How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[barbos]

Russia had no such evolution of thought.

We did not. Had no need to, because Russian monarchy was pretty mild and pluralistic. We had no religious wars.

 

[barbos]

Russia appears to be a stagnant system isolated from changes in the rst of the world.

That's your opinion, you see what I did there?

 

[SLD]

Barbos good buddy, can you post a link to a site hosted in Russia where I can express my views on Russia and Putin?

You can do it here, I report all of you to Putin.

Well, tell him from me, he’s a cocksucker, and I’ve killed better men.

 

[SLD]

I thought that this was an interesting response. Are you trying to say that Russia isn't losing any soldiers in Ukraine?

That's not what you said. You talked trash about Putin and Russia.

Russia does lose men, but a lot less than Ukrainian Regime.

Really? And you still can’t conquer them? Dude, your army sucks. They’re doing so great at killing Ukrainians, but they can’t take any territory? Are they cowards? Afraid to move forward? So it would seem.

Yes, really. No, our army does not suck. Even your NATO forces chief does not think they suck, even Ukro-Wehrmacht chief does not think so. Yes we are doing great killing ukrainian soldiers. And territory will come later, it actually started to come already. No, we are not cowards, we are simply not stupid.

Yeah. Sure you are. As you said 2 1/2 years ago. And after losing at least 3,000 tanks. Do you have much more left?

 

[Elixir]

We are lucky to have a classic caricature of a bumbling Russian pootapologist gracing these pages, lest we forget what a fucking mess authoritarian, personality-based goobermint looks like.

I can't help wonder who babs goes to for answers to questions like "Is there a russian website where I can air my opinion of Pooty and his cabal?"
Maybe the answer is simply "no" and he doesn't want to deal with that fact.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

We are lucky to have a classic caricature of a bumbling Russian pootapologist gracing these pages, lest we forget what a fucking mess authoritarian, personality-based goobermint looks like.

I can't help wonder who babs goes to for answers to questions like "Is there a russian website where I can air my opinion of Pooty and his cabal?"
Maybe the answer is simply "no" and he doesn't want to deal with that fact.

If you speak up against the present russian dictator you get punished. Maybe the punishment is arrest but maybe you get sent to the gulag or fall out a window or get poisoned. You can't blame someone like barbos for a lack of courage, for simply taking it in order to survive. Theoretically that can happen in any country. Russia just happens to be one of the shitholes where it did and still does and barbos happens to be living there.

 

[Elixir]

Theoretically that can happen in any country. Russia just happens to be one of the shitholes where it did and still does and barbos happens to be living there.

Is ballyhooing the virtues of Putlerism a required activity?
I'm guessing it is, lest government contractors come measuring your office for new windows.

If you speak up against the present russian dictator you get punished.

If you are in Russia, or somewhere else where Pootey's thugs can get to you, right?
Pootey has gone to great lengths to show the reach of his thugs, so I wouldn't really blame babs if everything he posts here is just an extension of his survival necessity.

 

[steve_bank]

Russia had no such evolution of thought.

We did not. Had no need to, because Russian monarchy was pretty mild and pluralistic. We had no religious wars.

You have outdone yourself.

Over here it took decades to openly address slavery as it really was. There are still deniers today who say it was not so bad. When I was in the militray in the VN war I was in Tennessee and Virginia. I saw Jim Crow oppression in person.

Saying the Russian aristocracy was mild is like somebody over here denying slavery.

If the monarchy was not so bad why did the Russian Revolution occur?.

Back in the 70s I read Trotsky's History Of The Russian Revolution.

In 1936, Trotsky was sentenced to death in absentia at the first of the Moscow show trials, and in 1940, was assassinated at his home in Mexico City by Stalinist agent Ramón Mercader.

An ice pick in the head I believe.

Putin is Stalin reborn. Assassination, suppression, and jailing of any and all counter voices. A throw back to the line of Russian Czars.

 

[TV and credit cards]

Theoretically that can happen in any country. Russia just happens to be one of the shitholes where it did and still does and barbos happens to be living there.

Is ballyhooing the virtues of Putlerism a required activity?
I'm guessing it is, lest government contractors come measuring your office for new windows.

Maybe he gets a nicer apartment for being a Putin booster. The frequency of his bullshit posts and that he often splits up responses into separate individual posts makes me wonder if he is just trying to bump up his total to hit some reward level.

 

[steve_bank]

A monthly ration of Vodka and borscht soup.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Strong enough for light stuff, not for heavy stuff.

Do they even HAVE heavy stuff any more?

In this case, heavy stuff = trains. They have shown an unwillingness to send freight cars over that bridge. That says to me the Ukranian bomb damaged a track support enough that they don't trust it under heavy load.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Back channel communi8cations with China during the VN war warned us China would enter the war if the U.S. invaded North Vietnam or pursued massive bombing missions there. A land war with China. That tied the hands of U.S. war planners.

Exactly. Third party wars the big players have to be careful not to come into too much conflict, lest the world get blown up. Same reason we won't let them use ATACMS against those airfields. (Their own drones, though, are another matter.)

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Those 6000 lb glide bombs are the devil for Ukraine. They have to be launched from aircraft but we're not allowing Ukraine to hit the aircraft and the airfields. We're really fucking Ukraine with this condition.

American imperialists figured out that it is not worth it to is lose aircraft carrier in Red Sea over this, especially seeing how ineffective ukro-american strikes have been so far.

You realize we have almost never sent much in the way of military power into the Red Sea?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Doesn't mean they're controlling things, though.

Come on, who would not like to sit in some chair in Ukraine and control things?
It probably took CIA director hours to get there after the coup.

As I said, the FSB no doubt had an equivalent. Do we thus conclude that the FSB was in control?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Every year in China town a few blocks from where I live there is the China town parade with the requisite Dragon Dance. Very popular in Seattle.

Point being our cultural mix dispite the adversarial nature pf poliics.

Russia? There is a Russian Orthodox church and maybe a restaurant or two, but little else.

Yup. We have a little Chinatown here. IIRC with the yearly Dragon Dance but I'm not aware of any parade.

I can't think of anything Russian in town, although I won't swear there's nothing.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Yeah, there is a cultural difference between the West and Russia. In the West, especially in US you have a tradition of free speech. Which basically means everyone is free to speak whatever they want and ..... everybody else is free to ignore you.
That's basically your way of having utterly incompatible ideas to coexist.
In Russia we don't really have that. You better be right when you open your pie hole. It's reflected in russian expression "Отвечать за базар" which actually come from criminal subculture but it applies in general too. We are different and I find it annoying when people don't listen/ignore, but that's your way of dealing with inconvenient "free" speech.
There are advantages and disadvantages in both ways.

Except it's not "better be right", but "better agree with Putin."

We recognize that there can be disagreements about what the truth is.

 

[Elixir]

Ain’t never seen no Ruskies round these parts. There was a guy from Ukraine who kinda sounded like one. Nice enough feller, long as he don’t go teachin’ none of that commie lib stuff to the kids.

 

[barbos]

Barbos good buddy, can you post a link to a site hosted in Russia where I can express my views on Russia and Putin?

You can do it here, I report all of you to Putin.

Well, tell him from me, he’s a cocksucker, and I’ve killed better men.

He said he needs it in video and your full name and address.

 

[barbos]

If the monarchy was not so bad why did the Russian Revolution occur?.

Because capitalists were utter shit. Plus WW1 and german shenanigans. Tsar was pretty weak and incompetent.

 

[barbos]

Yeah, there is a cultural difference between the West and Russia. In the West, especially in US you have a tradition of free speech. Which basically means everyone is free to speak whatever they want and ..... everybody else is free to ignore you.
That's basically your way of having utterly incompatible ideas to coexist.
In Russia we don't really have that. You better be right when you open your pie hole. It's reflected in russian expression "Отвечать за базар" which actually come from criminal subculture but it applies in general too. We are different and I find it annoying when people don't listen/ignore, but that's your way of dealing with inconvenient "free" speech.
There are advantages and disadvantages in both ways.

Except it's not "better be right", but "better agree with Putin."

I don't know his opinion on many things, for example what QM interpretation he supports.

We recognize that there can be disagreements about what the truth is.

Yes, you do, that's why your government lies.