"Coronavirus and the US" or "We are all going to die!!!!"

[Jimmy Higgins]

The hospital is a bit of a thing, though, I have to wonder what in the heck excavators that are so tightly packed could possibly be accomplishing.

It's probably a case of putting on a show but I can see something they might actually be doing--driving around. A pale imitation of properly compacting the soil but for temporary structures it might be enough.

If you wanted compaction, you could just drive four or five sheepfoots out there. I'm watching the video and thinking, what could they be doing? There isn't any room to excavate. There are quicker ways to compact. I don't see a proof roller or a grader. There are literally dozens of excavators out there doing the Harlem Shake. Also, the color of that soil freaks the heck out of me.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Well I for one am well prepared for what is to come; I am up to part 24 of R R Haywood's The Undead, so I have a thorough grounding in the appropriate response to the collapse of civilisation.

I have a sledgehammer in the shed, and plenty of tinned food in the larder.

The burning twisters full of funnel spiders (also on fire) will kill you before Coronavirus makes it across the pond from Asia.

Nobody should be working around the clock, especially in a field like medicine. That's how accidents happen.

I think they mean the LABS are operating around the clock, not the researchers, but whatever.
Now i'm going to spend time in a meeting trying to imagine what sort of superhero would have their origin story in a coronavirus lab accident.

Let's see... working on a cure to the virus in rats... but they gave the wrong rat the virus, it was for the diabetes study. So with both Coronavirus and Diabetes, the rat mutates into fat, lazy, wheezing... wait... this Donald Trump's origin story.

 

[Keith&Co.]

The Sniffler

The Big Sneeze

I was going more towards Hyper Bowl...

 

[Loren Pechtel]

What is wrong with you? Seriously, are you okay? What would make you say something like that?

Pay attention to what's actually going on. Calling them "hospitals" doesn't make them so. There's no way they have much in the way of equipment being built that fast. It's buildings with beds and nurses.

Nobody should be working around the clock, especially in a field like medicine. That's how accidents happen. And the doctors at least aren't being given a choice, they are forced to work--mostly with inadequate protective measures. There already have been multiple fatalities due to this.

Evidence, please? The doctors and nurses working on this are incredibly serious about it:

I think Keith&Co figured out what they really meant--the facilities are working around the clock, not the people.

Wuhan nurse cured after being infected with coronavirus

Sorry, but the China Daily isn't a credible news source about anything remotely political.

As for Hong Kong--I don't blame the protesters one bit. I would expect plenty of healthy protesters to end up in them. Hong Kong has 10 cases, they don't need facilities like that yet.

From Reuters: Anti-government protesters set alight the lobby of a newly built residential building that authorities planned to use as a quarantine facility, as public fears about the coronavirus outbreak intensify in Hong.

Arson is not a reasonable response to building an emergency shelter in case the disease spreads further than it has. Keep defending them and their fight for "democracy" though

Destroying a facility that would most likely be used to disappear people is a good thing.

How about Germans burning Auschwitz while it was under construction?

 

[Elixir]

Why worry, be happy. If you're worried about a Corona Virus apocalypse, think about how much more resistant the post-pandemic human genome will be!
(But don't go near me if you're sick!)

 

[bilby]

It's buildings with beds and nurses.

...or to use the English word, "Hospitals".

 

[Copernicus]

...Yes, this virus could become a much greater problem than it is right now, but I hate to see people panicking. I read yesterday that people have been hoarding masks, and there is fear that people who really need them, like medical workers and those who have the virus, won't be able to obtain them. Hand washing with soap and water is still the most effective way to prevent the spread of infections. The problem is. that most people, including many health care professionals don't properly wash their hands. Some use sanitizer, which is far less effective than using soap and water, and scrubbing for a least 20 seconds.

Yes, I've seen young, healthy people walking around with masks in the Seattle area, and it is not possible to find masks in any store now. There is close to zero chance of catching the coronavirus in Seattle right now, but maybe they are trying to make a point about how scared they are. Masks sold out about a week ago because of panic buying, and the stores have no idea when they'll be able to get them again. We have a small supply of them, but a neighbor has offered to lend us some, if needed.

Here is why masks alone will not really protect most people, aside from the fact that most do not know how to put them on or handle them. Viruses like influenza and the coronavirus can get into the body through the eyes. You need to wear goggles or some form of eye protection, like medical professionals do. A friend of mine who is a medical professional suggested trying wrap-around glasses. Never rub your eyes or touch your face, if people near you are sneezing or coughing.

 

[barbos]

213 dead, 9692 infected

 

[Copernicus]

213 dead, 9692 infected

I think we realize that it will get a lot worse. The worst case is that it will approach or get past the 9,000 people who have already perished from common influenza. I don't have figures on how many have been infected.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

At the moment, China is the epicenter and the infected number appears to be pretty high, pretty quickly. The uptick outside of China isn't anywhere near as bad, and there are ways to isolate people and those they've been in contact with. China, however, it is getting around.

 

[southernhybrid]

If you can access it, the NYTimes had a good piece today on the virus.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/world/asia/china-coronavirus-contain.html?action=click&module=Top%20Stories&pgtype=Homepage

While the virus is a serious public health concern, the risk to most people outside China remains very low, and seasonal flu is a more immediate threat.

The scale of an outbreak depends on how quickly and easily a virus is transmitted from person to person. While research has just begun, scientists have estimated that each person with the Wuhan coronavirus could infect somewhere between 1.5 and 3.5 people without effective containment measures.

That would make the new virus roughly as contagious as SARS, another coronavirus that circulated in China in 2003 and was contained after it sickened 8,098 people and killed 774. Respiratory viruses like these can travel through the air, enveloped in tiny droplets that are produced when a sick person breathes, talks, coughs or sneezes.

These droplets fall to the ground within a few feet. That makes the virus harder to get than pathogens like measles, chickenpox and tuberculosis, which can travel a hundred feet through the air.

Early indications suggest the fatality rate for this virus is considerably less than another coronavirus, MERS, which kills about one in three people who become infected, and SARS, which kills about one in 10. All of the diseases appear to latch on to proteins on the surface of lung cells, but MERS and SARS seem to be more destructive to lung tissue. As of Jan. 31, fewer than one in 40 of the people with confirmed infections had died. Many of those who died were older men with underlying health problems.

Officials at the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention estimate that the Wuhan coronavirus has an incubation period of 2 to 14 days. But it is still not clear whether a person can spread the virus before symptoms develop, or whether the severity of the illness affects how easily a patient can spread the virus.

n addition to closing off transportation, officials shut down a market in Wuhan selling live poultry, seafood and wild animals, which was thought to be the origin of the coronavirus, and later suspended the trade of wild animals nationwide. Schools have been closed, Beijing’s Great Wall is off limits and tourist packages from China have been halted. World Health Organization officials have praised China’s aggressive response to the virus.

But the measures have also had unintended effects. Residents in Wuhan who are unwell must walk or cycle for miles to get to hospitals. There, many complain that they are being turned away because of shortages of hospital beds, staff and supplies that have been made worse by the lockdown.

Until recently, researchers abroad were also concerned by the fact that China was not admitting experts who could help track the virus and prevent its spread.

So, it doesn't look like much of a threat unless you live in certain parts of China. As of today, there have only been 6 cases identified in the US. Still due to what I think is an over reaction, the DOW lost over 600 points, almost all air travel has been banned between the US and China and about 200 Americans have been involuntarily quarantined, just because they were returning from China. This stuff is being constantly broadcasted on the news, which is probably scaring people unnecessarily. I don't remember people freaking out about SARS like this. What's wrong with people?

Just now, I heard someone from the CDC say that the mortality rate appears to be about 3% for this, just twice the mortality for seasonal influenza.

 

[Elixir]

...due to what I think is an over reaction, the DOW lost over 600 points.

I'm not so sure it's an overreaction - looks sort of like a self-fulfilling prophecy to me. Few things can puncture an economic bubble quicker than a big drop in consumer confidence. People in the US are very much aware of the fact that they are consuming Chinese goods every day. It may be irrational to think you can catch an exotic deadly respiratory illness from hard goods, but the subconscious negative association is a very real thing.
Though the mortality rate may be "merely" double that of the flu, the number of persons infected can already be reliably projected to be massive and international. Meanwhile, the Trumponomic fairytale propped up by trillions in tax revenue dumped directly back into the pockets and companies of the Republican donors, would be overdue for a "correction" in any event just because of the length of the Obama recovery. Cheato has already shot his wad as far as meddling with the markets - interest rates can't go lower by enough to prop things up, and supply lines are going to be effected even if the Corona Virus is largely contained to China. The story, because of the potential for massive numbers of patients, is going to remain (as it should) in the headlines until this thing peaks - which is estimated to be months from now.
It could be a pretty ugly picture in the equities markets for a while yet. I'd watch the consumer confidence index somewhat closely if I was heavily invested.

 

[barbos]

At the moment, China is the epicenter and the infected number appears to be pretty high, pretty quickly. The uptick outside of China isn't anywhere near as bad, and there are ways to isolate people and those they've been in contact with. China, however, it is getting around.

It does look like this virus have troubles spreading outside of China but I think we need to wait a little longer before be sure.

 

[barbos]

304 dead
13846 infected

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

304 dead
13846 infected

Sayeth the Grim Reaper...

First case on the U.S. east coast reported from a person returning from Wuhan.

 

[southernhybrid]

How China mismanaged the early development of the new viral disease

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/01/world/asia/china-coronavirus.html

A mysterious illness had stricken seven patients at a hospital, and a doctor tried to warn his medical school classmates. “Quarantined in the emergency department,” the doctor, Li Wenliang, wrote in an online chat group on Dec. 30, referring to patients.

“So frightening,” one recipient replied, before asking about the epidemic that began in China in 2002 and ultimately killed nearly 800 people. “Is SARS coming again?”

In the middle of the night, officials from the health authority in the central city of Wuhan summoned Dr. Li, demanding to know why he had shared the information. Three days later, the police compelled him to sign a statement that his warning constituted “illegal behavior.”

The government’s initial handling of the epidemic allowed the virus to gain a tenacious hold. At critical moments, officials chose to put secrecy and order ahead of openly confronting the growing crisis to avoid public alarm and political embarrassment.

A reconstruction of the crucial seven weeks between the appearance of the first symptoms in early December and the government’s decision to lock down the city, based on two dozen interviews with Wuhan residents, doctors and officials, on government statements and on Chinese media reports, points to decisions that delayed a concerted public health offensive.

In those weeks, the authorities silenced doctors and others for raising red flags. They played down the dangers to the public, leaving the city’s 11 million residents unaware they should protect themselves. They closed a food market where the virus was believed to have started, but didn’t broadly curb the wildlife trade.

So, the Chinese government knew there was a potential epidemic in early December but it silenced medical professionals who put out warnings about the new viral infection.

“Stressing politics is always No. 1,” the governor of Hubei, Wang Xiaodong, told officials on Jan. 17, citing Mr. Xi’s precepts of top-down obedience. “Political issues are at any time the most fundamental major issues.”

Shortly after, Wuhan went ahead with a massive annual potluck banquet for 40,000 families from a city precinct, which critics later cited as evidence that local leaders took the virus far too lightly.

As the congress was taking place, the health commission’s daily updates on the outbreak said again and again that there were no new cases of infection, no firm evidence of human transmission and no infection of medical workers.

“We knew this was not the case!” said a complaint later filed with the National Health Commission on a government website. The anonymous author said he was a doctor in Wuhan and described a surge in unusual chest illnesses beginning Jan. 12.

Officials told doctors at a top city hospital “don’t use the words viral pneumonia on the image reports,” according to the complaint, which has since been removed. People were complacent, “thinking that if the official reports had nothing, then we were exaggerating,” the doctor explained.

So, there is evidence that China tried to downplay the potential dangers of this new viral disease for political reasons. There are a lot more details in the linked article if anyone is interested and can access it. I imagine if you google up "how China mismanaged the epidemic" you could probably find more information of what China did wrong.

Of course, at this point, we can just hope that the epidemic will be managed more effectively.

 

[barbos]

Dead 361+1 (China+outside)
infected >17000

 

[Copernicus]

Dead 361+1 (China+outside)
infected >17000

Impressive. By way of contrast, only 10,000 people have died from influenza over the 2019-2020 season and 180,000 have been hospitalized. Something like 10-20% of the population is infected every year. Don't worry, though. That is confined to the US. I don't have the worldwide figures.

High flu activity spreads across US as virus claims 14 more children

Weekly U.S. Influenza Surveillance Report

Had your flu shot yet? The shot this year missed the target, but a second epidemic is starting up now that is protected against.

 

[barbos]

Dead 361+1 (China+outside)
infected >17000

Impressive. By way of contrast, only 10,000 people have died from influenza over the 2019-2020 season and 180,000 have been hospitalized. Something like 10-20% of the population is infected every year. Don't worry, though. That is confined to the US. I don't have the worldwide figures.

Again, these are mostly old and sick people. I have never had flu, common cold only, especially when I was a kid.
I try to rely on hygiene - wash hands and don't touch face while outside

High flu activity spreads across US as virus claims 14 more children

Weekly U.S. Influenza Surveillance Report

Had your flu shot yet? The shot this year missed the target, but a second epidemic is starting up now that is protected against.

It's a third world country here, no such thing as flu shots.

 

[Copernicus]

...
Again, these are mostly old and sick people. I have never had flu, common cold only, especially when I was a kid.
I try to rely on hygiene - wash hands and don't touch face while outside

FWIW, I hope you stay healthy. Soap and hot water are the best defense.

Had your flu shot yet? The shot this year missed the target, but a second epidemic is starting up now that is protected against.

It's a third world country here, no such thing as flu shots.

But Russia is not really a third world country. At least, it shouldn't be in reasonably-sized cities. Don't they offer free flu shots every year? From my last two visits to Russia, I got the impression that the standard of living had really risen considerably. Not like in 1997, when there were a lot of people on the streets begging for help.

A free flu shot would likely pay for itself, since influenza is a burden on national economies. The US suffers from the fact that only people with insurance, including Medicare recipients like myself, are entitled to free flu shots. A lot of people never bother with the extra out-of-pocket expense.