That's rather a nitpick.
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Merged Gaza just launched an unprovoked attack on Israel
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Once again, nitpicking a comparison. How about addressing the point rather than engaging in pointless disputes because a comparison isn't absolutely perfect.
I note neither of you addressed the selective nature of it.
He's advocating for a position that certainly would lead to it.
It isn't. Large scale terrorism is never about actual wrongs, it's always about somebody wanting to cause trouble. Any minor actions of Israel are not going to change things. To truly change things they would either have to cease to exist or they would have to take down Iran--and that would mean going nuclear. Since they are not going to do either of those nothing they do will provoke war or provoke peace.
But no path to do that short of appeasement is ever presented. If there's a third path how are we a year into it and nobody presented any reasonable third path?
It's not.
People suffer in war. Why is only Israel held to a standard that you can't harm any civilian even when they're being used as a human shield?
laughing dog
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You must be immune to irony because you are nitpicking about nitpicking.
There is no point to address other than it is just a desperate attempt to slander people with whom you disagree.
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TomC
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Not like giving in to Iran and their militant proxies in Palestine would be encouraging more missiles and kidnapping. Tons of them, as a matter of fact.
The history is right there in front of everyone and God.
Tom
laughing dog
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The baby and I kill them ala
Lone_Wolf_and_Cub. Not only does it disrupt their plans, I hope it ends your inane hypothetical,
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laughing dog
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If you had actually read my response, you'd realize it rebuts your straw man. I even bold-faced and italicized it for you.
Jimmy Higgins
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I said bilby is our leading pedant!
laughing dog
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Please stop slandering posters with whom you disagree. It is more than unseemly for a moderator to engage in such egregious behavior.
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laughing dog
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. I explicitly said I kill the terrorists if I must. So there is no choice to die. Try reading the posts to which you respond.
Jimmy Higgins
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Fuck the nature of those fucking useless hypotheticals. We have a theater where over one thousand actual Israelis were slaughtered in an attack, where actual millions of Palestinians are neglected and suffering, the displacement of actual Israelis, Gazans, and Lebanese.
The Middle East is a real thing with a history mired in crap, not some fantasy world where moral ambiguity can be washed away with hypotheticals.
bilby
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Where the everlasting fuck do you get these little truthy-sounding nonsense claims from?
That's the most insanely counterfactual idea in history.
Terrorism is ALWAYS about actual wrongs.
It may be directed at easy (but inappropriate) targets, when the appropriate targets for it are too well protected; But it always has a genuine grievance at its root.
Terrorists aren't just bored kids acting out to get attention. They are people so enraged by what has been done to them that they are prepared to kill - perhaps even to die - in an effort to fight back.
Nobody is waking up one day and saying to themselves "Well, I was planning to get a job in my uncle's workshop as an apprentice, but then I remembered that I was born evil, so I had better go and kill some random people instead, for no other reason than to cause trouble".
bilby
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I may be a pedant, but I deny having ever been made of lead, or of any other heavy metal.
Well, maybe uranium.
Of course, you are right. If the thread title said "unjustified", I would have no problem with it. But "unprovoked" is utter drivel.
Harry Bosch
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I don't disagree with you. But I also think that the Hamas attack was very deliberate. I think that it is no coincidence that this happened right before the Israel/Saudi Arabia normalization pact was to be signed. And they deliberately attacked a peace concert attended by Jewish kids who want peace with Palestinians. What does that tell you? It tells me that Hamas is against the normalization pact (no surprise here); and against any peace between Jews and Palestinians.
Arctish
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Arctish
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What specific accusations of war crimes are you talking about, Loren? I have provided evidence from credible sources of specific incidents I've talked about. Are there others you want to discuss?
Link, please.
Which mass grave are you talking about?
Unsupported assertion. The video comes from an area that was securely under IDF control at the time, and follows incidents in which IDF forces shot and killed unarmed people, including shirtless, barefoot escaping hostages trying to surrender to them.
I'm not going to pretend I think you're stupid and keep explaining things to you as though you were. I've been arguing against double standards on this board and it's offshoots for over 20 years and you damn well know it.
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Damn it Dr. That is supposed to be a secret. Now everybody knows.
Tigers!
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Sigh. I will say it again. People, including your self, keep saying that Israel can defend it itself. But when Israel uses a tank, bomb, shell, aircraft etc. to defend itself up pop cries of war crimes, disproportionate response etc. If on the one hand you say that Israel can defend itself and on the other hand complain when it does then you are actually not willing to let Israel defend itself. You want Israel to lie back and think of England.
I have been aware of that fine document for many years.
But what I am asking you, Arctish, is what actions would you would consider permissible for the Israelis to do to defend themselves? Not for you to hide behind a philosophical discussions of ways. What means would you find acceptable?
What you seem to forget is that the US soldiers lived 12,000 kms from Mogadishu. They unlike the Israelis are not within rocket range. That affects the way you treat those in front of you. Which means the Israelis need to be more discriminate and sometimes they are not.
War crimes should be prohibited and punished when found. Israel soldiers who used those prisoners as shields, for example, should be punished severely.
No argument from me. Do you consider Hamas to be the government of Gaza?
laughing dog
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It is a secret because it is untrue. For example, I believe Oman has no restrictions on worship.