How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Russia is now demanding that the west stop aiding Ukraine as a pre-condition for peace talks:

MSN

www.msn.com

They are deluded. They want the war to end on their terms with a weakened Ukraine, so that they can invade in the future with fewer losses. Putler dosn't really want peace.

Absolutely nothing Russian Hitler says is of any importance. If he wants to end his war he can withdraw forces, offer concrete proposals, etc. He and his mouthpieces have been offering up threat after threat after threat, demand after demand after demand. This is just their game as they hope to weaken western resolve by prolonging the war.

The Russian state in its present failed condition definitely constitutes an existential threat to democracy and freedom on this planet. He can stick that in his Kuznetsov stack and smoke it.

 

[Jayjay]

Russia is now demanding that the west stop aiding Ukraine as a pre-condition for peace talks:

MSN

www.msn.com

They are deluded. They want the war to end on their terms with a weakened Ukraine, so that they can invade in the future with fewer losses. Putler dosn't really want peace.

I would find it funny, but impossible demands may precede military action. This is like when Russia demanded NATO to pull back from Eastern Europe last year:

Russia demands NATO roll back from East Europe and stay out of Ukraine

Russia said on Friday it wanted a legally binding guarantee that NATO would give up any military activity in Eastern Europe and Ukraine, part of a wish list of security guarantees it wants to negotiate with the West.

www.reuters.com

Moscow for the first time laid out in detail demands that it says are essential for lowering tensions in Europe and defusing a crisis over Ukraine, which Western countries have accused Russia of sizing up for a potential invasion after building up troops near the border. Russia has denied planning an invasion.

The demands contain elements - such as an effective Russian veto on future NATO membership for Ukraine - that the West has already ruled out.

Others would imply the removal of U.S. nuclear weapons from Europe and the withdrawal of multinational NATO battalions from Poland and from the Baltic states of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania that were once in the Soviet Union.

Obviously, Kremlin didn't expect US and NATO to agree to these terms, just like it doesn't now. It's just a pretext before the massive push that Russia has been preparing for, so that they can pretend to their own people that they tried to negotiate first.

 

[Elixir]

It's just a pretext before the massive push that Russia has been preparing for, so that they can pretend to their own people that they tried to negotiate first.

We should be loading Ukraine up with everything we can right now, to ensure that this next phase of Russian aggression is as successful as their first effort. If they make ANY gains, it's going to embolden Putler.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

It's just a pretext before the massive push that Russia has been preparing for, so that they can pretend to their own people that they tried to negotiate first.

We should be loading Ukraine up with everything we can right now, to ensure that this next phase of Russian aggression is as successful as their first effort. If they make ANY gains, it's going to embolden Putler.

The problem here in the states is that too many republicans would love to be Russian Hitler. Zelensky is evil because he dared defy Trump and succeeded. That puts Zelensky on the republican shit list for the most part because those fucks would love to have Putin's power. If Trumpo were still president Ukraine would have gone down the shitter a long time ago. Orange and Russian Hitler would be vacationing together somewhere in Crimea or sailing around on Hitler's yacht. Sad but true.

 

[Jayjay]

It's just a pretext before the massive push that Russia has been preparing for, so that they can pretend to their own people that they tried to negotiate first.

We should be loading Ukraine up with everything we can right now, to ensure that this next phase of Russian aggression is as successful as their first effort. If they make ANY gains, it's going to embolden Putler.

The problem here in the states is that too many republicans would love to be Russian Hitler. Zelensky is evil because he dared defy Trump and succeeded.

But he didn't "defy Trump" though?

I think Zelensky did whatever he could to stay on Trump's good side, because it would be insane to snub the president of the United States. The reason for lack of progress to investigating the Bidens and the Democrats was that there was nothing there to investigate. Trump was asking Zelensky to "look into" alleged DNC servers in Ukraine, which didn't exist, for example.

Of course there could be a perception in the MAGA crowd that Zelensky somehow betrayed Trump but that's completely delusional.

 

[Harry Bosch]

It's just a pretext before the massive push that Russia has been preparing for, so that they can pretend to their own people that they tried to negotiate first.

We should be loading Ukraine up with everything we can right now, to ensure that this next phase of Russian aggression is as successful as their first effort. If they make ANY gains, it's going to embolden Putler.

The problem here in the states is that too many republicans would love to be Russian Hitler. Zelensky is evil because he dared defy Trump and succeeded.

But he didn't "defy Trump" though?

I think Zelensky did whatever he could to stay on Trump's good side, because it would be insane to snub the president of the United States. The reason for lack of progress to investigating the Bidens and the Democrats was that there was nothing there to investigate. Trump was asking Zelensky to "look into" alleged DNC servers in Ukraine, which didn't exist, for example.

Of course there could be a perception in the MAGA crowd that Zelensky somehow betrayed Trump but that's completely delusional.

Trump held up promised arms to Ukraine for months. Zelensky called him as asked why. No reason according to Trump. But then Trump asked him for a little favor. Dig up dirt on Hunter. Zelensky didn't play ball.

‘Do Us a Favor’: Call Shows Trump’s Interest in Using U.S. Power for His Gain (Published 2019)

The president pressed Ukraine’s leader on potential investigations that could benefit him politically.

www.nytimes.com

 

[barbos]

Merkel blurted their plan, now piece of shit Graham blurts his plan too.
No surprise there.

 

[barbos]

So who watched Z’s speech. Historical is the most common adjective of the talking heads. I hope that this speech will unite the country behind him and stop the squabbling over continuing aid to Ukraine. Not sure what McCarthy’s response is. He’s having to appease the traitors in his party.

LOL, unite my ass. US neocons are afraid new congress won't be so enthusiastic about their little war with Russia project. So they invited that narco-clown mini-hitler to speak.

 

[barbos]

It's just a pretext before the massive push that Russia has been preparing for, so that they can pretend to their own people that they tried to negotiate first.

We should be loading Ukraine up with everything we can right now, to ensure that this next phase of Russian aggression is as successful as their first effort. If they make ANY gains, it's going to embolden Putler.

The problem here in the states is that too many republicans would love to be Russian Hitler. Zelensky is evil because he dared defy Trump and succeeded.

But he didn't "defy Trump" though?

I think Zelensky did whatever he could to stay on Trump's good side, because it would be insane to snub the president of the United States. The reason for lack of progress to investigating the Bidens and the Democrats was that there was nothing there to investigate. Trump was asking Zelensky to "look into" alleged DNC servers in Ukraine, which didn't exist, for example.

Of course there could be a perception in the MAGA crowd that Zelensky somehow betrayed Trump but that's completely delusional.

There is plenty to investigate with Burisma.

 

[Elixir]

There is plenty to investigate with Burisma.

Can you explain the fact that there has been not one mention of Burisma by the rabid right that is promising to investigate everything but Trump?
I think you better tip them off, barbie.

 

[Harry Bosch]

So who watched Z’s speech. Historical is the most common adjective of the talking heads. I hope that this speech will unite the country behind him and stop the squabbling over continuing aid to Ukraine. Not sure what McCarthy’s response is. He’s having to appease the traitors in his party.

LOL, unite my ass. US neocons are afraid new congress won't be so enthusiastic about their little war with Russia project. So they invited that narco-clown mini-hitler to speak.

Negative. The Nazis are the Russians who have invaded a sovereign country. It would be a grave mistake to assume that the American people aren't nearly united in the belief that we must help Ukraine survive until the bitter end. Because we will.... At the speech, there were literally only 5 republicans who didn't stand and clap during Zelensky's speech.

 

[barbos]

So who watched Z’s speech. Historical is the most common adjective of the talking heads. I hope that this speech will unite the country behind him and stop the squabbling over continuing aid to Ukraine. Not sure what McCarthy’s response is. He’s having to appease the traitors in his party.

LOL, unite my ass. US neocons are afraid new congress won't be so enthusiastic about their little war with Russia project. So they invited that narco-clown mini-hitler to speak.

Negative. The Nazis are the Russians who have invaded a sovereign country. It would be a grave mistake to assume that the American people aren't nearly united in the belief that we must help Ukraine survive until the bitter end. Because we will.... At the speech, there were literally only 5 republicans who didn't stand and clap during Zelensky's speech.

NATO invaded Ukraine, not Russians. Russians are there to liberate it from nazi-neocon scam.
And don't equate your shitty Congress and even yourself with americans.

 

[barbos]

And by the way, Narco-Clown did not get much during this trip.
So, clapping is cheap.

 

[Harry Bosch]

So who watched Z’s speech. Historical is the most common adjective of the talking heads. I hope that this speech will unite the country behind him and stop the squabbling over continuing aid to Ukraine. Not sure what McCarthy’s response is. He’s having to appease the traitors in his party.

LOL, unite my ass. US neocons are afraid new congress won't be so enthusiastic about their little war with Russia project. So they invited that narco-clown mini-hitler to speak.

Negative. The Nazis are the Russians who have invaded a sovereign country. It would be a grave mistake to assume that the American people aren't nearly united in the belief that we must help Ukraine survive until the bitter end. Because we will.... At the speech, there were literally only 5 republicans who didn't stand and clap during Zelensky's speech.

NATO invaded Ukraine, not Russians. Russians are there to liberate it from nazi-neocon scam.
And don't equate your shitty Congress and even yourself with americans.

Nyet Comrade. As an aside, there are no Nato troops in Ukraine. But doesn't matter, Ukraine is a sovereign country and has the right to decide who is welcome or not in their country. And they do not want Russian storm troopers in their country. And again, would be a great mistake for you to assume that the US supporting Ukraine isn't wildly popular with Americans.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Of course there could be a perception in the MAGA crowd that Zelensky somehow betrayed Trump but that's completely delusional.

Zelensky wouldn't dance the MAGA cha-cha with Trumpo. He refused sucking Trump and Gulliani's political ballsacks. Nothing pisses a MAGAtard off more than not obeying their god.

 

[Elixir]

Barbs thinks he knows more about Americans than Americans do.

Add it to the list of propaganda-soaked delusions from which he suffers.

 

[Jayjay]

So who watched Z’s speech. Historical is the most common adjective of the talking heads. I hope that this speech will unite the country behind him and stop the squabbling over continuing aid to Ukraine. Not sure what McCarthy’s response is. He’s having to appease the traitors in his party.

LOL, unite my ass. US neocons are afraid new congress won't be so enthusiastic about their little war with Russia project. So they invited that narco-clown mini-hitler to speak.

Negative. The Nazis are the Russians who have invaded a sovereign country. It would be a grave mistake to assume that the American people aren't nearly united in the belief that we must help Ukraine survive until the bitter end. Because we will.... At the speech, there were literally only 5 republicans who didn't stand and clap during Zelensky's speech.

NATO invaded Ukraine, not Russians. Russians are there to liberate it from nazi-neocon scam.
And don't equate your shitty Congress and even yourself with americans.

NATO didn't invade Ukraine. Having joint exercises and providing training or weapons is not an invasion. Russia also does it with its allies: getting weapons from North Korea, instructors from Iran showing how to use Shahed drones, and joint military exercises with not only the usual puppets from CSTO but also China, India, Pakistan, Syria and Mongolia. According to your logic, these would be "invasions" and NATO would be entitled to march to Moscow to "liberate" you from the yoke of Mongolia.

Here's a helpful rule of thumb: if you have to shoot your way in to a country, then it's an invasion. If you're invited, then it's not.

 

[Jayjay]

Of course there could be a perception in the MAGA crowd that Zelensky somehow betrayed Trump but that's completely delusional.

Zelensky wouldn't dance the MAGA cha-cha with Trumpo. He refused sucking Trump and Gulliani's political ballsacks Nothing pisses a MAGAtard off more than not obeying their god.

I think that's an exaggeration. Zelensky kept as good relations with Trump as was reasonable. But obviously he couldn't deliver something that didn't exist, or start empty "investigations" by presidential decree that he would immediately get called on by his political opponents.

 

[Jayjay]

Merkel blurted their plan, now piece of shit Graham blurts his plan too.
No surprise there.

Graham is a weathervane that changes his opinion to back whoever seems to be winning at the time. If the MAGA folks start getting traction, he'll turn his coat faster than you can say "Slava Ukraini". But his present opinion isn't wrong. With the current level of assistance, Ukraine can at best hold the line, not win.

In any case, don't throw rocks if you live in a glass house. American senators and congressmen may have their own idiots, but when it come to craziness, it's hard to top the Russian Duma:



(EDIT: switched the video to one with subtitles.)

 

[Patooka]

So who watched Z’s speech. Historical is the most common adjective of the talking heads. I hope that this speech will unite the country behind him and stop the squabbling over continuing aid to Ukraine. Not sure what McCarthy’s response is. He’s having to appease the traitors in his party.

LOL, unite my ass. US neocons are afraid new congress won't be so enthusiastic about their little war with Russia project. So they invited that narco-clown mini-hitler to speak.

Negative. The Nazis are the Russians who have invaded a sovereign country. It would be a grave mistake to assume that the American people aren't nearly united in the belief that we must help Ukraine survive until the bitter end. Because we will.... At the speech, there were literally only 5 republicans who didn't stand and clap during Zelensky's speech.

NATO invaded Ukraine, not Russians. Russians are there to liberate it from nazi-neocon scam.
And don't equate your shitty Congress and even yourself with americans.

You should have stuck with the zombie bullshit, barbos. I mean, it is just as farcical but a lot more entertaining.

You also might want to reconsider your current..."argument" that Russia is the liberators considering you advocating the genocide of Ukraine back in July;

The more I watch "ukrainians" talking the more I get convinced that Ukraine was a mistake

That's the thing. When your "arguments" are always inconsistent, people are going to justifiably doubt your credibility.