Merged Gaza just launched an unprovoked attack on Israel

[lpetrich]

Israel-Hamas war live: Israel-Hamas ceasefire talks ‘at advanced stage’ | Israel-Palestine conflict News | Al Jazeera

• Al Jazeera sources say negotiations, mediated by Qatar, on a ceasefire and prisoner exchange deal between Israel and Hamas are “progressing and at an advanced stage”.
• Only a “handful” of aid convoys have been allowed into Gaza and the situation for besieged and bombed Palestinians is spiraling out of control, says Philippe Lazzarini, commissioner-general of the UN’s Palestine refugees agency. “Gaza is being strangled.”
• Hamas claims responsibility for rocket attack that hit Tel Aviv building, wounding three people.
• At least 7,326 Palestinians have been killed in Israeli attacks since October 7, as Israel promises to continue raids into Palestinian territories. More than 1,400 people were killed in the Hamas attack on Israel

Seems like good news.

French President Emmanuel Macron says several European countries are looking to build up a “humanitarian coalition” for Gaza.

...
Al Jazeera sources say negotiations, mediated by Qatar, on a ceasefire and prisoner exchange deal between Israel and Hamas are quickly progressing.

...
The report on negotiations for a ceasefire between Israel and Hamas officials in Qatar progressing comes in line with Israel’s recent readiness to pay a price for the release of hostages, America’s concern over the implications of a land invasion in Gaza, and Palestine’s imminent need for a ceasefire.

...
Following the news that advanced negotiations are “progressing” on a potential ceasefire and prisoner exchange, Ibrahim Fraihat from the Doha Institute says the news is a “huge breakthrough” depending on the terms of the agreement.

 

[lpetrich]

More from Al Jazeera.

UN says Gaza health ministry death tolls in earlier conflicts ‘credible’

The UN agency for Palestinian refugees says the death toll given by the health ministry in Gaza had proved to be “credible” in previous conflicts after Washington raised doubts about figures from the current war.

“In the past, the five, six cycles of conflict in the Gaza Strip, these figures were considered as credible and no one ever really challenged these figures,” UNRWA chief Philippe Lazzarini told reporters.

Lazzarini said 57 UNRWA staff had been killed since the conflict began, explaining how the agency’s death toll was in line with the ratio of Palestinians killed to the territory’s overall population, as provided by the health ministry.

“We have more or less the same percentage,” he said.

Lazzarini’s comments came just days after US President Joe Biden said he had “no confidence” in the figures provided by Gaza’s health ministry, drawing criticism from Palestinian rights advocates. On Thursday, meanwhile, the health ministry released a list with the names of the more than 7,000 Palestinians, including nearly 3,000 children, killed since the war began on October 7.

Seems to me that President Biden was uncritically repeating what some Israeli officials claimed -- that Hamas is ordering the hospital administrators to exaggerate the death toll from Israel's attacks on the Gaza Strip.

Hundreds rally at Ramallah protest despite ‘fear and anxiety’

It is a large rally by Ramallah standards these days. They are chanting support for Gaza as well as the Qassam Brigades – the military arm of Hamas. There are protests occurring in other cities and towns in the occupied West Bank.

You must not underestimate the amount of anxiety and fear that exists across the occupied West Bank. I’ve been reporting for weeks now about the nightly Israeli raids and detentions. There is also the settler violence – an average of eight attacks a day and they are increasing.

A far-right member of the Israeli government – who is also Israel’s national security minister Itamar Ben-Gvir – has been arming the settlers. The army has said it is ‘taking off its gloves’. So people are afraid.

So those settlers have become terrorists.

Nine trucks carrying ‘141 metric tonnes’ of food crossed into Gaza: WFP

The World Food Programme says nine trucks carrying 141 metric tonnes of food supplies crossed into Gaza since the Rafah crossing opened on Saturday.

But to ramp up its operation in the next two months and reach 1.1 million people in the Gaza Strip, 40 trucks need to enter the besieged enclave daily.

“For every person that received WFP food assistance, at least six more are in need,” the aid agency says.

 

[lpetrich]

A Wave Of People Are Tearing Down Posters Of Missing Israelis | HuffPost Latest News - "The missing persons flyers depict Israelis taken hostage by Hamas."

Gaza: Hamas-controlled health ministry publishes names of thousands of people killed in Gaza | CNN

The health ministry in Hamas-controlled Gaza has published a report listing the names of more than 6,000 “documented deaths” in Gaza since the October 7 terror attacks on Israel, after US President Joe Biden questioned the reliability of Palestinian casualty figures.

The report stated that between October 7 and 26, 7,028 Palestinians were killed, including 2,913 children, and blamed the deaths on Israeli military “aggression.” It said a further 281 bodies had not yet been identified.

The ministry said the actual number of dead is likely to be much higher than stated in the report.

How does Gaza’s Ministry of Health calculate the death toll? | AP News

How many Palestinians have been killed in the Gaza Strip since the war between Israel and Hamas started?

With Israel besieging and bombing territory at a scale never seen before, arriving at a precise answer isn’t easy. Cell service is spotty. Internet and power are out. Airstrikes have pulverized roads and leveled neighborhoods, slowing rescue work.
Doctors scribble on notepads in overflowing morgues and hospital halls, struggling to account for bodies trapped under rubble and tossed in hastily dug mass graves. The chaos has added to the likelihood of errors.

 

[lpetrich]

Israel Steps Up Air And Ground Attacks In Gaza And Cuts Off The Territory's Communications | HuffPost Latest News

Israel knocked out internet and communications in the Gaza Strip in stepped-up bombardment Friday night, largely cutting off its 2.3 million people from contact with each other and the outside world and creating a near-blackout of information, as the military said it was “expanding” ground operations in the territory.

Sirens and explosions heard over Gaza as Israel expands ground operation - YouTube


Husam Zomlot on X: "I have been trying to reach my family in Gaza for hours with no success. All telecommunications and internet have been cut, while Israeli strikes is literally destroying Gaza from air land and sea. How many more innocent people: children, parents and grandparents will be murdered before the world steps in?" / X
then
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez on X: "Cutting off all communication to a population of 2.2 million is unacceptable. Journalists, medical professionals, humanitarian efforts, and innocents are all endangered. I do not know how such an act can be defended. The United States has historically denounced this practice." / X

 

[lpetrich]

IfNotNow on X: "HAPPENING NOW: we’re at the @jvplive takeover of Grand Central Station to demand #CeasefireNOW.
As the Israeli government starves and bombs and invades the people of Gaza in the dark, the actions we take these next days and weeks will define our lifetimes. (vid link)" / X
and
Rafael Shimunov on X: "Jews calling for #ceasefirenow have taken over NYC’s grand central station in the name of Palestinians of Gaza we say not in our name. (vid link)" / X

That's a commuter-rail station in downtown Manhattan, one with an anachronistic name. Though once a major intercity station, it is nowadays a commuter-rail station, its trains now going only to upstate New York, Connecticut, and Long Island.

NYC protesters demand Israeli cease-fire, at least 200 detained after filling Grand Central station | AP News

“Hundreds of Jews and friends are taking over Grand Central Station in a historic sit-in calling for a ceasefire,” advocacy group Jewish Voice for Peace said on social media.

The scene echoed last week’s sit-in on Capitol Hill in Washington, where Jewish advocacy groups, including Jewish Voice for Peace and If Not Now, poured into a congressional office building. More than 300 people were arrested for illegally demonstrating.

noting
More than 300 are arrested in a Capitol Hill protest urging a cease-fire in the Israel-Hamas war | AP News

 

[lpetrich]

UN General Assembly calls for 'humanitarian truce' in Gaza leading to halt in Israel-Hamas fighting | AP News

Israel’s U.N. Ambassador Gilad Erdan called it “a day that will go down in infamy,” saying after the vote: “Israel will not stop the operation until Hamas terror capabilities are destroyed and our hostages are returned. … And the only way to destroy Hamas is root them out of their tunnels and subterranean city of terror.”

UN News on X: "BREAKING: UN General Assembly ADOPTS resolution on “protection of civilians and upholding legal and humanitarian obligations” on the ongoing Gaza crisis FOR: 120
AGAINST: 14
ABSTAIN: 45
LIVE COVERAGE (links)" / X
noting
UN General Assembly adopts Gaza resolution calling for immediate and sustained ‘humanitarian truce’ | UN News

The United Nations General Assembly on Friday adopted a resolution calling for an “immediate, durable and sustained humanitarian truce” between Israeli forces and Hamas militants in Gaza. It also demands “continuous, sufficient and unhindered” provision of lifesaving supplies and services for civilians trapped inside the enclave, as news reports suggest Israel has expanded ground operations and intensified its bombing campaign.

I looked for patterns in which nation voted for what, but without a lot of success. It was mainly Third-World nations that were for it, though a few industrialized ones voted for it. Most such nations abstained, however.

 

[lpetrich]

Israel-Hamas war casualties, injuries and people displaced | AP News

The kill ratio is currently 5 Palestinians for each Israeli.

 

[lpetrich]

H.Res.772 - 118th Congress (2023-2024): Censuring Representative Rashida Tlaib. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
Rep. Bergman, Jack [R-MI-1] (Introduced 10/11/2023)
No details

H.Res.807 - 118th Congress (2023-2024): Censuring Representative Rashida Tlaib for antisemitic activity, sympathizing with terrorist organizations, and leading an insurrection at the United States Capitol Complex. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
Rep. Greene, Marjorie Taylor [R-GA-14] (Introduced 10/24/2023)
No details

Marjorie Taylor Greene's Move to Censure Rashida Tlaib Backfires

Representative Becca Balint, a freshman Democrat, introduced a resolution aiming to censure Greene in the House of Representatives on Thursday and accused the Republican of using "Islamophobic" rhetoric.

Greene has called Tlaib, who is Muslim, an "Israel hating America hating woman who does not represent anything America stands for" and introduced a resolution to the House floor on Thursday to censure the Democrat over her response to the conflict between Israel and Hamas.

 

[Derec]

H.Res.772 - 118th Congress (2023-2024): Censuring Representative Rashida Tlaib. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
Rep. Bergman, Jack [R-MI-1] (Introduced 10/11/2023)
No details

She still believes Hamas over our own intelligence and the president from her own party. It is right to censure her.

Representative Becca Balint, a freshman Democrat, introduced a resolution aiming to censure Greene in the House of Representatives on Thursday and accused the Republican of using "Islamophobic" rhetoric.

That's just stupid and obviously retaliatory. She should look instead into stupid shit Tlaib keeps saying.

 

[Derec]

IfNotNow on X: "HAPPENING NOW: we’re at the @jvplive takeover of Grand Central Station to demand #CeasefireNOW.

Taking over a station is never good, no matter the cause.
In this case the cause was bad too. These idiots are either pro-Hamas or otherwise useful idiots for Hamas who don't know what's going on. At the very least Hamas must release all hostages before any ceasefire.

As the Israeli government starves and bombs and invades the people of Gaza in the dark, the actions we take these next days and weeks will define our lifetimes. (vid link)" / X

It is Hamas that starves and denies resources to their own people.
As the Gaza government, they have the responsibility to supply their people, not Israel.
As Gazans Scrounge for Food and Water, Hamas Sits on a Rich Trove of Supplies

 

[laughing dog]

H.Res.772 - 118th Congress (2023-2024): Censuring Representative Rashida Tlaib. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
Rep. Bergman, Jack [R-MI-1] (Introduced 10/11/2023)
No details

She still believes Hamas over our own intelligence and the president from her own party. It is right to censure her.

Representative Becca Balint, a freshman Democrat, introduced a resolution aiming to censure Greene in the House of Representatives on Thursday and accused the Republican of using "Islamophobic" rhetoric.

That's just stupid and obviously retaliatory. She should look instead into stupid shit Tlaib keeps saying.

It certainly looks tit for tat. But it is not stupid - MTG has used a lot of incendiary and stupid rhetoric. Nor should it be an automatic reason to censure someone for disbelieving the utterances of a POTUS or our intelligence agencies. It is not as if they are infallible. Certainly the Trump years and the "weapons of mass destruction" debacle should be sufficient proof of that. And if saying a lot of stupid shit was censurable, the House would never get anything done except censuring.

I am surprised such a disinterested non-partisan would continue to jump down the throat of a Democrat for alleged misstatements while eliding over the same for a Republican.

 

[lpetrich]

H.Res.772 - 118th Congress (2023-2024): Censuring Representative Rashida Tlaib. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
Rep. Bergman, Jack [R-MI-1] (Introduced 10/11/2023)
No details

She still believes Hamas over our own intelligence and the president from her own party. It is right to censure her.

What do you mean?

Representative Becca Balint, a freshman Democrat, introduced a resolution aiming to censure Greene in the House of Representatives on Thursday and accused the Republican of using "Islamophobic" rhetoric.

That's just stupid and obviously retaliatory. She should look instead into stupid shit Tlaib keeps saying.

Read it and see for yourself: Text - H.Res.610 - 118th Congress (2023-2024): Censuring Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

With: "Whereas Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene has repeatedly called for violence against elected representatives and their families;"

Has Rashida Tlaib said or done anything remotely comparable?

 

[Copernicus]

H.Res.772 - 118th Congress (2023-2024): Censuring Representative Rashida Tlaib. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress
Rep. Bergman, Jack [R-MI-1] (Introduced 10/11/2023)
No details

She still believes Hamas over our own intelligence and the president from her own party. It is right to censure her.

What do you mean?

Representative Becca Balint, a freshman Democrat, introduced a resolution aiming to censure Greene in the House of Representatives on Thursday and accused the Republican of using "Islamophobic" rhetoric.

That's just stupid and obviously retaliatory. She should look instead into stupid shit Tlaib keeps saying.

Read it and see for yourself: Text - H.Res.610 - 118th Congress (2023-2024): Censuring Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene. | Congress.gov | Library of Congress

With: "Whereas Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene has repeatedly called for violence against elected representatives and their families;"

Has Rashida Tlaib said or done anything remotely comparable?

I agree. Derec is just spreading the lie that Tlaib has endorsed Hamas. I have only seen statements from her that endorse the Palestinian cause and treat Hamas as a symptom of Israeli apartheid. That is quite different from endorsing the unelected terrorist organization that rules over Gaza. Hamas doesn't represent the Palestinian cause, and it is evident that they haven't just raped, murdered, and taken Israelis as hostage in their terrorist attack. They deliberately provoked Israel into launching a genocidal attack that has killed, wounded, and maimed thousands of Palestinians, who have nowhere to flee. Hamas will use Israel's excessive retaliation as a means of recruiting future terrorists and spreading more hatred and violence in the Middle East. Tlaib has called for an end to the root causes of the blood feud between Palestinians and Israelis that have led up to the current violence. Here position sounds extremely unrealistic, given the level of mutual animosity between Israelis and Palestinian Arabs, but so is the position that the two communities can end the violence with more violence.

 

[TV and credit cards]

Musk says Starlink will provide Gaza connectivity for aid groups

Elon Musk said on Saturday that SpaceX's Starlink will support communication links in Gaza with "internationally recognized aid organizations", prompting Israel's communication minister to say Israel would fight the move.

www.reuters.com

Responding to Musk's post on X, Israel's communication minister Shlomo Karhi said Israel "will use all means at its disposal to fight this."

Of course the Israelis want to fight all communications, all press coverage, particularly all pictures from getting out of Gaza.
I expect the IDF will kill many more members of the press before this is all over. But the world will still see what you're doing.
Go on Biden. Keep standing by your good friend. See how that turns out for you.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

That does not mean Israel should be given free rein to starve, bomb, and brutalize the civilians of Gaza. It should not be allowed to deny them water. But I firmly believe Israel should want peacemakers to succeed in bringing prosperity to Palestinians who have chosen to forswear violence, which means rewarding Abbas and Fatah with major improvements in Palestinian communities and recognition of Palestinian rights. And IMO Israel should insist on having the PA be the go-between negotiators for Gaza, at least until the current spate of fighting dies down.

Which will just make things worse, just like everything else "positive" that Israel does. The thing is it's not the opinion of the Palestinians that matters, it's the opinion of those who are funding the war that matters--and it's not done for the benefit of the Palestinians. Any approach to peace based on concessions is hopeless.

The biggest problem with the situation in Gaza and the West Bank is that people who don't fight back against Israel's expansion have their land stolen, their orchards and farms ruined, and their livelihoods destroyed, while people who do fight back have the exact same thing happen only quicker. We can all see the incentive to be violent but where is the incentive to be peaceful?

That's what happens when you choose the path of war.

Years ago, the PA offered major concessions on Jerusalem and the settlements. This was after it formally recognized the Right of Israel to exist and the Right of Jewish immigrants to live there. I think it's time Israel offered a few major concessions as well, starting with recognizing the Right of Palestinians to remain in their homes in Palestine. Honestly, I don't believe Israel will be doing that anytime soon. The settlers have the upper hand in Israeli society and the Knesset. The violence they commit has been on the increase since 2022
but arrests and prosecutions for those acts of violence haven't.

That's the UN. Not even a remotely honest source on Israel/Palestine issues.

And arrests for such violence usually don't happen because the police are not allowed to investigate. (Understandable, since many of them are internal matters completely unrelated to Israel.)

I know there’s long history of enmity between Israel and Palestine. But Hamas is a terrorist organization which attacked Israel without warning. There has been grave wrong in the part of Israel and grave wrong on the part of Palestine prior to the recent attack by Hamas. I cannot see how Israel now owes Hamas concessions for a brutal surprise attack.

Do you honestly think the IDF and Hamas have been warning each other about impending attacks before this one?

The IDF does have a pretty good intelligence system.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/24/middleeast/israel-hostages-freed-lifshitz-cooper-intl-hnk/index.html

‘I went through hell:’ Released Hamas hostage describes being kidnapped and taken into tunnel system​

While I do not in the least think this justifies anything at all by Hamas, I do think this is an interesting nuance to the story that I had not yet heard:

Lifshitz also accused the Israel Defense Forces and Shin Bet intelligence service of not taking threats from Hamas “seriously” and said the costly Gaza border fence erected by Israel had done nothing to protect her community from Hamas’ attack.

“The lack of awareness by Shin Bet and the IDF hurt us a lot,” she stressed. “They warned us three weeks beforehand, they burned fields, they sent fire balloons and the IDF did not treat it seriously,” she continued.

Another interesting thing is that the hostages might be in the tunnels. Certainly, some of them were in the tunnels and this is below the north or at least not in the south. So if ground troops go in, presumably they'd do some urban warfare and then invade the tunnels. But if there is major bombing by both sides, the tunnels could be destroyed in the process.

Huh? Burned fields and fire balloons are a warning? No, they are just business as usual from Hamas.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I think that this attack was solely designed to stop the normalization of relationships between Israel and the Arab states.

I don't know about solely. But yeah, Iran definitely benefits from the suffering and death of Palestinians.

It's unfortunate for everyone that the Teaparty and Trump scuttled the Peace Treaty with Iran. Iran would have far fewer reasons to stoke the violence and more to support peace if the Republicans hadn't done that.
Tom

No, because there never was a viable peace.

Iran pretends to comply, we pretend to believe them. They continue their warlike ways.

Actual peace would mean the scrapping of Hamas and Hezbollah amongst other organizations. So long as they exist Iran can't be said to be at peace.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

As to your point about earlier agreements between Israel and PA, yes, both have violated and continue to wage aggressions against each other.

The PA doesn't. That's a very important point that gets swept under the rug all too often. Hamas broke away from the PA when it engaged in a shooting match with Fatah and then stopped holding elections in Gaza.

The PA continues to pay for terrorism. That's an act of war. And it's their #1 budget priority.

And you talk about elections in Gaza--it's the absence of any elections, Gaza or West Bank. Can't blame Hamas for what happens in the West Bank.

Israel apologists used to say Israel would be happy to make peace if only the Palestinians would recognize Israel's Right to Exist. The PA did that.

Did? No, they never renounced their claim on Israel.

The Palestinians have made huge concessions over the years. It's time for Israel to make them too. And it's time for Israel to stop building settlements and start arresting settlers who commit acts of violence and intimidation.

The Palestinians have pretended to make concessions. They have not actually done so.

Frankly, I don't see anything but more brutality and killing happening anytime soon. Racists and bigots are running things in Israel and Gaza, the PA is mostly toothless, and the only acts of violence the likes of Netanyahu and America's Religious Right decry are the ones that kill Jews.

This isn't about racism or bigotry. This is about Iran using disorder as a weapon to take over as much of the Middle East as it can.

IMO the Two State solution died with the Oslo Accords. The only options left are genocide, ethnic cleansing, Israel's defeat, or equal rights in the One State solution.

One state = genocide. Israel's defeat = genocide. Why are you supporting Holocaust 2.0?

(And that's not to mention that I expect the result of the destruction of Israel would be a Russian nuclear laydown. They wouldn't want the Israeli arsenal in terrorist hands. And if Russia didn't I expect China would for the same reason.)

 

[Loren Pechtel]

IMO the Two State solution died with the Oslo Accords. The only options left are genocide, ethnic cleansing, Israel's defeat, or equal rights in the One State solution.

Israel's defeat is equivalent to genocide. As is, frankly, the so-called "one state solution" which is really the "final solution". This "one state" would be dominated by Muslims and Arabs and Jews would either be killed or driven out. The only possible solution involves crushing the terror groups, defanging Iran, and convincing Palestinians that their best course of action is to be a good neighbor and not a genocidal menace.

<Psst... your anti-Semitism is showing>

I think you need a mirror.

I can't see how anything he said is anti-semitic. Rather, he's pointing out that your position is in effect calling for genocide of the Jews.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Agree that Hamas needs to be crushed. Agree that one-state will never happen. The hatred between the two groups won't be fixed for many generations. However, the only chance of a real peace is the two state solution. And the Israeli far right is doing as much damage to this process as Hamas. The Israelis need to stop taking unclaimed land and be prepared to pull out settlements in the West Bank when the Palestinians are ready to move forward on a two state solution.

There is no option for peace so long as the terror money flows.

And two-state is clearly dead due to the Fatah/Hamas civil war. The objective should be three-state. I don't believe peace can be made with both but it might be possible to make peace with one.