Larry Baer

[RavenSky]

[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwT54X0sJIc[/YOUTUBE]

I'm assuming everyone has seen the video by now. Without minimizing nor maximizing what we see on the video, nor making up "what if's" to fit our agendas, do you think Larry Baer's behavior here was appropriate or inappropriate.

I stipulate to the fact that it is his phone she is holding.

 

[untermensche]

They tussled, she fell back and he took a phone. She screamed when she fell back.

A little kitten fight.

 

[Angry Floof]

Fucking testerical piece of shit abuser is what he is. I can't imagine my ex husband or any man I ever dated putting their hands on me like that. They'd be eating their own balls if they had, though. This is not normal. It's not ok. That man has no self control.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Depends, was she about to buy $100 million in bitcoin and he stopped her?

 

[Bronzeage]

The only thing that prevents this from being an obvious case of criminal assault is the fact there is a relationship between the two people. If they were strangers to each other, he'd be chased down as any purse snatcher.

 

[repoman]

So, was she thinking that he was cheating on him and she was trying to see his texts, emails or phone calls?

If he was innocent of that it could get him riled up and indignant. If guilty, well that is obvious...

So, what is the answer to someone taking YOUR PROPERTY to spy on you in your face?

 

[barbos]

The only thing that prevents this from being an obvious case of criminal assault is the fact there is a relationship between the two people. If they were strangers to each other, he'd be chased down as any purse snatcher.

I understand she took his smartphone and he took it back.

 

[RavenSky]

Depends, was she about to buy $100 million in bitcoin and he stopped her?

Points for making me laugh

The only thing that prevents this from being an obvious case of criminal assault is the fact there is a relationship between the two people. If they were strangers to each other, he'd be chased down as any purse snatcher.

This is where I am, with a healthy dose of Angry Floof.

I would also note that anyone who would be this physically aggressive with their spouse in public, knowing full well that people are watching, has most likely done far worse in private.

 

[RavenSky]

The only thing that prevents this from being an obvious case of criminal assault is the fact there is a relationship between the two people. If they were strangers to each other, he'd be chased down as any purse snatcher.

I understand she took his smartphone and he took it back.

He didn't take it back. He was physically aggressively straddling her while trying to pry it from her hand, thereby causing her chair to tip and for her to fall to the ground. This to a person - his spouse - that he later claimed was already injured.

Do you typically assault injured people because they are holding your phone?

 

[RavenSky]

So, was she thinking that he was cheating on him and she was trying to see his texts, emails or phone calls?

If he was innocent of that it could get him riled up and indignant. If guilty, well that is obvious...

So, what is the answer to someone taking YOUR PROPERTY to spy on you in your face?

It appears that a lot of people think the answer is to assault her.

 

[untermensche]

Is fighting over the same phone assault?

Who owned the phone?

 

[southernhybrid]

He physically assaulted his wife. There is no excuse for his behavior. I've been married for almost forty years and my husband knows that any type of physical violence would be the deal breaker in our relationship. We get mad at each other sometimes, but no matter how angry my husband might be, he has never done anything like that asshole did.

I don't care if she took his fucking phone. Physical violence is not the way that your protest when your partner grabs something like your phone. And, if for some reason he didn't want his wife to look at his phone record, he shouldn't have let told her his passcode.

 

[untermensche]

Just saying it was assault doesn't make it so.

They tussled over a phone. He was stronger. He won.

That doesn't make it assault.

If she was stronger she would have won.

 

[RavenSky]

Is fighting over the same phone assault?

She was sitting in a chair looking at the phone. He physically assaulted her to take the phone from her. Yes, it was a physical assault.

Who owned the phone?

Doesn't matter.

 

[RavenSky]

Just saying it was assault doesn't make it so.

They tussled over a phone. He was stronger. He won.

That doesn't make it assault.

If she was stronger she would have won.

What he did is the very definition of "assault and battery"

"the crime of threatening a person together with the act of making physical contact with them."

 

[dismal]

Is fighting over the same phone assault?

She was sitting in a chair looking at the phone. He physically assaulted her to take the phone from her. Yes, it was a physical assault.

Who owned the phone?

Doesn't matter.

It looks like his objective was to grab the phone. She doesn't appear to have had much to do with it, other than she was holding the phone.

Whether it is right to grab a phone from someone depends on context. If it was her phone I suppose you could call it an assault. If it was his phone and she wouldn't give it back it seems reasonably justified.

No one has any right to occupy someone else's phone without their permission. If women want to be treated equally, this is sometimes what you get. You can't prevail on the cultural bias that a man should not do that to a woman. You're just a person that took something that belongs to another person.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

If somebody steals your stuff, you should be able to use a certain amount of force to get it back.

If he’d grabbed her purse and she wrestled him to the ground to get it back, there wouldn’t be much of a discussion about whether it was fine for her to do do. There’s no need to be a misogynist and say that the reverse doesn’t apply as well.

If you don’t want people to use force against you to retake their stolen property, don’t fucking rob them.

 

[RavenSky]

I'm seeing the same pattern here as elsewhere... blame her for his actions by claiming (without evidence) that she "stole" the phone, or "grabbed" the phone, or other assumptions that put the blame on her for his aggressive behavior.

So let's play some more "what if".

What if he wanted her to hold the phone, as many men do want their wives to hold the phone in her purse?

What if the phone was sitting on the bench, and she picked it up?

Any of these "what ifs" are nonsense because no matter what the prior circumstances, assault and battery is NOT an appropriate way to regain possession of a cell phone from your spouse.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Just saying it was assault doesn't make it so.

They tussled over a phone. He was stronger. He won.

That doesn't make it assault.

If she was stronger she would have won.

What he did is the very definition of "assault and battery"

"the crime of threatening a person together with the act of making physical contact with them."

Somebody hack UM's account? Their posts recently have been insane.

Also, who's phone it is? This was his wife, not some stranger. Property ownership lines are quite muddled. However, physically harassing a woman (wife or stranger), the lines aren't quite as gray.

 

[dismal]

I'm seeing the same pattern here as elsewhere... blame her for his actions by claiming (without evidence) that she "stole" the phone, or "grabbed" the phone, or other assumptions that put the blame on her for his aggressive behavior.

So let's play some more "what if".

What if he wanted her to hold the phone, as many men do want their wives to hold the phone in her purse?

What if the phone was sitting on the bench, and she picked it up?

Any of these "what ifs" are nonsense because no matter what the prior circumstances, assault and battery is NOT an appropriate way to regain possession of a cell phone from your spouse.

I don't think it's really that complicated:

Person A has Person B's phone and won't give it back: that amount of force seems reasonable from Person B to take it back
Person A has Person A's phone: no amount of force is reasonable from Person B to take it.

Dragging words like "spouse" and gender into it are irrelevant. We should not try to assess the dynamics of someone else's marriage. Nor should we presume special treatment based on gender. We should treat them as individuals with their own moral agency.