Black Jogger Gunned Down In The Street

[Patooka]

Looking back at the comments at the start of the thread before anyone was charged along with certain media outlets, it's pretty disappointing the common factors this incident had with other incidents.

Everybody seemed to be on board condemning this incident much like when the George Floyd incident or the plethora of other acts of excessive force or vigilante justice come to public light. But when the is a growing sentiment for there to be consequences with regards to such acts, man it's amazing how quickly some people go full blown Tucker Carlson and blame the victim instead.

It's almost as though certain elements of society are fine with condemning vigilante justice so long as there is no accountability and in their minds, that's a fair and reasonable compromise.

 

[SLD]

What should he have done?

Not run towards the guys with the guns but run away from the guys with the guns. He could certainly have run off the road, to the side, over the ditches, called for help.

{snip}

Careful now.

WTF?!?? Seriously, he’s supposed to just ignore the basic fact that a white guy is up there holding a gun on him and just hope in the good graces that he doesn’t shoot him? Well, I mean he’s a white guy, so he can’t be intent on murdering me! Sheesh. This line of thinking is insane. I don’t care if he was guilty of burglarizing the construction site. He posed no threat to the McMichaels whatsoever when they chose to point a gun at him. Once they did that, they are the aggressors and under the law they lose their right to self defense. This is a very different situation than the Rittenhouse case where the evidence showed that he didn’t point the gun at Rosenbaum until he was attacked By him. Rittenhouse backed away from the confrontation. In this case Arbery has the right to self defense and to attack the man with the gun.

Again, this case illustrates the insanity of our gun culture. Ooh, I’m a big man. I gotta gun, I’ll show him. Now Arbery is dead and three other lives are ruined. None of these fucking morons should have ever been licensed to carry any weapon. They had no serious training in the laws regarding their use, and obviously didn’t know jack shit about the law of self defense. I just hope the younger Mcmichaels never reproduces and his stupid gene is deleted from the gene pool. He got what he deserved, decades behind bars.

 

[atrib]

What should he have done?

Not run towards the guys with the guns but run away from the guys with the guns. He could certainly have run off the road, to the side, over the ditches, called for help.

Round and round we go in circles. Mr Arbery had been trying to run away from his assailants for over 5 minutes. He was not carrying a cellphone, so he couldn't have called for help. Mr Arbery had tried to go around the white truck just before he was shot, but Travis McMichael, who was out of his truck and on the road cut him off. Up until the last few seconds of the encounter, Arbery was trying to run away, but the aggressors had him cornered. In the words of Greg McMichael who was standing in the bed of his truck pointing his gun at Arbery: "We had him trapped like a rat". That was his statement to the police. He was right there, less than 10 feet from the shooting, but apparently his word isn't good enough for you - you want to keep pursuing hypothetical scenarios, apparently in an attempt to shift some of the blame on to Arbery.

Arbery is dead because three racist thugs hunted him down and killed him for no good reason. They did this despite Arbery's attempts to run away from them. After Arbery had been shot, Travis stood over his dying body and said: "Fucking n****r". And his dad called his DA buddy to ask for help in covering it up. None of the killers bothered to call the police during the pursuit, which tells is that they intended to handle the situation with their guns. That is what the facts show, that is what the prosecution demonstrated through the testimony (much of which came from the killers's own statements to the police), and that is what the jury decided. Before you make any more stupid assertions trying to shift the blame to the victim, you should take the time to at least watch the prosecution's closing arguments to understand what happened that day.

 

[Terrell]

Looks like there are people in this thread that are desperate to excuse the irresponsible & downright murderous actions of the McMichaels & Bryan. Facts be damned.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

So logic is: They did not claim citizen's arrest therefore it was lynching?
there is nothing in between?

Note that trying to run someone down with a vehicle is considered lethal force. They were trying to kill him before the guns were involved.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Has anyone even bothered to mention that the 3 White jerks never even tried to use the, "we were only trying to make a citizen's arrest" claim until after they were arrested, which was months after they killed Mr. Arbery. I don't think they were trying to make a citizen's arrest. They were trying to scare and then murdered a man simply because he was a Black man running in a White neighborhood. It's obvious to most sane people that this was a murder, inspired by racism.

Yes it was mentioned by prosecutor. I don't buy it. When you say "Stop or I blow your *** head off" it means you would not blow **** head off if I stop. That's 90% of citizen's arrest in my book.

Otherwise "citizen's arrest" would be a magic word which anyone can use to stop anyone, that's not how it works in real life. Arbery is on record ignoring policeman's command on 2 separate occasions.

"Stop or I'll blow your fucking head off" would only be legal if you were doing something that was about to cross the point where it would be legal to employ deadly force against you. Simply running doesn't qualify. Thus the only reasonable interpretation is that the person saying it is threatening to commit murder.

 

[barbos]

So logic is: They did not claim citizen's arrest therefore it was lynching?
there is nothing in between?

Note that trying to run someone down with a vehicle is considered lethal force. They were trying to kill him before the guns were involved.

I am still waiting for a proof that they were trying to run him down.

 

[barbos]

Has anyone even bothered to mention that the 3 White jerks never even tried to use the, "we were only trying to make a citizen's arrest" claim until after they were arrested, which was months after they killed Mr. Arbery. I don't think they were trying to make a citizen's arrest. They were trying to scare and then murdered a man simply because he was a Black man running in a White neighborhood. It's obvious to most sane people that this was a murder, inspired by racism.

Yes it was mentioned by prosecutor. I don't buy it. When you say "Stop or I blow your *** head off" it means you would not blow **** head off if I stop. That's 90% of citizen's arrest in my book.

Otherwise "citizen's arrest" would be a magic word which anyone can use to stop anyone, that's not how it works in real life. Arbery is on record ignoring policeman's command on 2 separate occasions.

"Stop or I'll blow your fucking head off" would only be legal if you were doing something that was about to cross the point where it would be legal to employ deadly force against you. Simply running doesn't qualify. Thus the only reasonable interpretation is that the person saying it is threatening to commit murder.

If they don't stop and even then it's a figure a speech.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It does not even matter to me.
You have some petty theft one day. Then few days later you see someone trespassing the same site you would want at least talk and ask a name.
I am sorry, but this tragedy is more complicated than racists lynching an innocent black jogger.

Seriously what the fuck Arbery was doing walking around that house multiple times at night?
And no, I am not claiming he stole anything.

So, you might want to know the person's name but they're perfectly justified in saying "fuck you" and walking away. You can't compel them to give their name. You certainly don't get to use force to get their name.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Okay, show of hands. How many people here have been on a construction site they weren't supposed to?

*all members raise hands*

Thanks, you can put your hands down now.

I can honestly say, "I have never been on a construction site I wasn't supposed to."
I sincerely doubt that I'm the only person who hasn't trespassed, much of anywhere. The closest I came was grabbing wood scraps from a home building site's burn pile to build a tree house.
Tom

Which almost certainly meant you were where you weren't supposed to be.

I'm thinking of back in grade school. There was an empty field next to the school, a lot of us who lived northwest of the school went through the field to get home. One day they started building houses across our path. If we got too close to where people were actually using power tools we would get shooed back but other than that nobody cared, we continued to pass through the construction site until fences went up and it was no longer a viable route, we had to go around.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

And they were convicted of a false arrest, so your continual fallback on that is a red herring. He was unlawfully detained and acted in self defense.

False arrest, eh? Then explain to me why did they remove citizen's arrest from the book after that?

They simply made it clearer that a citizen's arrest wasn't permitted in that sort of situation.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

1. They committed a felony by brandishing a firearm when they were not under threat which would have made the citizens arrest null and void if they could have made one

Trying to hit him with the truck is worse than brandishing the firearm.

 

[barbos]

It does not even matter to me.
You have some petty theft one day. Then few days later you see someone trespassing the same site you would want at least talk and ask a name.
I am sorry, but this tragedy is more complicated than racists lynching an innocent black jogger.

Seriously what the fuck Arbery was doing walking around that house multiple times at night?
And no, I am not claiming he stole anything.

So, you might want to know the person's name but they're perfectly justified in saying "fuck you" and walking away. You can't compel them to give their name. You certainly don't get to use force to get their name.

That's not what Arbery did though.

 

[barbos]

And they were convicted of a false arrest, so your continual fallback on that is a red herring. He was unlawfully detained and acted in self defense.

False arrest, eh? Then explain to me why did they remove citizen's arrest from the book after that?

They simply made it clearer that a citizen's arrest wasn't permitted in that sort of situation.

So you admit that it's not that clear.

 

[Gospel]

What should he have done?

Not run towards the guys with the guns but run away from the guys with the guns. He could certainly have run off the road, to the side, over the ditches, called for help.

You over here starry-eyed bushy-tailed thinking the three idiots with guns would have said "Oh sure, you're no danger to our neighbors who may have their kids playing out in the yard". BANG BANG BANG!!

 

[Jarhyn]

And they were convicted of a false arrest, so your continual fallback on that is a red herring. He was unlawfully detained and acted in self defense.

False arrest, eh? Then explain to me why did they remove citizen's arrest from the book after that?

They simply made it clearer that a citizen's arrest wasn't permitted in that sort of situation.

So you admit that it's not that clear.

No. Quit abusing language. "Clearer".

It was already clear, but just like a clear law about firearms "lawful evil" is a slippery snake to pin down.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

And they were convicted of a false arrest, so your continual fallback on that is a red herring. He was unlawfully detained and acted in self defense.

False arrest, eh? Then explain to me why did they remove citizen's arrest from the book after that?

They simply made it clearer that a citizen's arrest wasn't permitted in that sort of situation.

So you admit that it was not as clear, as it is now.

Yes, with those modifications.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

1. They committed a felony by brandishing a firearm when they were not under threat which would have made the citizens arrest null and void if they could have made one

Trying to hit him with the truck is worse than brandishing the firearm.

Brandishing a firearm after trying to hit him with a truck is worse than trying to hit him with a truck. The keyword is escalation, which is the source of Arbery's desperation.

 

[Elixir]

Poor McMichaels & Bryan! Not only were they wrongly convicted of murder after trying to uphold their god-given right to kill nigras, they are apparently bereft of supporters even in this forum, other than one misguided Russian with no clue about American racism, trying to impose his uninformed views upon those who know better.
Sucks to be them, I guess.
Oh well… maybe Putin’s Boy will “win” again in ‘24 and pardon them all.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Poor McMichaels & Bryan! Not only were they wrongly convicted of murder after trying to uphold their god-given right to kill nigras, they are apparently bereft of supporters even in this forum, other than one misguided Russian with no clue about American racism, trying to impose his uninformed views upon those who know better.
Sucks to be them, I guess.
Oh well… maybe Putin’s Boy will “win” again in ‘24 and pardon them all.

He only pardons people with celebrity backing.