Merged Gaza just launched an unprovoked attack on Israel

[steve_bank]

Assassination of Yitzhak Rabin - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yitzhak Rabin, the prime minister of Israel, was assassinated on 4 November 1995 at 21:30, at the end of a rally in support of the Oslo Accords at Kings of Israel Square in Tel Aviv. The assailant was Yigal Amir, an Israeli law student and far-right ultranationalist who radically opposed the Oslo Accords and Rabin's peace initiative more broadly.

Background

The assassination of Israeli prime minister Yitzhak Rabin came immediately after an anti-violence rally in support of the Oslo peace process.[1]



Before the rally, Rabin was disparaged personally by right-wing conservatives and Likud leaders who perceived the peace process as an attempt to forfeit the occupied territories and a capitulation to Israel's enemies.[2][3]



National religious conservatives and Likud party leaders believed that withdrawing from any "Jewish" land was blasphemy and heresy.[4] The Likud leader and future prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, accused Rabin's government of being "removed from Jewish tradition [...] and Jewish values".[2][3] Right-wing rabbis associated with the settlers' movement prohibited territorial concessions to the Palestinians and forbade soldiers in the Israel Defense Forces from evacuating Jewish settlers under the accords.[5][6] Some rabbis proclaimed din rodef, based on a traditional Jewish law of self-defense, against Rabin personally, arguing that the Oslo Accords would endanger Jewish lives.[5][7]



Rallies organized by Likud and other right-wing groups featured depictions of Rabin in a Nazi SS uniform, or in the crosshairs of a gun.[2][3] Protesters compared the Labor party (which Rabin led) to the Nazis and Rabin to Adolf Hitler[5] and chanted, "Rabin is a murderer" and "Rabin is a traitor".[8][9] In July 1995, Netanyahu led a mock funeral procession featuring a coffin and hangman's noose at an anti-Rabin rally where protesters chanted, "Death to Rabin".[10][11] The chief of internal security, Carmi Gillon, then alerted Netanyahu of a plot on Rabin's life and asked him to moderate the protests' rhetoric, which Netanyahu declined to do.[8][12] Netanyahu denied any intention to incite violence.[2][3][13]

The extreme anti peace right. For thee excrement Zionist nationalists I have no doubt what thy want is the compete destruction of or relocation of Palestinians.

 

[Arctish]

This is an example of what I meant by no one really grasping the possibility of peace. Hamas could have stopped those suicide bombers/gunmen using the crossing and Israel could have kept the crossing open.
Neither side was really willing to take a hold of the nettle. Result all suffered one way or another.

Hamas was a not in power at that time. The elections that gave it slightly more votes than Fatah happened after the closure of the Karni Crossing that ruined crops from those greenhouses. The civil war that made it the unchallenged ruling party happened a year after the election.

Which closure of the Karni crossing are you referring too? The Karni Crossing had more openings and closing than the Straits of Hormuz.

There were slowdowns and stoppages in late 2005, and a full closure on January 15th, 2006 that lasted to mid February and caused the loss of millions of dollars worth of Gazan produce. This is from Gisha, reporting on a petition to Israel's High Court to intervene and reopen the crossing:

Since Jan. 15, 2006, the Karni Crossing has been completely closed 47% of the time, and only partially open the rest of the time. According to UN-OCHA, the closure has already caused more than $30 million in losses to the Palestinian economy. The closure has caused shortages of flour, baby formula, medicines, and other goods. Every day, farmers in Gaza systematically destroy or donate their crops, because they cannot get them to export markets.

Israel under Ariel Sharon and his protege Benjamin Netanyahu chose the Path of Fuckery instead of the Path of Peace in Gaza. I think that was a bad choice.

And I think your “neither side” rhetoric is designed to shield your pro-Israel beliefs from legitimate criticism of Israeli politics and leaders. If you can “both sides” hard enough you can avoid the uncomfortable truths about Sharon not wanting Gaza to be secure and prosperous because he wanted it to become part of Israel after he was done grabbing the West Bank. Remember, this is the guy who was convicted in an Israeli court of having committed a war crime, and not the one he bragged about in his memoir.

And I think that your "Is always Israel's fault" rhetoric is designed to shield your pro-Hamas beliefs from legitimate criticism of Palestinian/ Iranian etc. politics and leaders.

I don't have pro-Hamas beliefs and I don't believe you genuinely think that I do.

I think you want to cast everything in an either-or Excluded Middle Fallacy because the simplicity of that argument is preferrable to the complexity of multiple political leaders, some of them bad and some of them very bad, representing millions of innocent civilians in a nasty decades long regional conflict.

I think you agree with me on where the path to peace lies and what is necessary to follow it, but you really don't like it when I say Netanyahu and his political mentor Ariel Sharon did everything they could to ensure Israel didn't follow it because they want Israel to claim all of Eretz Israel more than they want peace with the neighbors.

If you can "only Israel's fault" hard enough you can avoid the uncomfortable truths about Hamas/Iran wanting to destroy Israel and Jews to create a greater, "Judenfrei" Palestine.

Bullshit.

At what point can we just move on from basic points of agreement?

I am well aware of what Sharon/Netanyahu have done or being convicted of. That is a part of want is happening but not the complete story.

It is possible to read your posts and be almost unaware of Hamas' existence until Oct. 2023 when it could no longer be hidden.

I have been discussing Hamas with other posters since before the election in 2006 and I have the posting history to prove it.

 

[Tigers!]

This is an example of what I meant by no one really grasping the possibility of peace. Hamas could have stopped those suicide bombers/gunmen using the crossing and Israel could have kept the crossing open.
Neither side was really willing to take a hold of the nettle. Result all suffered one way or another.

Hamas was a not in power at that time. The elections that gave it slightly more votes than Fatah happened after the closure of the Karni Crossing that ruined crops from those greenhouses. The civil war that made it the unchallenged ruling party happened a year after the election.

Which closure of the Karni crossing are you referring too? The Karni Crossing had more openings and closing than the Straits of Hormuz.

There were slowdowns and stoppages in late 2005, and a full closure on January 15th, 2006 that lasted to mid February and caused the loss of millions of dollars worth of Gazan produce. This is from Gisha, reporting on a petition to Israel's High Court to intervene and reopen the crossing:

Since Jan. 15, 2006, the Karni Crossing has been completely closed 47% of the time, and only partially open the rest of the time. According to UN-OCHA, the closure has already caused more than $30 million in losses to the Palestinian economy. The closure has caused shortages of flour, baby formula, medicines, and other goods. Every day, farmers in Gaza systematically destroy or donate their crops, because they cannot get them to export markets.

Israel under Ariel Sharon and his protege Benjamin Netanyahu chose the Path of Fuckery instead of the Path of Peace in Gaza. I think that was a bad choice.

And I think your “neither side” rhetoric is designed to shield your pro-Israel beliefs from legitimate criticism of Israeli politics and leaders. If you can “both sides” hard enough you can avoid the uncomfortable truths about Sharon not wanting Gaza to be secure and prosperous because he wanted it to become part of Israel after he was done grabbing the West Bank. Remember, this is the guy who was convicted in an Israeli court of having committed a war crime, and not the one he bragged about in his memoir.

And I think that your "Is always Israel's fault" rhetoric is designed to shield your pro-Hamas beliefs from legitimate criticism of Palestinian/ Iranian etc. politics and leaders.

I don't have pro-Hamas beliefs and I don't believe you genuinely think that I do.

I think you want to cast everything in an either-or Excluded Middle Fallacy because the simplicity of that argument is preferrable to the complexity of multiple political leaders, some of them bad and some of them very bad, representing millions of innocent civilians in a nasty decades long regional conflict.

I think you agree with me on where the path to peace lies and what is necessary to follow it, but you really don't like it when I say Netanyahu and his political mentor Ariel Sharon did everything they could to ensure Israel didn't follow it because they want Israel to claim all of Eretz Israel more than they want peace with the neighbors.

If you can "only Israel's fault" hard enough you can avoid the uncomfortable truths about Hamas/Iran wanting to destroy Israel and Jews to create a greater, "Judenfrei" Palestine.

Bullshit.

At what point can we just move on from basic points of agreement?

I am well aware of what Sharon/Netanyahu have done or being convicted of. That is a part of want is happening but not the complete story.

It is possible to read your posts and be almost unaware of Hamas' existence until Oct. 2023 when it could no longer be hidden.

I have been discussing Hamas with other posters since before the election in 2006 and I have the posting history to prove it.

This is an example of what I meant by no one really grasping the possibility of peace. Hamas could have stopped those suicide bombers/gunmen using the crossing and Israel could have kept the crossing open.
Neither side was really willing to take a hold of the nettle. Result all suffered one way or another.

Hamas was a not in power at that time. The elections that gave it slightly more votes than Fatah happened after the closure of the Karni Crossing that ruined crops from those greenhouses. The civil war that made it the unchallenged ruling party happened a year after the election.

Which closure of the Karni crossing are you referring too? The Karni Crossing had more openings and closing than the Straits of Hormuz.

There were slowdowns and stoppages in late 2005, and a full closure on January 15th, 2006 that lasted to mid February and caused the loss of millions of dollars worth of Gazan produce. This is from Gisha, reporting on a petition to Israel's High Court to intervene and reopen the crossing:

Since Jan. 15, 2006, the Karni Crossing has been completely closed 47% of the time, and only partially open the rest of the time. According to UN-OCHA, the closure has already caused more than $30 million in losses to the Palestinian economy. The closure has caused shortages of flour, baby formula, medicines, and other goods. Every day, farmers in Gaza systematically destroy or donate their crops, because they cannot get them to export markets.

Israel under Ariel Sharon and his protege Benjamin Netanyahu chose the Path of Fuckery instead of the Path of Peace in Gaza. I think that was a bad choice.

And I think your “neither side” rhetoric is designed to shield your pro-Israel beliefs from legitimate criticism of Israeli politics and leaders. If you can “both sides” hard enough you can avoid the uncomfortable truths about Sharon not wanting Gaza to be secure and prosperous because he wanted it to become part of Israel after he was done grabbing the West Bank. Remember, this is the guy who was convicted in an Israeli court of having committed a war crime, and not the one he bragged about in his memoir.

And I think that your "Is always Israel's fault" rhetoric is designed to shield your pro-Hamas beliefs from legitimate criticism of Palestinian/ Iranian etc. politics and leaders.

I don't have pro-Hamas beliefs and I don't believe you genuinely think that I do.

I think you want to cast everything in an either-or Excluded Middle Fallacy because the simplicity of that argument is preferrable to the complexity of multiple political leaders, some of them bad and some of them very bad, representing millions of innocent civilians in a nasty decades long regional conflict.

I think you agree with me on where the path to peace lies and what is necessary to follow it, but you really don't like it when I say Netanyahu and his political mentor Ariel Sharon did everything they could to ensure Israel didn't follow it because they want Israel to claim all of Eretz Israel more than they want peace with the neighbors.

The aim is for the people of Gaza and Israel to live in peace. Watch their children grow up. Work their fields and factories. Visit and learn from each other.
Without having to worry about whether a rocket, bomb, missile, shell, gunman, tank or suicide bomber will shatter the serenity.
Say what you wish about Netanyahu, I will agree with much of it. But I do not accept that Hamas are just a resistance movement. They are a death cult. They will not stop until the ME has no Jews or they are eliminated first. There is no Excluded Middle Fallacy with Hamas.

lIf you can "only Israel's fault" hard enough you can avoid the uncomfortable truths about Hamas/Iran wanting to destroy Israel and Jews to create a greater, "Judenfrei" Palestine.

Bullshit.

At what point can we just move on from basic points of agreement?

In your points of agreement you state that Hamas must be destroyed militarily. But who is going to do it? Not the US, not the EU, certainly not any nation is the ME except one.
Israel is trying to destroy Hamas militarily and you have criticised, complained, scolded, condemned every step of the way.
Does Hamas need to be destroyed militarily or not?

I too, have critiqued Israel. Some of their tactics have been just stupid and ill-prepared. Hamas is a great threat to them. Not to you or I.

I am well aware of what Sharon/Netanyahu have done or being convicted of. That is a part of want is happening but not the complete story.

It is possible to read your posts and be almost unaware of Hamas' existence until Oct. 2023 when it could no longer be hidden.

I have been discussing Hamas with other posters since before the election in 2006 and I have the posting history to prove it.

Your criticism of Hamas are far less vocal and strident that your condemnation of Israel. That is obvious.

 

[Arctish]

And I think that your "Is always Israel's fault" rhetoric is designed to shield your pro-Hamas beliefs from legitimate criticism of Palestinian/ Iranian etc. politics and leaders.

I don't have pro-Hamas beliefs and I don't believe you genuinely think that I do.

I think you want to cast everything in an either-or Excluded Middle Fallacy because the simplicity of that argument is preferrable to the complexity of multiple political leaders, some of them bad and some of them very bad, representing millions of innocent civilians in a nasty decades long regional conflict.

I think you agree with me on where the path to peace lies and what is necessary to follow it, but you really don't like it when I say Netanyahu and his political mentor Ariel Sharon did everything they could to ensure Israel didn't follow it because they want Israel to claim all of Eretz Israel more than they want peace with the neighbors.

The aim is for the people of Gaza and Israel to live in peace. Watch their children grow up. Work their fields and factories. Visit and learn from each other.
Without having to worry about whether a rocket, bomb, missile, shell, gunman, tank or suicide bomber will shatter the serenity.
Say what you wish about Netanyahu, I will agree with much of it. But I do not accept that Hamas are just a resistance movement. They are a death cult. They will not stop until the ME has no Jews or they are eliminated first. There is no Excluded Middle Fallacy with Hamas.

I never said Hamas was just a resistance movement. I don't think anyone posting here ever said or implied it either. We have been calling it a terrorist group since at least 2003, which you already know if you followed that link I posted to the Archives.

It looks like you constructed a strawman and now you're knocking it down.

lIf you can "only Israel's fault" hard enough you can avoid the uncomfortable truths about Hamas/Iran wanting to destroy Israel and Jews to create a greater, "Judenfrei" Palestine.

Bullshit.

At what point can we just move on from basic points of agreement?

In your points of agreement you state that Hamas must be destroyed militarily. But who is going to do it? Not the US, not the EU, certainly not any nation is the ME except one.
Israel is trying to destroy Hamas militarily and you have criticised, complained, scolded, condemned every step of the way.
Does Hamas need to be destroyed militarily or not?

I already answered that in this post. Not only did I respond to the questions you had just asked, I linked to previous posts where I answered the same questions when you asked them on those occasions, too.

Did you even bother to read what I wrote or do you just keep forgetting that those questions have been asked and answered?

I too, have critiqued Israel. Some of their tactics have been just stupid and ill-prepared. Hamas is a great threat to them. Not to you or I.

I am well aware of what Sharon/Netanyahu have done or being convicted of. That is a part of want is happening but not the complete story.

It is possible to read your posts and be almost unaware of Hamas' existence until Oct. 2023 when it could no longer be hidden.

I have been discussing Hamas with other posters since before the election in 2006 and I have the posting history to prove it.

Your criticism of Hamas are far less vocal and strident that your condemnation of Israel. That is obvious.

We agree Hamas is a terrorist organization. We agree Hamas being in power is an obstacle to peace. We agree it would be far better for a political faction that has disavowed violence as a means to achieving their goals to hold political power in Gaza. So what is there to discuss? Shall we sit around in an endless circle-jerk talking about how much we agree with each other? Maybe have a rousing round-robin about who agrees the most with everyone else?

Discussions are fueled by disagreement. Giving each other affirmations all the time would be the death of this forum.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

US diplomat calls Israeli settler siege of West Bank homes ‘act of terror’

Israeli settlers have blocked the homes of three Palestinian families in Qusra, cutting them off from food and supplies.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[Derec]

UNICEF Report Dispels Gaza Famine Narrative, Enclave Less Malnourished Than Finland

The whole narrative was just modern-day Blood Libel.

 

[laughing dog]

UNICEF Report Dispels Gaza Famine Narrative, Enclave Less Malnourished Than Finland

The whole narrative was just modern-day Blood Libel.

Not quite. From the link

While the survey found little evidence of widespread acute wasting, it identified several longer-term nutritional concerns. Researchers reported that approximately one in eight children suffers from stunting, an indicator associated with chronic nutritional deprivation rather than immediate food shortages. The report also noted the continued presence of childhood overweight, suggesting that poor diet quality, not simply food availability, remains a significant public health challenge.

“Acute malnutrition remains low, but nutritional vulnerability remains high,” the study contends.

The article ignores this report - Humanitarian Situation Update - Analysis of the Response to the Needs of Children at Mid-year 2026 that finds

• Humanitarian conditions in the Gaza Strip remain dire, with most of the population – 1.9 out of 2.1 million people – displaced and exposed to ongoing health and environmental risks.
• Access restrictions and operational constraints continue to disrupt humanitarian delivery, with only 280 out of 633 UNICEF aid trucks (44 per cent) from Egypt able to offload during May and June 2026.
• Essential services remain critically limited: access to healthcare, water, sanitation, and protection services continue to be disrupted by destruction or damage to critical civilian infrastructure, and movement restrictions.
• Severe restrictions on the entry of fuel, spare parts, and essential materials – including engine oil required to operate generators – are driving system failures across health and WASH services.
• In the WASH sector, conditions remain critical. An estimated 82 per cent of families are water insecure, and up to 70 per cent cannot access 6 litres per person per day – far below minimum emergency standards – placing children at direct risk of dehydration and waterborne disease.
• Nearly 90 per cent of water and sanitation infrastructure has been damaged or destroyed. Limited latrine access, unsafe disposal practices, and disrupted sludge management compromise infection prevention and control, increase the risk of healthcare-related infections, the growing presence of rats and other disease vectors, and contribute to widespread environmental contamination.
  

 

[Tigers!]

US diplomat calls Israeli settler siege of West Bank homes ‘act of terror’

Israeli settlers have blocked the homes of three Palestinian families in Qusra, cutting them off from food and supplies.

www.aljazeera.com

The settlements have to be stopped.

 

[Arctish]

The settlers should be resettled inside Israel or renounce their Israeli citizenship and become citizens of the State of Palestine under the authority of the PA.

Settlers who have engaged in acts of violence, intimidation, theft, and destruction of property should be prosecuted but probably won’t.

 

[ZiprHead]

The settlers should be resettled inside Israel or renounce their Israeli citizenship and become citizens of the State of Palestine under the authority of the PA.

Settlers who have engaged in acts of violence, intimidation, theft, and destruction of property should be prosecuted but probably won’t.

That's one reason why there are no good guys in this situation.

 

[Arctish]

The settlers should be resettled inside Israel or renounce their Israeli citizenship and become citizens of the State of Palestine under the authority of the PA.

Settlers who have engaged in acts of violence, intimidation, theft, and destruction of property should be prosecuted but probably won’t.

That's one reason why there are no good guys in this situation.

There are good guys.

They’ve been peacefully demonstrating for years, organizing, working cooperatively with people from within their community and outside it, and petitioning the courts in Israel and the UN to stop the racist assholes who are making trouble for everyone.

The peaceful ones hardly ever make headlines which leads people who only skim the news to think they don’t exist.

 

[Arctish]

Can’t ETA the previous post so I’m posting this as clarification:

I know you don’t just skim the news ZiprHead. I’m referring to the posters who don’t seem to realize when they’re painting with an overly broad brush or to know that Palestine is full of people who just want to go about their lives without racists and bigots making life difficult, friendships dangerous, and fairness impossible.

 

[ZiprHead]

The settlers should be resettled inside Israel or renounce their Israeli citizenship and become citizens of the State of Palestine under the authority of the PA.

Settlers who have engaged in acts of violence, intimidation, theft, and destruction of property should be prosecuted but probably won’t.

That's one reason why there are no good guys in this situation.

There are good guys.

They’ve been peacefully demonstrating for years, organizing, working cooperatively with people from within their community and outside it, and petitioning the courts in Israel and the UN to stop the racist assholes who are making trouble for everyone.

The peaceful ones hardly ever make headlines which leads people who only skim the news to think they don’t exist.

I stand corrected. You are right. Thank you.

 

[Politesse]

UNICEF Report Dispels Gaza Famine Narrative, Enclave Less Malnourished Than Finland

The whole narrative was just modern-day Blood Libel.

I'd like to discuss this further, but only if it's a true disucssion. Because Algemeiner is promoting an incredibly selective read of their dispatches from the front, but there's no point in exploring why if you aren't willing to talk in good faith about this. So, before we begin, do you agree that UNICEF studies are a valid source of information about what is happening in Gaza right now, even when they also say things that you do not agree with?