Disney's Frozen is coming for your manhood

[Bronzeage]

I do not know about Frozen but especially in many US commercials and sitcoms men are usually portrayed as idiots who have to be rescued by their smart wives. I think at least part of the reason is rampant political correctness and the fact that if a woman were portrayed as stupid and man as smart the work would be labeled as "sexist" with brigades of radical feminists descending to attack the work.
Unfortunately this kind of bitching about non-PC content is starting to happen for video games as well with that insufferable Anita Sarkeesian character.

Disney concentrates on Princess movies because that's where the merchandising money is. They are good at it and will stick to stories that little girls like and stuff they want to buy.

We still have Transformers and GI Joe.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Transformers is racist against robots by playing into the stereotype that they make for shitty movies.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Transformers is racist against robots by playing into the stereotype that they make for shitty movies.

I thought it was unfair to shitty directors.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Transformers is racist against robots by playing into the stereotype that they make for shitty movies.

I thought it was unfair to shitty directors.

That's true. It plays into the unfair trope that Michael Bay makes Michael Bay movies.

 

[bigfield]

Haven't seen Frozen, but I would expect that, in a movie aimed at young girls, the male characters would merely be acting as a foil to the heroine(s). If they are dumb or evil, it's merely because that's the role they serve in the film.

On the subject of sitcoms, Foxtel have recently been running the old sitcom Full House, which was made when I was in single digits. What struck me is that the character Danny Tanner is a nurturing and loving father who acts like a decent parent should. It's a stark contrast from almost every other sitcom that comes to mind, where the father has a dysfunctional relationship with his family, or a husband has a dysfunctional relationship with his wife.

 

[Derec]

Disney concentrates on Princess movies because that's where the merchandising money is. They are good at it and will stick to stories that little girls like and stuff they want to buy.

I didn't say anything against princess movies per se. It should certainly be possible to make a princess movie without denigrating men. I cannot say whether or not Frozen is anti-male as the article in the OP claimed, but I did point to a general tendency in media to that effect.

 

[thebeave]

It is not enough to have a ditzy blonde, you have to pair her with a much smarter man to reverse the dominant trope of dumb men and smart women.
The trope codifier is probably Simpsons where they went as far to make all men in that family idiots and all women geniuses. But it is hardly the only one.

Yeah, because no one takes men seriously anymore. That's why in the last election, congress became 90% female.

No, wait...

No one is stopping women for running for Congress, or any office for that matter. And women are greater than 50% of the population, so your voter base to elect them is there (not to mention that the majority of men will have no problem voting a woman into office). So, if you want more women in office, look in the mirror.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Yeah, because no one takes men seriously anymore. That's why in the last election, congress became 90% female.

No, wait...

No one is stopping women for running for Congress, or any office for that matter. And women are greater than 50% of the population, so your voter base to elect them is there (not to mention that the majority of men will have no problem voting a woman into office). So, if you want more women in office, look in the mirror.

Ok, This is the point here > THE POINT

this is you















>YOU


Missed it by that much.

 

[Rhea]

Are you kidding me? Have you not seen all the movies and shows with ditzy women, usually blondes?

It is not enough to have a ditzy blonde, you have to pair her with a much smarter man to reverse the dominant trope of dumb men and smart women.
The trope codifier is probably Simpsons where they went as far to make all men in that family idiots and all women geniuses. But it is hardly the only one.

Make sure you don't watch Big Bang Theory
Or Three's Company
Or Archie Bunker
Or The A Team
Or.... I couldn't possibly list them all.

This is hilarious.

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Haven't seen Frozen, but I would expect that, in a movie aimed at young girls, the male characters would merely be acting as a foil to the heroine(s). If they are dumb or evil, it's merely because that's the role they serve in the film.

On the subject of sitcoms, Foxtel have recently been running the old sitcom Full House, which was made when I was in single digits. What struck me is that the character Danny Tanner is a nurturing and loving father who acts like a decent parent should. It's a stark contrast from almost every other sitcom that comes to mind, where the father has a dysfunctional relationship with his family, or a husband has a dysfunctional relationship with his wife.

Yeah, remember the Cosby Show?

 

[Underseer]

Haven't seen Frozen, but I would expect that, in a movie aimed at young girls, the male characters would merely be acting as a foil to the heroine(s). If they are dumb or evil, it's merely because that's the role they serve in the film.

[...]

But that's exactly why Frozen is proof that men are being persecuted. Up until recent years, every single female character was a foil for a male character. Now we occasionally get movies in which the male characters are foil to female characters, thus it is proven that males are being persecuted by Hollywood.

 

[bigfield]

Haven't seen Frozen, but I would expect that, in a movie aimed at young girls, the male characters would merely be acting as a foil to the heroine(s). If they are dumb or evil, it's merely because that's the role they serve in the film.

On the subject of sitcoms, Foxtel have recently been running the old sitcom Full House, which was made when I was in single digits. What struck me is that the character Danny Tanner is a nurturing and loving father who acts like a decent parent should. It's a stark contrast from almost every other sitcom that comes to mind, where the father has a dysfunctional relationship with his family, or a husband has a dysfunctional relationship with his wife.

Yeah, remember the Cosby Show?

Nope - before my time, and haven't caught any reruns. Fox Classics will probably run it again sooner or later.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Yeah, remember the Cosby Show?

Nope - before my time, and haven't caught any reruns. Fox Classics will probably run it again sooner or later.

Meh. It's pretty much just Cosby drugging and raping random people. It gets old after the first couple of episodes.

 

[Axulus]

Nope - before my time, and haven't caught any reruns. Fox Classics will probably run it again sooner or later.

Meh. It's pretty much just Cosby drugging and raping random people. It gets old after the first couple of episodes.

Allegedly - the episodes never provide any video proof. He and his attorney deny it in every episode and Clair Huxtable always stands by her man. Cliff Huxtable's escapades at the playboy mansion kept things fresh though.

 

[Derec]

Haven't seen Frozen, but I would expect that, in a movie aimed at young girls, the male characters would merely be acting as a foil to the heroine(s). If they are dumb or evil, it's merely because that's the role they serve in the film.

But if there was a cartoon aimed at young boys where all the female characters were dumb and/or evil there would be much opposition to them from the feminist left and the very same people who make fun of the silly Fox News would defend these attacks.
Remember, the whole Gamergate started because apparently Super Mario is super sexist because he is rescuing a princess and in GTA it's perfectly ok to kill men, but the GTA games are unacceptably sexist because you can kill women as well.

On the subject of sitcoms, Foxtel have recently been running the old sitcom Full House, which was made when I was in single digits. What struck me is that the character Danny Tanner is a nurturing and loving father who acts like a decent parent should. It's a stark contrast from almost every other sitcom that comes to mind, where the father has a dysfunctional relationship with his family, or a husband has a dysfunctional relationship with his wife.

I was in single digits too, at least when it started (I am between DJ and the second daughter in age).

 

[Derec]

Make sure you don't watch Big Bang Theory
Or Three's Company
Or Archie Bunker
Or The A Team

None of these are family sitcoms. And in Big Bang Theory they made sure to emasculate Howard (he has to beg for allowance for example) by making Bernadette make much more money than he does, even though in real world aerospace engineers outearn microbiologists.

Yeah, remember the Cosby Show?

Yeah, the only boy (Theo) was the dumb one, as per the sexist trope. Also the wife character was horrible. She didn't let Heathcliff do anything!

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But that's exactly why Frozen is proof that men are being persecuted. Up until recent years, every single female character was a foil for a male character. Now we occasionally get movies in which the male characters are foil to female characters, thus it is proven that males are being persecuted by Hollywood.

But we were also taught for years that such foils are sexist and patriarchal. Are matriarchal foils any less sexist? Why?

 

[Toni]

None of these are family sitcoms. And in Big Bang Theory they made sure to emasculate Howard (he has to beg for allowance for example) by making Bernadette make much more money than he does, even though in real world aerospace engineers outearn microbiologists.

Usually, that's true. But Howard is working in academia, although he isn't teaching (I don't think) so he won't be making big bucks. If Bernadette is making big bucks, it's because she is working for Big Pharma in tv fantasy land.

The thing about the whole Howard/Bernadette dynamic is threefold:

1. Howard has a dysfunctional and overly close relationship with his mother and an absent father.
2. Prior to Bernadette, Howard was at best, a sexist pig who could not stop hitting on Penny or virtually any other female and whose main purpose in life outside of his job and geeky interests was scamming on women, any woman, whom he reduced to stereotypes. So, this thing with Bernadette earning more money, and acting like his mother a)plays into #1 above b)is an amusing turnabout for Howard and c)the allowance thing wouldn't have happened if Howard weren't irresponsible with money and household chores and acted like a grown up instead of a spoilt little boy.
3. Bernadette is tiny and blonde and very sweet looking, like a sweet little Catholic girl. The fact that she's domineering is funny because it is such an unexpected trait given her physical persona and her voice.

BTW, what gives with thinking that if a woman earns more money than a man then the man is emasculated? The 50's called and they want their attitudes back, dude. My husband assures me he would be thrilled if I out-earned him. I would be, too, assuming it wasn't because his earnings sank below the level of mine. Of course, I believe him because he sure wasn't complaining when I did earn more than he did.

Yeah, remember the Cosby Show?

Yeah, the only boy (Theo) was the dumb one, as per the sexist trope. Also the wife character was horrible. She didn't let Heathcliff do anything!

You must be forgetting Denise, the family screw up/air head. Theo wasn't dumb, but it was discovered that he had a learning disability--dyslexia, which in fact, is more common in males than in females.

Claire just tried to keep Heathcliff on the straight and narrow when it came to eating right. That's pretty much one of those things that a whole lot of wives do, Derec. But don't you worry your pretty little head about that: I let my husband retain his masculinity by taking out the trash and mowing the lawn although I am more than capable of doing both. And I also let him cook. And he lets me have the horrible commute. It's all about the balance.

But that's exactly why Frozen is proof that men are being persecuted. Up until recent years, every single female character was a foil for a male character. Now we occasionally get movies in which the male characters are foil to female characters, thus it is proven that males are being persecuted by Hollywood.

But we were also taught for years that such foils are sexist and patriarchal. Are matriarchal foils any less sexist? Why?

Have you actually seen Frozen, Derec? Because trust me, the girls come across as being pretty stupid, too. I managed to sit through the whole thing and thought it was just awful. Awful. Awwful. The snowman was the brains of the whole thing and he was a)male and b)made out of snow and c)comic relief. There was still a male rescuer. The older, gifted sister had to be imprisoned and then ran away because her power was so frightening. The younger sister was so gullible that she fell for the first male who batted his eyes at her and who was only after her money and kingdom. So much for female empowerment. The only evidence of 'female empowerment' was that Elsa was to rule the kingdom. She wouldn't have a man, but she would be in charge. Anna, the younger ungifted sister was sufficiently unthreatening to attract male suiters and a potential mate. Blech.

Aside from that, I will agree with you that idiot father as a TV trope is offensive. I don't care for it, either.

 

[Toni]

I do not know about Frozen but especially in many US commercials and sitcoms men are usually portrayed as idiots who have to be rescued by their smart wives. I think at least part of the reason is rampant political correctness and the fact that if a woman were portrayed as stupid and man as smart the work would be labeled as "sexist" with brigades of radical feminists descending to attack the work.
Unfortunately this kind of bitching about non-PC content is starting to happen for video games as well with that insufferable Anita Sarkeesian character.

Disney concentrates on Princess movies because that's where the merchandising money is. They are good at it and will stick to stories that little girls like and stuff they want to buy.

We still have Transformers and GI Joe.

Wellllll, they'll stick to stories that out of touch parents and distant relations who want an easy gift to buy little girls can relate to.

Lots and lots and lots of little girls have never been interested in princess stories. Personally, I always thought wanting to be a princess showed a distinct lack of both imagination and ambition. And the main dynamic in the stories wasn't Princess being rescued by Prince but Princess winning over Evil Stepmother.

 

[fast]

Out of touch with what?

 

[bigfield]

But if there was a cartoon aimed at young boys where all the female characters were dumb and/or evil there would be much opposition to them from the feminist left and the very same people who make fun of the silly Fox News would defend these attacks.
Remember, the whole Gamergate started because apparently Super Mario is super sexist because he is rescuing a princess and in GTA it's perfectly ok to kill men, but the GTA games are unacceptably sexist because you can kill women as well.

I don't recall anyone on FRDB defending Sarkeesian's idiotic claims who is now here hanging shit on Fox.

 

[bigfield]

None of these are family sitcoms. And in Big Bang Theory they made sure to emasculate Howard (he has to beg for allowance for example) by making Bernadette make much more money than he does, even though in real world aerospace engineers outearn microbiologists.

BTW, what gives with thinking that if a woman earns more money than a man then the man is emasculated? The 50's called and they want their attitudes back, dude. My husband assures me he would be thrilled if I out-earned him. I would be, too, assuming it wasn't because his earnings sank below the level of mine. Of course, I believe him because he sure wasn't complaining when I did earn more than he did.

Indeed, Derec, what the fuck?