One of us has done so. In general the easiest way to get such housekeeping taken care of is to report it. Housekeeping doesn't require agreement amongst us, the first to see it normally acts.
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Hezbollah’s Exploding Electronics
- Thread starter Elixir
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I never got a meaningful response to the cartoon of Hamas with a baby in their plate carrier.
There are a lot of people who stick their head in the sand when confronted by hard choices. If you refuse to pick one when reality offers up a horrible choice you probably get the worse outcome.
laughing dog
Contributor
Killing noncombatants it is wrong even when it unavoidable. Shrugging it off with the”It’s unavoidable, so it’s ok” is moral cowardice. Nor is it to be celebrated. Your logical conclusion is a straw man.
How about looking at the rest of that protocol?
In the list of things that must not be booby trapped the only thing remotely relevant is:
protocol said:
In other words, booby trapping a civilian item used in a military context is permissible. And the booby trapped pagers were Hezbollah. Thus Israel did not break the rules however much you want them to have.
Arctish
Centimillionaire
It looks to me like you never got the response you wanted to hear so you ignored the responses you did get.
Your proposal to kill the kidnapper, the baby, the neighbors, and anyone who might possibly be connected to the kidnapping in any way no matter how circumstantial or trivial, isn't a hard choice. It's brutality masquerading as morality, and for people who judge the rightness or wrongness of an action by who is doing it to whom, it's a simple choice.
The hard choice is the one where you struggle with the morality of killing scores of people in order to prevent more kidnappings, not where you simply condemn them to death because it's inconvenient to devote all that time and effort into thinking up ways to stop crimes against humanity without resorting to crimes against humanity.
Of the signs in that picture I can read there is only one that is not effectively endorsing the 10/7 atrocity.If you skew the meaning of "justice" and "human rights" to fit some eccentric definition no one else uses, then the only calls for justice and upholding human rights you will acknowledge are your own. And if you say that apartheid is justice and ethnic cleansing is upholding human rights, then you can claim that Netanyahu, Smotrich, Ben Gvir, and their allies are standing on the moral high ground while Jews for Peace and Médecins Sans Frontières are stanning for genocide.Another photo from the 10/8 protest:
Of course, that only works in Alice's Wonderland, not irl where words have meanings everyone shares.
Do you endorse atrocity? If not, why do you think those protesters are on the side of justice and human rights?
Leftist error. You are assuming that diplomacy can prevent all wars. Does it not occur to you that there are those evil enough that they knowingly choose the path of horror?
Arctish
Centimillionaire
Oh I see.Of the signs in that picture I can read there is only one that is not effectively endorsing the 10/7 atrocity.If you skew the meaning of "justice" and "human rights" to fit some eccentric definition no one else uses, then the only calls for justice and upholding human rights you will acknowledge are your own. And if you say that apartheid is justice and ethnic cleansing is upholding human rights, then you can claim that Netanyahu, Smotrich, Ben Gvir, and their allies are standing on the moral high ground while Jews for Peace and Médecins Sans Frontières are stanning for genocide.Another photo from the 10/8 protest:
Of course, that only works in Alice's Wonderland, not irl where words have meanings everyone shares.
Do you endorse atrocity? If not, why do you think those protesters are on the side of justice and human rights?
In your mind, when someone says "Resistance against occupation is a human right" they're "effectively endorsing" an atrocity.
This from a guy who less than one hour ago said Israel successfully threw off its oppressors and attacks get worse when victims leave their abusers.
laughing dog
Contributor
The only way those signs “effectively” endorse the 10/7 atrocity is through imputation of meaning because the words clearly do not.Of the signs in that picture I can read there is only one that is not effectively endorsing the 10/7 atrocity.If you skew the meaning of "justice" and "human rights" to fit some eccentric definition no one else uses, then the only calls for justice and upholding human rights you will acknowledge are your own. And if you say that apartheid is justice and ethnic cleansing is upholding human rights, then you can claim that Netanyahu, Smotrich, Ben Gvir, and their allies are standing on the moral high ground while Jews for Peace and Médecins Sans Frontières are stanning for genocide.Another photo from the 10/8 protest:
Of course, that only works in Alice's Wonderland, not irl where words have meanings everyone shares.
You have it utterly wrong and you are committing the standard sin of thinking everyone thinks alike.
If Israel was trying to get the international community to exterminate it's rivals you would expect to see at least some such extermination. Yet we have absolutely nothing. We have responded to attacks directed at us. We have shot down weapons heading for Israel, but we did nothing about the launchers.
And the settlers are nuts. Most of the Israelis don't like them, but neither do they feel the need to expend too much effort to stop them as they know that they're actually irrelevant.
As for the international community, what do you propose they do? Israel will not accept extermination as an answer, nobody else is lifting a finger to try to do anything but keep down the level of Israel shooting back. And now there's nothing that the international community can do because Russia has gotten into the game with Iran. Trying to force a resolution in either direction will result in it going nuclear before it reaches the point of "success."
And how in the world do you think a two state answer will bring peace?? Even if you could somehow create a two state solution there would be enough money on the side of war that war would continue. The Iranian money goes to whoever will do the shooting--and they put enough money into it that somebody will take it.
Politesse
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In children's books, sure. When I was nine or ten, I graduated to reading novels where people had a bit more nuance than simplistic stereotypes of good and evil. More complicated, I found, but more interesting, and certainly more like real life.
I don't know what you mean by "diplomacy can prevent all wars". Obviously, it has failed to do so repeatedly. I am well aware of this. Similarly, I do not believe that medicine can prevent all illness, that environmental regulations can prevent all extinctions, that counseling can fix every marriage, or that loving mommy enough will fix her brain. I do, however, think that illnesses (of whatever kind) should be ameliorated to whatever extent possible, not intentionally fostered and certainly not celebrated.
Politesse
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You're getting as bad as barbos! Refusing to acknowledge the daily news doesn't somehow stop it from happening. The whole world is watching Israel rain bloody hell both on its neighbors and those it claims as its own citizens. (Subjects? Property? Whatever it considers Gazans to be.)
Toni
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Off topic and completely rhetorical and not directed at your remark personally but why is it always mommy who supposedly needs fixing??
Hamas leaves enough room for doubt that you can convince yourself they don't stand for genocide. Doesn't mean you're right.
You are very willing to believe the best of them.
And how do you propose this happens???
1) There is no ballot box. And if there were Hamas will have killed any meaningful competition.
2) You continue to pretend the data shows targeting of civilians despite there being a lower civilian to combatant death rate than anyone else has accomplished.
3) Where do you see them not being allowed to surrender? Israel is very strict about how it will accept a surrender because they're used to suicide attacks. You will not be allowed to approach until you have demonstrated that you don't have a bomb. Israel is taking quite a few prisoners, surrender is obviously possible.
4) How do you think a two state solution will magically be peaceful?
5) How would you ensure a one state solution would continue to respect everyone??
You continue to demand an unattainable ideal and effectively say they should accept death if they can't do a sufficient perfect job of defending themselves.
The real world is the trolley problem. Your response it to tell the trolley to stop but of course it doesn't--and it goes on to smash the group.
Where did I get a meaningful response? As in a solution that actually works. Remember, it's a metaphor, it's the battlefield, not something that can be solved with a sniper.
Except your choice is to tie the hands of anyone who tries to prevent more atrocities.
The "resistance" of which it speaks is the 10/7 atrocity. That sign is endorsing atrocity even if you don't want to believe it.Oh I see.Of the signs in that picture I can read there is only one that is not effectively endorsing the 10/7 atrocity.If you skew the meaning of "justice" and "human rights" to fit some eccentric definition no one else uses, then the only calls for justice and upholding human rights you will acknowledge are your own. And if you say that apartheid is justice and ethnic cleansing is upholding human rights, then you can claim that Netanyahu, Smotrich, Ben Gvir, and their allies are standing on the moral high ground while Jews for Peace and Médecins Sans Frontières are stanning for genocide.Another photo from the 10/8 protest:
Of course, that only works in Alice's Wonderland, not irl where words have meanings everyone shares.
Do you endorse atrocity? If not, why do you think those protesters are on the side of justice and human rights?
In your mind, when someone says "Resistance against occupation is a human right" they're "effectively endorsing" an atrocity.
This from a guy who less than one hour ago said Israel successfully threw off its oppressors and attacks get worse when victims leave their abusers.
Arctish
Centimillionaire
Doesn't mean I'm right that Hamas has always identified its enemy as the "Zionist entity"? Well then, show me the Charter or position paper or press release that proves I'm wrong. Or just accept that the only official statements we have indicate that I'm right, and we can all move on.
If you can support the assertion that Hamas' stated goal is the murder is all Jews everywhere, then please do. Link to your source(s).
Enough with the deliberate misreading of everyone else's posts and the ridiculous rhetoric.
Stop pretending anyone here thinks peace just magically happens.
Stop pretending anyone here is so ignorant they believe there has ever been a way to ensure that a government will "always" respect everyone.
Stop pretending you don't know about the shirtless and barefoot Israeli hostages who escaped their captors and were gunned down by the IDF as they tried to surrender, or the other reports of people who had surrendered being murdered.
Stop pretending that when you posed the question about the baby being held hostage that no one answered your question, when in fact we discussed it: I said that's what snipers were for and you complained that I kept framing it as kill the hostage taker, not something else you refused to specify.
BTW, I'm still waiting for an answer to my questions in post#4993. If you're not trying to kill the hostage taker, why are you shooting? What are you aiming at, or are you not aiming at all?
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