Michael Brown Shooting and Aftermath

[AthenaAwakened]

 

[HaRaAYaH]

Something I stole from someone smarter than me:

Ten questions and a few more.

10. Did you tell Mike Brown & Dorian Johnson to "get the fuck on the sidewalk"?

9. When you pulled away, since your chief said you didn't know about the store incident, why did you reverse your SUV to confront them?

8. When you recklessly reversed your SUV to confront Mike & Dorian, 4 people saw & heard your tires screech & nearly hit the teens. Why?

7. If you did not know about the store incident, why exactly did you open the door of your SUV to confront the teens?

6. Did you believe that Mike Brown was armed?

5. After you shot Mike Brown through your SUV window, he fled over 100 feet, did you still feel threatened while you chased him?

4. 6 eyewitnesses saw you take 6 shots at the back of Mike Brown. Was your intention to arrest or kill him with those shots?

3. Did you believe Mike Brown was hit again when his body jerked & he turned around after your 8th shot at him?

2. 6 eyewitnesses saw Mike Brown lift his hands & verbally surrender to you. How did you interpret these actions?

1. Before you fired 2 fatal shots into Mike Brown's head, he had been shot 4 times by you. Did you still believe him to be a threat then?


5 BONUS QUESTIONS for Darren Wilson and his legal defense team.

5. You told federal investigators that you were punched & scratched repeatedly by Mike Brown. Why did you not see ANY of the on-scene medics?

4. You claim that Mike Brown "went" for your gun. Was this after it was drawn within inches of his face?

3. Why did you not radio in to dispatch after you shot & killed Mike Brown? Who were the first 3 people you called and why?

2. When you successfully aimed & shot Mike Brown twice in the head w/ your last bullets, is this because you had no intention to arrest him?


Last question...

1. Who first told you not to create a report the day you killed Mike Brown and why did they tell you not to create a report?

Nice try but even the pathologist hired by the family disputes your theory he was fired on from the front:

Michael Brown, the unarmed black teenager who was killed by a police officer, sparking protests around the nation, was shot at least six times, including twice in the head, a preliminary private autopsy performed on Sunday found.

One of the bullets entered the top of Mr. Brown’s skull, suggesting his head was bent forward when it struck him and caused a fatal injury, according to Dr. Michael M. Baden, the former chief medical examiner for the City of New York, who flew to Missouri on Sunday at the family’s request to conduct the separate autopsy. It was likely the last of bullets to hit him, he said.

Mr. Brown, 18, was also shot four times in the right arm, he said, adding that all the bullets were fired into his front.

NY Times

Here is an equally stupid scenario.

Michael Brown and his friend were disrupting traffic by walking down the middle of the street.
Michael Brown hates all police because they are racist.
There was a verbal confrontation when the cop said get out of the street.
The cop pulled over
Michael brown reached into the car to assault the cop (he just assaulted a store owner it's not like it's an unlikely thing to do, after all the store owner didn't deserve it either.
Michael Brown went for the cops gun.
Michael Brown moved away from the cop
The cop opened the door of the car
Michael Brown turned and moved toward the cop

“This one here looks like his head was bent downward,” he said, indicating the wound at the very top of Mr. Brown’s head. “It can be because he’s giving up, or because he’s charging forward at the officer.”

NY Times report of the pathologist hired by the Brown Family.
The cop shot Michael Brown.

We don't know what happened. Not you and not me. You will just have to put your big boy pants on and wait for the racist system to complete it's investigation. I'm always suspect when this information come out. Who does it benefit? Is the cop going to be charged and wants it released because it makes him look better? Nobody knows. You will just have to be patient. Think

Richard Jewel
Tawana Brwaley
Duke Lacrosse Team

The "facts" that came out in the beginning didn't match the "facts" that came out at the conclusion, hence all the conjecture at the beginning was just that conjecture and it adds nothing to the situation.....

 

[Bronzeage]

Nice try but even the pathologist hired by the family disputes your theory he was fired on from the front:

Michael Brown, the unarmed black teenager who was killed by a police officer, sparking protests around the nation, was shot at least six times, including twice in the head, a preliminary private autopsy performed on Sunday found.

One of the bullets entered the top of Mr. Brown’s skull, suggesting his head was bent forward when it struck him and caused a fatal injury, according to Dr. Michael M. Baden, the former chief medical examiner for the City of New York, who flew to Missouri on Sunday at the family’s request to conduct the separate autopsy. It was likely the last of bullets to hit him, he said.

Mr. Brown, 18, was also shot four times in the right arm, he said, adding that all the bullets were fired into his front.

NY Times

Here is an equally stupid scenario.

Michael Brown and his friend were disrupting traffic by walking down the middle of the street.
Michael Brown hates all police because they are racist.
There was a verbal confrontation when the cop said get out of the street.
The cop pulled over
Michael brown reached into the car to assault the cop (he just assaulted a store owner it's not like it's an unlikely thing to do, after all the store owner didn't deserve it either.
Michael Brown went for the cops gun.
Michael Brown moved away from the cop
The cop opened the door of the car
Michael Brown turned and moved toward the cop

“This one here looks like his head was bent downward,” he said, indicating the wound at the very top of Mr. Brown’s head. “It can be because he’s giving up, or because he’s charging forward at the officer.”

NY Times report of the pathologist hired by the Brown Family.
The cop shot Michael Brown.

We don't know what happened. Not you and not me. You will just have to put your big boy pants on and wait for the racist system to complete it's investigation. I'm always suspect when this information come out. Who does it benefit? Is the cop going to be charged and wants it released because it makes him look better? Nobody knows. You will just have to be patient. Think

Richard Jewel
Tawana Brwaley
Duke Lacrosse Team

The "facts" that came out in the beginning didn't match the "facts" that came out at the conclusion, hence all the conjecture at the beginning was just that conjecture and it adds nothing to the situation.....

We don't know what happened. Not you and not me.

Who are you talking to about theories and big boy pants?

 

[Jayjay]

Loren: Have you ever been walking down the street completely unarmed, saw a police car and attacked it? Would you even begin to imagine doing that yourself? Why do you think somebody else would consider doing that? Do you really believe black people are that suicidal? Do you really believe that the cops could not have taken him into custody without killing him? I think the easily could do so. No weapon. How did the cops allow the guy to get inside the car? Their story makes no sense.

Based on description of events I read, the police car stopped so close to Brown that the door practically hit him when Wilson tried to open it. Brown might have been sufficiently pissed off by this to reach inside the car through the window, which would explain the struggle that ensued. It makes sense to me.

 

[HaRaAYaH]

Nice try but even the pathologist hired by the family disputes your theory he was fired on from the front:



NY Times

Here is an equally stupid scenario.

Michael Brown and his friend were disrupting traffic by walking down the middle of the street.
Michael Brown hates all police because they are racist.
There was a verbal confrontation when the cop said get out of the street.
The cop pulled over
Michael brown reached into the car to assault the cop (he just assaulted a store owner it's not like it's an unlikely thing to do, after all the store owner didn't deserve it either.
Michael Brown went for the cops gun.
Michael Brown moved away from the cop
The cop opened the door of the car
Michael Brown turned and moved toward the cop

“This one here looks like his head was bent downward,” he said, indicating the wound at the very top of Mr. Brown’s head. “It can be because he’s giving up, or because he’s charging forward at the officer.”

NY Times report of the pathologist hired by the Brown Family.
The cop shot Michael Brown.

We don't know what happened. Not you and not me. You will just have to put your big boy pants on and wait for the racist system to complete it's investigation. I'm always suspect when this information come out. Who does it benefit? Is the cop going to be charged and wants it released because it makes him look better? Nobody knows. You will just have to be patient. Think

Richard Jewel
Tawana Brwaley
Duke Lacrosse Team

The "facts" that came out in the beginning didn't match the "facts" that came out at the conclusion, hence all the conjecture at the beginning was just that conjecture and it adds nothing to the situation.....

We don't know what happened. Not you and not me.

Who are you talking to about theories and big boy pants?

I just made up an equally silly scenario. Like I said. We just don't know what happened.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Loren: Have you ever been walking down the street completely unarmed, saw a police car and attacked it? Would you even begin to imagine doing that yourself? Why do you think somebody else would consider doing that? Do you really believe black people are that suicidal? Do you really believe that the cops could not have taken him into custody without killing him? I think the easily could do so. No weapon. How did the cops allow the guy to get inside the car? Their story makes no sense.

The only thing that makes sense here is that the guy saw a chance to grab the cop's gun.

- - - Updated - - -

You get blood on the gun by firing a shot at very close range--while struggling in the car.

You can also get blood on it by touching a person you just shot.

And he magically picked up the car and set it on Michael Brown???

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The only thing that makes sense here is that the guy saw a chance to grab the cop's gun.

Actually, little makes sense in this case.

 

[HaRaAYaH]

The only thing that makes sense here is that the guy saw a chance to grab the cop's gun.

Actually, little makes sense in this case.

Aint that the truth.... Why would this a-hole f with a cop and why did the cop have to shoot him 87 times...... I do hope we find out whether one or both of them is to blame....

 

[RavenSky]

The only thing that makes sense here is that the guy saw a chance to grab the cop's gun.

Is that what you would do?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Actually, little makes sense in this case.

Aint that the truth.... Why would this a-hole f with a cop and why did the cop have to shoot him 87 times...... I do hope we find out whether one or both of them is to blame....

Based on some witness accounts, the cop started it.

 

[Derec]

Aint that the truth.... Why would this a-hole f with a cop and why did the cop have to shoot him 87 times...... I do hope we find out whether one or both of them is to blame....

Based on some witness accounts, the cop started it.

The only one claiming that is Dorian Johnson, hardly a disinterested witness being the friend of the deceased and he also has a history of theft and filing a false police report. None of the other witnesses claim to have seen the events at/in the police car.

- - - Updated - - -

The only thing that makes sense here is that the guy saw a chance to grab the cop's gun.

Is that what you would do?

Criminals often do stupid shit. To disbelieve them doing stupid shit because you or I or Loren would not be doing the stupid shit would indeed be stupid itself.

 

[Derec]

One problem. How does Brown's blood get on the gun? To me, this always implied that while the gun was holstered.

I do not see how the gun being holstered would help here. I assume the blood got onto the gun, Wilson's uniform and the car interior through spatter when Brown was shot.

The claim is that Brown went for the officer's gun, which forced the officer to shoot Brown. But the blood gets on the gun at what point?

When he was shot.

The evidence presented demonstrates Brown's proximity to the police car.

More than proximity. Which comports to Wilson's version of events.

The additional evidence disputes that Brown then charged back at the officer, rather he staggered. So, it is possible the first shots could have been legitimate, while the last shots were not. The guy has a bullet wound in his arm. Surely the officer can evade him.

If the suspect was moving toward the officer while he was ordering him to stop then it may well have been a justified shooting from the beginning to the end. An arm would is not usually immediately debilitating and if he was surrendering why was he moving toward Wilson?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I do not see how the gun being holstered would help here. I assume the blood got onto the gun, Wilson's uniform and the car interior through spatter when Brown was shot.

So Brown assaulted the officer, went for a holstered gun, the officer was able to unholster it, and get two shots off?

The claim is that Brown went for the officer's gun, which forced the officer to shoot Brown. But the blood gets on the gun at what point?

When he was shot.

This only seems to be possible if the gun was originally unholstered and put into play immediately by the officer.

The evidence presented demonstrates Brown's proximity to the police car.

More than proximity. Which comports to Wilson's version of events.

Not really. It doesn't demonstrate why Brown was originally near the vehicle.

The additional evidence disputes that Brown then charged back at the officer, rather he staggered. So, it is possible the first shots could have been legitimate, while the last shots were not. The guy has a bullet wound in his arm. Surely the officer can evade him.

If the suspect was moving toward the officer while he was ordering him to stop then it may well have been a justified shooting from the beginning to the end. An arm would is not usually immediately debilitating and if he was surrendering why was he moving toward Wilson?

The officer's own version indicates that Brown was staggering, which implies that the officer is not in immediate threat to his life and can deal with the situation in multiple different ways.

 

[Sabine Grant]

And again and again, whichever incident occurred while Officer Wilson was in the vehicle, the ACTUAL issue is whether Officer Wilson was justified in shooting Michael Brown to the point of fatal wounds (last 2 shots) to his head while Michael Brown would be surrendering about 25 feet away from Officer Wilson. Again and again, witnesses who corroborate each other's testimonies pointing to having had a visual of what Micheal Brown was doing at the time Officer Wilson pursued to shoot him to the point of fatal shots to his head.

 

[ZiprHead]

So Brown assaulted the officer, went for a holstered gun, the officer was able to unholster it, and get two shots off?

I always kind of figured the cop pulled the gun when the altercation at the vehicle began and that Brown tried to keep the gun from being pointed at him. Other than Brown's blood, which obviously splattered a fair amount, is there any proof that Brown touched the gun? Fingerprints? Anything?

 

[Shadowy Man]

The only thing that makes sense here is that the guy saw a chance to grab the cop's gun.

Is that what you would do?

I would think that it would take someone with very little sense to believe that they could actually have the leverage to reach into a car and get a holstered gun away from an officer. Now, I'm not saying that Micheal Brown didn't have very little sense, so it's not impossible.

But remember, the threshold in a court of law includes the word "reasonable".

 

[HaRaAYaH]

And again and again, whichever incident occurred while Officer Wilson was in the vehicle, the ACTUAL issue is whether Officer Wilson was justified in shooting Michael Brown to the point of fatal wounds (last 2 shots) to his head while Michael Brown would be surrendering about 25 feet away from Officer Wilson. Again and again, witnesses who corroborate each other's testimonies pointing to having had a visual of what Micheal Brown was doing at the time Officer Wilson pursued to shoot him to the point of fatal shots to his head.

We just don't know. If he reached into the car and started an altercation with a policemen and then was able to get 25 feet away and then turned towards the policemen who you would suspect told him to stop. If he failed to stop after earlier making an attempt to get the gun from the police officer while he was in the car, the policeman would be justified in shooting him. I could also paint this story as the policeman being the aggressor in all points of this story and the shooting being totally unjustified.

Until we know all of the facts we can only, to the detriment of everyone, speculate. Rampant speculation leads to riots and unrest. It's funny that the "secret" grand jury testimony was leaked now. Who leaked it? Why? Who benefits? Are they trying to make the cop look good before the indictment and generate good will from the jury pool? Just not enough information to know what really happened and who was at fault. Until we have this data, it's wrong to accuse the policeman of homicide and it's wrong to smear Michael Brown as a worthless criminal who got what he deserved. The truth will probably be somewhere in the middle.

 

[Arctish]

I think the fact Officer Wilson did not fill out a routine after-action report describing the incident casts a huge shadow over the story that was leaked. Police officers are public servant authorized to make arrests and use force if necessary to keep order and uphold the law. Wilson should have been required to report his version of the events, and the public should have access to that information.

By not filling out the usual reports, he leaves the door wide open for speculation. I can't help but wonder what he's trying to hide.

 

[Derec]

New autopsy results seem to confirm Officer Wilson's version of events, according to St. Louis' local rag.
Official autopsy shows Michael Brown had close-range wound to his hand, marijuana in system

A source with knowledge of Wilson’s statements said the officer had told investigators that Brown had struggled for Wilson’s pistol inside a police SUV and that Wilson had fired the gun twice, hitting Brown once in the hand. Later, Wilson fired additional shots that killed Brown and ignited a national controversy.

The St. Louis medical examiner, Dr. Michael Graham, who is not part of the official investigation, reviewed the autopsy report for the newspaper. He said Tuesday that it “does support that there was a significant altercation at the car.”
Graham said the examination indicated a shot traveled from the tip of Brown’s right thumb toward his wrist. The official report notes an absence of stippling, powder burns around a wound that indicate a shot fired at relatively short range.
[..]
Dr. Judy Melinek, a forensic pathologist in San Francisco, said the autopsy “supports the fact that this guy is reaching for the gun, if he has gunpowder particulate material in the wound.” She added, “If he has his hand near the gun when it goes off, he’s going for the officer’s gun.”
[..]
Melinek also said the autopsy did not support witnesses who have claimed Brown was shot while running away from Wilson, or with his hands up.
She said Brown was facing Wilson when Brown took a shot to the forehead, two shots to the chest and a shot to the upper right arm. The wound to the top of Brown’s head would indicate he was falling forward or in a lunging position toward the shooter; the shot was instantly fatal.
A sixth shot that hit the forearm traveled from the back of the arm to the inner arm, which means Brown’s palms could not have been facing Wilson, as some witnesses have said, Melinek said. That trajectory shows Brown probably was not taking a standard surrender position with arms above the shoulders and palms out when he was hit, she said.

The full autopsy report is available here. Nothing too surprising in there except that the medical examine should take some remedial English classes.

So there might not be an indictment after all. Doesn't bode well for peace and quiet.

 

[RavenSky]

Pure speculation that Brown was reaching for the gun, as opposed to (for instance) holding his hand out in a "don't shoot" sort of motion. And in any case, a shot to his hand isn't what killed him.

A shot to his head did - after he had run approximately 25 feet away and put his hands up in surrender.

I love how the very same people argue that Michael Brown was so fucking threatening to a supposedly trained police officer that said police officer was justified in killing him from 25 feet away, but Marissa Alexander could not have possibly in any way felt threatened by Rico Gray at a much closer range. The hypocrisy is breath-taking.