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Male and female privileges acknowledgement thread

 
 
 
ruby sparks

ruby sparks

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There are some interesting and thought-provoking suggested examples of male privileges in this article:

160+ Examples of Male Privilege in All Areas of Life
https://everydayfeminism.com/2016/02/160-examples-of-male-privilege/

And, for balance, some examples of suggested female privileges in this one:

Ladies, check your privilege
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/ladies-check-your-privilege/article33797846/

I think that reading both is enlightening.

So, here's the rule for this thread. I hope posters will comply. You can pick an example or examples from either of those articles, or you can suggest your own examples, but, you are only allowed, in this particular thread, to agree with (and discuss or elaborate on) examples from your own sex or gender. No ifs, buts or maybes. If you can't find any examples about your own sex or gender to agree with or acknowledge, or you can't agree with an example offered by another poster, or feel you want to quibble, please don't post. Bite your typing finger. Similarly if you feel that another poster has broken the rule. Try to ignore it. :)

For example. As a male, I agree that men/males, in general or often, have the privilege of not feeling they have to take, or indeed of not having to take, as many personal safety precautions as women generally do when out and about in public, particularly if alone and particularly at night. I was not previously as aware of this as I am now and I aim to try to weave this increased awareness into my daily life in a positive way, without necessarily making assumptions about individuals or individual circumstances.

Responses without so many caveats (eg "men don't have to take so many personal safety precautions") will be accepted and it will be assumed, unless stated to the contrary, that the poster is only speaking generally and does not think that the privilege is always present, always 100% present, or always obtained by all persons of that sex/gender.

Posts of the 'I agree that my sex/gender has privilege X, but....' will be vetted and may receive a facepalm or similar verbal/visual sanction from the thread starter, especially if the 'but' is a precursor to something critical or negative about the other sex/gender or a complaint about their privileges.

Try to play along. Try to be generous, unselfish, helpful and if necessary confessional. Personal experiences and anecdotes welcome also. Hey, this could be fun.

I predict this thread will die in about 48 hours due to lack of infighting. Feel free to prove me wrong. :)
 
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Women generally have greater freedom to take time off to raise children and in general to choose careers which involve caring for young children than do men.


Keeping within the bounds stated in the OP, I will not mention the downsides or negative consequences to this privilege.

Personally, I am very grateful to have had as much freedom as I did to care for my own children and also to work in a career that I chose. My own grandmothers could not spend much time caring for their children as economic reality forced them to spend a great deal of time working. My mother had little choice except to stay home, despite the fact that it didn't really suit her much. Social norms of her day plus memories of her own mother being absent a great deal of time kept her home past when she would have chosen otherwise.
 
As a professional female, I feel I have greater liberty in professional work attire, specifically in very formal settings. Men get to wear a suit and tie. I get to wear a suit, dress, or blouse and pants, and more jewelry, (and makeup!).
 
As a woman, I think that (in most modern countries) women have privilege in our clothing choices.

Leaving aside the sexualization and blame aspects that sometimes gets tied up with women's clothing and, of course, certain countries that restrict women's clothing, we have a much greater freedom of choice of clothing in the modern world than men do.

If I choose to wear a pantsuit or a skirt to the office, no one blinks. I don't think men yet have that same freedom. I can choose to wear high heels or flats. A man would likely end his career if he wore pumps to work. Women have a much wider variety of styles and colors to choose from. It is still a huge deal in some offices for men to wear anything other than a white button down shirt. And dude! Neckties! Nothing like cutting off the oxygen supply to your brain on a regular basis.

This is one area that I have always thought women currently have it better than men.

ETA: I see that Starwater writes way faster than I do, but is on the same wavelength :D
 
I really enjoy being a slob or not, as I choose. Not worrying about my appearance, not caring that I accidentally went to the grocery with bed head, cutting my own hair, exercising for health not vanity, and you should see me sneaking out on the porch to grab a UPS package. Okay, I’m a bit concerned about that one but so far, so good. And not having to sit on public toilets, especially the outhouse type in the parks. I don’t even like to pee standing up over those things, except to try and dislodge the toilet paper hanging on the stainless steel bars. That’s kind of fun.
 
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Much of those privileges for women are apples-to-oranges or just irrelevant.

Any decent society would allow tons of leeway to pregnant women and mothers. This isn't a privilege. It's a humane norm and policy to hold. This "privilege" doesn't compare to the privilege of treating people as you please with little or no consequence, and those not inclined to treat people badly have the luxury of not caring.

And whatever someone might perceive as a lack of this privilege for men should be aware, I would hope, that supporting women and fighting for our rights and for progressive values and policies is what WILL give men those rights and benefits.

We women may have some privileges, but none of them equate to the freedom and leeway to prey on others, to brutalize others, to diminish others, etc.

That list has some good points, but it looks like a list made for men who insist on some kind of "both sides are the same" bullshit.

The whole country is discussing how male privilege can so easily destroy life after life with little or no consequence. That's a huge problem. Whatever else you think is a problem regarding gender norms and issues, none of it comes close to being the issue of how American men routinely brutalize women. Not sure what the point of the thread is, but looks like "Hey, let's all look at our privilege," which is a good topic, but implying that there's an equal level of privilege also makes this a safe kind of conversation for those who won't or can't recognize the differences in opportunities and barriers as well as the level of acceptance of violence against women.
 
Angry Floof said:
Much of those privileges for women are apples-to-oranges or just irrelevant.

Any decent society would allow tons of leeway to pregnant women and mothers. This isn't a privilege. It's a humane norm and policy to hold. This "privilege" doesn't compare to the privilege of treating people as you please with little or no consequence, and those not inclined to treat people badly have the luxury of not caring.

And whatever someone might perceive as a lack of this privilege for men should be aware, I would hope, that supporting women and fighting for our rights and for progressive values and policies is what WILL give men those rights and benefits.

We women may have some privileges, but none of them equate to the freedom and leeway to prey on others, to brutalize others, to diminish others, etc.

That list has some good points, but it looks like a list made for men who insist on some kind of "both sides are the same" bullshit.

The whole country is discussing how male privilege can so easily destroy life after life with little or no consequence. That's a huge problem. Whatever else you think is a problem regarding gender norms and issues, none of it comes close to being the issue of how American men routinely brutalize women. Not sure what the point of the thread is, but looks like "Hey, let's all look at our privilege," which is a good topic, but implying that there's an equal level of privilege also makes this a safe kind of conversation for those who won't or can't recognize the differences in opportunities and barriers as well as the level of acceptance of violence against women.
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Yes. But I think you are missing the point with the OP. This is a social exercise on this forum, which is trying to bring some civility to the :boom: (damn I was looking for the trainwreck emoticon - mods can you add that one?) that happened yesterday.
 
No, speaking my thoughts on this is not a train wreck. The OP gives a list and an implication that I find questionable.
 
starwater said:
Yes. But I think you are missing the point with the OP. This is a social exercise on this forum, which is trying to bring some civility....
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Thanks. Yes that was the hope and the intention. Not that disagreements are necessarily uncivil, obviously.
 
Interesting to read from female posters about perceived privileges regarding dress and appearance options. :)

I would like to offer in return that I, like TV and credit cards, feel privileged, as a man, by not having to make as much of an effort, as often. This applies to both clothing and grooming. Related to this, and on behalf of my daughters, it has been my experience that young men are not obliged to wear revealing clothes or ridiculously high heels when going to school parties. This may not be universally the case so I would consider it anecdotal.
 
In spite of my reservations about the OP, I will give an example of my privilege in a sense. I didn't use my privilege so much as saw it in glaring light in one moment and I felt horrible.

I was shopping for groceries and in a foul mood. I'm usually patient with other shoppers being in the way or going slow or whatever. This one day I was just done. I was looking for something on a shelf and someone came up behind me. Usually, you wait until the person who was there first to make their choice and move on and then you have access to that shelf after giving them a chance to find what they want. Now and then someone will push in front like you're not there, but generally, people wait.

So I was looking at shelves of small items searching for a specific flavor or whatever. The person came up behind me very close. I could hear her breathing and I perceived her to be impatient. So in my foul mood, I growled something sarcastic like, "Oh, am I in your way?"

She said, "Oh, no, take your time!" I turned to look at her and realized she was genuine and I was wrong to assume she was impatient. But more than that, her reaction was a strong fear reaction in her body language and voice. It hit me like a wrecking ball that she was terrified of me. She was a black woman, if I didn't mention that before, and it was like one lightning bolt of realization where I saw my white privilege to be a nasty, petty shit to a woman of color who didn't do anything to deserve it. I saw someone whose life is likely riddled with discrimination and probably abuse as well. And I terrorized her just because I was in a foul mood.

Granted, I did not know who was behind me when I said it. Could have been a giant, testerical white man for all I knew. (My foul moods are not discriminatory.) But that moment of seeing her face had quite an impact on me. I cried in the car on the way home that I caused her that stress. I really don't want to know what my face looked like at that moment. She was shaking and scared and attempting to appease me because I showed irritation. I'll never forget that. I wish I could find her and apologize.
 
That was such a poignant and laudable post that I am inclined to ignore that it wasn't about gender privilege and just say thanks very much for posting. :)
 
ruby sparks said:
That was such a poignant and laudable post that I am inclined to ignore that it wasn't about gender privilege and just say thanks very much for posting. :)
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Doh! My mind went to privilege in general. I can move the post if you like.

Sorry about that. My second apology in one thread!
 
Angry Floof said:
ruby sparks said:
That was such a poignant and laudable post that I am inclined to ignore that it wasn't about gender privilege and just say thanks very much for posting. :)
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Doh! My mind went to privilege in general. I can move the post if you like.

Sorry about that. My second apology in one thread!
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No need to be sorry. Or move the post. Thanks for offering though.

Gosh, this trying to be civil and generous (in this thread at least) is even rubbing off on me. Lol.
 
Oh AF, you might or might not also have noticed that I did not send you a facepalm for infringing the thread 'rules' (not really rules, more like aspirations). First I would like to reassure you that that was not because you are female (as far as I know). I must just be infected with something worryingly gracious today. It may pass. I get these blips from time to time. :)

Second, I'd like to briefly break the 'rules' myself just to respectfully address your points. The having of two complimentary lists was not intended to imply equality of advantage or disadvantage. I'm only trying to avoid what someone else in another thread called a divisive 'victim olympics' competition. My own personal opinion, for what it's worth, is that given the hypothetical choice, I'd rather be a man, because I think there are more advantages.

Nor do I think either list is particularly good, the more I explore them both. They were just meant to be jumping off points and weren't particularly well vetted initially.

Finally, it was partly your "THIS IS NOT A POLITICAL THREAD. THIS IS SUPPORT FIRESIDE" thread which gave me the idea for this one, even if the intent was only similar in the sense of trying to avoid disagreements. Think of it as a 'safe space' even if not gendered.

And now, hopefully, back to the OP.....:)
 
I am a privileged overweight male in that i am more likely to receive medical care from strangers.
No one's afraid to touch my chest if CPR is necessary.
If in a crash, a lot more of my clothing will be removed to search for any unnoticed wounds.
 
ruby sparks said:
Second, I'd like to briefly break the 'rules' myself just to respectfully address your points. The having of two complimentary lists was not intended to imply equality of advantage or disadvantage.

Nor do I think either list is particularly good, the more I explore them both. They were just meant to be jumping off points and weren't particularly well vetted initially...

And now, hopefully, back to the OP.....:)
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Before we go back to the purpose of your thread (which I think is a good one, btw), may I point out that I agree with the poor quality of the second article regarding "female privilege", with examples that are mostly not. The first article did a better job on both sides, though it did stretch the point almost to breaking to reach the title clickbait number of 101 on the male privilege side

The second article though, was horrible imo. For example:

As the cranky feminist Camille Paglia notes, "It is men who heft and weld the giant steel beams that frame our office buildings, and it is men who do the hair-raising work of insetting and sealing the finely tempered plate-glass windows of skyscrapers 50 stories tall." The vast majority of workplace fatalities are male. So are the vast majority of workers in policing, firefighting, war and other lethal professions. Do you think this arrangement is unfair to women? Me neither.
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That's not female privilege. That's women being shut out of career paths that they may want to take. It is only recently that women have been allowed into combat units in the military, hired as firefighters, etc. The writer pretending that we are somehow "privileged" for being shut out of "male" career paths does a disservice to everyone (and to the spirit of this thread)

And I will save you the trouble:

:picardfacepalm:
 
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