Pro-Lifer says, "Let them die if it costs me money"

[bigfield]

When you start trotting out “ten 9/11s worth” then yes, you really are hysterical. You need to calm down.

So 30,000 dead in a few months doesn't bother you at all. At what point will you begin to be slightly concerned? A hundred thousand? A million?

I am very concerned. But not to the point that society should come to a standstill. This virus is going to have to run its course. We tolerate tens of thousands of deaths from flu every year with barely a murmur. This is just going to be part of life now.

It will be a part of life, in the future. Right now it threatens to overwhelm medical services if we let it "run its course".

 

[TSwizzle]

Open up the economy and the pandemic will ruin them..

How exactly will the pandemic ruin them ? Everyone drops dead in three, four weeks ? The vast, vast majority of people recover from the virus. In fact, it turns out there are many people that had it and never knew it.

It wouldn't be over in three, four weeks.

Firstly, some people don't want to die from COVID-19, or get other people killed through their negligence.

You’re not paying attention. The vast, VAST majority of people don’t die from Covid19. Now, following the lock down etc, it’s probably for the best if we start to build on the herd immunity.

 

[TSwizzle]

It will be a part of life, in the future. Right now it threatens to overwhelm medical services if we let it "run its course".

No, we have already taken the steps to prevent the overwhelming of the medical services. This is why we need to ease up on the lock down. It has done its job. With the exception of a few places. NY for example.

 

[bigfield]

It wouldn't be over in three, four weeks.

Firstly, some people don't want to die from COVID-19, or get other people killed through their negligence.

You’re not paying attention. The vast, VAST majority of people don’t die from Covid19. Now, following the lock down etc, it’s probably for the best if we start to build on the herd immunity.

It doesn't matter whether you write "vast" in lowercase or uppercase, it remains that precisely no-one gives a rat's ass how minor you personally consider the risk to be. They have already weighed up the risk for themselves.

It will be a part of life, in the future. Right now it threatens to overwhelm medical services if we let it "run its course".

No, we have already taken the steps to prevent the overwhelming of the medical services. This is why we need to ease up on the lock down. It has done its job. With the exception of a few places. NY for example.

No, you're just plain old wrong about that.

In one post, you suggest that we need to develop herd immunity, and then in the very next post, you overlook the fact that we are vulnerable because we lack hard immunity.

 

[TSwizzle]

It doesn't matter whether you write "vast" in lowercase or uppercase, it remains that precisely no-one gives a rat's ass how minor you personally consider the risk to be.

The level of risk is not my personal opinion. It’s a fact. The vast majority of people come out of it unscathed.

In one post, you suggest that we need to develop herd immunity, and then in the very next post, you overlook the fact that we are vulnerable because we lack hard immunity.

for the most part, only certain people are vulnerable, the very elderly etc. the youngsters are the ones that need to build up immunity. That’s not going to happen if they are sitting at home waiting on a vaccine that may never get developed.

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Points to ponder for fucking morons talking out their assholes:

Covid-19 is on track to kill far more people in the United States this year than the seasonal flu.

But determining just how deadly the new coronavirus will be is a key question facing epidemiologists, who expect resurgent waves of infection that could last into 2022.

As the virus spread across the world in late February and March, the projection circulated by infectious disease experts of how many infected people would die seemed plenty dire: around 1 percent, or 10 times the rate of a typical flu.

But according to various unofficial Covid-19 trackers that calculate the death rate by dividing total deaths by the number of known cases, about 6.4 percent of people infected with the virus have now died worldwide.
...
The known number of coronavirus cases worldwide is about two million, and at least 127,000 of those patients have died. The United States has an estimated 600,000 reported cases and more than 25,000 deaths, the most in the world.
...
What scientists call the infection fatality rate is so closely watched because even a seemingly trivial decrease — from, say, 1.0 percent to 0.9 percent — could mean a few hundred thousand fewer deaths in a population the size of the United States.
,,,
Even as parts of the country edge toward reopening, cases are rising in Florida and other Southern states whose governors delayed closing beaches and dine-in restaurants. And it is the virus’s transmission rate, as much as its infection fatality rate, that is preoccupying public health experts trying to find a way forward.

“Everyone in the whole country is vulnerable to this,” said Andrew Noymer, an associate professor of public health at the University of California, Irvine. “Nobody has pre-immunity. That’s totally unlike flu. So New York had some early cases, it spread like crazy. But why is Des Moines not going to have a Covid epidemic? What’s so special about Springfield, Ill.? Social distancing will end. And people will start getting it again and dying.”

Even the creator of the WH’s favored model states:

"The one thing we absolutely know for sure is that social distancing measures work," Murray said. "It leads to a situation where every case is infecting less than one other case, and that means if you keep the course, you'll get transmission essentially down to zero."

Murray cited Italy and China as places where this was happening.
...
By August, the model predicts, a total of 68,841 people will have died in the United States, which is up from Friday's projection of 61,500 deaths.

But of course, that’s a peak, not a total and a highly dubious estimate that can’t take into account all the fucking morons that are ignoring social distancing rules, or Trump’s criminal incitement and idiotic quest to ‘re-open” America before then.

And, of course, since we do not yet have a vaccine and don’t know whether or not you’re immune once you’ve had it, the whole fucking thing can just keep infecting over and over and over again, all the while growing more and more invulnerable to our attempts at killing it.

Typical “seasonal flu” kills around 3,000 every year, NOT 36,000. That number came from inflating the death toll with the numbers caused by the more lethal (and more rare) H3N2 strain. So even if we use the WH’s own preferred model, the Trump virus will have killed over twenty times as many as the typical flu in just a few short months with nothing foreseeable BUT shelter-in-place preventing more.

Similar models—that were set to estimate the global death toll without such measures—placed the numbers in the thirty to forty million range.

for the most part, only certain people are vulnerable, the very elderly etc.

No, for the “most part” those over 65 and those with already compromised immune systems and those with pre-existing conditions have simply been the first to die. We still have no idea who is at risk or how deadly this can turn out to be or what other longer term problems it may cause:

“Young people are not invincible,” WHO's Maria Van Kerkhove added, saying more information is needed about the disease in all age groups.

Italy reported that a quarter of its cases so far were among people ages 19 to 50. In Spain, a third are under age 44. In the U.S., the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention’s first snapshot of cases found 29% were ages 20 to 44.

Then there’s the puzzle of children, who have made up a small fraction of the world’s case counts to date. But while most appear only mildly ill, in the journal Pediatrics researchers traced 2,100 infected children in China and noted one death, a 14-year-old, and that nearly 6% were seriously ill.

Fun.

the youngsters are the ones that need to build up immunity.

We don’t even know if that’s possible, considering the many cases where someone has been determined to have it, survive and then get re-infected.

 

[bigfield]

It doesn't matter whether you write "vast" in lowercase or uppercase, it remains that precisely no-one gives a rat's ass how minor you personally consider the risk to be.

The level of risk is not my personal opinion. It’s a fact. The vast majority of people come out of it unscathed.

I can tell you missed the point, because you omitted it:

It doesn't matter whether you write "vast" in lowercase or uppercase, it remains that precisely no-one gives a rat's ass how minor you personally consider the risk to be. They have already weighed up the risk for themselves.

You also missed the point of the post before that:

It wouldn't be over in three, four weeks.

Firstly, some people don't want to die from COVID-19, or get other people killed through their negligence. So even in the absence of a government shutdown, much of the economy will remain in a self-imposed shutdown.

 

[bilby]

It doesn't matter whether you write "vast" in lowercase or uppercase, it remains that precisely no-one gives a rat's ass how minor you personally consider the risk to be.

The level of risk is not my personal opinion. It’s a fact. The vast majority of people come out of it unscathed.

Which is lovely, when you're thinking of this as something that happens to others.

But it's also something that might happen to you.

A 1-3% death toll means that 97-99% of people survive. But it also means that you are staking your life on a 100:1 or maybe a 33:1 shot.

I dunno about you; But I would hesitate to bet my life at 100:1 odds, even if the reward were spectacular. But it's not - the reward is nothing you weren't already expecting.

 

[ZiprHead]

It doesn't matter whether you write "vast" in lowercase or uppercase, it remains that precisely no-one gives a rat's ass how minor you personally consider the risk to be.

The level of risk is not my personal opinion. It’s a fact. The vast majority of people come out of it unscathed.

Which is lovely, when you're thinking of this as something that happens to others.

But it's also something that might happen to you.

A 1-3% death toll means that 97-99% of people survive. But it also means that you are staking your life on a 100:1 or maybe a 33:1 shot.

I dunno about you; But I would hesitate to bet my life at 100:1 odds, even if the reward were spectacular. But it's not - the reward is nothing you weren't already expecting.

He wants to turn the country into a big game of Russian roulette.

 

[TV and credit cards]

It will be a part of life, in the future. Right now it threatens to overwhelm medical services if we let it "run its course".

No, we have already taken the steps to prevent the overwhelming of the medical services. This is why we need to ease up on the lock down. It has done its job. With the exception of a few places. NY for example.

It matters not. Most people are still scared. As long as the toilet paper shelf stays mostly empty, people are still hoarding because they are still scared. And now news of disruptions in the food supply. Instead of worrying about yoga studios opening back up, you should worry about meat processing plants shutting down.

 

[Elixir]

As long as the toilet paper shelf stays mostly empty, people are still hoarding because they are still scared.

TP shortage is not a good indicator. It is a side effect of people staying home and not availing themselves of public or institutional bathrooms. There are warehouses brimming with institutional TP, which has completely separate manufacturing and distribution channels from the consumer product. There is no incentive for the manufacturers of the consumer product to gear up their manufacturing capacity in order to accommodate what is assumed to be a temporary spike in demand.

What Everyone’s Getting Wrong About the Toilet Paper Shortage

 

[lpetrich]

I'd mentioned Communist mass murders as something that right-wingers get very worked up about. But when it comes to the prospect of a virus producing a death toll worthy of Joseph Stalin, they become curiously diffident.

This "for the good of the economy" argument looks to me like a version of "you must break eggs to make an omelet."

 

[TSwizzle]

It matters not. Most people are still scared. As long as the toilet paper shelf stays mostly empty, people are still hoarding because they are still scared. And now news of disruptions in the food supply. Instead of worrying about yoga studios opening back up, you should worry about meat processing plants shutting down.

Despite the wall to wall MSM fear mongering, Florida beaches are packed after reopening.

 

[ZiprHead]

 

[TSwizzle]

It’s unremarkable that these now unnecessary diktats are so appealing to leftists. They are enjoying it like pigs in mud.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Taking a stay at home order and turning it into a recommendation to appease the mouth breathers will further endanger those of us who have enough sense to stay at home when we do have to go out for groceries and other necessities.

Mouth breathers or not, people are suffering extreme hardships because they have had their livelihoods taken away from them unnecessarily. It's enough already. It's time to ease up and start allowing some businesses to open. Keeping the "stay at home/shelter in place" order because of mass hysteria is unnecessary and unjust.

Yup, because repeatedly calling it ‘hysteria’ makes the science go away.

Please stop arguing with right wing talking points.

 

[Jokodo]

It’s unremarkable that these now unnecessary diktats are so appealing to leftists. They are enjoying it like pigs in mud.

And how exactly would they have become unnecessary overnight when even you seem to understand they were necessary 3v weeks ago, and the us counts if anything more new infections per day now than then?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

To some extent you're right--in the truly rural areas the transmission threat is low. However, that's not that many people. Most of the objectors have to be suburban reds.

I often end up classing outlying suburbia more with rural areas than with urban areas. Behaviorally, most suburbanites in the outlying MSA areas behave more like ruralites than like urbanites. They just have less distance to drive for groceries. But single family home, personal yard & outdoor space, home cooking, and church attendance all show up more frequently the further you get away from urban centers. I don't think there's a bright line divider when it comes to suburbia.

For example, I'm technically in a suburban portion of a relatively large urban center... but it's much more spread out, quiet, less traffic, more birds, etc. I have a strong dislike of cities and crowded areas that is pretty independent of my political views, but is likely to have a lot of correlation with conservatives. I definitely feel a lot less anxiety and concern than I would if I lived in a densely populated urban area.

We are suburban, also. The transmission threat isn't like it is in urban areas (I can get in my car without any risk) but neither is it anything like the rural areas (I know there's a package in the mailbox but I didn't get it because a guy is doing yardwork right around the mailbox.) I don't think the people around here behave rural, but I do agree it's a spectrum, not a dividing line.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Tucker was explaining that in Michigan it's still legal to buy lottery and alcohol! Abortion is still legal! Guess what's baned? Joint replacement surgery. That's right. If you can't walk due to your joints grinding down to bone on bone, she says that is not essential.

What a boneheaded governor, seriously. Lottery and alcohol and abortion are essential though! Who voted for that moron?

Lottery tickets--agreed, no reason.

Alcohol--very good reason. For an alcoholic to go cold turkey is life threatening.

Abortion--time sensitive. Note that the bans included chemical abortion, something that puts no load on the system at all--that clearly shows the intent was to go after abortion, not for any medical reason.

Joint replacement--this isn't something that is sudden. The problem develops over years, eventually the patient and their doctor decide it's time to do something about it, but there is no sharp dividing line. It's major surgery, not something you want to be doing with very good reason right now. I wouldn't do it now even if there wasn't an issue of diverting resources from Covid-19.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Oh, by the way, Halfie. Do you know why 7-11s are called 7-11?

Because they were open from 7 am to 11 pm. There's no requirement they be open all night long.

Also, here in our little city, a 9 pm to 6 am curfew has just been imposed because people were joy-riding and going house to house to party. Travel during that time is restricted to those going to and from essential work.

which is dumb on its own. When you're driving in your car, you are protected and way farther than the 6 foot rule. People in grocery stores are closer to each other. Yet, driving is a problem? This is why government is dumb. They ban the stuff that makes no difference but permit the stuff that would make a difference.

Oh no! I'm driving down a road all by myself at midnight! I'm really spreading the disease!

As I also said, the McDonald's in my town is still open 24 hours. I guess that 2am big mac with large fries and a coke is essential! And at the 711 my friend works at he was saying that 65-70 year old men come in at 2-3am for cigarettes and nothing else. Guess that is essential, too! The most vulnerable demographic to the disease is given permission to get cigarettes at 2--3am! Yippee!

Did you read what he said??

It's not about driving at night, it's about where they were going when they drove.