a severe decline that would make the post 9-11 PATRIOT ACT decline look like a piece of statistical noise in comparison. Many companies would want to stop doing business here due to the type of bullshit you propose. What executive that doesn't have shit for brains would want to undergo that kind of treatment when coming here for a business meeting?

I am sure he only intended that for the poor brown skinned people. The point is that he is objectifying human beings...treating them like Fedex packages. He could perhaps require of foreign businessmen a receipt in excess of $500 for the purchase of their business suit instead of making them carry the bracelet of shame.
 
come on. Take the less expensive route. Inject every traveler between countries. Set up GPS trackers everywhere, commandeer phones if necessary for the purpose and we'll all be safer. We'll have less privacy, probably get taken more often, but, we won't be blown up so often.
 
come on. Take the less expensive route. Inject every traveler between countries. Set up GPS trackers everywhere, commandeer phones if necessary for the purpose and we'll all be safer. We'll have less privacy, probably get taken more often, but, we won't be blown up so often.

Chrisie was talking about the problem of these illegal immigrants staying in America, not necessarily blowing anybody up. A bracelet or an injected RFID tag still would not stop someone from lighting off a bomb or doing terrorism. It just that we would know where it was happening. Christie is concerned with the demographics of these people settling in and staying. He is one fat racist.
 
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