How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?

[steve_bank]

Aup's argument is NATO and Putin are equivalent morally, and NATO forced Putin to do what he is doing.

NATO members are required to rerspond for mutual defense. If NATO member act in a conduct it does not make it a NATO action.

The invasion of Afghanistan was a direct response to an attack on the USA. The Pentagon was hit by a hijacked jet. The NATO treary was invoked.

The first Gulf war was a response to Iraq and Hussein seizing Kuwait and its oil assets. He justified by claiming it was historically a province or part of Iraq. Same reasoning as Putin. The war was also to protect the Saudi oil fields. Interruptions or control by Hussein could have had district effects on the global economy. That would include India.

It was sanctioned by the UN and was a coalition that included Arab armies and NATO members.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_W

On 2 August 1990, Iraq, governed by President Saddam Hussein, invaded neighboring Kuwait and fully occupied the country within two days. The invasion was primarily over disputes regarding Kuwait's alleged slant drilling in Iraq's Rumaila oil field, as well as to cancel Iraq's large debt to Kuwait from the recently ended Iran-Iraq War. After Iraq briefly occupied Kuwait under a rump puppet government known as the "Republic of Kuwait", it split Kuwait's sovereign territory into the "Saddamiyat al-Mitla' District" in the north, which was absorbed into Iraq's existing Basra Governorate, and the "Kuwait Governorate" in the south, which became Iraq's 19th governorate. The invasion of Kuwait was immediately met with international condemnation, including UN Security Council Resolution 660, which demanded Iraq's immediate withdrawal from Kuwait, and the imposition of comprehensive international sanctions against Iraq with the adoption of UN Security Council Resolution 661.

An array of countries joined the American-led coalition, forming the largest military alliance since World War II. The bulk of the coalition's military power was from the United States, with Saudi Arabia, the United Kingdom, and Egypt as the largest lead-up contributors, in that order. Additionally, Saudi Arabia and the Kuwaiti government-in-exile paid out around US$32 billion of the US$60 billion cost to mobilize the coalition against Iraq.

The second Gulf war was a mistake. Our neocons thought deposing Hussein would lead to democracy and a free Iraq in short order. We do not control Iraq.

Kuwait is free today.


Aup needs to read history instead of sitting on moral fence. From what I can see India plays both sides as non aligned.

 

[Henry-Finland]

 

[Henry-Finland]

"We raped 3 boys, 5 girls, 6 women, and shot them" - a captured russian occupier tells about his group's atrocities in Avdiivka."​

 

[Copernicus]

I feel sorry for her. Very sorry. But jesus christ. How dumb or naive do you have to be to want to travel to Russia? Or maybe she dosn't pay attention to the news.

That was kinda the first thing that popped into my head. Why would anyone with her history and knowledge think that going to Russia is a good idea?
Tom

I was just in Budapest a few weeks ago, and we met some young Russian citizens on the street who were also viewing the tourist sites. I had an opportunity to practice my Russian, and we had a nice long friendly chat about everything but the war. I expressed my regret at probably never being able to travel to Russia again, given my advanced age and the hostile relationships. They were insistent that I had nothing to fear in traveling to Russia, and I think they believed it. All I could do was point out that they do take hostages to exchange for Russians incarcerated in the West, and I was not young enough to assume the risk, despite the chance of getting to improve my conversational skills in Russian.

 

[laughing dog]

I pointed out to you that NATO is a defensive alliance that never attacked anyone in its 80-year history.

I do not agree to that. All major members of NATO (US, France, UK) have been involved in wars. Other countries also have participated in wars in Afghanistan, Iraq.

You conflate NATO countries with NATO. That is like conflating Assam or Gujurat with India.

 

[JohnG]

Whenever I get a feed on Ukraine/Russia from the Hindustan Times or the Times of India it is 100% Russian propaganda. So I figure there is a connection.

Are Indian newspapers paid by Russia? Does Russia buys advertising space in these papers? Do they invite these people to visit Russia without any cost. US does it. I was connected with American Embassy in Delhi for 25 years. Is everyone who differs with your view a Russian stooge?

Do you have the answers to those questions? I think he was pointing out an observation. None of the reasons you stated are usual methods of spreading propaganda. Inviting people at no cost? What does that have anything to do with anything? Were you connected to the Russian embassy? Are you familiar with them?

Your replay doesn't really address his observation. It just attempts to turn the table.

 

[Elixir]

I feel sorry for her. Very sorry. But jesus christ. How dumb or naive do you have to be to want to travel to Russia? Or maybe she dosn't pay attention to the news.

That was kinda the first thing that popped into my head. Why would anyone with her history and knowledge think that going to Russia is a good idea?
Tom

ANYONE going to Russia needs to do the math, starting with the question “am I worth anything as trade bait?”
Russia is so bad that Putin had to INVENT an invasion of Russia to make his people think there was something desirable enough about it that anyone would want to invade.
Now Ukraine has answered his prayers and he doesn’t know what to do about it. He might have to nuke his own people to cleanse the UkroNazis.
Russia is fucked.

 

[bilby]

I wonder that too. For that matter, what distinguishes a “strong atheist Hindu” from a strong atheist Buddhist, a strong atheist Sikh or any other strong atheist?

Indian nationalism.

"Hindu" as a descriptor here serves a similar purpose to an American describing himself as "Aryan", or an Englishman as "Anglo-Saxon"; It's an abuse of the common meaning of the word, used as code for "superior human".