Why is it only white people that are racist?

[Toni]

Really? Asians are disfavored? I honestly cannot understand how that is true. Asians comprise under 6% total of the US population and comprise about 19% of all medical students. The acceptance rate of Asians, Hispanics and Whites is very close and significantly exceeds the acceptance rates of black applicants.

Once again you are taking on faith the idea that they are all equal. The scores say that that 19% is too low, if they were not being discriminated against it would be even higher.

Your lack of understanding of admissions processes and your lack of comprehension of the limits of test scores is showing almost as much as your bias.

 

[bigfield]

Really? Asians are disfavored? I honestly cannot understand how that is true. Asians comprise under 6% total of the US population and comprise about 19% of all medical students. The acceptance rate of Asians, Hispanics and Whites is very close and significantly exceeds the acceptance rates of black applicants.

Once again you are taking on faith the idea that they are all equal. The scores say that that 19% is too low, if they were not being discriminated against it would be even higher.

Your lack of understanding of admissions processes and your lack of comprehension of the limits of test scores is showing almost as much as your bias.

Loren's certainly biased, but on this point he's not wrong. The University of Texas, for instance, uses race-based admissions criteria for ~25% of its student body in order to compose an ethnically-diverse student body.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/15pdf/14-981_4g15.pdf

If we assume that such a policy is the norm for universities, then one would expect Black and Hispanic students to be admitted at higher rates than White and Asian students in order to compensate for their relative lack of representation, while Asian and White students would be "disfavored". This is borne out by the data from AAMC:

Percentage of successful applicants by MCAT score:

MCAT Score	Black	Hispanic	White	Asian
5-14	0.0%	0.4%	0.0%	0.0%
15-17	0.9%	3.1%	1.0%	0.6%
18-20	3.2%	11.7%	2.0%	0.8%
21-23	19.7%	25.8%	6.0%	3.6%
24-26	54.7%	40.0%	18.0%	11.9%
27-29	73.5%	58.4%	38.0%	28.3%
30-32	82.9%	71.9%	58.0%	50.6%
33-35	86.0%	80.3%	73.0%	68.2%
36-38	94.1%	87.3%	81.0%	78.8%
39-45	96.0%	84.5%	87.0%	85.6%

https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/157998/factstablea24.html

It is likely that, as Jimmy put it, universities have put their thumb on the scales. Black applicants still accepted at much lower rates overall--despite the favouritism--because they score lower on the MCAT than applicants from other races.

 

[Toni]

Once again you are taking on faith the idea that they are all equal. The scores say that that 19% is too low, if they were not being discriminated against it would be even higher.

Your lack of understanding of admissions processes and your lack of comprehension of the limits of test scores is showing almost as much as your bias.

Loren's certainly biased, but on this point he's not wrong. The University of Texas, for instance, uses race-based admissions criteria for ~25% of its student body in order to compose an ethnically-diverse student body.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/15pdf/14-981_4g15.pdf

If we assume that such a policy is the norm for universities, then one would expect Black and Hispanic students to be admitted at higher rates than White and Asian students in order to compensate for their relative lack of representation, while Asian and White students would be "disfavored". This is borne out by the data from AAMC:

Percentage of successful applicants by MCAT score:

MCAT Score	Black	Hispanic	White	Asian
5-14	0.0%	0.4%	0.0%	0.0%
15-17	0.9%	3.1%	1.0%	0.6%
18-20	3.2%	11.7%	2.0%	0.8%
21-23	19.7%	25.8%	6.0%	3.6%
24-26	54.7%	40.0%	18.0%	11.9%
27-29	73.5%	58.4%	38.0%	28.3%
30-32	82.9%	71.9%	58.0%	50.6%
33-35	86.0%	80.3%	73.0%	68.2%
36-38	94.1%	87.3%	81.0%	78.8%
39-45	96.0%	84.5%	87.0%	85.6%

https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/157998/factstablea24.html

It is likely that, as Jimmy put it, universities have put their thumb on the scales. Black applicants still accepted at much lower rates overall--despite the favouritism--because they score lower on the MCAT than applicants from other races.

Your figures do not say anything about the overall admissions rate of students by race or ethnicity. Nowhere do you account for any reasons that as a group, black applicants might score lower than white students or Asian students. Nor do those stats from TX account for the number of schools applicants applied to. Since it is expensive to apply to medical school, students who come from higher socioeconomic strata are favored because it is more affordable for them to apply to multiple schools, just as they have more access to better schools, and significantly, to prep courses which help them to score higher. As student A applies to an increasing number of schools, it is likely that they will increase their chance of admissions to some school(s) but because they are less selective about the schools they apply to, they are risking applying to schools where they will not have a good chance of admissions.

This, of course, totally ignores the fact that admissions is based on more than just numbers--for very good reasons. Medical schools are interested in educating students who will be successful in their studies at that school--and who will become excellent doctors. Not every person who has an excellent GPA and MCAT scores is actually someone who would become a good physician.

I cited my source--a very good one--that describes the admissions rates for all groups by race. If you click on the link, you will find other tables for comparison.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Your lack of understanding of admissions processes and your lack of comprehension of the limits of test scores is showing almost as much as your bias.

Loren's certainly biased, but on this point he's not wrong. The University of Texas, for instance, uses race-based admissions criteria for ~25% of its student body in order to compose an ethnically-diverse student body.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/15pdf/14-981_4g15.pdf

If we assume that such a policy is the norm for universities, then one would expect Black and Hispanic students to be admitted at higher rates than White and Asian students in order to compensate for their relative lack of representation, while Asian and White students would be "disfavored". This is borne out by the data from AAMC:

Percentage of successful applicants by MCAT score:

MCAT Score	Black	Hispanic	White	Asian
5-14	0.0%	0.4%	0.0%	0.0%
15-17	0.9%	3.1%	1.0%	0.6%
18-20	3.2%	11.7%	2.0%	0.8%
21-23	19.7%	25.8%	6.0%	3.6%
24-26	54.7%	40.0%	18.0%	11.9%
27-29	73.5%	58.4%	38.0%	28.3%
30-32	82.9%	71.9%	58.0%	50.6%
33-35	86.0%	80.3%	73.0%	68.2%
36-38	94.1%	87.3%	81.0%	78.8%
39-45	96.0%	84.5%	87.0%	85.6%

https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/157998/factstablea24.html

It is likely that, as Jimmy put it, universities have put their thumb on the scales. Black applicants still accepted at much lower rates overall--despite the favouritism--because they score lower on the MCAT than applicants from other races.

Your figures do not say anything about the overall admissions rate of students by race or ethnicity. Nowhere do you account for any reasons that as a group, black applicants might score lower than white students or Asian students. Nor do those stats from TX account for the number of schools applicants applied to. Since it is expensive to apply to medical school, students who come from higher socioeconomic strata are favored because it is more affordable for them to apply to multiple schools, just as they have more access to better schools, and significantly, to prep courses which help them to score higher. As student A applies to an increasing number of schools, it is likely that they will increase their chance of admissions to some school(s) but because they are less selective about the schools they apply to, they are risking applying to schools where they will not have a good chance of admissions.

This, of course, totally ignores the fact that admissions is based on more than just numbers--for very good reasons. Medical schools are interested in educating students who will be successful in their studies at that school--and who will become excellent doctors. Not every person who has an excellent GPA and MCAT scores is actually someone who would become a good physician.

I cited my source--a very good one--that describes the admissions rates for all groups by race. If you click on the link, you will find other tables for comparison.

Toni, the stats indicate blacks and hispanics have average lower scores than whites and asians. This is undeniable.

The issue is this bullshit idea that this is racism, when in general 5 in 6 accepted students is white or asian. Loren and company want to suggest that 5 in 6 isn't enough and that a 3.5 GPA is 'inferior'. That is crap.

What is also crap is that this is about admission to med school, not a med school diploma lottery. This massive swell of 1 in 6 black or hispanic students will have to get through the program just like those superior whites and asians. AA is about access to opportunities.

 

[bigfield]

Your figures do not say anything about the overall admissions rate of students by race or ethnicity. Nowhere do you account for any reasons that as a group, black applicants might score lower than white students or Asian students. Nor do those stats from TX account for the number of schools applicants applied to. Since it is expensive to apply to medical school, students who come from higher socioeconomic strata are favored because it is more affordable for them to apply to multiple schools, just as they have more access to better schools, and significantly, to prep courses which help them to score higher. As student A applies to an increasing number of schools, it is likely that they will increase their chance of admissions to some school(s) but because they are less selective about the schools they apply to, they are risking applying to schools where they will not have a good chance of admissions.

As far as I can tell, the AAMC's figures count applicants, not applications. A prospective student who applies to multiple schools is counted as a single applicant.

Accepted Applicant or Acceptee: A person who has applied to one of the U.S. M.D.-granting medical schools and who has been offered admission to (i.e., been accepted by) one or more of those schools....

Applicant: A person who has applied to at least one U.S. M.D.-granting medical school.

https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/glossary/

 

[Toni]

Loren's certainly biased, but on this point he's not wrong. The University of Texas, for instance, uses race-based admissions criteria for ~25% of its student body in order to compose an ethnically-diverse student body.

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/15pdf/14-981_4g15.pdf

If we assume that such a policy is the norm for universities, then one would expect Black and Hispanic students to be admitted at higher rates than White and Asian students in order to compensate for their relative lack of representation, while Asian and White students would be "disfavored". This is borne out by the data from AAMC:

Percentage of successful applicants by MCAT score:

MCAT Score	Black	Hispanic	White	Asian
5-14	0.0%	0.4%	0.0%	0.0%
15-17	0.9%	3.1%	1.0%	0.6%
18-20	3.2%	11.7%	2.0%	0.8%
21-23	19.7%	25.8%	6.0%	3.6%
24-26	54.7%	40.0%	18.0%	11.9%
27-29	73.5%	58.4%	38.0%	28.3%
30-32	82.9%	71.9%	58.0%	50.6%
33-35	86.0%	80.3%	73.0%	68.2%
36-38	94.1%	87.3%	81.0%	78.8%
39-45	96.0%	84.5%	87.0%	85.6%

https://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/157998/factstablea24.html

It is likely that, as Jimmy put it, universities have put their thumb on the scales. Black applicants still accepted at much lower rates overall--despite the favouritism--because they score lower on the MCAT than applicants from other races.

Your figures do not say anything about the overall admissions rate of students by race or ethnicity. Nowhere do you account for any reasons that as a group, black applicants might score lower than white students or Asian students. Nor do those stats from TX account for the number of schools applicants applied to. Since it is expensive to apply to medical school, students who come from higher socioeconomic strata are favored because it is more affordable for them to apply to multiple schools, just as they have more access to better schools, and significantly, to prep courses which help them to score higher. As student A applies to an increasing number of schools, it is likely that they will increase their chance of admissions to some school(s) but because they are less selective about the schools they apply to, they are risking applying to schools where they will not have a good chance of admissions.

This, of course, totally ignores the fact that admissions is based on more than just numbers--for very good reasons. Medical schools are interested in educating students who will be successful in their studies at that school--and who will become excellent doctors. Not every person who has an excellent GPA and MCAT scores is actually someone who would become a good physician.

I cited my source--a very good one--that describes the admissions rates for all groups by race. If you click on the link, you will find other tables for comparison.

Toni, the stats indicate blacks and hispanics have average lower scores than whites and asians. This is undeniable.

The issue is this bullshit idea that this is racism, when in general 5 in 6 accepted students is white or asian. Loren and company want to suggest that 5 in 6 isn't enough and that a 3.5 GPA is 'inferior'. That is crap.

What is also crap is that this is about admission to med school, not a med school diploma lottery. This massive swell of 1 in 6 black or hispanic students will have to get through the program just like those superior whites and asians. AA is about access to opportunities.

I would correct you to state that on average, black and hispanic applicants score lower on the MCAT than do white or asian students. That does not address the fact that some of the top scoring applicants are black or hispanic.

I do not see AA as racism, but rather as an attempt to remedy institutional racism as well as to address the fact that it is important to select students who actually want to be physicians and to serve populations who need doctors. I agree that AA is about access to opportunities.

I suspect that you and I agree far more than we disagree.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Your figures do not say anything about the overall admissions rate of students by race or ethnicity. Nowhere do you account for any reasons that as a group, black applicants might score lower than white students or Asian students. Nor do those stats from TX account for the number of schools applicants applied to. Since it is expensive to apply to medical school, students who come from higher socioeconomic strata are favored because it is more affordable for them to apply to multiple schools, just as they have more access to better schools, and significantly, to prep courses which help them to score higher. As student A applies to an increasing number of schools, it is likely that they will increase their chance of admissions to some school(s) but because they are less selective about the schools they apply to, they are risking applying to schools where they will not have a good chance of admissions.

This, of course, totally ignores the fact that admissions is based on more than just numbers--for very good reasons. Medical schools are interested in educating students who will be successful in their studies at that school--and who will become excellent doctors. Not every person who has an excellent GPA and MCAT scores is actually someone who would become a good physician.

I cited my source--a very good one--that describes the admissions rates for all groups by race. If you click on the link, you will find other tables for comparison.

Toni, the stats indicate blacks and hispanics have average lower scores than whites and asians. This is undeniable.

The issue is this bullshit idea that this is racism, when in general 5 in 6 accepted students is white or asian. Loren and company want to suggest that 5 in 6 isn't enough and that a 3.5 GPA is 'inferior'. That is crap.

What is also crap is that this is about admission to med school, not a med school diploma lottery. This massive swell of 1 in 6 black or hispanic students will have to get through the program just like those superior whites and asians. AA is about access to opportunities.

I would correct you to state that on average, black and hispanic applicants score lower on the MCAT than do white or asian students. That does not address the fact that some of the top scoring applicants are black or hispanic.

While accurate, I don't believe it is relevant in the discussion of general aggregates.

I do not see AA as racism...

Nor do I.

...but rather as an attempt to remedy institutional racism as well as to address the fact that it is important to select students who actually want to be physicians and to serve populations who need doctors. I agree that AA is about access to opportunities.

I suspect that you and I agree far more than we disagree.

Oh certainly, I just wanted to correct what appeared to be a misstatement regarding average scores.

On average, black and hispanic applicants had lower average GPA and MCAT levels than White and Asian applicants on average. On average, blacks and hispanics had lower acceptance levels than White and Asian applicants. The vast majority of those accepted are white and asian. "Institutional racism" charge is full of shit.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It's called affirmative action. A policy that puts a little bit of thumb on the scale when judging applicants for admission*. That blacks had a lower acceptance rate while having a lower average in scores seems like the weight of the thumb on the scale isn't that heavy. About 84% of enrollees into medical school were White and Asian (that's about 5 in 6.. ie... look to your left and look to your right and the students next to you would have likely been accepted because they were qualified to go to the fucking school! Blacks and Hispanics entering the programs aren't troglodytes!). Again, not an indication of "institutionalized racism".

Affirmative action & racism are two sides of the same coin.

And your statement that they aren't troglodytes shows your problem--you're still assuming they are equally qualified. The scores say otherwise.

Oh, I'm sure, but the numbers indicate you are messing your trousers over nothing. 1 in 6 accepted were Black or Hispanic.

I don't give a hoot how many were accepted. I care about the qualifications of those that were accepted. I want fully color-blind admissions--there's no need for the admissions people to know the race of the applicants.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I think your choice of words: inferior black students' makes my argument better than anything else.

Also you either don't understand stats or you're so caught up in the notion that blacks are inferior that it is clouding your ability to reason.

I'm talking about ones with lower scores. How is "inferior" not the right word to use?

You're so focused on stomping on anything that looks like racism that you can't see reality.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Your figures do not say anything about the overall admissions rate of students by race or ethnicity. Nowhere do you account for any reasons that as a group, black applicants might score lower than white students or Asian students. Nor do those stats from TX account for the number of schools applicants applied to. Since it is expensive to apply to medical school, students who come from higher socioeconomic strata are favored because it is more affordable for them to apply to multiple schools, just as they have more access to better schools, and significantly, to prep courses which help them to score higher. As student A applies to an increasing number of schools, it is likely that they will increase their chance of admissions to some school(s) but because they are less selective about the schools they apply to, they are risking applying to schools where they will not have a good chance of admissions.

You're still assuming the differences in scores are bogus. The problem is real, focus on fixing it, not sweeping it under the rug!

And now I see part of why you're so mixed up here--in a hunt for how to discredit the data you have failed to understand it in the first place. You're treating "acceptance" as whether the student is admitted--but this is data from the schools, it's looking at it from the other direction: "Acceptance" is whether the school approved the application. Thus applying to more schools isn't going to help the whites and Asians. If anything, it would drive down white and Asian acceptance rates because if you're going to apply to many schools you'll aim high with at least some of them.

This, of course, totally ignores the fact that admissions is based on more than just numbers--for very good reasons. Medical schools are interested in educating students who will be successful in their studies at that school--and who will become excellent doctors. Not every person who has an excellent GPA and MCAT scores is actually someone who would become a good physician.

And Asians are bad doctors while blacks are excellent ones? Why in the world should we think that?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The issue is this bullshit idea that this is racism, when in general 5 in 6 accepted students is white or asian. Loren and company want to suggest that 5 in 6 isn't enough and that a 3.5 GPA is 'inferior'. That is crap.

"Enough" is a racist concept.

Pick the most qualified ones, ignore what race they are.

 

[ruby sparks]

On the whole, I prefer what is called here (in the UK), 'Positive Action' to what is called here, 'Positive Discrimination'. The former allows, for example, for employers and institutions to go out of their way to target and encourage applications from disadvantaged minorities, but not to positively discriminate in favour of them thereafter, using quotas for example.

By and large, I would be against quotas, though there may be situations where they may, temporarily, be acceptable to redress a 'crisis' situation of historical disenfrachisment.

That said, I have some reservations.

Take the case of university admissions based on final school exam grades, or the equivalent (SAT tests or whatever). Is it the case that a high mark or score is because the student applicant is brighter, or are there not other factors, to do with prior opportunities and circumstances?

Typically, a student applicant from a privileged background has benefitted from, for example, parents who have the resources to improve their child's mark, by being able to afford extra tuition at various times in their school career, even from primary school, or spend quality (and educationally-qualified) time with them themselves. Also, such a 'privileged' child may have been able to go to a school where it was easier to study (less disruptive and/or stressful) or go home to a house and a neighbourhood where it is easier to do independent homework, for a variety of similar domestic reasons. Such a child will often also have been responding, with or without enthusiasm, to the parents' high expectations, and perhaps also peer pressure.

In other words, I am not sure if highest marks in tests = brightest or most able applicant.

The secondary school my kids went to (the one my wife teaches at) only takes the students with the very highest marks in the 'Transfer Test' (transfer from primary to secondary) but it is widely acknowledged that many of the successful entrants have been expensively after-school-coached to the hilt, and extensively coached during school hours in the run-up to the tests by the 'better' primary schools, who like to retain their reputation for getting kids into top schools. Not to mention being encouraged if not pushed into applying to such a school in the first place by parents with high aspirations.

That's partly how our kids got in. Yes, they were a bit middle-class privileged.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The issue is this bullshit idea that this is racism, when in general 5 in 6 accepted students is white or asian. Loren and company want to suggest that 5 in 6 isn't enough and that a 3.5 GPA is 'inferior'. That is crap.

"Enough" is a racist concept.

Pick the most qualified ones, ignore what race they are.

When you buy a car I suppose you only care about the mileage and how fast it can go from 0 - 60. That is all that matters, all that qualifies the car as being great.

You keep talking about qualifications, but only resort to GPA and MCAT. Nothing else qualifies one to enter school.

I'm starting to think you aren't qualified for discussing this.

 

[Toni]

I think your choice of words: inferior black students' makes my argument better than anything else.

Also you either don't understand stats or you're so caught up in the notion that blacks are inferior that it is clouding your ability to reason.

I'm talking about ones with lower scores. How is "inferior" not the right word to use?

You're so focused on stomping on anything that looks like racism that you can't see reality.

Please quit assuming you know or understand anything about what I think or believe. Your responses demonstrate that you do not.

If you don't want people to see you as racist, try not pairing the words 'black' and 'inferior.'

Why not say: lower scoring applicants. This, btw, does not distinguish between races of applicants. Isn't that what you've said you want?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The issue is this bullshit idea that this is racism, when in general 5 in 6 accepted students is white or asian. Loren and company want to suggest that 5 in 6 isn't enough and that a 3.5 GPA is 'inferior'. That is crap.

"Enough" is a racist concept.

Pick the most qualified ones, ignore what race they are.

When you buy a car I suppose you only care about the mileage and how fast it can go from 0 - 60. That is all that matters, all that qualifies the car as being great.

You keep talking about qualifications, but only resort to GPA and MCAT. Nothing else qualifies one to enter school.

I'm starting to think you aren't qualified for discussing this.

If you've got other relevant qualifications, list them.

Race isn't a qualification.

- - - Updated - - -

I think your choice of words: inferior black students' makes my argument better than anything else.

Also you either don't understand stats or you're so caught up in the notion that blacks are inferior that it is clouding your ability to reason.

I'm talking about ones with lower scores. How is "inferior" not the right word to use?

You're so focused on stomping on anything that looks like racism that you can't see reality.

Please quit assuming you know or understand anything about what I think or believe. Your responses demonstrate that you do not.

If you don't want people to see you as racist, try not pairing the words 'black' and 'inferior.'

Why not say: lower scoring applicants. This, btw, does not distinguish between races of applicants. Isn't that what you've said you want?

Political correctness over sensible speech.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

"Enough" is a racist concept.

Pick the most qualified ones, ignore what race they are.

When you buy a car I suppose you only care about the mileage and how fast it can go from 0 - 60. That is all that matters, all that qualifies the car as being great.

You keep talking about qualifications, but only resort to GPA and MCAT. Nothing else qualifies one to enter school.

If you've got other relevant qualifications, list them.

Race isn't a qualification.

Have you never filed an application for Grad School? Things like recommendations, collegiate activities, public work, performance in courses related to grad degree?

Race isn't a qualification.

Clearly it can't be too much of a qualifier if around 2/3's of black applicants are not accepted into med school. That'd be the worst "institutionalized racism" ever!

- - - Updated - - -

I'm talking about ones with lower scores. How is "inferior" not the right word to use?

LP, Grade School teacher. Mr. Smith, you daughter is clearly inferior.

 

[ronburgundy]

And as I noted, while the average accepted GPA for blacks and hispanics is 0.2 lower, that difference isn't a massive chasm, that some seem to imply it is, nor is it the end all to the application, which includes letters of recommendations, activities, among other things.

You misread that chart. You are looking at the "matriculants" (students that actually chose to enroll) rather than those who got accepted, which in the top half of the chart you linked. Among students the school accepted, the total GPA for blacks was 3.29 versus 3.61 for whites. And the more relevant comparison is GPA for science courses, since there is other research showing that students that don't do as well in required courses tend to choose easier courses for their electives. Science GPA for blacks was 3.11 versus 3.53 for whites. That is a sizable difference. It is the difference between getting mostly Bs and either very few As or nearly as many Cs as As, versus getting mostly As and almost nothing below a B. And the most valid indicator of being intellectually prepared that controls for differences in difficulty of courses taken is the MCAT scores where the average black accepted has a percentile rank of 30th (meaning they score worse than 70% of people who take the test, while the average for whites is 64th (more than twice as high).

This is the definition of racial discrimination, applying different standards of who gets accepted based on skin color. The fact that a higher % of black applicants get rejected is irrelevant, because that only means that many more blacks with scores and GPAs that are at the bottom of the barrel are applying, hoping that the obvious racism used to lower the standards for them will be lowered even further. If the blacks that get accepted are at the 30th percentile and B students on average, then some down around the 20th percentile and C GPAs are getting accepted. Whereas virtually zero whites with those scores are, so they wouldn't even bother applying.

The differences in qualification not only directly harm the applicants rejected for being the wrong skin color, but harms many of the black students that get accepted. Their 4-year graduation rate from Med-school is only 60% versus 80% for whites. They are 10 times more likely to drop out in the first 4 years for "academic reasons" (aka failing). Those that graduate take an average of 1 year longer and thus accrue greater debt and have a less impressive CV. This is tied to the well-documented "mismatch" problem that AA causes whereby blacks get accepted to more competitive schools that they are are not prepared for, increasing dropout rates and other harmful outcomes that they would not have encountered by going to a school where they were not well below the average student.

A glaring and well documented instance of this in law school, where white law school graduates are more than 50% as likely to pass the bar on their first attempt than black graduates, and black graduates are 600% more likely than white graduates to fail their first 5 attempts. A detailed analysis shows that about half of this differential rate in passing the bar is due to preferential AA policies that puts most black students into schools where they are well below their classmates in HS GPA and LSAT scores.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

So umm, does this help explain why 2/3's of applicants that are black aren't accepted?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Loren Pechtel]

So umm, does this help explain why 2/3's of applicants that are black aren't accepted?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Once again, your faith prevents you from comprehending blasphemy. He did answer it--their scores aren't as good.

 

[ronburgundy]

So umm, does this help explain why 2/3's of applicants that are black aren't accepted?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes, it fully explains that, as I already detailed.
If the 35% of blacks who get accepted have a B average and MCAT scores at the 30th percentile, then most of those getting rejected have closer to a C average and MCATs in the 10th percentile. Even racist admissions officers cannot justify admitting students with such definitive lack of academic readiness and very likely to fail out.

IOW, while the racist policies do reject definitively worse students for better students due solely to skin color and those worse students are less likely to succeed in med school, they are not so extreme as to give a seat to every single black applicant, even if they barely made it out of high school and learned next to nothing in their pre-med education.

Your argument that this isn't racism is like saying that because there are women whose pussy Trump did not grab, he has not engaged in sexual assault.