Henry-Finland
Senior Member
What official narrative?
If you mean about Natsi-Russia, so it has changed as nowadays they also murder POWs.
Nothing new per se, but the discussion is now "clearer".
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How should west respond to potential (likely) Russian invasion of Ukraine?
- Thread starter Harry Bosch
- Start date
If you mean about Natsi-Russia, so it has changed as nowadays they also murder POWs.
Nothing new per se, but the discussion is now "clearer".
T.G.G. Moogly
Traditional Atheist
Someone appears to be an expert on gulags. No argument from me.
Harry Bosch
Contributor
The narrative hasn’t changed for me. I favor stopping imperialism. I’m also against American imperialism when it happens. I think that all countries should keep their damn military within their own UN recognized boundaries unless they are directly attacked. Period. And Utin invaded a sovereign country.
steve_bank
Diabetic retinopathy and poor eyesight. Typos ...
Whatever mistakes the western alliance have made, the question in this thread is about the brutal genocide of Ukraine and its justification..
Again you are ignorant of modern history and current events. Obama did bot invade Syria. Syria was in a civil war.
Right or wrong we got rid of Hussein and handed Iraq to the people. Free elections, but they could not handle it and fell into factional fighting.
The USA, French, and Brits have long been trying to stabilize the Mid East mostly in the interest of keeping oil flowing. If it were not for oil and Israel we would not care what they all do to each other.
What started ed it all was the attack on the Twin Towers and the Pentagon. One of the suicide planes on 911 struck the Pentagon. An act of war.
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www.history.navy.mil
911 led to attacking Afghanistan and Iraq a second time.
The first Gulf War was about getting Iraq out of Kuwait and protecting the Arab oil fields. It was coalition of western allies and Arabs.
One of Husein's claims was that Kuwait was historically part of Iraq and he had a right to plunder it. Just like Putin's clam about Ukraine.
Ukraine was never a threat to Russia or anyone. Like Husein Putin was out to plunder for personal glory, resources, and power.
I a still waiting for factual reports of opposition voices in Baltic states always being arrested.
Elixir
Made in America
That was a chilling moment. But not nearly as chilling for me, as was the moment just days later when Bushbaby announced the spawning of Das Department von Heimat Sicherheit.
Every nightmarish vision that announcement evoked, is coming to pass.
steve_bank
Diabetic retinopathy and poor eyesight. Typos ...
I remember it clearly.
I did not watch TV or turn on the radio before work.
When I walked in it was obvious something was wrong. I went into my boss's office and he hard a hard time talking about it. I watched on TV in another office and I could not believe it, I thought it must be a hoax.
Bush senior decided to not to enter Iraq and topple Hussein because it would have unpredictable consequences.
The only time I have emailed the WH was to oppose GWB's decision to invade Iraq. We had no post war pan for Iraq. General Chinsaki complained he did not have enough material for the war and troops for post war occupation and was fired.
Rumsfeld said 'You don't go to war with what you need you go wihat what you have''.
We have our share of political idiots.
I did not watch TV or turn on the radio before work.
When I walked in it was obvious something was wrong. I went into my boss's office and he hard a hard time talking about it. I watched on TV in another office and I could not believe it, I thought it must be a hoax.
Bush senior decided to not to enter Iraq and topple Hussein because it would have unpredictable consequences.
The only time I have emailed the WH was to oppose GWB's decision to invade Iraq. We had no post war pan for Iraq. General Chinsaki complained he did not have enough material for the war and troops for post war occupation and was fired.
Rumsfeld said 'You don't go to war with what you need you go wihat what you have''.
We have our share of political idiots.
barbos
Contributor
Sorry, Russia made a mistake, are we good now?
barbos
Contributor
Yes, you have. You still occupy part of the Syria.
steve_bank
Diabetic retinopathy and poor eyesight. Typos ...
It is not an occupation.
Russian intervention in the Syrian civil war - Wikipedia
The rebellion was against the dictator leading Syria. People wanted democracy, human rights, and free speech. As usual Russia supports the dictator and we support democracy.
As in Ukraine the Russians destroyed settlements and attacked civilians.
Free Syrian Army - Wikipedia
Free Syrian Army - Wikipedia
Does Russian TV and Internet allow global reporting?
Still waiting for cases about opposition always being arrested in Baltic states.
barbos
Contributor
Actually it is.
barbos
Contributor
barbos
Contributor
I have better. They harass western foreigners who dared to live in Russia:
Baltic states are the most deranged of all the west.
steve_bank
Diabetic retinopathy and poor eyesight. Typos ...
Yo9u said 'always getting arrested' not harassed.
To a degree in western liberal democracies people can be harassed, defamed, and heckle by citizens but not the government. For citizens we cal freedom of speech and expression.. The right to oriticize and publicly protest individuals, groups, and government.
In contrast in Russia both Russian and foreign reporters have been arrested for voicing criticism of government.
A Russian media video in Russian is not proof of 'always being arrested in Baltic states'.
The video looks homemade.
If I saw you in Seattle I would get a group following you around haraqnguing you....it is my right to do so, express my hostility to you and Putin to your face.
To a degree in western liberal democracies people can be harassed, defamed, and heckle by citizens but not the government. For citizens we cal freedom of speech and expression.. The right to oriticize and publicly protest individuals, groups, and government.
In contrast in Russia both Russian and foreign reporters have been arrested for voicing criticism of government.
A Russian media video in Russian is not proof of 'always being arrested in Baltic states'.
The video looks homemade.
If I saw you in Seattle I would get a group following you around haraqnguing you....it is my right to do so, express my hostility to you and Putin to your face.
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barbos
Contributor
barbos
Contributor
And your point is?
It's argentinian citizen who was refused entrance into Estonia on the basis that she was a student in russian university.
She was detained, lost money on the ticket to the bus and was kicked out back to Russia.
Estonian border officers were rude obnoxious and out of control.
SLD
Contributor
Damn! You should attack them for such rudeness. Sounds like a good pretext for war.
steve_bank
Diabetic retinopathy and poor eyesight. Typos ...
People in the Baltic states and others like Poland remember the Soviet oppression and see what Putin is doing today.
They don't like Russia and Russians. That is why they joined NATO.
It comes down to Putin seeing himself as a reincarnation of old Russian czars, conquerors. A fantasy of Soviet glory and power which never existed.
Putin appears to live in an isolated reality not grasping the world is moving on, people like feeling free from governments and tyrants. They like free expression.
Our Trump is a Putin wannabe. Without our constitution and independent judiciary he might be.
If you came to Seattle I would get in your face and suggest you go back where you came from.
Savvy? Get my drift?
If Russia had free speech, free press, and free elections Putin would be out. He knows it like all dictators and authoritarians do. Free speech and media are threats to their personal power.
Poor Putin, all that money he has squirreled away and he can't go anywhere to spend it. All those great restaurants and hotels in Europe. All those people and leaders in the EU going where they want having a good time.
My guess is Putin in private pitiably goes into a frustrated rage, we know Trump does. He probably thinks conquering Ukraine will make him feel better.
They don't like Russia and Russians. That is why they joined NATO.
It comes down to Putin seeing himself as a reincarnation of old Russian czars, conquerors. A fantasy of Soviet glory and power which never existed.
Putin appears to live in an isolated reality not grasping the world is moving on, people like feeling free from governments and tyrants. They like free expression.
Our Trump is a Putin wannabe. Without our constitution and independent judiciary he might be.
If you came to Seattle I would get in your face and suggest you go back where you came from.
Savvy? Get my drift?
If Russia had free speech, free press, and free elections Putin would be out. He knows it like all dictators and authoritarians do. Free speech and media are threats to their personal power.
Poor Putin, all that money he has squirreled away and he can't go anywhere to spend it. All those great restaurants and hotels in Europe. All those people and leaders in the EU going where they want having a good time.
My guess is Putin in private pitiably goes into a frustrated rage, we know Trump does. He probably thinks conquering Ukraine will make him feel better.
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- Joined
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- Old Fart
- Basic Beliefs
- Don't be a dick.
Russia Fines Man Who Dyed Hair in Ukraine Flag Colors - The Moscow Times
A Moscow resident who dyed his hair in the colors of the Ukrainian flag has been found guilty of "discrediting the army" and fined, court documents showed.
Fined for yellow and blue shoes: How Russian laws smother dissent
Since the invasion of Ukraine, the measures used to clamp down on Kremlin critics have swelled.
www.bbc.com