Mar-a-Largo raided by FBI?

[Jimmy Higgins]

So, after reading all 10 pages...

It is the case that the documents seized were nuclear information that Trump planned to give to Putin?

There are a couple things here.

1) Did the FBI know his possession of these documents months ago? The FBI knew Trump had additional documents several months back. If they knew he had these, the value of the documents might be limited. Still quite illegal to have, but not harmful. Had they not known months ago that these documents were there, then the documents could definitely be much more secure.

2) Having nuclear documents was a crime, whether he intended to pass them along or not. That intention would be additional crimes.

 

[Toni]

So, after reading all 10 pages...

It is the case that the documents seized were nuclear information that Trump planned to give to Putin?

There are a couple things here.

1) Did the FBI know his possession of these documents months ago? The FBI knew Trump had additional documents several months back. If they knew he had these, the value of the documents might be limited. Still quite illegal to have, but not harmful. Had they not known months ago that these documents were there, then the documents could definitely be much more secure.

2) Having nuclear documents was a crime, whether he intended to pass them along or not. That intention would be additional crimes.

I disagree that, assuming the documents that Trump withheld was known that they were rendered not harmful or that the harm was limited. Suppose he had documents that contained the nuclear code, for example, and it was known that he had such documents: even if the codes had immediately been changed and even recoded by an entirely different system of codes, having possession of even ineffective obsolete codes can provide valuable information about how these codes are structured, in the right hands.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

So, after reading all 10 pages...

It is the case that the documents seized were nuclear information that Trump planned to give to Putin?

There are a couple things here.

1) Did the FBI know his possession of these documents months ago? The FBI knew Trump had additional documents several months back. If they knew he had these, the value of the documents might be limited. Still quite illegal to have, but not harmful. Had they not known months ago that these documents were there, then the documents could definitely be much more secure.

2) Having nuclear documents was a crime, whether he intended to pass them along or not. That intention would be additional crimes.

I disagree that, assuming the documents that Trump withheld was known that they were rendered not harmful or that the harm was limited. Suppose he had documents that contained the nuclear code, for example, and it was known that he had such documents: even if the codes had immediately been changed and even recoded by an entirely different system of codes, having possession of even ineffective obsolete codes can provide valuable information about how these codes are structured, in the right hands.

The FBI already had taken back files from a while ago. I have a hard time thinking that illegally held nuclear docs would have led them to saying "put a lock on the door", instead of "we are taking these too".

If the FBI didn't know about these documents, that does imply conspiring to keep these docs from their knowledge, which really fucks Trump in a trial. IE, while having them alone is a crime, conspiring to keep them withheld makes that case a slam dunk. Especially when knowing that he has no authority to "declassify" them.

 

[Toni]

So, after reading all 10 pages...

It is the case that the documents seized were nuclear information that Trump planned to give to Putin?

There are a couple things here.

1) Did the FBI know his possession of these documents months ago? The FBI knew Trump had additional documents several months back. If they knew he had these, the value of the documents might be limited. Still quite illegal to have, but not harmful. Had they not known months ago that these documents were there, then the documents could definitely be much more secure.

2) Having nuclear documents was a crime, whether he intended to pass them along or not. That intention would be additional crimes.

I disagree that, assuming the documents that Trump withheld was known that they were rendered not harmful or that the harm was limited. Suppose he had documents that contained the nuclear code, for example, and it was known that he had such documents: even if the codes had immediately been changed and even recoded by an entirely different system of codes, having possession of even ineffective obsolete codes can provide valuable information about how these codes are structured, in the right hands.

The FBI already had taken back files from a while ago. I have a hard time thinking that illegally held nuclear docs would have led them to saying "put a lock on the door", instead of "we are taking these too".

If the FBI didn't know about these documents, that does imply conspiring to keep these docs from their knowledge, which really fucks Trump in a trial. IE, while having them alone is a crime, conspiring to keep them withheld makes that case a slam dunk. Especially when knowing that he has no authority to "declassify" them.

I just used an example of something everyone would have an easy visual of—I would assume that such codes are changed frequently and immediately if there is a change in POTUS. I did not meant o imply lieralky that he had taken the nuclear codes with him, although I did read that fake nuclear codes were in a visual he used for fundraising.

I personally have a hard time understanding why anyone would assume or seem to assume that any documents taken were returned in total in the first set picked up. But then, I have a difficult time understanding why all such documents/boxes of documents were not immediately inventoried on site and anything missing not immediately demanded, with those charged with retrieval refusing to leave premises without either the missing items or Trump in their custody ( really, both—should have been both).

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I personally have a hard time understanding why anyone would assume or seem to assume that any documents taken were returned in total in the first set picked up. But then, I have a difficult time understanding why all such documents/boxes of documents were not immediately inventoried on site and anything missing not immediately demanded, with those charged with retrieval refusing to leave premises without either the missing items or Trump in their custody ( really, both—should have been both).

The FBI knew Trump had some additional docs. Yes, there are questions as to why they weren't all taken, however, it is possible some could have been gray area documents.

What seems to have happened is someone told the FBI additional documents, all classified, were at the resort / home. The evidence of this was so high, a judge actually signed off on a warrant to search an ex-President's home. Now we all know the alt-right will think any judge will do this, but that isn't the case and the FBI's bar for passing a judicial test were absurdly high. Makes one wonder who found the docs... or how they found them. Which does provide some thoughts that it is Jr... or maybe Giuliani. I mean how many people would know about these things or have access.

This seems to indicate Number 2 from my question above is the situation we see unfolding. That Trump stole documents that were classified, in fact up to TS - CSI, and nuclear weapon related, and when going back and forth with the FBI, he did not disclose having any of these documents.

 

[Copernicus]

Given the handling of Donald Trump up to this point, I think that the message to future presidents is that they should consider themselves too big to fail. They hold the position of highest public trust possible for our nation, so, if they violate laws, they face relatively few consequences. I would prefer that people in that position felt more hesitation to cross lines, because the original idea was not to have someone with the power of a monarch in that position. However, Donald Trump has now shown that it is possible to do pretty much what one pleases with the powers of that high office and get away with very few consequences. We now see a governor in Florida who is following exactly that role model and aspires to occupy the office of the presidency after Biden. I still believe that Donald Trump will never face a day in jail for his crimes. At worst, he may have to spend a few months under house arrest in one of his mansions. Anyone else caught with such documents in his or her possession could expect to face very quick trial and punishment.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Given the handling of Donald Trump up to this point, I think that the message to future presidents is that they should consider themselves too big to fail. They hold the position of highest public trust possible for our nation, so, if they violate laws, they face relatively few consequences. I would prefer that people in that position felt more hesitation to cross lines, because the original idea was not to have someone with the power of a monarch in that position. However, Donald Trump has now shown that it is possible to do pretty much what one pleases with the powers of that high office and get away with very few consequences. We now see a governor in Florida who is following exactly that role model and aspires to occupy the office of the presidency after Biden. I still believe that Donald Trump will never face a day in jail for his crimes.

If he had nuclear weapon documents that were top secret or better... I think that is a slam dunk case as mere possession is convictable. Possession and conspiring to keep said possession secret makes it a pedestrian conviction. Attorneys love pedestrian convictions. If there is evidence suggesting he meant to use this info down the road... well, that gets less pedestrian, but a lot more substantial. MOST IMPORTANTLY, some one correct me if I'm wrong, a conviction of this disqualifies him from being President.

To makes things even more interesting... Trump wants the affidavit unsealed. Which can be meant to imply there is more hidden stuff... or maybe just Trump wants to punish the leaker. And this was a huge leak, and likely very recent as well.

 

[Elixir]

Trump wants the affidavit unsealed.

What gives you THAT idea?
He says so?

His lawyers sat like statues when they had a chance to move for unsealing the affidavit.
There’s lotsa damaging stuff there, and Trump knows it. He’d like to learn who the leaker is, but not badly enough to move to make the basis of the search warrant known to the public.

 

[bilby]

I would assume that such codes are changed frequently and immediately if there is a change in POTUS.

Is this your first day?

I bet some of those codes haven't been changed since the Cold War.

 

[Copernicus]

The  Gold Codes are changed daily.

Gold Codes are generated daily and provided by the National Security Agency (NSA) to the White House, The Pentagon, United States Strategic Command and TACAMO. For an extra level of security, the list of codes on the card includes codes that have no meaning, and therefore the president must memorize where on the list the correct code is located. The concept behind the codes is that they permit the president to positively identify themself as the commander-in-chief and thereby authenticate a launch order to the National Military Command Center (NMCC).

 

[Oleg]

The  Gold Codes are changed daily.

Gold Codes are generated daily and provided by the National Security Agency (NSA) to the White House, The Pentagon, United States Strategic Command and TACAMO. For an extra level of security, the list of codes on the card includes codes that have no meaning, and therefore the president must memorize where on the list the correct code is located. The concept behind the codes is that they permit the president to positively identify themself as the commander-in-chief and thereby authenticate a launch order to the National Military Command Center (NMCC).

So Trump had some expired launch codes in his luggage? 12345? The monster.

 

[Copernicus]

The  Gold Codes are changed daily.

Gold Codes are generated daily and provided by the National Security Agency (NSA) to the White House, The Pentagon, United States Strategic Command and TACAMO. For an extra level of security, the list of codes on the card includes codes that have no meaning, and therefore the president must memorize where on the list the correct code is located. The concept behind the codes is that they permit the president to positively identify themself as the commander-in-chief and thereby authenticate a launch order to the National Military Command Center (NMCC).

So Trump had some expired launch codes in his luggage? 12345? The monster.

It is unlikely that Trump cared about the nuclear codes, since they are just numbers. What would be interesting is the process surrounding the handling of those codes--for example, how and when they are transmitted and decoded. It might be possible for an adversary to interrupt that process at the start of a nuclear attack.

 

[Toni]

I would assume that such codes are changed frequently and immediately if there is a change in POTUS.

Is this your first day?

I bet some of those codes haven't been changed since the Cold War.

I'd really feel like a thief for taking your money.

 

[ZiprHead]

 

[Toni]

The  Gold Codes are changed daily.

Gold Codes are generated daily and provided by the National Security Agency (NSA) to the White House, The Pentagon, United States Strategic Command and TACAMO. For an extra level of security, the list of codes on the card includes codes that have no meaning, and therefore the president must memorize where on the list the correct code is located. The concept behind the codes is that they permit the president to positively identify themself as the commander-in-chief and thereby authenticate a launch order to the National Military Command Center (NMCC).

So Trump had some expired launch codes in his luggage? 12345? The monster.

It is unlikely that Trump cared about the nuclear codes, since they are just numbers. What would be interesting is the process surrounding the handling of those codes--for example, how and when they are transmitted and decoded. It might be possible for an adversary to interrupt that process at the start of a nuclear attack.

Well, dollars are just numbers, more precisely 0's and 1's. He understands numbers very well when it comes to how much money he can get and what is and is not in his various accounts and to what extent he must lie to present the image he wishes to present.

He both fostered an appearance of idiocy and at the same time, has never been particularly literate and is mentally declining. We all know what kind of people he surrounded himself with. He definitely knew what nuclear codes were and what they were for. The question is whether he cared enough about their importance to be willing to do anything to safeguard them.

 

[Ford]

It is getting even more ridiculous...if that's even possible.

Trump Wants A Special Master

“This matter has captured the attention of the American public. Merely ‘adequate’ safeguards are not acceptable when the matter at hand involves not only the constitutional rights of President Trump, but also the presumption of executive privilege,” the attorneys wrote.

Did you get that? We can't trust the FBI to safeguard the documents that Trump put in a storeroom next to the pool at his golf resort. A room that didn't even have a lock on the door for months on end. Plus he's still insisting that executive privilege still applies even though he's not President anymore!

 

[Copernicus]

Sometimes people bend over so far backwards to accommodate Trump's demands that they are in danger of snapping their spines. Or, if they are Republican officeholders, that's one less thing they need worry about.

 

[Elixir]

Sometimes people bend over so far backwards to accommodate Trump's demands that they are in danger of snapping their spines. Or, if they are Republican officeholders, that's one less thing they need worry about.

 

[ZiprHead]

Sometimes people bend over so far backwards to accommodate Trump's demands that they are in danger of snapping their spines. Or, if they are Republican officeholders, that's one less thing they need worry about.

They have spines???

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Trump wants the affidavit unsealed.

What gives you THAT idea?
He says so?

His lawyers sat like statues when they had a chance to move for unsealing the affidavit.
There’s lotsa damaging stuff there, and Trump knows it. He’d like to learn who the leaker is, but not badly enough to move to make the basis of the search warrant known to the

The affidavit can reveal the mole.